Reply With QuoteOriginally Posted by noTAGlove
Tell him the damage is about £250, ask if he’d rather pay for it or go through the insurance.
I’ll wager his excess is £250 so he’ll probably offer to pay.
Wife had her car heavily reversed into today. It is street parking but a private road shared by the school she works for and large residential houses along it. The parking space is private to the school.
Anyway, wife was alerted to the thump by the porters of the school, and as it is covered by CCTV they viewed the footage and effectively the guy in the opposite house tw@atted his car into the wife's bumper with a good old force. Then drove off and parked his car in his house as if nothing had happened.
Wife went with the porters to confront him, and he made up a cock 'n' bull story about he thought he hit a lamppost, blah, blah, blah.
Has left the bumper with a dent and loads of scrapes, plus panel scrape. But, car is only worth £500, so we can live with it. Otherwise if we claim on the guys insurance the car will be written off given it is such a low value and repair will cost the same as the car is worth. Car is very reliable so don’t want it written off.
But, we'd like to teach the guy a lesson, as this stuff really p!sses me off. Plus he had a big pile of a house in SW London, so not like he was skint
Any suggestions?
Last edited by noTAGlove; 13th December 2018 at 16:15.
Tell him the damage is about £250, ask if he’d rather pay for it or go through the insurance.
I’ll wager his excess is £250 so he’ll probably offer to pay.
Tell him it's £350. He'll pay it anyway.
"A man of little significance"
If he doesn't want to play ball, point out that driving away after an accident / not exchanging details is illegal.
He could have left a note.
Andy
Wanted - Damasko DC57
Try and squeeze him for £375?
We alway knew you were a thinking man.
We have his email address now. Let me know what you think.
Hello,
I am writing to you as you crashed into my wife’s car which was parked at XXXXX School. I am her husband of the person you crashed the car into.
I presume you are aware the it is a criminal act to leave the scene without leaving your personal details or reporting the crash to the police with immediate effect. The crash was caught on the school CCTV and witnessed live by the porter on duty.
We have had the damage preliminary inspected and estimate the repair cost/reduction in cars value, as a result of your driving to be around £250. Therefore, I’m offering you an opportunity to pay the estimated repair bill/reduction in cars value of £250 and donate £50 to charity (Shelter - a good cause at this time of year don’t you think), and we will not take this matter any further.
Otherwise please provide insurance details, and we will advise you of any further action we will take.
Happy Christmas,
XXXX
Tell him its £500 and buy another car.
If it is just some pain you wish to inflict for his dishonesty, make an insurance claim, only problem is your premiums will also increase.
Agree, I had a similar incident many years ago with ex wife's car. We found who'd done it (they lived locally) and when confronted they agreed to pay up and keep it out of the insurance.
I'd remind him that he's committed an offence and offer him choice of insurance + police or pay the cost of getting the car sorted........at around £500. He's bang out of order and he knows it.
Two wrongs don’t make a right.
Demanding he pays money (a) to charity or (b) on the pretext of an estimate could be perceived as blackmail, and he might decide to teach you a lesson.
If your wife works in a school she could find this causes problems.
Where have you obtained his email address? Did he give it to you?
Better just ask for his insurance details IMO.
You need to re-write the first line.
I would go round there with an estimate and ask him how he would like to settle.
You are far more likely to get him on the back foot if you go around in person than sending an email he can choose to ignore.
Tell him you have a copy of the CCTV footage as well as a witness statement from the porter and it was clear he knew he was driving away from the scene of an accident. See how the conversation goes and you can mould your responses to suit, ranging from him offering a cash settlement to passing all the info on to the police. He won't want an insurance claim or police visit and if he sees you have purpose then he'll probably fold.
Tell t’bugger to cough up £300 (no kites) for the damage or you will send Michael Gove to join them for Christmas lunch and the stabproof vests they will need will cost the family more than £300!
This!!
My first thought on reading your email was blackmail.
I’d go and speak to him either with an estimate or to tell him that you’re going to get an estimate and ask for his insurance details.
Let him suggest paying for it without involving his insurance. If he does then you can take it from there.
Indeed. (@ the OP, I think your frustration got better of you in that email draft. Leave it for a day or two and think about it rationally.)
Last edited by VDG; 13th December 2018 at 18:44.
Fas est ab hoste doceri
The legitimate way to do this legally is for you to get 2 estimates (ask the garage for a proforma invoice ) for repairing the damage to the car at whatever it costs (which is likely to be more than you think)
You can then go and visit him or write to him enclosing copies of the estimates and ask him to pay the cost of repairing the damage or supply his insurance details. Point out that if it is an insurance claim then you will have to report the incident to the police as well to get a report number for the insurance claim as he failed to stop and leave his details at the time of the collision.
From there you can offer to accept a lesser amount if he chooses to settle in cash, in person rather than involving his insurers, should you wish.
His insurance excess is irrelevant as it's not payable on claims for damage to a third party car (which yours is in this case). What will affect him (even if he has a protected NCB) is the cost of the increased premium for having an at-fault claim on his insurance for the next 5 years.
Even if he does report the claim to his insurers to settle, you can still use the proforma invoice to request a "cash in lieu of repairs" settlement from them so they won't write the car off, but instead pay you either the repair costs or the value of the car less any salvage value, with the car not being a write off and you keeping it.
You’re right. But I do feel like punishing the git at the moment
We had the same thing happen a few months back to the same car and had a lovely note left with details and a big sorry.
Sent the person a text saying many thanks for leaving the note, and told her the scrapes just added a bit more character to the car and she shouldn’t worry about it.
If this guy had done the same, he’d have got the same response. But, he chose not to.
You need to make sure the letter is “without prejudice” which makes it crystal clear this is a one off payment with no further action to be taken which is legally binding and signed by both parties, plenty of info online about this and I’ve had todo it myself on a couple of occasions. Failing that it’s via the insurance company with the risk of your car being written off although a no fault claim on your part should not affect your premium moving forward.
I’m fairly certain that the driver’s insurer has NO right to write-off your wife’s car - as the car is not underwritten by them.
So- Go ahead with a claim to return the car to as-was condition - against his policy.
Once I calmed down and inspected the car with a torch this evening, I sent the following;
Dear Mr. XXXXX,
I am the husband of Sarah XXXXX who owns the car that you reversed into today. I have inspected the car this evening and although there are significant scratches to the rear bumper and some minor new scratches to the bodywork I can see no further damage to the car.
As the car is old and already has had a couple of previous scratches/dings, I see no benefit in chasing you/your insurance company for the cost of repairs. Therefore, on this occasion you will hear from us no further with regards to the damage you caused to my wife's car.
However, you may be aware that failing to leave details, or directly inform the police of damage caused to a car is a criminal offence, and CCTV is available on this occasion. But, in the spirit of Christmas, we have decided not to progress this any further.
Given our generosity in this matter, we would like you to consider donating £50 to the charity 'Shelter' as a gesture of goodwill on your behalf, and I hope you agree a good cause for those without a home this Christmas.
Regards,
XXXXX
Fairly certain you will get no response and there will be no charity donation...........
He’s been shamed and his course of action will be to avoid anything connected with that.
Fair play to you, though.
Fair play indeed. Merry Christmas!
Does he have a letterbox?
That isn't what without prejudice means. It means that the offer is privileged and usually cannot be shown to a court as evidence, if the dispute reaches that stage. It is a system designed to allow parties to negotiate without fear of a compromise offer being used against them if the case ultimately has to be decided by court. Whether the without prejudice offer letter is a one-off offer and the manner it is binding actually fall on how the offer letter is constructed, that's a separate matter to "without prejudice" and could for instance be separately marked "subject to contract" to be clear that a separate contract is required to bring effect, not merely replying "agreed" to the offer letter itself.
For general interest, the next tier up is a calderbank offer - that will take the form of something marked "without prejudice save as to costs" which will again be privileged for the purpose of the court making a ruling BUT can be presented as evidence when the judge subsequently rules on costs. It is designed to punish those that rack up significant legal costs when turning down an offer that the judge's subsequent ruling shows to have been reasonable. As such, the offer needs to be capable of acceptance and offer a reasonable period for due consideration / acceptance.
Thought it was worth setting this out as "without prejudice" is a much mis-understood and mis-used concept. So in the case here, if OP had offered to accept a concessionary amount of £250 for an out of court settlement (vs costed claim of £500) he might make that offer "without prejudice" and he could subsequently seek damages of £500 (and costs) if it subsequently went to court. If his claim was £500 and he didn't want to make a concession, there is no harm in asking for £500 and not marking the offer "without Prejudice" as that's what he would state his claim to be before the judge anyway. He might then choose to make a calderbank offer of £250 down the line to protect him against costs being disproportionate to the value of the claim.
Of course you really should report to insurers whatever the outcome...
Why?
Aren’t we obliged to inform insurers of any accidents?
They’d be bloody busy keeping the records updated if people did that here.
Don't just do something, sit there. - TNH
Given the choice of informing my insurer that my banger has been banged while parked up and them raising my premiums whether I claim or not, or saying nothing and sorting it myself, i’ll be saying nothing.
I don’t believe I would be committing a crime.
Thank you, that’s very informative and hopefully useful for both myself and anyone else reading this thread. Such a breadth and depth of knowledge and professions on this forum that has helped me learn about many more things than watches over the years.
Not a crime but probably breaking T&Cs of your insurance.
Forget the charity stuff.
Just say 'you crashed into my wife's car. We have cctv and a witness. We'd like to come to an arrangement that suits both parties. What do you want to do about it?'
Don't even mention extent of damage at this stage. just my 2p.
Good luck everybody. Have a good one.
That ship has sailed, mate.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Just for future reference. If your car is written off for cosmetic damage, as in a category c or d, you can buy it back from the insurance company for scrap value and it's still legal to drive on the road.
If you ever sell it you must state that it's a category c/d, but that wouldn't even apply in this case as I imagine you're keeping it.
They’ve recently changed their definitions; there’s also a category N and S.
https://www.gov.uk/scrapped-and-writ...ance-writeoffs
Last edited by Dave+63; 14th December 2018 at 09:25.
Is it the one that says:
"You must inform us at the earliest opportunity of every little knock and scrape, no matter how slight or insignificant, so that we may royally shaft you for the next five years."
They can whistle.
Are you honestly saying that faced with the same scenario as the OP you would inform your insurer? Would you inform them if, for instance, your wing mirror got knocked off? Would you honestly phone them up and say, "Just to let you know, my wing mirror got knocked off. I'll pay to fix it myself, but thought I should inform you because of the T&Cs"?
I'm not condoning insurance fraud, I'm living in the real world.
Last edited by Onelasttime; 14th December 2018 at 09:22.
I've come to the conclusion after selling stuff on here over the years and asking people to donate to charity that it's a hell of a lot easier to accept payment yourself and then do the donation than it is to put the ball in their court, spend ages chasing them and then guessing the donation the buyer makes a few weeks/months later (if you're lucky) is the one for what you've given and sent them at your cost.
"A man of little significance"
You're very welcome. I have learnt a lot here too and most are so friendly hence I like to give back whenever I can.
I'm suprised it took up to 23 posts to get this suggestion.... I'd thought it would have appeared sooner....
Anyhow my 2cents worth - get £250 - £300 out of him if you can .... buy something nice with it or donate it to charity and make something nice happen out of a sour situation
Don't send that letter, get a quote, tell him what it is to get it repaired and ask him for his insurance details. Do not get it repaired with him 'offering' to pay it because what happens if he doesn't pay it - you're then stuck with the bill and will find it difficult to claim on his insurance.
Do it the proper way and the loss of his excess/increased insurance is all you need to get satisfaction.
I think you’re a bit late to the (3rd) party..........
That's just cruel and twisted.
The cost could be reduced by not issuing Gove with a protective vest.
So clever my foot fell off.
Yes I'm finding this A LOT. particularly with the Omega Fundraiser PSAs. Must be at least 8 people yet to donate.....
I found the same when I was doing charity stuff on here. Some people would diddle a charity.
Good luck everybody. Have a good one.
It's frustratingly common, I'm 'selling' off a load of stuff for charity donations here at the moment and spending far too much time chasing the transfers. I've also had two experiences of people promising to send something for a fundraiser donation and it never materialising.
Fully agree about "without prejudice" being misunderstood and misused, even by those who should know better.
Calderbank offers have now been superseded under the new costs regime, the equivalent is now a "Part 36 offer" which can be put forward by either side
Bing Bing Bing!!! We have a winner and the correct answer
What he said.
Or just go round with a bat and see if he fancies a game of rounders!!!!
Some friendly advice...
Careful! There is a poster on here who will think you are being literal and actually encouraging the poster to go and batter the chap with a rounders bat in an act of extreme wanton violence.
Or he may think you actually want to play rounders with the guy - and what’s the sense in that?
That was exactly my first thought. I spend too much time on this forum.
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