Well it made me feel better

[Gee252]

Wasting your time, too many folk on here with little regard for cyclists.

Both ways pal, like I say respect is a two way street ain't it ?

[Captain Morgan]

Both ways pal, like I say respect is a two way street ain't it ?

You’re no pal of mine. Show respect to cyclists by passing safely & courtesy then.

[Gee252]

You’re no pal of mine. Show respect to cyclists by passing safely & courtesy then.

Works both ways don't it ? Let Cyclist (or should I say some as I don't stereo type) start showing respect and.may help in perceiving you all in a better way.
Oh and by the way won't lose no sleep.if your not my pal :)

[Captain Morgan]

Works both ways don't it ? Let Cyclist (or should I say some as I don't stereo type) start showing respect and.may help in perceiving you all in a better way.
Oh and by the way won't lose no sleep.if your not my pal :)

Sounds like you might want to sleep something off...

[murkeywaters]

Whats with all the liquid fear, a bloody lycra clad cyclist is hardly going to be carrying hydrofluoric acid in his water bottle is he, some people are so over sensitive, if its on the news lets all panic about it!

Road rage is really not worth it, everyone is hard and angry until they are face to face in the street out of their tin safety shells or pedalling away in fear, If you got the nerve to shout out abuse have the balls to back up your words.

The lorry driver might have been an uneducated character but in this situation he was a bigger man than you.

[woodacre1983]

Works both ways don't it ? Let Cyclist (or should I say some as I don't stereo type) start showing respect and.may help in perceiving you all in a better way.
Oh and by the way won't lose no sleep.if your not my pal :)

You learn much on the replica watch guide forum gee? Into replica watches are we?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[halfpasttwothirty]

Cyclists can be their own worst PR ambassadors. Around our way it’s common for the Lycra crowd to ride in bunches of 15 or 20 odd 3 or 4 abreast. This can cause vehicles having little chance of overtaking on some busy roads and leading to frustration and bad feeling.
If I overtook them and then slowed down impeding their speed I’m guessing they wouldn’t be impressed either.

*Some cyclists.

[Gee252]

You learn much on the replica watch guide forum gee? Into replica watches are we?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I learn alot from everywhere if that's ok with you ?
Since when has what i am allowed to look at or be interested in be any of your business, please enlighten me. Your not my keeper are you?

If this debate is so touchy you have to try disrespect other members that is your problem not mine.

Any issues members of this forum have with me, I'm only a PM away.

[Tifa]

It has made me buy a helmet cam ......

And that stops you getting knocked off your bike and crushed?
How?

[MrSmith]

Cyclists can be their own worst PR ambassadors. Around our way it’s common for the Lycra crowd to ride in bunches of 15 or 20 odd 3 or 4 abreast. This can cause vehicles having little chance of overtaking on some busy roads and leading to frustration and bad feeling.
If I overtook them and then slowed down impeding their speed I’m guessing they wouldn’t be impressed either.

Round my way cars clog the roads for several hours both morning and evening and most of the weekend, they sit there fuming at the traffic thinking everyone else is the problem.

People amaze me sometimes only it’s not in any way due to their enlightenment.

[Gee252]

You learn much on the replica watch guide forum gee? Into replica watches are we?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Oh and here is just a few of my replica watches
pal!

Sent from my Mi MIX 2 using Tapatalk

[Yeti]

Typical cyclist superiority complex throughout this thread. Some truly nasty individuals. Like to mock the working man for driving a hgv and other cyclists openly admit to throwing dog poo into someone’s car..a 70 year old man at that. Bet that was nice for the old boy because you deemed him to have driven too close yet he didn’t touch you or cause you to have an accident. Definition of a nasty to**er you are...

[Omegamanic]

Some cyclists make me ashamed to ride my bike. If someone walk past you in a bar and nudged your arm (oh sorry they were close enough that if you stuck your elbow out then they might have nudged your arm) and then you poured your drink over them - then I think you deserve the hiding you should have got for those actions.

For some reason some cyclists can’t convey calmly to a driver how vulnerable they were made to feel - rightly or wrongly - they just get all shouty and self righteous and wonder why some drivers want to give them a kicking.

[Gee252]

Some cyclists make me ashamed to ride my bike. If someone walk past you in a bar and nudged your arm (oh sorry they were close enough that if you stuck your elbow out then they might have nudged your arm) and then you poured your drink over them - then I think you deserve the hiding you should have got for those actions.

For some reason some cyclists can’t convey calmly to a driver how venerable they were made to feel - rightly or wrongly - they just get all shouty and self righteous and wonder why some drivers want to give them a kicking.

Well said, cyclist are far from perfect (just as much as are HGV or car drivers not ) let's face it none of us are.
I have for the past 12 months played a big part in our organisation in training our HGV drivers on vulnerable road users (Cyclist an pedestrians alike) but this thread has just proved to me that most Cyclist (not all by the way!) are just selfish!!

[The_Perfect_Sandwich]

A few (not all) lorry drivers are nasty, aggressive and inconsiderate on the road.

A few (not all) cyclists are nasty, aggressive and inconsiderate on the road.

This is a story about the bad kind of cyclist meeting the bad kind of lorry driver.


Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app

[Martylaa]

I ride a bike sometimes, yes there has been the odd time with something too close but no point getting mad.

But I will say this, those who ride in packs of say 10/15 or more riding three or four abreast in the roads holding up traffic behind them refusing to ride single file to let them pass are pure selfish a...holes!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Captain Morgan]

Well said, cyclist are far from perfect (just as much as are HGV or car drivers not ) let's face it none of us are.
I have for the past 12 months played a big part in our organisation in training our HGV drivers on vulnerable road users (Cyclist an pedestrians alike) but this thread has just proved to me that most Cyclist (not all by the way!) are just selfish!!

You are right, none of us are perfect, I believe that significant minority of motorists see a cyclist as a ‘thing’ an inconvenience that needs to be shown no quarter and gets what they deserve. Some others are simply poor drivers that are unaware of their actions and the impact that has on a cyclist.

Most cyclists are also drivers, most drivers are not cyclists, if you stop and consider the impact of having a couple of tons whizz a couple of inches past your elbow at 30 plus mph and the implications on them both if something went wrong it might be easier to understand why red mist can happen to some cyclists, especially after being endangered by other road users, after all no ones perfect, not even cyclists.

I hope the training program showed more patience and less bias that your posts on here.

[oldoakknives]

I ride a bike sometimes, yes there has been the odd time with something too close but no point getting mad.

But I will say this, those who ride in packs of say 10/15 or more riding three or four abreast in the roads holding up traffic behind them refusing to ride single file to let them pass are pure selfish a...holes!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Exactly. Try slowing down in front of them and see how patient they would be.

[oldoakknives]

Round my way cars clog the roads for several hours both morning and evening and most of the weekend, they sit there fuming at the traffic thinking everyone else is the problem.

People amaze me sometimes only it’s not in any way due to their enlightenment.

And your point is, apart from you live somewhere where there is a lot of traffic?

[TBKBABAB]

OP Lorry driver should have given you more space but, doing 27mph on a country road and below nearly 30 on a steep down hill single car width country lane and it definitely is your fault that you can't hear him, sounds stupidly fast do you have any idea what you're braking distance is at that speed on a steep downhill gradient?
If you want to do these kind of speeds get an exercise bike. This is becoming more common near us cyclists just obsessed with how fast they can go with little regard to safety or other road users.

A car driver did similar to me recently. He overtook me with inches to spare on a single car width country lane while I was going nearly 30 mph down a steep hill. Worst overtake I’ve ever suffered while cycling. He then pulled up outside a house at the bottom of the hill so I stopped and confronted him. He was a typical never wrong middle class 70 year old know it all gammon type. Apparently the road was clear ahead so in his opinion it was fine to squeeze past me and it’s not his fault that at 30mph with the wind in my ears I can’t hear him approach from behind. If I fell off and died it would be completely my fault so I should just f@ck off. He then darted into the house and slammed the door. This was only a mile or so from where I live as it was at the end of a long ride. I walked past the house later in the day when walking my dog. In my hand was a poo bag nicely full of a recently deposited pile of turd by my faithful spaniel. The car was still parked on the street outside the house and I noticed the drivers side window was half way down. Without thinking too much, except that I was still furious, I emptied the contents of the poo bag onto the drivers seat and continued rapidly on my way. Felt like a proportionate response to his attempt at killing me. Hope he sat in it. My wife thought it was a fantastic response (I expected her to be disgusted with me but as a fellow cyclist she felt it was the least I could do!).

[KavKav]

I agree he should definitely have given you more space but your best course of action in this situation would be to focus on your own safety and if that means hopping up on the kerb, slowing down or otherwise distancing yourself then that was what you should have done. Asserting your ‘right to the road’ in circumstances like this can often end badly and given your spraying and subsequent mocking of the driver, I think you were very fortunate that he was unable to get a fist on your collar.

[Captain Morgan]

OP Lorry driver should have given you more space but, doing 27mph on a country road and below nearly 30 on a steep down hill single car width country lane and it definitely is your fault that you can't hear him, sounds stupidly fast do you have any idea what you're braking distance is at that speed on a steep downhill gradient?
If you want to do these kind of speeds get an exercise bike. This is becoming more common near us cyclists just obsessed with how fast they can go with little regard to safety or other road users.

Have new speed regulations been introduced for cyclists?

Too slow and it’s the cyclist fault for causing an obstruction, too fast and their a menace.

I’m not sure what the cyclist speed has to do with being a passed in a dangerous manner?
Do you have any idea of the stopping distance for bicycles?


EDIT:
It seems that the stopping distance for a bike at 30mph is 10.4m, the Highway Code give a cars breaking distance as 23m. Even assuming that cars significantly improve on the Highway Code figure I bet its not what you were expecting?

Cycle figure take from here http://www.exploratorium.edu/cycling/brakes2.html

[MrSmith]

Have new speed regulations been introduced for cyclists?

Too slow and it’s the cyclist fault for causing an obstruction, too fast and their a menace.

I’m not sure what the cyclist speed has to do with being a passed in a dangerous manner?
Do you have any idea of the stopping distance for bicycles?


EDIT:
It seems that the stopping distance for a bike at 30mph is 10.4m, the Highway Code give a cars breaking distance as 23m. Even assuming that cars significantly improve on the Highway Code figure I bet its not what you were expecting?

Cycle figure take from here http://www.exploratorium.edu/cycling/brakes2.html

No need to go into detail, it’s called victim blaming.
Standard response especially in the media.

[Tifa]

Oh and here is just a few of my replica watches
pal!

They almost look like the real thing.

[TBKBABAB]

Did I say speed has anything to do with with being passed in a dangerous way, if you actually read my post that’s why I started it with he should have given you more more space.

Doesn't matter what the speed limit is doesn’t mean you should always go at that speed whether in a car or on a bike and don’t think they are really aimed at cyclists and a lot of the campaigning to reduce speed limits on urban and country roads is lead by cycling groups. You should always be going at a safe speed for the road and conditions whether it’s a car or bike.

10.4m is complete rubbish depends on brakes/tyres/weight of rider and bike/road surface type and on incline distance will be considerably longer plus you have to add reaction time which at 30mph is about 9m which is included in the Highway Code figures you quote for an average family car, not sure how quickly you would stop once you’ve gone over the handlebars.
I would guess that a car with abs doing 30 down hill will stop quicker than a bike especially with abs.

Have new speed regulations been introduced for cyclists?

Too slow and it’s the cyclist fault for causing an obstruction, too fast and their a menace.

I’m not sure what the cyclist speed has to do with being a passed in a dangerous manner?
Do you have any idea of the stopping distance for bicycles?


EDIT:
It seems that the stopping distance for a bike at 30mph is 10.4m, the Highway Code give a cars breaking distance as 23m. Even assuming that cars significantly improve on the Highway Code figure I bet its not what you were expecting?

Cycle figure take from here http://www.exploratorium.edu/cycling/brakes2.html

[sprite1275]

Trouble is no one wants to stop or slow down. For a cyclist it takes a lot of energy to get back up to speed, a truck driver has to go down multiple gears and takes a while to get back up to speed and when sitting in your car nice and comfy you have to stretch that left leg and press the brake with your right leg then change gear.... It's all just an effort. There is no excuse for any of it. I've been guilty of it and have had it done to me in the past. I try to chill out more these days on the roads as it's just not worth the agro.

Regards the cyclists in packs it is far more safe for them to ride 3/4 a breast if there is more than say 6/7 of them. I wouldn't like to try over taking a 200yard long cycling train. It's the cyclists where there is only 2/4 of them when they ride side by side that I think there is no need.

[Gee252]

You are right, none of us are perfect, I believe that significant minority of motorists see a cyclist as a ‘thing’ an inconvenience that needs to be shown no quarter and gets what they deserve. Some others are simply poor drivers that are unaware of their actions and the impact that has on a cyclist.

Most cyclists are also drivers, most drivers are not cyclists, if you stop and consider the impact of having a couple of tons whizz a couple of inches past your elbow at 30 plus mph and the implications on them both if something went wrong it might be easier to understand why red mist can happen to some cyclists, especially after being endangered by other road users, after all no ones perfect, not even cyclists.

I hope the training program showed more patience and less bias that your posts on here.

Patience and bias works both ways don't you think?
Do you show the same to other road users?

[Groundrush]

Cyclists are crazy. They voluntarily engage in an activity that requires them to pass off all responsibility for their own safety to everyone else and then wonder why some people don't take their safety quite as seriously as they obviously don't.

[Captain Morgan]

Did I say speed has anything to do with with being passed in a dangerous way, if you actually read my post that’s why I started it with he should have given you more more space.

Doesn't matter what the speed limit is doesn’t mean you should always go at that speed whether in a car or on a bike and don’t think they are really aimed at cyclists and a lot of the campaigning to reduce speed limits on urban and country roads is lead by cycling groups. You should always be going at a safe speed for the road and conditions whether it’s a car or bike.

10.4m is complete rubbish depends on brakes/tyres/weight of rider and bike/road surface type and on incline distance will be considerably longer plus you have to add reaction time which at 30mph is about 9m which is included in the Highway Code figures you quote for an average family car, not sure how quickly you would stop once you’ve gone over the handlebars.
I would guess that a car with abs doing 30 down hill will stop quicker than a bike especially with abs.

There was an intimation that if they had been traveling slower they would have heard the truck, if they heard the truck they could have avoided the truck passing closely, perhaps I misunderstood. How did you believe being passed dangerously closely by a truck could be improved by hearing its approach/

Do you cycle?
If not what are you basing your assertion that brakes/tyres/weight of rider and bike/road surface type and incline will impact the stopping distance and to what extent do you belive they affect braking?

Are you also asserting that brakes/tyres/weight of load and motor vehicle/ road surface type and and incline do not affect the braking of motor vehicles?

I’m still unclear why it’s inherently safe for a motor vehicle to drive at 30mph down a single lane but it’s inherently unsafe and/or reckless for a cyclist to do the same, could you explain?

It is not unreasonable in my opinion to assume that the majority of riders who undertake such riding have a reasonable level of skill and equipment in such a case one would expect safe and effective braking, would you not.

[Captain Morgan]

Patience and bias works both ways don't you think?
Do you show the same to other road users?

I believe I do,

Could you help my understand how cyclists who are passed illegally (<1.5m) could show more patience and bias to improve their situation?

[MrSmith]

Cyclists are crazy. They voluntarily engage in an activity that requires them to pass off all responsibility for their own safety to everyone else and then wonder why some people don't take their safety quite as seriously as they obviously don't.

You are either a part of the problem or the solution.
Basically the bike isn’t going away no matter how much the ingrained ‘car is king’ culture prevails because it’s slowly changing and the more people cycle as well as drive the easier it gets.
Motorists should take everyone’s safety seriously, obviously they don’t because we all see speeding/innatention/mobile phone use on a daily basis but cyclists often make good motorists because they understand the vulnerability of not sitting in a cosseted metal box. (There are dickheads out there whatever mode of transport they use)

As for “voluntarily engaging in an activity that requires them to pass off all responsibility for their own safety” ? Well if that’s the case you need to blame pedestrians for leaving the house, after all motorists kill 400 of them and cause injury to many more every year.

[TBKBABAB]

1 No intimation by me and again you are replying before fully reading, the reference to not being able to hear was by someone doing close to 30 mph down hill and being passed by a car. But if you can hear and have awareness of what is around you have better chance to avoid dangerous situations.

2 Physics, If you don’t believe braking going down hill will take longer then you shouldn’t be on the road at all.

3.No, and I didn’t assert that, but a car will have advantages with bigger contact patch and abs etc.

4. Same reply as above although if it was sharp incline single lane don’t think I would be doing 30
as I said whatever your form of transport you should be travelling at a safe speed for the road and conditions.

5.No don’t think I do agree or would assume that, If you buy a Ferrari and have some driving instruction doesn’t mean you should drive It at 150mph on the road you need to go on a track day to try that.

There was an intimation that if they had been traveling slower they would have heard the truck, if they heard the truck they could have avoided the truck passing closely, perhaps I misunderstood. How did you believe being passed dangerously closely by a truck could be improved by hearing its approach/

Do you cycle?
If not what are you basing your assertion that brakes/tyres/weight of rider and bike/road surface type and incline will impact the stopping distance and to what extent do you belive they affect braking?

Are you also asserting that brakes/tyres/weight of load and motor vehicle/ road surface type and and incline do not affect the braking of motor vehicles?

I’m still unclear why it’s inherently safe for a motor vehicle to drive at 30mph down a single lane but it’s inherently unsafe and/or reckless for a cyclist to do the same, could you explain?

It is not unreasonable in my opinion to assume that the majority of riders who undertake such riding have a reasonable level of skill and equipment in such a case one would expect safe and effective braking, would you not.

[Gee252]

I believe I do,

Could you help my understand how cyclists who are passed illegally (<1.5m) could show more patience and bias to improve their situation?

I actually agree with you there and I have not in anyway got a problem with a Cyclist whom respects the road and conditions.
Like I have and quite a few more have said I think the main problem, and this is not just Cyclist it's also car and HGV driver's who think the road is theirs and bugger everyone else.

I probably have more experience in all of the above as myself and my family have bikes (although not avid cyclist) when ever we are out I always stop at the back in some stupid way thinking if God forbid someone in does smash into us I would offer some kind of protection to the rest of my family.
Believe me there are some.crazy people in cars who don't seem to look past the end of the bonnet!!!

I have also drove all kinds of HGVs many, many years including large mobile cranes and abnormal loads covering alot of miles.
I like to think I am a professional driver and am a firm believer of reading the road and situation ahead and all around me (no many do and I see it day in day out!)

And now one of my roles is looking after HGV drivers and I would like to think educating them to make other road users and themselves safer.

I fully understand why Cyclist and Pedestrians are the most vulnurable people on the road I do not need a lesson in this.

But again I will state respect has to be given by all on the road, as no one has the right of us anymore than the rest of us.

[Chairman LMAO]

Let's face it Cyclists are no better!

I am not really taking sides but see all perspectives.
I do not drive HGVs now or maybe twice a year but am heavily involved in promoting safe driving and protection of vulnerable road users but it really is a two sided coin!!
Respect is needed on both sides.
Cyclist need to start taking responsibility for their actions and not think they do actually own the roads!!!!!!!!

I agree with the sentiment of the above.

I have a lot of sympathy for the OP's position, it can be enraging when a motorist nonchalantly almost kills you - you really have to be in that situation to understand just how that feels. I think the OP should reflect that his actions following the event don't really help anybody.

I'm pleased you're alright. It's flaming terrifying when it's happening.

[Captain Morgan]

1 No intimation by me and again you are replying before fully reading, the reference to not being able to hear was by someone doing close to 30 mph down hill and being passed by a car. But if you can hear and have awareness of what is around you have better chance to avoid dangerous situations.

OP Lorry driver should have given you more space but, doing 27mph on a country road and below nearly 30 on a steep down hill single car width country lane and it definitely is your fault that you can't hear him, sounds stupidly fast do you have any idea what you're braking distance is at that speed on a steep downhill gradient?

I'm sorry it does sound like you're apportioning blame onto the cyclist here (as well as the truck driver) unfortunately I still can't grasp how hearing the truck is going to reduce the risk of a close pass, in this case if the op had no space to move into hearing the truck is irrelevant, though I'm happy to be educated.

2 Physics, If you don’t believe braking going down hill will take longer then you shouldn’t be on the road at all.

I'd be happy for you to indicate where I said they would not have an impact, what I asked to what extent you thought that they would be affected.

I've already evidenced that the stopping distance of a bicycle with normal rim non disk brakes is around 10.4m plus 9m reaction distance 3.6m better that the guide distance for a car. we can dance around this as much as you like but stopping distances on bicycles are more than adequate

3.No, and I didn’t assert that, but a car will have advantages with bigger contact patch and abs etc.

Will a car not have disadvantages such as weight, after all a average car will be 10-20 times heavier than a cycle and rider, plus they are physically bigger which could obviously affect obstacle avoidance.

4. Same reply as above although if it was sharp incline single lane don’t think I would be doing 30
as I said whatever your form of transport you should be travelling at a safe speed for the road and conditions.

Yep seems reasonable

5.No don’t think I do agree or would assume that, If you buy a Ferrari and have some driving instruction doesn’t mean you should drive It at 150mph on the road you need to go on a track day to try that.

I think you have misunderstood I was not advocating speed, please feel free to quote me if you believe otherwise.

My point was that you are likely that a regular cyclist will have a reasonable level of bike and therefore you would also expect the braking ability to be better than average.

As speed and braking seem to be key to your arguments perhaps you could let us know what you believe is the maximum safe speed cyclists should be limited to?

[Groundrush]

As for “voluntarily engaging in an activity that requires them to pass off all responsibility for their own safety” ? Well if that’s the case you need to blame pedestrians for leaving the house, after all motorists kill 400 of them and cause injury to many more every year.

Pedestrians would do well to heed this advice as well, wandering about with their eyes glued to their mobile phones.

Your safety is primarily your responsibility. If you shirk that responsibility or defer it to others who may not treat it with the respect you think it deserves then you do so at your own risk. "It wasn't my fault" is of absolutely no practical use whatsoever when written as an epitaph. Life is risky, deal with it.

[GraniteQuarry]

Cyclists are crazy. They voluntarily engage in an activity that requires them to pass off all responsibility for their own safety to everyone else and then wonder why some people don't take their safety quite as seriously as they obviously don't.

Bingo

I choose to not ride on a public road, and I’ll never understand those who do.

[Captain Morgan]

I actually agree with you there and I have not in anyway got a problem with a Cyclist whom respects the road and conditions.
Like I have and quite a few more have said I think the main problem, and this is not just Cyclist it's also car and HGV driver's who think the road is theirs and bugger everyone else.

I probably have more experience in all of the above as myself and my family have bikes (although not avid cyclist) when ever we are out I always stop at the back in some stupid way thinking if God forbid someone in does smash into us I would offer some kind of protection to the rest of my family.
Believe me there are some.crazy people in cars who don't seem to look past the end of the bonnet!!!

I have also drove all kinds of HGVs many, many years including large mobile cranes and abnormal loads covering alot of miles.
I like to think I am a professional driver and am a firm believer of reading the road and situation ahead and all around me (no many do and I see it day in day out!)

And now one of my roles is looking after HGV drivers and I would like to think educating them to make other road users and themselves safer.

I fully understand why Cyclist and Pedestrians are the most vulnurable people on the road I do not need a lesson in this.

But again I will state respect has to be given by all on the road, as no one has the right of us anymore than the rest of us.

I have to say this has a significantly different tone from your earlier posts.

And in kind I'm fully aware that all road users have the ability to act foolishly with disregard to others, be they truck, car, moped, motorcyclist, cyclist or mobility scooter users.

I've been close passed on my bike by cars with very expecive bikes on the roof rack, I'm sure we are all aware of motocyclists hooning on contry lanes, its not what the transports is its how you are using and shari

I try and treat all other users with respect, my passion is when it seems as cyclists in particular but all vulnerable road users when they are targeted with active 'punishment' or just poor driving.

Sorry mate didn't see you... Often the the impact to more vulnerable road users is significantly more than that of occupants of a motor vehicle.

[Tifa]

Your safety is primarily your responsibility. If you shirk that responsibility or defer it to others who may not treat it with the respect you think it deserves then you do so at your own risk. "It wasn't my fault" is of absolutely no practical use whatsoever when written as an epitaph. Life is risky, deal with it.

[Gee252]

I have to say this has a significantly different tone from your earlier posts.

And in kind I'm fully aware that all road users have the ability to act foolishly with disregard to others, be they truck, car, moped, motorcyclist, cyclist or mobility scooter users.

I've been close passed on my bike by cars with very expecive bikes on the roof rack, I'm sure we are all aware of motocyclists hooning on contry lanes, its not what the transports is its how you are using and shari

I try and treat all other users with respect, my passion is when it seems as cyclists in particular but all vulnerable road users when they are targeted with active 'punishment' or just poor driving.

Sorry mate didn't see you... Often the the impact to more vulnerable road users is significantly more than that of occupants of a motor vehicle.

My tone is the same, may have worded it a little better that is all.

All my post are on the grounds of respect from all road users to each other along with being aware of your surroundings.
This thread started with calling someone thick and fat!
Both were at fault in the end.

[TBKBABAB]

Not it sure this really merits another reply but to try and close it out

1.My original post quotes the person being passed by a car on a single downhill road and mentions not being able to hear, there is no reference to not being able to hear the lorry by me or anyone else.

2.

If not what are you basing your assertion that brakes/tyres/weight of rider and bike/road surface type and incline will impact the stopping distance and to what extent do you belive they affect braking

3.That calculation is to say the least debatable and takes in to account too few of the variables.
This is an interesting read and first post kind of answers you’re point about regular cyclists.

https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?t=110589

A car is obviously heavier but more stable as it has 4 wheels.

4.I didn’t say anywhere that you advocated speed but you referenced the speed limits, If you disagree with my view that too many cyclists now are just interested in speed you’re intitled to your opinion.

And by the way there is no legal minimum distance you have to give a cyclist when passing in the U.K.

I'm sorry it does sound like you're apportioning blame onto the cyclist here (as well as the truck driver) unfortunately I still can't grasp how hearing the truck is going to reduce the risk of a close pass, in this case if the op had no space to move into hearing the truck is irrelevant, though I'm happy to be educated.



I'd be happy for you to indicate where I said they would not have an impact, what I asked to what extent you thought that they would be affected.

I've already evidenced that the stopping distance of a bicycle with normal rim non disk brakes is around 10.4m plus 9m reaction distance 3.6m better that the guide distance for a car. we can dance around this as much as you like but stopping distances on bicycles are more than adequate



Will a car not have disadvantages such as weight, after all a average car will be 10-20 times heavier than a cycle and rider, plus they are physically bigger which could obviously affect obstacle avoidance.




Yep seems reasonable



I think you have misunderstood I was not advocating speed, please feel free to quote me if you believe otherwise.

My point was that you are likely that a regular cyclist will have a reasonable level of bike and therefore you would also expect the braking ability to be better than average.

As speed and braking seem to be key to your arguments perhaps you could let us know what you believe is the maximum safe speed cyclists should be limited to?

[Captain Morgan]

Not it sure this really merits another reply but to try and close it out

Some straight answers would help...

You can’t or won’t tell me how hearing the car/truck behind prevents them from passing close. I’ve got to assume that’s because hearing something appoching from behind does nothing to how they pass you.

You can’t or won’t tell me what you think is the stopping distance of a bike, bar saying you disbelieve the figures I’ve given.

This video from the met shows wet braking on a hybrid type bike with rim brakes at 15mph to be 3m in the wet. Vs nearly 20m for a fixed wheel bike without a front brake.
http://news.met.police.uk/videos/com...n-cycles-30256

Still unsure what you belive are the maximum safe speeds and minimum stopping distances are for cyclists are?

I’m more than happy to concede some people travel faster than is safe, be they motorists or cyclists (I don’t believe I had refuted this). What I fail to understand is how cyclists speed, stopping distance or hearing can effect other road uses passing them too closely.

[Captain Morgan]

And by the way there is no legal minimum distance you have to give a cyclist when passing in the U.K.

Not particularly well published but I understand that the police are now able to issue fines and points for unsafe passes

The Highway Code's insistence cars should leave a decent distance between them an cyclists when passing (1.5m) is now being strengthened by fines.

Following law changes in March, motorists could be fined for not leaving enough space between a vehicle and a bike. Failure to do so could land you with a £100 fine and three points on your licence.

Police forces across the country are being encouraged to penalise those who drive dangerously close to cyclists.

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/u...-rules-1944067

[TBKBABAB]

Yawn

Once again you don’t seem to read posts properly

I haven’t said hearing the car had any relevance to someone passing too close, All I said was that if the cyclist said he couldn’t hear because of wind noise due to his speed that was just down to him and nothing to do with the car.

Seems like there is no definitive reply to what the braking distance for a bike is but you’re 10.4m isn’t correct, did you read the link I posted.
your link doesn’t seem relevant comparing 2 fairly unusual types of bike.

And the Highway Code doesn’t say 1.5m.

From March 2018 ‘The Highway Code currently says drivers should give cyclists “plenty” of space and “at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car”, but ministers have previously said they were “interested” in introducing a mandatory minimum passing distance.’ - This has not been introduced sofar.

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-ne...aking-cyclists

Some straight answers would help...

You can’t or won’t tell me how hearing the car/truck behind prevents them from passing close. I’ve got to assume that’s because hearing something appoching from behind does nothing to how they pass you.

You can’t or won’t tell me what you think is the stopping distance of a bike, bar saying you disbelieve the figures I’ve given.

I’m more than happy to concede some people travel faster than is safe, be they motorists or cyclists (I don’t believe I had refuted this). What I fail to understand is how cyclists speed, stopping distance or hearing can effect other road uses passing them too closely.

[Kingstepper]

That dog poo is probably undergoing DNA testing right now.

[Passenger]

That dog poo is probably undergoing DNA testing right now.

chuckle.
Perhaps more worryingly this allegedly took place within a mile of the posters own home, so basically he's just poo bombed either a neighbour or friend or visitors of his neighbours, might be a smart move to nail closed his own letterbox and keep a closer than usual eye on his spaniel for a bit, as these things have been known to escalate among country folk with time on their hands and perhaps vengeance on their minds.
Just saying.

[Kingstepper]

chuckle.
Perhaps more worryingly this allegedly took place within a mile of the posters own home, so basically he's just poo bombed either a neighbour or friend or visitors of his neighbours, might be a smart move to nail closed his own letterbox and keep a closer than usual eye on his spaniel for a bit, as these things have been known to escalate among country folk with time on their hands and perhaps vengeance on their minds.
Just saying.

If he's lucky the victim might not associate the poo with him, the angry cyclist.

Councils are using DNA to identify fouling dogs BTW.

[Captain Morgan]

Yawn

Once again you don’t seem to read posts properly

I haven’t said hearing the car had any relevance to someone passing too close, All I said was that if the cyclist said he couldn’t hear because of wind noise due to his speed that was just down to him and nothing to do with the car.

Seems like there is no definitive reply to what the braking distance for a bike is but you’re 10.4m isn’t correct, did you read the link I posted.
your link doesn’t seem relevant comparing 2 fairly unusual types of bike.

And the Highway Code doesn’t say 1.5m.

From March 2018 ‘The Highway Code currently says drivers should give cyclists “plenty” of space and “at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car”, but ministers have previously said they were “interested” in introducing a mandatory minimum passing distance.’ - This has not been introduced sofar.

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-ne...aking-cyclists

Your Auto-express link is from March 18, perhaps these links from June 18 are more relevant, they seem clear about a 1.5m threshold to me.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/g...fine-f0p8xmpv8
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/98...e-fine-new-law
https://www.thesun.co.uk/motors/6654...fine-new-laws/
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/l...s-close-384560
https://www.bikerandbike.co.uk/100-f...-to-a-cyclist/


The met link shows a standard bike first, what do you belive is so ‘unusual’ about it?
It looks like many bikes in the £100-300 range to me.

The brake distance calculator gives the minimum distance as 2.6m so out by 10% as near as.
I’ve not seen anything in your posts or links to suggest 10m plus reaction time is not achievable, obviously there are variables at play that could increase that distance. In the same way the braking in other modes could be reduced.

I’m glad we’ve finally confirmed that neither cyclists speed or aural impairment play any part in close passes, it was much like pulling teeth.

I don’t hold out much hope in you confirming what speed bikes should be limited to or the minimum braking distance though.

[Passenger]

If he's lucky the victim might not associate the poo with him, the angry cyclist.

Councils are using DNA to identify fouling dogs BTW.

Interesting, thanks I was unaware of that development.

[Gee252]

I give up with this thread, going for a drink!
Let's get back to normality boys and girls!