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Thread: Watches as investments.. Who'd have thought?

  1. #1
    Master
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    Watches as investments.. Who'd have thought?

    https://www.chrono24.co.uk/info/watch-collection.htm


    Another nail in the coffin for watches being an enjoyable hobby, when future worth is more and more the focus.

  2. #2
    Grand Master
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    It was far more enjoyable when prices were 50% of their current levels, parts were freely available for most brands, and service costs were far lower. Unfortunately it’s all changed over the last 10-12 years. My own collection has proved to be a decent investment, but that’s not the point. Provided they hold their value I’m happy, I’ve never bought a watch in the belief that it’ll appreciate in value.

    Paul

  3. #3
    Master
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    I have never once thought about buying a watch as an investment,nor a bike or a car in fact nothing I own has been bought as an investment.

    Saying that I wish my ISA was something like an investment.

  4. #4
    Master
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    I wouldn't say I've ever bought anything as an investment but will admit to considering how much money I'll get back if it needs to be sold sharpish!

  5. #5
    Useful to ensure adequate insurance cover too.

  6. #6
    Master
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    Basically with a rising market it is much easier to convince the wife that buying a Rolex is better idea than putting money into a bank. Happy wife means a happy life and most of us here have a box full of Rolex because of that.

    Don't bite the hand that feeds you.

  7. #7
    Master endo's Avatar
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    So far my lifetime watch ownership excel spreadsheet says... they're not an investment.

  8. #8
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    Remember that conventional investments have performed rather poorly in recent years I.e. stocks/shares, banks even property out with hotspots.

    No surprise that the market looks elsewhere.

  9. #9
    I quite enjoyed putting my watches into the app...well I would say that it’s saying I’m 50% up across the board! (Although I take it with a pinch of salt!)

  10. #10
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    What surprises me is the way the cheaper stuff has kept going up. All those 60s Omegas that were £80-£120 watches 15 years ago are now £400+ for good examples. The real ’value’ to be found in vintage watches is at the cheaper end, with less desirable brands, but unfortunately the cost of servicing can be a problem and it helps a lot if you have a contact who can service them for reasonable prices.

    Looking at it logcally, the demand for the cheaper vintage watches should be in decline, but that doesn’t seem to be happening.

    One area I steer clear of is quartz or any other electronic watches. Some if these will become unrepairable, and the number of second- hand parts to keep them going will dwindle. I was chatting to a repairer earlier this week on this very topic, a mechanical watch can almost always be fixed to a reasonable standard.

    Paul

  11. #11
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    Basically with a rising market it is much easier to convince the wife that buying a Rolex is better idea than putting money into a bank. Happy wife means a happy life and most of us here have a box full of Rolex because of that.

    Don't bite the hand that feeds you.
    Quote Originally Posted by stefmcd View Post
    Remember that conventional investments have performed rather poorly in recent years I.e. stocks/shares, banks even property out with hotspots.

    No surprise that the market looks elsewhere.


    I'm not so sure that most people on the forum have a box full of Rolex but I take the point.

    The flip side of that though and more where I'm coming from I suppose - you've bought your Rolex because you wanted the watch - not as an investment - but it's now appreciating nicely. But guess what - you fancy a change or have gone off it; or heaven forbid - you're too scared to wear it now because it's value is rocketing. Are you prepared to sell it though, knowing there's a good chance you're foregoing future returns? Do you keep solely because of value; purely as an investment?

    It just feels like it's harder to enjoy watches for what they are these days and to swap and change what you own without second thoughts than 10 years ago when I first started taking an interest - that's all I'm saying.
    Last edited by gcleminson; 17th October 2018 at 13:17. Reason: spelling

  12. #12
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    Short-term investments, for a number of people.

    There have been 3 brand new Sea Dwellers, from U.K. sellers, listed in the last 24 hours.

  13. #13
    Journeyman
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    I shall confess to having put a few of my watches in there to follow, more for fun than anything else, that feature has been there some while,

    Scottie

  14. #14
    Journeyman
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    I dont have much worth listing unlike some of the photos I see on here :) I like all my watches but very few worth more than a few hundred at best

  15. #15
    I notice it asks for year acquired but not how old the actual watch is. With the Blnr and hulk for example, a 2018 is worth a fair bit more than a 2013.

    Also models like 16710 seem to have various different options, and all collide with each other with values between £6k to £10k

  16. #16
    Master
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    I think this is part of why I’ve not been so enthusiastic about collecting of late.

    It’s all got a bit expensive and too much emphasis is on investment value.

    It’s not the only thing that’s gone mad though. Some years back I was at the point of buying the dream car - a 993 Turbo - when my wife announced our first born was on her way. I know which I prefer but look at the values now .


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  17. #17
    Master spuds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    Basically with a rising market it is much easier to convince the wife that buying a Rolex is better idea than putting money into a bank. Happy wife means a happy life and most of us here have a box full of Rolex because of that.
    Agreed!!!

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tahiti View Post
    I think this is part of why I’ve not been so enthusiastic about collecting of late.

    It’s all got a bit expensive and too much emphasis is on investment value.

    It’s not the only thing that’s gone mad though. Some years back I was at the point of buying the dream car - a 993 Turbo - when my wife announced our first born was on her way. I know which I prefer but look at the values now .


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    I like it.

    As i know what you mean.

  19. #19
    Won't even find a Aerospace Night mission Cobra. Pfft rubbish app

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  20. #20
    Grand Master magirus's Avatar
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    I wear my watches because I like them. The last time I sold one was 2009, when my DC67 went to fund a DC56, which I still have. If I should want to sell one then if I lose money it's the cost of the hobby.
    F.T.F.A.

  21. #21
    Grand Master Neil.C's Avatar
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    The frankly silly prices asked for most watches now have pushed a lot of enthusiasts out of the hobby and replaced them with investment managers.

    I've seen it on here over the last 15 years or so.

    The once interesting posts have been supplanted by arguments over bits of plastic and AD's keeping bits and pieces.

    Just boring.
    Cheers,
    Neil.

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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil.C View Post
    The frankly silly prices asked for most watches now have pushed a lot of enthusiasts out of the hobby and replaced them with investment managers.

    I've seen it on here over the last 15 years or so.

    The once interesting posts have been supplanted by arguments over bits of plastic and AD's keeping bits and pieces.

    Just boring.
    That's just the way it goes, I bought an AJS 650cc motor bike in 1976 for £15 when you could not give them away. I sold it a couple of years later for £300 because they just became valued again. It was a good thing because there is now a cottage industry out there to maintain them and you can now but any almost any part for any bike easier than even back in the 1960s. There are owners clubs that represent the riders and do deals with manufacturers to get hard to find stuff re made. The same will happen to anything else

    If more people move into any hobby, the prices rise but the people who bought years ago are now sitting on a fortune, so they have done alright. There is nothing to lament over.

    Also the internet means more discussion, some sensible and some not so sensible, so it's no big deal really.

  23. #23
    Grand Master Neil.C's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    That's just the way it goes, I bought an AJS 650cc motor bike in 1976 for £15 when you could not give them away. I sold it a couple of years later for £300 because they just became valued again. It was a good thing because there is now a cottage industry out there to maintain them and you can now but any almost any part for any bike easier than even back in the 1960s. There are owners clubs that represent the riders and do deals with manufacturers to get hard to find stuff re made. The same will happen to anything else

    If more people move into any hobby, the prices rise but the people who bought years ago are now sitting on a fortune, so they have done alright. There is nothing to lament over.

    Also the internet means more discussion, some sensible and some not so sensible, so it's no big deal really.
    I wasn't talking so much about price rises as the way most people view watches as investments nowadays and the boring chat (plastic, AD waiting lists etc) that goes along with it.

    Your comparison with old AJS's is spurious. Who is now making movements for old Rolexes? There are no owners clubs and nobody doing deals with manufacturers for parts for vintage watches are there?

    It's apples and oranges.

    The fact is when these sorts of places were populated by genuine enthusiasts and not people trying to make a few bob off of the next "must have" the chat was far more interesting.
    Cheers,
    Neil.

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  24. #24
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    It’s a great way for Chrono24 to get a list of people with certain in demand watches. Not a great valuation on the first watch I put in either heyho


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  25. #25
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil.C View Post
    I wasn't talking so much about price rises as the way most people view watches as investments nowadays and the boring chat (plastic, AD waiting lists etc) that goes along with it.

    Your comparison with old AJS's is spurious. Who is now making movements for old Rolexes? There are no owners clubs and nobody doing deals with manufacturers for parts for vintage watches are there?

    It's apples and oranges.

    The fact is when these sorts of places were populated by genuine enthusiasts and not people trying to make a few bob off of the next "must have" the chat was far more interesting.
    The chat may have been more interesting for you a few years ago, but the "new crowd" would almost certainly disagree. They talk about what interests them today rather than what interested you a few years ago.

    You got to get down with the new kids on the block.

  26. #26
    Grand Master magirus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    The chat may have been more interesting for you a few years ago, but the "new crowd" would almost certainly disagree. They talk about what interests them today rather than what interested you a few years ago.

    You got to get down with the new kids on the block.
    The constant chatter about values, residuals etc is vacuous drivel. It's what watches are made of and what's inside them that's of interest.
    F.T.F.A.

  27. #27
    Grand Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil.C View Post
    The frankly silly prices asked for most watches now have pushed a lot of enthusiasts out of the hobby and replaced them with investment managers.

    I've seen it on here over the last 15 years or so.

    The once interesting posts have been supplanted by arguments over bits of plastic and AD's keeping bits and pieces.

    Just boring.
    Agree completely, things have certainly changed, and not for the better. I think prices for many watches have become silly, but this dosn’t seem to be a view that’s popular.

  28. #28
    Grand Master Chris_in_the_UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil.C View Post
    I wasn't talking so much about price rises as the way most people view watches as investments nowadays and the boring chat (plastic, AD waiting lists etc) that goes along with it.

    Your comparison with old AJS's is spurious. Who is now making movements for old Rolexes? There are no owners clubs and nobody doing deals with manufacturers for parts for vintage watches are there?

    It's apples and oranges.

    The fact is when these sorts of places were populated by genuine enthusiasts and not people trying to make a few bob off of the next "must have" the chat was far more interesting.
    I wholeheartedly agree Neil.

    Too many people image conscious and money driven,
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by magirus View Post
    The constant chatter about values, residuals etc is vacuous drivel. It's what watches are made of and what's inside them that's of interest.
    People chat about the things that interest them, and if chat about values and residuals is dominating discussions, then there is an obvious conclusion. That is now the flavour of the day because lots of people are interested in it.

  30. #30
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    The thing that everyone seems to forget is that the two spheres of this field "enthusiast" and "profit-making dealer" are not mutually exclusive. There are scales of both.
    For instance MWR is full of interesting people who have fascinating stories about restoring military watches from a whole plethora of parts carefully found and assembled, sometimes over years.
    And almost all of them make a significant profit from the watches they do this with.
    Dave

  31. #31
    Grand Master Chris_in_the_UK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    People chat about the things that interest them, and if chat about values and residuals is dominating discussions, then there is an obvious conclusion. That is now the flavour of the day because lots of people are interested in it.
    What you fail to take account of is the influence of the internet on the generation that are doing this, couple this to the fact that a large portion of members on here are readers rather than posters. Once the constant posting of dull, similar things gets to those who have posted over the years it's easy to see where things get skewed.

    Lot's of people?, I disagree.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  32. #32
    Craftsman TAFKARM's Avatar
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    My money in US Equities is an investment, I just want my watches to hold their value rather than haemorrhaging it.

  33. #33
    Master Mark020's Avatar
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    I sort of collect auctions catalogues from the 90ies and the prices then sometimes make me want to cry :-)

  34. #34
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_in_the_UK View Post
    What you fail to take account of is the influence of the internet on the generation that are doing this, couple this to the fact that a large portion of members on here are readers rather than posters. Once the constant posting of dull, similar things gets to those who have posted over the years it's easy to see where things get skewed.

    Lot's of people?, I disagree.
    Chris

    You cannot resist change, it happens. What is "dull and similar" to you is quite interesting to the new guy and they will almost certainly be replaced by someone else who will be obsessed with something else.

    Nothing lasts ever and that includes topical interests.

    Time to let go of the old order.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    Chris

    You cannot resist change, it happens. What is "dull and similar" to you is quite interesting to the new guy and they will almost certainly be replaced by someone else who will be obsessed with something else.

    Nothing lasts ever and that includes topical interests.

    Time to let go of the old order.
    The king is dead..... long live the king


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  36. #36
    Master
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    Everybody has a price point but with the endless supply of watches to keep the hobby going just switch brands, nobody’s interested in profit on this thread, or are they?




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  37. #37
    Grand Master MartynJC (UK)'s Avatar
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    I for one - recently bought a new watch from an Authorised Dealer for full retail (gasp!!!!!!!!). Just because I really liked the watch. What is this heresy - no buying off grey’s or negotiating a discount.

    I know I will ‘take a bath’ if I sell. So probably it will stay within the collection (along with a few others that I will never sell).

    So - do I buy for inverstment - not at all. It’s a hobby - it’s great of some appreciate but that is the main reason for by interest. It is a shame prices have risen too much over recent years - but with a shrinking market they have to raise revenue somehow -

    And as they say ‘SuperJets and Super.Yachts never go out of fashion’. So I guess SuperWatches for the SuperRich will always exist - others may die. Just my thoughts.

    Martyn

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