Stop Killing Cyclists

[cbh]

The only strange logic is you trying to suggest that pushing past a line of cars held at a red light with clear road ahead is no different to overtaking cars caught up in genuine congestion. Comments like that really do considerate cyclists NO favours.

We've already established that no one is pushing in, they are filtering in quite legally past a stationary line of traffic, bike are not cars so don't have to behave like one, if you'd like bikes to behave like a car then maybe they should ride in the middle of a lane giving you no chance of ever passing, that way no one would ever overtake would that make you happy?

[thegreatdogwood]

We've already established that no one is pushing in, they are filtering in quite legally past a stationary line of traffic, bike are not cars so don't have to behave like one, if you'd like bikes to behave like a car then maybe they should ride in the middle of a lane giving you no chance of ever passing, that way no one would ever overtake would that make you happy?

No, all that has been established is that cyclists use the words filtering and legal as justification for pushing in at red lights.

What would make me happy is if cyclists showed the same courtesy to motorists that they seem to demand in return. We'd all like to get to our destination as quickly as possibly which means cyclists should not push in when it means they are going to hold the same vehicles up again, in the same manner that I'm sure cyclists don't want motorists positioning their cars in a way that makes genuine filtering impossible when there is true congestion and cycles are quicker.

And that is coming from someone who is both a motorist and occasional cyclist.

[MrSmith]

“No, all that has been established is that cyclists use the words filtering and legal as justification for pushing in at red lights.
”
No. There is nothing to justify, if you take your logic nobody would filter or pass other traffic on a multi lane road, “pushing in” is what cars do when it goes from 2-3 lanes down to 1 and they merge at the last minute. How can a cyclist or motorbike push in when their direction or path would essentially be the same if the cars where there or not? (Apart from filtering slowly to allow for passing safely stationary or very slow moving cars)

[adg31]

“No, all that has been established is that cyclists use the words filtering and legal as justification for pushing in at red lights.
”
No. There is nothing to justify, if you take your logic nobody would filter or pass other traffic on a multi lane road, “pushing in” is what cars do when it goes from 2-3 lanes down to 1 and they merge at the last minute. How can a cyclist or motorbike push in when their direction or path would essentially be the same if the cars where there or not? (Apart from filtering slowly to allow for passing safely stationary or very slow moving cars)

How much time does a cyclist gain by moving to the front of a queue of say 20 cars held by a set of traffic lights compared to waiting in line with the other traffic?


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[MrSmith]

How much time does a cyclist gain by moving to the front of a queue of say 20 cars held by a set of traffic lights compared to waiting in line with the other traffic?


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No idea as I have never tried sitting behind cars with a stopwatch.

I can tell you I have caught up and passed cars repeatedly loads of times on my commute though.
Down to there being 57 sets of lights and the average traffic speed of about 12-13mph

[Gestarp]

We've already established that no one is pushing in, they are filtering in quite legally past a stationary line of traffic, bike are not cars so don't have to behave like one, if you'd like bikes to behave like a car then maybe they should ride in the middle of a lane giving you no chance of ever passing, that way no one would ever overtake would that make you happy?

that seems pretty normal behaviour from a lot of cyclists i see. especially on A roads. my favourite though is the swerving all over the road without warning and without looking, to avoid the slightest pothole regardless of size

[adg31]

No idea as I have never tried sitting behind cars with a stopwatch.

I can tell you I have caught up and passed cars repeatedly loads of times on my commute though.
Down to there being 57 sets of lights and the average traffic speed of about 12-13mph

So was the aggravation caused to the drivers of the cars you have repeatedly held up on your journey worth it given that it appears to have made little difference to your journey time?


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[grandconjuration]

that seems pretty normal behaviour from a lot of cyclists i see. especially on A roads. my favourite though is the swerving all over the road without warning and without looking, to avoid the slightest pothole regardless of size

This isn’t a problem for good drivers that obey rule 163 of the Highway Code.


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[Gestarp]

This isn’t a problem for good drivers that obey rule 163 of the Highway Code.


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if you think that rule in someway admonishes the cyclist from that behaviour, then we shall just have to disagree there.I like to think that i give cyclists plenty room and have had them swerve drastically as i'm over taking causing me to do the same. which isn't pleasant. certainly gets the heart pumping.

[Mj2k]

I’m all for bike riding.

But then I’m also all for the application of some common sense.

Almost every morning I sit in a queue of twenty or more cars trundling along at 10mph behind a solitary cyclist who has decided that it is his right to bike along a very busy major road in the height of rush hour and delay countless others on their way to work, and force them into risky overtaking manoeuvres they shouldn’t have to make.

A single selfish cyclist on a five mile pedal probably impedes the time critical journey of hundreds of commuters and creates risk where there shouldn’t need to be a risk.

Cycle in the evenings or at weekends by all means, just not at the height of rush hour on roads too narrow to enable safe passing. Mamils seem to think they have the right to put everyone else at risk, and delay their journeys for the sake of their hobby.

Completely agree with you & was going to post the same. The fact you’ve done it means I’m not going to bother with the remaining 130 posts.

A clear difference cycling in London, to reduce congestion in cycle lanes vs cycling in country lanes where all cyclists do is create congestion for other road users, particularly at rush hour.

A particular favourite of mine is 10mph in each direction due to a cyclist in each direction & complete inability to overtake for what is sometimes miles.

Tractors pull over to let queues of traffic pass them....maybe one for the cyclists to consider in similar circumstances...


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[grandconjuration]

Completely agree with you & was going to post the same. The fact you’ve done it means I’m not going to bother with the remaining 130 posts.

A clear difference cycling in London, to reduce congestion in cycle lanes vs cycling in country lanes where all cyclists do is create congestion for other road users, particularly at rush hour.

A particular favourite of mine is 10mph in each direction due to a cyclist in each direction & complete inability to overtake for what is sometimes miles.

Tractors pull over to let queues of traffic pass them....maybe one for the cyclists to consider in similar circumstances...


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You should provide some evidence to support your claim that cyclists create congestion. What proportion of road congestion is caused by cyclists? Please provide statistics and cite the source.


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[trident-7]

if you think that rule in someway admonishes the cyclist from that behaviour, then we shall just have to disagree there.I like to think that i give cyclists plenty room and have had them swerve drastically as i'm over taking causing me to do the same. which isn't pleasant. certainly gets the heart pumping.

The state of the public highway is appalling. There are potholes everywhere & I've seen some 4" deep. If you hit one in a car you feel a slight jolt. If you hit one of those on a bike it can be life-threatening. Plenty of cyclists have lost their lives through hitting potholes therefore they must be avoided. Personally I "bunny-hop" them if I see them in time. The council doesn't bother repairing them, they might come & spray a fluorescent yellow ring around them if you're lucky. In some cases the yellow ring is now fading because it's been there so long.

If you're overtaking a cyclist you should allow for this. If I'm in a car I treat the width of a cyclist about the same as that of a car. If it's not safe to pass a car I wouldn't pass a cyclist. If you take a cyclist out they're likely to end up dead, whereas you might just have a slight dent in your car.

[seadog1408]

^^^^^^^^^^ dent in the car?!!!, who the hell is going to pay for that if the cyclist is dead?

[Gestarp]

The state of the public highway is appalling. There are potholes everywhere & I've seen some 4" deep. If you hit one in a car you feel a slight jolt. If you hit one of those on a bike it can be life-threatening. Plenty of cyclists have lost their lives through hitting potholes therefore they must be avoided. Personally I "bunny-hop" them if I see them in time. The council doesn't bother repairing them, they might come & spray a fluorescent yellow ring around them if you're lucky. In some cases the yellow ring is now fading because it's been there so long.

If you're overtaking a cyclist you should allow for this. If I'm in a car I treat the width of a cyclist about the same as that of a car. If it's not safe to pass a car I wouldn't pass a cyclist. If you take a cyclist out they're likely to end up dead, whereas you might just have a slight dent in your car.

i've been driving for 30 years and not once had an accident that was my fault (been rear ended twice) so i think i know how to pass a cyclist. if a cyclist wants to swerve like a crazy then that is not my lookout especially if i've given him plenty of room. the state of the roads is a concern for all road users. so if a cyclist wants to use them with equipment thats not up to the condition of the road then he should buy a bike that is or not use the one that isn't. I driven over some large potholes and the resulting shock going through the car was more than a little bump. again if cyclists want to take them on thats there lookout not mine

[ralphy]

I've just read through the entire thread and IMO this is the most salient post. By far.

The answer is for all road users and pedestrians to have more respect for each other, and to obey the laws that are already in place.
Pete

R

[Franky Four Fingers]

One of my basic gripes about cyclist is that they do certain things just because they can.
We were taking my sons girlfriend back home a few weekends ago with the wife when 2 cyclists were going in the opposite direction along a very busy road side by side.
When I passed them they were taking up most of the carriageway.
I dropped off my boys girlfriend which is about 5 miles up the road and by the time I had turned around and caught back up with them they were still in exactly the same position i.e. Side by side taking up most of the carriageway.
We were caught behind them I would say for over a mile and eventually they turned off and went the other way.
They were complete happy without a care in the world chatting away taking up the whole carriageway holding up countless cars.
Whilst I'm sure the law is completely on their side I would in the situation have pulled in behind my mate and made it easier for others to pass,
It's this kind of attitude that p***es me off about cyclist

[MrSmith]

So was the aggravation caused to the drivers of the cars you have repeatedly held up on your journey worth it given that it appears to have made little difference to your journey time?


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You really are myopic aren’t you! Did you selectively ignore the bit about 57 sets of lights to go through and an average traffic speed of 12-13mph ?????

And how fast do you think the traffic would be if those on bikes (or buses) were in cars?

Don’t bother answering that as I’m not interested in replying to obvious trolls.

[adg31]

You really are myopic aren’t you! Did you selectively ignore the bit about 57 sets of lights to go through and an average traffic speed of 12-13mph ?????

And how fast do you think the traffic would be if those on bikes (or buses) were in cars?

Don’t bother answering that as I’m not interested in replying to obvious trolls.

Sorry to ignore your unwarranted myopic troll insult - a first time for everything so thank you for a new experience - but do you not think that traffic speeds would increase if cars were not being repeatedly held up behind slower moving cyclists?



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[cbh]

No, all that has been established is that cyclists use the words filtering and legal as justification for pushing in at red lights.

What would make me happy is if cyclists showed the same courtesy to motorists that they seem to demand in return. We'd all like to get to our destination as quickly as possibly which means cyclists should not push in when it means they are going to hold the same vehicles up again, in the same manner that I'm sure cyclists don't want motorists positioning their cars in a way that makes genuine filtering impossible when there is true congestion and cycles are quicker.

And that is coming from someone who is both a motorist and occasional cyclist.

Just because you overtake another road user that doesn't give you special dispensation not be be re-overtaken, that's not how the roads work, or maybe you expect a cyclist to make a note of all the vehicles that have overtaken them so as not to upset them further down the road!

Other than not being killed what courtesy are cyclists demanding of you?

And that is coming from someone who is both a motorist (15k a year) and occasional cyclist.

[bwest76]

I nearly killed a cyclist tonight,no lights,dark street he was dressed in black.

He came up my inside as I was diligently negotiating a roundabout with a narrow exit road he must have just sped across.
I swerved at the last minute nearly hit another car,if it was daytime I could have hit a pedestrian.

I lost my temper big time,I don’t want to kill anyone.
I value his life more than he does [for a set of lights and common sense].

[Captain Morgan]

i've been driving for 30 years and not once had an accident that was my fault (been rear ended twice) so i think i know how to pass a cyclist. if a cyclist wants to swerve like a crazy then that is not my lookout especially if i've given him plenty of room. the state of the roads is a concern for all road users. so if a cyclist wants to use them with equipment thats not up to the condition of the road then he should buy a bike that is or not use the one that isn't. I driven over some large potholes and the resulting shock going through the car was more than a little bump. again if cyclists want to take them on thats there lookout not mine

I’ve been driving almost 30 years and I was advised to try and give cyclists 6 foot of space when overtaking back when learning to drive, these days I endever to cross to the other lane as you would overtaking a car.

The thought of seriously injuring or killing someone because I hadn’t left enough space doesn’t bare thinking about.
Leaving that kind of gap allows me a margin of error for unforeseen events on my offside as well as issues with the cyclist on my nearside.

[Captain Morgan]

I nearly killed a cyclist tonight,no lights,dark street he was dressed in black.

He came up my inside as I was diligently negotiating a roundabout with a narrow exit road he must have just sped across.
I swerved at the last minute nearly hit another car,if it was daytime I could have hit a pedestrian.

I lost my temper big time,I don’t want to kill anyone.
I value his life more than he does [for a set of lights and common sense].

Sadly there are cyclists who do this, and with less and less police presence on the roads there are no officers there to educate and enforce the law.

No helmet okay a personal choice, no lights and dark clothes is Darwinian and could have a massive impact on anyone involved in a collision with them. Sadly there are twonks everywhere not just on two wheels.

[Gestarp]

I’ve been driving almost 30 years and I was advised to try and give cyclists 6 foot of space when overtaking back when learning to drive, these days I endever to cross to the other lane as you would overtaking a car.

The thought of seriously injuring or killing someone because I hadn’t left enough space doesn’t bare thinking about.
Leaving that kind of gap allows me a margin of error for unforeseen events on my offside as well as issues with the cyclist on my nearside.

6ft is just over the requirement by the highway code its not a great distance. any mentalist on a bike who goes pot hole dancing, if he crashes the bike at the wrong moment when you are overtaking will be under the car in the blink of an eye. i hope it never happens to me but if it did. my conscience will be clear

[lughugger]

One of my basic gripes about cyclist is that they do certain things just because they can.
We were taking my sons girlfriend back home a few weekends ago with the wife when 2 cyclists were going in the opposite direction along a very busy road side by side.
When I passed them they were taking up most of the carriageway.
I dropped off my boys girlfriend which is about 5 miles up the road and by the time I had turned around and caught back up with them they were still in exactly the same position i.e. Side by side taking up most of the carriageway.
We were caught behind them I would say for over a mile and eventually they turned off and went the other way.
They were complete happy without a care in the world chatting away taking up the whole carriageway holding up countless cars.
Whilst I'm sure the law is completely on their side I would in the situation have pulled in behind my mate and made it easier for others to pass,
It's this kind of attitude that p***es me off about cyclist

I am a cyclist and MAMIL and this type of behaviour infuriates me too. It used to be that the entry to sport cycling was through a club and road etiquette would be explained by senior club members. Audax clubs would do the same.
It does seem that over the last 10 years or so many new cyclists have bypassed these entry routes to the sport and ride with arrogance.


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[bry nylon]

What I should have made clearer when I started this thread was one of the main aims of the 'Stop Killing Cyclists' campaign group. I was focusing on some dreadful cases that I had read about on https://road.cc/ and that prompted me to post and paste a link about 'SKC's upcoming demo in London which was held last Saturday the 13th of October.

The main aim of the pressure group is to secure 10% of the transport budget (3 billion pounds quoted), for safer cycling facilities.
This would encourage more people to ditch their cars and cycle, if they felt it was safer to do so with more dedicated safe spaces and routes.
The effect of this would be to cut pollution and combat the obesity crisis that we are facing in the UK. The campaign group feel that 3 billion spent on more dedicated safe cycling spaces /routes would have a great impact and would be far better value for money than say the billions that will be spent on the high speed rail line ;HS2. Just checked and according to Wikipedia the latest estimate for HS2 is 56 billion pounds..

They want to copy the Dutch model;

A few decades ago, the Dutch campaigned to reduce road danger, especially for young people that chose to walk or cycle, under the banner ‘Stop the Child Murder’ (‘Stop de kindermoord’) – it had an effect: after years of persistence the Dutch got their cycle paths.

[bwest76]

I wouldn’t cross the road on foot without looking both ways and taking care nor run out into the road.

So why when cycling would you ride out onto a major road without looking,go from left to right without looking,cycle off the pavement straight into the road without looking,cycle across a red light at speed without looking.
All these things I see regularly and worse.

I would suggest quite a few lives/injury’s could be save with cyclists just using common sense.

[Saint-Just]

I believe it’s called natural selection. But it remains a tragedy for the non responsible victim, whether on the bike or in the car. And for the families.
But you cannot fix stupid.

[Xantiagib]

6ft is just over the requirement by the highway code its not a great distance. any mentalist on a bike who goes pot hole dancing, if he crashes the bike at the wrong moment when you are overtaking will be under the car in the blink of an eye. i hope it never happens to me but if it did. my conscience will be clear

1.5m is recommended now thats under 6ft - Heck would be nice to get 50cm sometimes - every day on my commute to from work I get at least one close call - I am so tempted to put metal studs on the edges of my shoes/gloves to deliberately scratch cars that get too close - i'm submissive most of the time - you have to be - you have a bike; they have a car - don't take a knife to a gunfight

everyone here who doesn't cycle needs to cycle in said traffic they are moaning about for a month then come back and make comments ...
likewise cyclists need to use the car for a month and then comment again - you'll remember why you cycle and need bloodpressure pills ...
pedestrians - stop crossing the road where you shouldn't and wear brighter clothes when its dark and look away from the phone when walking down the street ffs ...

my favourite - pedestrian pushes button to cross the the zebra crossing, the light goes red, I stop (bike or car) they cross walking BEHIND me in a non perpendicular way to the zebra crossing... thereby sitting at the red light with no one crossing directly infront

[rfrazier]

Does adhering to speed limits count as relevant to good driving? If so, then there is little of it about. I live on a relatively short residential road. The (clearly) posted speed limit is 20mph. It is sometimes used to cut across from one main road to another, albeit, it isn't a clear shot (involves turns). In any case, of the 3 cars I saw on it when I was cycling to work this morning, not one (0%) stayed within the speed limit. I seldom see anyone conform to the speed limit on it.

A number of cars passed me, not as carefully as one might like, but, given the traffic, I ended up (in a bicycle lane) passing those and about 20 others when things got congested. They didn't save any time at all by passing me. And it was obvious when they passed me that they wouldn't. Why do it then? Not that I mind, of course.

People are funny.

Best wishes,
Bob

[Gestarp]

1.5m is recommended now thats under 6ft - Heck would be nice to get 50cm sometimes - every day on my commute to from work I get at least one close call - I am so tempted to put metal studs on the edges of my shoes/gloves to deliberately scratch cars that get too close - i'm submissive most of the time - you have to be - you have a bike; they have a car - don't take a knife to a gunfight

everyone here who doesn't cycle needs to cycle in said traffic they are moaning about for a month then come back and make comments
likewise cyclists need to use the car for a month and then comment again
pedestrians - stop crossing the road where you shouldn't and wear brighter clothes and look away from the phone when walking down the street ffs

Why would I want to cycle in crazy traffic 10 miles along an A road,with narrowing lanes that is used by cars, buses and large HGV’s, in winter just to turn up at work, dirty sweaty and soaking wet. I’ll stick to the relative warm, comfort and dry of the car. I don’t need to cycle for a month to know that my journey to work on a bike is fraught with danger. But if others want to do that then that’s fine by me but I won’t lose sleep when they come a cropper.

[Xantiagib]

Does adhering to speed limits count as relevant to good driving? If so, then there is little of it about. I live on a relatively short residential road. The (clearly) posted speed limit is 20mph. It is sometimes used to cut across from one main road to another, albeit, it isn't a clear shot (involves turns). In any case, of the 3 cars I saw on it when I was cycling to work this morning, not one (0%) stayed within the speed limit. I seldom see anyone conform to the speed limit on it.

A number of cars passed me, not as carefully as one might like, but, given the traffic, I ended up (in a bicycle lane) passing those and about 20 others when things got congested. They didn't save any time at all by passing me. And it was obvious when they passed me that they wouldn't. Why do it then? Not that I mind, of course.

People are funny.

Best wishes,
Bob

funny indeed - When the road is clear the vehicles will happily stick to the speed limit - put a bike in front going at the speed limit quite easily and consistently - and they just have to get past and the earliest and unsafest opporunity...!

I tend to stick to the speedlimit and speed up a bit when we pass a speeding camera - caught a few people out just having to have to pass me the cyclist... and they trigger the camera... passive agressive I know

Why would I want to cycle in crazy traffic 10 miles along an A road,with narrowing lanes that is used by cars, buses and large HGV’s, in winter just to turn up at work, dirty sweaty and soaking wet. I’ll stick to the relative warm, comfort and dry of the car. I don’t need to cycle for a month to know that my journey to work on a bike is fraught with danger. But if others want to do that then that’s fine by me but I won’t lose sleep when they come a cropper.

If you've tried both and one works for you better than the other then why would anyone expect anything else naturally

- If i take the car then I have to park 10 minutes walk away and traffic depending at least a 30 minute drive - sure its nice in winter with the music and heater on but its 40 minutes I won't have again - cycling to work - takes me 10 minutes door to door - don't get sweaty unless I push hard, and wet weather gear is bought on company clothing allowance.
I arrive clean and dry every day - it isnt a problem and they have showers too in the gym round the corner if i ever need to use them

[thegreatdogwood]

Just because you overtake another road user that doesn't give you special dispensation not be be re-overtaken, that's not how the roads work, or maybe you expect a cyclist to make a note of all the vehicles that have overtaken them so as not to upset them further down the road!

Other than not being killed what courtesy are cyclists demanding of you?

And that is coming from someone who is both a motorist (15k a year) and occasional cyclist.

Well when I cycle, I set the bar a bit higher and don't want a motorist to have an accident with me at all. I suspect most cyclists have that as a primary objective rather than not being killed which obviously follows if you don't have an accident.

Equally it is pure common sense that if you have held a load of traffic up then why "upset them further" by going to the front of a queue at red traffic lights when you know you are going to hold up the same traffic again.

[cbh]

Equally it is pure common sense that if you have held a load of traffic up then why "upset them further" by going to the front of a queue at red traffic lights when you know you are going to hold up the same traffic again.

That is not how the road works, ok so a bus on a single carrigeway road stops to pick up passengers along it's route, it's causing a queue behind, a couple of cars manage to pass everytime it stops, further down the road there's a bus lane are you suggesting that the bus shouldn't use that lane to gain advantage over the cars that previously overtook it?

[thegreatdogwood]

That is not how the road works, ok so a bus on a single carrigeway road stops to pick up passengers along it's route, it's causing a queue behind, a couple of cars manage to pass everytime it stops, further down the road there's a bus lane are you suggesting that the bus shouldn't use that lane to gain advantage over the cars that previously overtook it?

Hardly comparable and you can see that's not what I have suggested.

One is a public service vehicle of benefit to the community weighing 5+ tonnes that has been given it's own lane in order to ferry multiple passengers as reliably as possible against a timetable. It would also be an urban setting prone to congestion to have a bus lane.

The scenario we have actually been debating is an individual cyclist on a free flowing single lane road where it is difficult to overtake safely and the cyclist is actually holding up all the traffic (including buses given it is single carriageway and no bus lane). The cyclist is skin and bones that would come off worst in any collision yet has chosen to go to the front of the queue at red lights where there is no cycle lane or ASL at a location that will then delay the same motorists ("upset them further") in trying to find a safe place to overtake.

[Jeremy67]

It takes me anything between 30 & 80 minutes to commute 11 miles to work by car. On my bike it takes 28-32 minutes depending on wind direction. I regularly pass over 300 cars on the bike (yes I've counted) either by overtaking or riding legally up the bus lane. Do you seriously expect cyclists to sit in line in a queue of motor vehicles? That's one of the benefits of riding a bike. Maybe more people should try it, they might arrive at work full of endorphins with a feeling of well being, rather than stressed out & wound up with frustration looking for a scapegoat to blame.

I sit in line when I'm on a bike, those cars are waiting to use a resource (typically a junction) by moving to the front you will use that resource before the people who got their before you, irrespective of their mode of transport.

[cbh]

Hardly comparable and you can see that's not what I have suggested.

Nonsense, it's exactly the same

[thegreatdogwood]

Nonsense, it's exactly the same

In the words of John McEnroe, you cannot be serious?

[cbh]

In the words of John McEnroe, you cannot be serious?

You say that it's bad form for a bike to re-overtake a vehicle that has previously overtaken it, but that it's ok for a bus, the principle is the same, just the vehicle is different.

[thegreatdogwood]

You say that it's bad form for a bike to re-overtake a vehicle that has previously overtaken it, but that it's ok for a bus, the principle is the same, just the vehicle is different.

Actually a number of us say that, for instance see post #235 from another cyclist. And they are completely different scenarios.

[cbh]

Actually a number of us say that, for instance see post #235 from another cyclist. And they are completely different scenarios.

I absolutely accept that some cyclists may well sit in, and not overtake/filter to the front of a queue, that's not to say that they have to do it, they choose to.

The point of being on a bike is not to get caught up in motorised traffic jams, not to add to it!

[Captain Morgan]

Why would I want to cycle in crazy traffic 10 miles along an A road,with narrowing lanes that is used by cars, buses and large HGV’s, in winter just to turn up at work, dirty sweaty and soaking wet. I’ll stick to the relative warm, comfort and dry of the car. I don’t need to cycle for a month to know that my journey to work on a bike is fraught with danger. But if others want to do that then that’s fine by me but I won’t lose sleep when they come a cropper.

Have you ever considered apart from health and environmental reasons there are still many people who can’t affort to drive?

Your post is a superb illustration of lack of empathy and possibly low EQ.

[rfrazier]

Have you ever considered apart from health and environmental reasons there are still many people who can’t affort to drive?

Your post is a superb illustration of lack of empathy and possibly low EQ.

Not to speak of the possibility that the world can't afford to have me behind the wheel of a car. ;)

(I found ordinary driving boring, so I always had to suppress a temptation to do something to liven it up a bit. )

Best wishes,
Bob

[NikGixer750]

I have not read the entire thread but from my point of view as a cyclist is things have gotten much worse recently. Years ago most cyclist had good road sense then the cycling scheme blew up and the roads are much busier and the mentality of the cyclist seem to have changed. I often see cyclist 3-4 abreast riding down a country lane just chatting away for mile after mile paying no attention to the ever growing line of cars behind them. Then when a car goes past and beeps its horn the cyclist get all angry!! Someone posted a video (maybe on here) of a cyclist swerving time and time again to stop a car going past, something must have happened before that part of the video was shown but still on another day the driver could have had enough and knocked him off. I think cyclist often forget then have little to no protection and a car will easily kill / serious harm them!

I use to cycle in a club and we always called out for cars and people went single file, waved cars past etc and we had very little road rage aimed at us.

[grandconjuration]

It appears that some on here have been misinformed. When receiving their driving licence, granting them the privilege of using a motor vehicle on public roads, they were told that there aren’t slower vehicles that might occasionally delay them momentarily.

[Gestarp]

Have you ever considered apart from health and environmental reasons there are still many people who can’t affort to drive?

Your post is a superb illustration of lack of empathy and possibly low EQ.

I could word this post more strongly. But as it’s not the bear pit I can’t.(and that I don’t have access to it) I’m glad you have such high reasoning and deduction skills that from a few short sentences you can deduce that I have no empathy and a lack of EQ. Forget that you have never met me for a single second or know anything about me. I’m sure your higher state of thinking is in such high demand from all sorts of dark and secret government depts that only has initials as a moniker, that I’m surprised you can grace a lowly Internet forum with your skills. But I’m for one am grateful you have. As I will take you last comment and disect the last 40 odd years of my life and make amends.

[Kingstepper]

Have you ever considered apart from health and environmental reasons there are still many people who can’t affort to drive?

Your post is a superb illustration of lack of empathy and possibly low EQ.

Low EQ?

[Gestarp]

Low EQ?

Emotional intelligence

[cbh]

I could word this post more strongly. But as it’s not the bear pit I can’t.(and that I don’t have access to it) I’m glad you have such high reasoning and deduction skills that from a few short sentences you can deduce that I have no empathy and a lack of EQ. Forget that you have never met me for a single second or know anything about me. I’m sure your higher state of thinking is in such high demand from all sorts of dark and secret government depts that only has initials as a moniker, that I’m surprised you can grace a lowly Internet forum with your skills. But I’m for one am grateful you have. As I will take you last comment and disect the last 40 odd hours of my life and make amends.

Did you not mean this then?

Why would I want to cycle in crazy traffic 10 miles along an A road,with narrowing lanes that is used by cars, buses and large HGV’s, in winter just to turn up at work, dirty sweaty and soaking wet. I’ll stick to the relative warm, comfort and dry of the car. I don’t need to cycle for a month to know that my journey to work on a bike is fraught with danger. But if others want to do that then that’s fine by me but I won’t lose sleep when they come a cropper.

Low EQ?

https://www.arealme.com/eq/en/

[Gestarp]

Did you not mean this then?





https://www.arealme.com/eq/en/

if thats your take on it. and you also think i'm emotionally retarded because i wont lose sleep when someone dies in an accident, then crack on. i see accidents almost on a daily basis as probably do most folk. do i know if those accidents result in a death no. is it upsetting to me no. and probably to most folks its not. they just rubber neck have a look and move on with their day. its how the modern world is.

[Captain Morgan]

I could word this post more strongly. But as it’s not the bear pit I can’t.(and that I don’t have access to it) I’m glad you have such high reasoning and deduction skills that from a few short sentences you can deduce that I have no empathy and a lack of EQ. Forget that you have never met me for a single second or know anything about me. I’m sure your higher state of thinking is in such high demand from all sorts of dark and secret government depts that only has initials as a moniker, that I’m surprised you can grace a lowly Internet forum with your skills. But I’m for one am grateful you have. As I will take you last comment and disect the last 40 odd hours of my life and make amends.

I seem to have touched a nerve here, not my intention. For the record I didn’t say that you had no empathy just that I believed you were lacking in it and that’s often an indicator of lower EQ. Not everyone is same we don’t all have equal ability’s some of us have greater levels of empathy and are lacking in other areas it’s the way of the world.

To be fair the lack of empathy seems a reasonable observation when you’ve been indicating that while you hope it doesn’t happen, you have no issues if a cyclist comes a cropper or ends up under your car in the blink of an eye as your conscience would be clear.

The intimation of cyclists getting what the deserve for swerving around and failing to smash through pot holes with unsuitable equipment also coloured my observation.

As did the stance that the cyclists are operating out of choice rather than a need, be that lack of access to a car, poor or nonexistent public transport or a distance too far to cover by foot.

That said I’m not stranger to the pit so happy to move there if you like, i’ll be cycling and depending on the time might have a few snifters on route, please try not to mow me down if I get a touch swervey on the way