Reply With QuoteFirst response is usually "yeah, right," but there are of course some genuine ones and I see nothing obvious here to alarm. Sometimes if it quacks, swims and flies like a duck then it really is a duck!
H
A newbie has posted over on TWF about her dad's 1990 Tiffany & Co Sub, which, naturally, they're looking to sell. I was sceptical at first but now the pics are in I'm not so sure.
Apparently, she also has pics from the day her dad bought the watch, standing outside Tiffany & Co with her mum. If all this is true then I would have thought sentimental value alone would make it priceless, but if the prices these go for are to be believed then I can understand why she might be considering selling.
It's an amazing full set – he even kept the Tiffany bag.
Anyway, here's the link the imgur library
https://imgur.com/a/9wemX6U
What do the experts think?
First response is usually "yeah, right," but there are of course some genuine ones and I see nothing obvious here to alarm. Sometimes if it quacks, swims and flies like a duck then it really is a duck!
H
I have looked at a couple of Tiffany dialled Rolex Explorers and then walked away on the realisation that I’m way out of my depth. There are just too many suspect examples out there. One even came with papers but I couldn’t get my head over the risk involved.
Nice! Out of interest, how much is she selling it for or is she just trying to gauge value?
Thanks Mr H. I'm not in any way in the market for this but was curious. I immediately suspected a replica seller trying it on, but maybe not then.Originally Posted by Haywood_Milton
I’ve got a feeling WF had one sale recently, think an 84yr no idea if for sale still or current value but my memory thinks £14k.
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Watchfinder have one for a tad under £20k.
I looked at it the other day, and asked whether that was the price 5513’s were going for (I hadn’t spotted the Tiffany on the dial). The salesman said yes.
It took a couple of minutes for him to mention it was a Tiffany dial, which explained (to me) the price.
You sure it's not SweepingHoover in a skirt ???
No, I'm not sure
Certainly one of the more convincing Tiffany sets.
Realistically though, how hard would any of it be to fake in this day and age. Even the bag looks the same as the current ones. Would that be the style from nearly 30 years ago?
The Tiffany logo is wonky but not suggesting it’s fake, just saying.
Hello everyone,
here's the newbie writing in person, I'm a male! :)
Glad to have found this thread about my father's watch.
I would like to ask you guys an advice as you could maybe suggest me the best way to sell this Rolex.
First of all, I can understand your doubting about the originality of the piece, I have seen that the Rolex Market is a nightmare for replicas and fakes, but there might be some originals all around the world!
And I know I'm just a guy writing on behalf of his father anonymously on a watch forum (obviously I'll give all my details and infos in private to anyone REALLY interested in buying the watch), but I think, as I said, on the other forum, we have all the possible proofs to demonstrate this is an original piece.
My father just bought this on holiday in 1990 when no one could know that these watches would become rare and expensive almost 30 years later.
The watch is all with original pieces, nothing replaced and my father kept the receipt of the shop, of the card transaction, all the accessories with the watch, included indeed Tiffany bag as shown in the pictures, etc.
He sent me pics of the Tiffany shop and of the watch just bought (a bit blurry as it was 1990..., I'll upload them here), he has got even the audio recording of him talking with the sale assistant!
Which other proof could be possible to have to demonstrate the originality of a Rolex?
Second of all I want to say:
I'm trying to put myself in a probable buyer/collector's shoes and maybe they would prefer an auction house like Christie's instead of a private seller for safety reasons?
Even in my position though it's not easy to manage this sale as I've been contacted from LOTS of scammers.
And even on watch forums the treatment is not always nice, on an Italian watch forum they freezed my thread and removed the photos (mhhh maybe feeling envy?) and I have been contacted from lots of low profile collectors that think I'm stupid and I'll accept ridiculous offers, Rolex forum as well.
Lots of private messages trying to get the watch fooling me.
One offer of $20k, another one $40k, another one £10k.
We are definitely not in a rush to sell this amazing set.
The 5513 Tiffany that someone mentioned above here is with no box and papers, would you really buy a Rolex like that?
I can't find another full set like this on chrono24 or any other serious website, even past auctions, I mean with ALL these proofs and watch 100% original, nothing replaced or polished
(apart from the plastic glass polishing, the ultrasonic cleaning and replacing a 'little tube' of the watch band - the only time this Rolex went to a trusted shop, as I said on twf, we got receipt of that too, 65 euros).
This could (maybe I'm wrong, maybe not) be a unique piece right now on the online worldwide market, so guys, any advice on where and how to sell it would be really appreciated.
Thank you a lot to everyone
It seems the stickers have been removed. It's practically worthless.
Not having an audio recording
Yes, that just sounds strange to me.
Possibly the worst 'stealth' sales thread ever.
I have to ask, is there no sentimental value for you on such a wonderful and complete set?
I also laughed when I read it, who records the sales assistant!
The story sounds fake. No wonder the guy got banned in Italy.
And in 1990 when a mobile phone was just a phone.. perhaps he carried a recording walkman around with him wherever he went in case he needed to record any sales transactions.
Talk to Phillips or watches of knightsbridge.
There might be someone who would buy it directly, but if you're not typically in the market and very aware, you could get ripped off. If I were in your position I would would lose a bit of money to have someone experienced to act on my behalf.
"Hello good... sir and how may I help you today?"
"Why hello... erm... Robert, I would like to buy a Tiffany and Company Rolex five five one three please."
"Of course, here you are Dave, I mean here you are sir."
"Thank you Robert. Farewell my man."
"Farewell Da... sir. Was that ok?"
"Yeah mate, spot on."
That’s silly, he would of had a Sony MiniDisc Man, recording one.........
Hello everyone,
Thank you for your reply.
Unfortunately I was expecting any kind of help or advice, but maybe this is not the right place.
Just want to reply quickly to your comments because this thread is public and I have nothing to hide.
Should I give my full sensible details to someone who doesn't even show his real name on forums?
My father has got diapositives of the watch with the green sticker in the back, but I think it's not worth it uploading them here after looking at your reactions to anything I say.
Audio recording was a plus, I know by myself that is not THE proof to show that a Rolex is original, it was just a PLUS.
Yes, me and even my father, are impressed as well because without thinking, he kept a lot of materials from that holiday and YES, he used to walk with a walkman to record, we got pictures of my mother holding the walkman too, but same as above.
Yes of course my father has got a huge sentimental value to this set, but again, should I say publicly, to someone that I don't know and I can't see their names and are just attacking me, the private reasons why he decided to sell it?
Probably here there is no one that could afford to buy a set like this, that's why no one of you thought 5 seconds before replying and maybe thinking that I'm just a guy not expert like you and I was asking for help/advice.
Fair enough, thank you again for your time and thank you to the only one (WhopperSenior) who replied in a kind way.
Kind regards
p.s. Papa Hotel, you are the only one who really managed to draw a smile on my face.
Everybody knows it was raining in 1990 in New York, so the photo is not authentic.
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
Is there a sound recording relating to the purchase of the mini disc?
Skyman to Watch Talk. Calling Skyman to Watch Talk
There’s a fair few who I dare say could buy and sell you a good few times over..and still have change. Why don’t you do us all a favour and take your stories elsewhere?
Crook
Sulky Crook
Google Translating Crook
Sulky Google Translating Crook
Persistent Crook
Desperate Crook
Haughty Crook
Sulky Haughty Crook
PM sent!
(Not)
Lily Iris, Since the value is what someone is prepared to pay, just send it off to an auction house and have them sell it for you. Or you could try ebay.
Last edited by Tiny; 23rd October 2018 at 23:33.
I'd also want the saleman's employment records and a video recording of his birth, along with a photograph of his recently exhumed parents (to confirm it's really him). I'd also want the original incorporation papers of Tiffany & Co, along with an affidavit from the founder's descendants, verified by a notary who will then sacrifice himself to prove his sincerity.
At a minimum.
Why would you think that someone who has accumulated enough spare cash to indulge themselves with something like this, would be stupid enough to fall for a story like that? You need to go back to scam school. It's not even close to plausible.
Surely if the watch has punched papers, stamped with both Tiffany and the Owners Name, plus the original receipt (with the owners credit card details (for example), then this would normally be good enough.
It certainly a lot more than lots of Triffany logo Rolexes have.
OP, if you really want some assistance then I suggest you reach out to the guys on the Vintage Rolex Forum.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
Try Humbert & Ellis Ltd they may even have the old sales counter to complete the set from tupenny & con.
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Recording conversations was a thing in the 90s.
atomic mass of sulfate
If WF sold the watch I'd say sure, I'll take it, because of trust.
But buying from the OP is a 'no'.
I know that I don't know what I'm doing when it comes to ancient Rolex.
So when I do dip my toe in that pond, it'll be a retail sale and not private.
And as for that story concerning the recording...!
Did he make other recordings throughout his life, buying cars and other watches ect ect ?
The sellers conception?
If this is what you say it is then there are many, many places who would want to sell this on your behalf who would authenticate it prior to sale.
You're just going to attract more and more negativity trying to tout it on forums in this way, especially as the story itself feels too laboured to be credible.
Someone on here will PM him about it, I guarantee it.
This!
I have spoken in private with a member of this forum who kindly explained me what to do.
I have asked a valuation request to two of the main English auction houses.
Thanks to anyone who replied in this thread.
If anyone could suggest (here or in private) someone of the highest regard who can authenticate/document the watch (in Italy or around London) before sending it eventually to an auction house, that would be really appreciated.
haywood_Milton is the resident rolex expert, he is not in London but if this is authentic getting him to verify will increase the value and make the trip worthwhile
Seems very sensible advice.
But in the meantime can we please have the audio recording?
There is even a video of when they left the store:
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
Ha brilliant thread, I was convinced until the audio recording.
Too much polish on your story champ, live and learn for when you try the scam again.
lol...this was an interesting thread, fake or not...
Bingo.. i was correct, what do i win ... a Tiffany submariner ? or a tape of the transaction when buying a Polaroid camera.
I've a recent auction catalogue that has a few Tiffany Rolex in it and the prices they made -
Here are a couple.
1990 Explorer II = sold at £5000.
18ct Rose Gold, 1953. Sold at £5200.
If this was bought at a time when ‘no one could know that these watch would become rare and expensive’, it does seem to contradict the foresight to record the sales assistant....
(The thread makes for a cracking read though!)
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Even earlier. My grandmother was in the American Red Cross. She was field officer in Da Nang during the Tet offensive in 1968. She sent me a recording of her and some others on a roof top watching the "fireworks".
Best wishes,
Bob
.....all I can say is, I was in New York last year and that woman was still outside the store on Fifth Avenue ....so must be genuine.
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