My son and drug taking....

[Vanguard]

When I was on Road Traffic we attended a call to some tower block flats in Billingham where a youth jumped from the top of one (on LSD). Luckily the nearly 100' fall was broken by wet grass and he survived that (amazingly). He said he felt he could 'fly'.
No drugs are safe in my opinion. An aquaintance has had two serious crashes because of cannabis smoking.

Maybe he was right and he could fly if he survived a 100 ft fall!

[relaxer7]

The kids don't tend to pop pills nowadays as MDMA is seen as stronger and more pure (still basically the same stuff though). If he's got a job and a normal sort of life routine I won't worry too much at this stage. I guarantee it's not the type of drug you can do on a weekday night and hold down any sort of responsibility the next day. It's also not addictive like coke is or anywhere near as expensive which means it's less likely to ruin lives in the long run.

After a few small lines of MDMA he'll have been awake all night and have had zero sleep. About 12 hours later he won't have felt great (sweaty, feeling sick, hungry but not really able to eat or sleep).

You said his girlfriends mum picked them up and this is a good indication that they only took a very small amount. If he was a regular user of it or had took a larger quantity it's all most certain they they wouldn't have been able to hold a conversation or even a turned up for a lift - it would be way more obvious than diluted pupils.

My guess is that it was a first time type of thing because you'd definitely not want to sit in a car with someone's mum if you knew what you'd be feeling like.

My advice would be keep an eye on it and take notice if he changes his group of friends or starts staying out all night regularly.

[Gestarp]

[QUOTE=relaxer7;4873395]

it's all most certain they they wouldn't have been able to hold a conversation or even a turned up for a lift - it would be way more obvious than diluted pupils.


thats just nonsense. why after a night taking mdma would you not be able to hold a conversation or turn up for a lift

[village]

Maybe he was right and he could fly if he survived a 100 ft fall!

Clearly,if he was right and could fly then he wouldn't have fell.
Says a lot for the properties of wet grass though.

And I agree with Rod.....no drugs are safe.

Its good to hear that the OP's son is contrite about it. This shows that he knows it was a daft thing to do and all is most definitely not lost!

[GC2012]

When I was on Road Traffic we attended a call to some tower block flats in Billingham where a youth jumped from the top of one (on LSD). Luckily the nearly 100' fall was broken by wet grass and he survived that (amazingly). He said he felt he could 'fly'.
No drugs are safe in my opinion. An aquaintance has had two serious crashes because of cannabis smoking.

Sorry for the off topic post, I think I remember this happening.
Small world as I actually live not far from there, I presume its the flats in Low Grange (which are notorious for drugs)?

[relaxer7]

[QUOTE=Gestarp;4873406]

it's all most certain they they wouldn't have been able to hold a conversation or even a turned up for a lift - it would be way more obvious than diluted pupils.


thats just nonsense. why after a night taking mdma would you not be able to hold a conversation or turn up for a lift

You probably could and they did if you took a small amount. My point was that if you were a regular user and knew what to expect then the last thing you'd want to do would be sit with a 'grown up' for a lift home. You'd have any excuse for that not to happen.

On the other hand if you hadn't taken it before and had been on it all night i.e. line after line... As well as feeling the intended effect you could be confused, paranoid, losing track of time or forgetting what you were trying to do. You'd also have a hard time actually processing what was going on around you.

I'm guessing you've never done it yourself or that you take so much of it you can happily sit with your mum and have a nice chit chat whilst controlling your gurning face.

[Vanguard]

Clearly,if he was right and could fly then he wouldn't have fell.
Says a lot for the properties of wet grass though.

And I agree with Rod.....no drugs are safe.

Its good to hear that the OP's son is contrite about it. This shows that he knows it was a daft thing to do and all is most definitely not lost!

He didn't fall he jumped, landings can be tricky even for the most experienced pilots

[Gestarp]

[QUOTE=relaxer7;4873425]

You probably could and they did if you took a small amount. My point was that if you were a regular user and knew what to expect then the last thing you'd want to do would be sit with a 'grown up' for a lift home. You'd have any excuse for that not to happen.

On the other hand if you hadn't taken it before and had been on it all night i.e. line after line... As well as feeling the intended effect you could be confused, paranoid, losing track of time or forgetting what you were trying to do. You'd also have a hard time actually processing what was going on around you.

I'm guessing you've never done it yourself or that you take so much of it you can happily sit with your mum and have a nice chit chat whilst controlling your gurning face.

nice little back handed insult at the end of your post. your point is still nonsense a regular user who knew what to expect would easily have a conversation with an adult getting a lift home and an inexperienced user would also hold it.as they clearly did from the op.

the op was looking for sound advice if you just regurgitate a piece that could have been written by the daily mail i would refrain

[neillp]

I used all drugs in my earlier life with the exception of smack. Whether it is weed or MDMA the concern is what it might lead too.

Pretty sure my parents must have had their concerns/suspicions but we never discussed it.

I really wish we had so I knew I could have called them when it went a bit Pete Tongue, which it did occasionally.

When your life is turned upside down by a dodgy pill, you would want your child to be able to reach out to you.

Talking is the answer, I wouldn’t condone his actions and he needs to understand how concerned you are.

Good luck, just make sure you don’t drive a wedge between you which is a difficult conversation with a 16 year old. I am pretty sure I will be having a similar talk with my boys in a few years.

[the big fella]

I,d be far more concerned about him putting his bird up the duff at 16 to be honest, a far more life changing experience than some daft rave pill imo.

[Snoopdong]

I,d be far more concerned about him putting his bird up the duff at 16 to be honest, a far more life changing experience than some daft rave pill imo.

Anecdotally, it has been found that MDMA acts as a contraceptive.... of sorts.... (not speaking from personal experience, of course)... so every cloud has a silver lining, I guess.

[Hood]

Nearly all kids do it.
I did it BITD
My 19 year old son at university does it as I found 2 Grams of Coke in his bedroom a while back
Make sure they know the risks and are also aware of the massive comedown associated with pure MDNA usage.
Oh yeh-tell them pills aren't what they used to be.
He'll be fine.

[JasonM]

Nearly all kids do it.
I did it BITD
My 19 year old son at university does it as I found 2 Grams of Coke in his bedroom a while back
Make sure they know the risks and are also aware of the massive comedown associated with pure MDNA usage.
Oh yeh-tell them pills aren't what they used to be.
He'll be fine.

I hope you put his one gram back.

[Hood]

I hope you put his one gram back.

Finders Fee

[steptoe]

How do I punish but educate my son.

Regards

A very disappointed dad.

Why the need to punish ? he's 16, a teenager, it's what they do, should he tell you everything he does when out with friends.
Punishing him means you'll never be told anything and kept at arms length from his social life.

Can you remember being a teenager ? did you never try drugs of any sort ?. If not then i think your son can educate you rather than you educate your son.

:D

[walkerwek1958]

My stance would be 'zero tolerance' where drugs are concerned. I`ve done plenty of drinking over the years but never dabbled with drugs, fortunately I took the view as a teenager in the 70s that drugs were for idiots and it's a view I still hold.

Despite my strong anti-drugs views I can see a case for legalising some drugs as the lesser evil, but in an ideal situation drugs would be eradicated completely. Maybe much harsher penalties would help, at the moment we're caught between a rock and a hard place, we should either legalise some drugs or strictly impose the current law.

Not sure what I`d do if I was the OP, but this lad needs to learn a lesson in my view and that would involve withdrawal of privileges in some form. At 16 he's an adult, albeit a young one, he's no longer a child. To let this go unpunished is a mistake, it gives out the wrong message.

Both my wife's kids are now grown up and established in life, but whilst the were teenagers we took the hard line and made it clear that dabbling in drugs was a no-no. Apart from a couple of alcohol incidents neither strayed from the straight and narrow and they both kept out of trouble. I think seeing the pitfalls their peers fell into had some influence but the standards we set played its part in giving them the right values.

Drinking's Ok provided it's sensible and not excessive, drugs is an absolute no-no, that's the message we gave them and thankfully they took it on board.

[RAFF]

That’s a hard one. I took drugs for many years off and on and I’m just getting myself sorted even now. I’m 38 and even though it’s not held me back from achieving what I wanted to so far, it definitely slowed me down.

I always say there are positives in every negative and at least when my son is at that age I’ll know the signs and be able to offer advice from a position of experience. Do you know anyone who could do this for your son?


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[JasonM]

Drinking's Ok provided it's sensible and not excessive, drugs is an absolute no-no, that's the message we gave them and thankfully they took it on board.

Is that because of the legality issue Paul, or another view?

[farquare]

My stance would be 'zero tolerance' where drugs are concerned. I`ve done plenty of drinking over the years but never dabbled with drugs, fortunately I took the view as a teenager in the 70s that drugs were for idiots and it's a view I still hold.

Is drink not a drug now?

[RAFF]

Is drink not a drug now?

Funnily enough, drink has always been the doorway to drug use with me (other than the days i used to smoke weed). It’s probably the worst of the lot!


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[Hood]

My stance would be 'zero tolerance' where drugs are concerned. I`ve done plenty of drinking over the years but never dabbled with drugs, fortunately I took the view as a teenager in the 70s that drugs were for idiots and it's a view I still hold.

Despite my strong anti-drugs views I can see a case for legalising some drugs as the lesser evil, but in an ideal situation drugs would be eradicated completely. Maybe much harsher penalties would help, at the moment we're caught between a rock and a hard place, we should either legalise some drugs or strictly impose the current law.

Not sure what I`d do if I was the OP, but this lad needs to learn a lesson in my view and that would involve withdrawal of privileges in some form. At 16 he's an adult, albeit a young one, he's no longer a child. To let this go unpunished is a mistake, it gives out the wrong message.

Both my wife's kids are now grown up and established in life, but whilst the were teenagers we took the hard line and made it clear that dabbling in drugs was a no-no. Apart from a couple of alcohol incidents neither strayed from the straight and narrow and they both kept out of trouble. I think seeing the pitfalls their peers fell into had some influence but the standards we set played its part in giving them the right values.

Drinking's Ok provided it's sensible and not excessive, drugs is an absolute no-no, that's the message we gave them and thankfully they took it on board.

Pretty much a stock response from someone who has never tried them.
As previously stated this sort of response will result in your boy telling you nothing and being scared to confide anything with you.
Total bollocks to be honest and archaic way of thinking.

[woodacre1983]

Pretty much a stock response from someone who has never tried them.
As previously stated this sort of response will result in your boy telling you nothing and being scared to confide anything with you.
Total bollocks to be honest and archaic way of thinking.

I’ve got to disagree! I’m 35 and yes have never tried drugs. But, have grown up in an environment where I have been offered them seen them taken and been with people on a night out while they are on them. I chose not to take them due to the values instilled in me and the previous communications I had with my mum and Dad, the subject was raised and chatted about from an age of about 13. It was made clear that they are illegal and people do die from them. It was instilled into me not to take them. And not to smoke. I remember being caught drinking at a young age (16ish) despite knowing I was wrong and in for a mighty punishment I still talked to my mum and Dad about it. Explained myself.. I was punished.. firmly. But in a way that I knew why I was being punished.

Fast forward to now. I have 5 kids. The eldest is 14 we are already speaking to him on the drugs/alcohol temptations he knows our views and he knows that should he use them he will be punished. That doesn’t make the lines of communication difficult he knows in life actions have consequences. IMO not punishing would be cause the lines to be blurred despite his own knowledge of doing wrong. I would punish him and make it clear why and the risks involved in what he used.


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[RAFF]

I’ve got to disagree! I’m 35 and yes have never tried drugs. But, have grown up in an environment where I have been offered them seen them taken and been with people on a night out while they are on them. I chose not to take them due to the values instilled in me and the previous communications I had with my mum and Dad, the subject was raised and chatted about from an age of about 13. It was made clear that they are illegal and people do die from them. It was instilled into me not to take them. And not to smoke. I remember being caught drinking at a young age (16ish) despite knowing I was wrong and in for a mighty punishment I still talked to my mum and Dad about it. Explained myself.. I was punished.. firmly. But in a way that I knew why I was being punished.

Fast forward to now. I have 5 kids. The eldest is 14 we are already speaking to him on the drugs/alcohol temptations he knows our views and he knows that should he use them he will be punished. That doesn’t make the lines of communication difficult he knows in life actions have consequences. IMO not punishing would be cause the lines to be blurred despite his own knowledge of doing wrong. I would punish him and make it clear why and the risks involved in what he used.


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Maybe that's the key for a hard line then. Talk to them about it up front rather than go in swinging having not done that and finding out they've dabbled.

[RAFF]

P.S. It's good to see how different parents have handled it in different ways. Gives me ideas for when my son gets to that age.

[woodacre1983]

Maybe that's the key for a hard line then. Talk to them about it up front rather than go in swinging having not done that and finding out they've dabbled.

Agree wholeheartedly. I’m a firm believer in being upfront with things I treat my own kids with the maturity level they show. I am up front on what I expect and what I think and I make it clear consequences of actions be they good or bad. And I have found (touch wood!) this has led to an open and honest approach from both them and me. They know where they stand.


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[RAFF]

Agree wholeheartedly. I’m a firm believer in being upfront with things I treat my own kids with the maturity level they show. I am up front on what I expect and what I think and I make it clear consequences of actions be they good or bad. And I have found (touch wood!) this has led to an open and honest approach from both them and me. They know where they stand.


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Think I’ll follow you example tbh.


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[Saint-Just]

In other words, I don’t know what I am talking about but I was told it was wrong so I am teaching my kids it’s wrong.
If it worked for you, and you believe it will work for your kids, good.
I believe inquisitive minds want to know, and while they should be told about the very real risks attached to illegal -and therefore uncontrolled- substance mixes, as well as addiction ( for drugs like nicotine, ethanol and heroine) I’d rather they experimented in a controlled environment than in the wild.

[woodacre1983]

In other words, I don’t know what I am talking about but I was told it was wrong so I am teaching my kids it’s wrong.
If it worked for you, and you believe it will work for your kids, good.
I believe inquisitive minds want to know, and while they should be told about the very real risks attached to illegal -and therefore uncontrolled- substance mixes, as well as addiction ( for drugs like nicotine, ethanol and heroine) I’d rather they experimented in a controlled environment than in the wild.

I never once said that. I disagreed with a statement from Hood. But I will ask one thing. You say you’d rather they experimented in a controlled environment, which for controllable drugs eg alcohol I fully agree. I would and will allow that in a controlled manner. But how can you use a controlled environment on illegal drugs where you have no information or way of finding out what the drugs have been cut with?


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[swatch]

There is a really good youtube channel called 'Drugslab'.
It is a dutch show where the presenters take various substances and then talk through the experience.
Here is one on MDMA: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zptnnYPNBN4

[Saint-Just]

There is a really good youtube channel called 'Drugslab'.
It is a dutch show where the presenters take various substances and then talk through the experience.
Here is one on MDMA:

Would I be wrong if I said she was from the South of the country?

[RAFF]

There is a really good youtube channel called 'Drugslab'.
It is a dutch show where the presenters take various substances and then talk through the experience.
Here is one on MDMA: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zptnnYPNBN4

I'm definitely going to check this out!

[Captain Morgan]

I never once said that. I disagreed with a statement from Hood. But I will ask one thing. You say you’d rather they experimented in a controlled environment, which for controllable drugs eg alcohol I fully agree. I would and will allow that in a controlled manner. But how can you use a controlled environment on illegal drugs where you have no information or way of finding out what the drugs have been cut with?


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There are cases of fake alcohol and tobacco being sold from retail outlets so, any assumptions that they can be 100% safe is incorrect.

Re illegal drugs steps can be taken to minimise risk, buy from a ‘known’ source, not a random fly by night in a club / corner, use a testing kit to confirm you have brought what you expected. Generally speaking drug dealers try not to poison their punters, it’s not good for repeat business and is likely to bring even closer scrutiny from the authorities.

Many more young adults suffer death and serious injury through mental health, suicide, traffic accidents and alcohol than from drugs. Prohibition has never worked and we are way too far down the rabbit hole for it to start now.

[RAFF]

There are cases of fake alcohol and tobacco being sold from retail outlets so, any assumptions that they can be 100% safe is incorrect.

Re illegal drugs steps can be taken to minimise risk, buy from a ‘known’ source, not a random fly by night in a club / corner, use a testing kit to confirm you have brought what you expected. Generally speaking drug dealers try not to poison their punters, it’s not good for repeat business and is likely to bring even closer scrutiny from the authorities.

Many more young adults suffer death and serious injury through mental health, suicide, traffic accidents and alcohol than from drugs. Prohibition has never worked and we are way too far down the rabbit hole for it to start now.

Seriously, who actually tests coke for purity and what it's been cut with. Usually your pissed up and get it whilst out on the raz. It might not be cut with anything harmful, but it will be cut with some BS like pain killers or something. Good for the hang over headache though, but as for how pure it is you just have no practical way of telling.

[davida]

Pretty much a stock response from someone who has never tried them.
As previously stated this sort of response will result in your boy telling you nothing and being scared to confide anything with you.
Total bollocks to be honest and archaic way of thinking.

Totally agree. A very out of touch response.

[Saint-Just]

But how can you use a controlled environment on illegal drugs where you have no information or way of finding out what the drugs have been cut with?

I am in the countryside, not in or near London. I am also generally law abiding, have never had a ticket for speeding or parking in the last 20 years (my wife had one in Canterbury), for example. My next door neighbour is a police officer and she never misses my daughter’s birthday.
Yet I would have no difficulty in finding decent quality stuff, a test kit and the necessary supplements.
My daughter is not 13 yet, but in a few years, will she or her friends be able to do the same? Possibly, but I’d rather not chance it.

[RAFF]

I am in the countryside, not in or near London. I am also generally law abiding, have never had a ticket for speeding or parking in the last 20 years (my wife had one in Canterbury), for example. My next door neighbour is a police officer and she never misses my daughter’s birthday.
Yet I would have no difficulty in finding decent quality stuff, a test kit and the necessary supplements.
My daughter is not 13 yet, but in a few years, will she or her friends be able to do the same? Possibly, but I’d rather not chance it.

I'd love to know how you could get decent quality stuff when you aren't moving in those circles? Unless you know people who are of course.

[Saint-Just]

Or people who know people who are...

Remember, any 2 people in the world are only 6 degrees of separation from each other

[RAFF]

But the further away from the source the more hit and miss it will be. And good luck getting a refund from a dealer!


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[farquare]

I'd forgotten that scroobious pip and Dr Suzi Grange did a podcast about drugs called say why to drugs.

I've not listened to it, but having listened to his other stuff if imagine it's quite an interesting, rational and factual.

[Captain Morgan]

Seriously, who actually tests coke for purity and what it's been cut with. Usually your pissed up and get it whilst out on the raz. It might not be cut with anything harmful, but it will be cut with some BS like pain killers or something. Good for the hang over headache though, but as for how pure it is you just have no practical way of telling.

Seriously, who goes out on the raz, gets lashed up and buys council house coke in a seedy provincial club, I thought this forum was one of standards...

[RAFF]

Seriously, who goes out on the raz, gets lashed up and buys council house coke in a seedy provincial club, I thought this forum was one of standards...

Why does it need to be council estate coke. My point is the idea of getting it and pulling out a testing kit is not practical. Unless you plan ahead and buy it somewhere you can easily test. And the people who do that are the ones with serious coke issues...


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[Rod]

Maybe he was right and he could fly if he survived a 100 ft fall!

He broke both his legs and arms, numerous internal injuries, one leg was vertical behind his back. We thought he was dead but felt a very weak pulse. A lucky lad.

[Captain Morgan]

Why does it need to be council estate coke. My point is the idea of getting it and pulling out a testing kit is not practical. Unless you plan ahead and buy it somewhere you can easily test. And the people who do that are the ones with serious coke issues...


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Just like you missing my point?
I was responding to someone suggesting there was a safe way of experimenting with alcohol but not with drugs, when the reality is neither can be 100% safe but clearly steps can be taken in both cases to minimise the risks.

[RAFF]

Of course alcohol can be 100% certain. That’s one of the benefits of regulation due to it being legal. Class A drugs and the manner in which they are obtained however are not 100% certain. The vast majority of users aren’t in the state of mind when purchasing to think about testing kits. It’s a good idea in theory but just doesn’t happen that way.


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[Saint-Just]

All the more good reason to provide your kids with a safe experimenting environment. At the end of the day, there is no ‘right’ choice: it depends on the youth, his/her friends, and the environment.
As I find it difficult to control the last 2 at a music festival I know the way I’ll handle it. Feel free to handle it differently.

[Captain Morgan]

Of course alcohol can be 100% certain. That’s one of the benefits of regulation due to it being legal. Class A drugs and the manner in which they are obtained however are not 100% certain. The vast majority of users aren’t in the state of mind when purchasing to think about testing kits. It’s a good idea in theory but just doesn’t happen that way.


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Are you sure?

https://www.drinkaware.co.uk/advice/...-fake-alcohol/

https://news.sky.com/story/new-year-...-kill-10712757

[RAFF]

All the more good reason to provide your kids with a safe experimenting environment. At the end of the day, there is no ‘right’ choice: it depends on the youth, his/her friends, and the environment.
As I find it difficult to control the last 2 at a music festival I know the way I’ll handle it. Feel free to handle it differently.

My parents thought this way when I started smoking cannabis at 16, as they thought it would keep me off the streets and away from getting a criminal record. IMO it was the right thing to do. I wish I had been more considerate and realised they didn't like it but I was 16 so I wasn't thinking like that unfortunately.

[RAFF]

Are you sure?

https://www.drinkaware.co.uk/advice/...-fake-alcohol/

https://news.sky.com/story/new-year-...-kill-10712757

I'm aware it's out there but you can easily avoid that buy getting it from a licensed shop; You can't do that with drugs.

[Captain Morgan]

I'm aware it's out there but you can easily avoid that buy getting it from a licensed shop; You can't do that with drugs.

Are you 100% sure?

If you read the links they note that it’s for sale in pubs and off licenses, are these not the licensed premises you mentioned?

Here are a couple more examples.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-new...erfeit-4093388

http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/14845...lcohol_claims/

Still 100%?

[RAFF]

Are you 100% sure?

If you read the links they note that it’s for sale in pubs and off licenses, are these not the licensed premises you mentioned?

Here are a couple more examples.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-new...erfeit-4093388

http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/14845...lcohol_claims/

Still 100%?

So a couple of dodgy pubs found selling fake alcohol. Personally I don’t go to dodgy pubs and if you really want to press that exception to the rule the simple answer is to buy booze from reputable shops. You can hardly compare a couple of occurrences of fake alcohol to dodgy drugs as the chances of buying fake alcohol are extremely slim.


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