Reply With QuoteYou know the answer to that: They have invited you to take any of their available bikes, as a customer who they think might just be tempted.Originally Posted by j0hnbarker
That is not exploiting them.
Fine, but “with no intention to buy” is the key. Tony, as he says, is temporarily embarrassed from a financial pov.
You know the answer to that: They have invited you to take any of their available bikes, as a customer who they think might just be tempted.
That is not exploiting them.
Indeed. But why deliberately book a test-ride on a bike you have no intention/ability to buy?
I’ve already said I’ll be buying the bike, so I don’t actually know what you’re going on about. In any event, bikes are tested all the time - it’s good publicity for the dealers aside from anything else. In fact, Triumph were begging me to take bikes out to test.
I’m not actually sure why I answered your WTFs, but there you go. Can’t you communicate politely, Simon?
Edit: sorry Tony, no need for me to speak on your behalf!
Last edited by Dave+63; 8th April 2019 at 19:07.
Of course I can. So, you have said you are already buying that particular bike. Really? When is the order placed?
Why do you think a test ride by an average Joe is good publicity?
Don’t feed the troll Tony, life is too short...
Nice contribution to the debate.
I’m not debating with you, I’m trying to avoid you polluting this thread anymore. I have no interest in engaging with you whatsoever. I appreciate I’m not taking my own advice, so this will be the only engagement I have with you, as I find your posts boring and deliberately argumentative.
Nice video mate. Cracking bikes aren’t they?
Class them as a muscle, naked, sports, tourer. Unique would be a perfect prefix also.
Love my Gen 2 but having done 12,000 miles with a Desmo service looming I’m at a crossroads. Don’t know whether to go down a custom Harley Bobber, keep the Diavel or try something different.
Great to have so many choices these days!
I need to try one at some point, I like the look but not sure I’d get in with the riding position. Mind you I said that about the GS after many sports bikes!
Nor I with you. But you are neither boring nor argumentative. Just sand in the desert. Bye.
The Ducati dealer that gave me an extended test ride, was chuffed to bits that I’d done over 100 miles on their demo.
He didn’t care if I decided the bike wasn’t for me. He said the demo bikes are there to be used, and if a customer didn’t like that particular model, it didn’t matter. The fact that they’d been on the bike, even if they didn’t buy, generally meant they’d see them again in the future, and they’d buy a different model.
Why not? Test ride loads of bikes myself. What’s the issue?
From my POV, that’s a bit sad, wannabe, and shallow. But if you want to fabricate an internet persona?
FWIW if getting a service I sometimes take a loan bike and use it as a chance to try something different and see if I like it. Not for an MOT but they don't care, it's all pipeline.
Come again?
Which is not the same as specifically booking a test on a bike you can neither afford nor proceed on.
No intention to buy, no funds to buy, joyriding in order to build an on line persona, and that’s about it. Not necessarily directed at you.
I have no idea why I'm encouraging you to continue thread-spoiling, but to be clear:
1) I could buy the bike tomorrow, for cash, if I chose to.
2) I was completely open with the Ducati sales manager, advising him that I was thinking about a purchase likely to be about 9 months ahead. He encouraged me to test it, and has encouraged me to test it again whenever I want to.
3) Believe me when I tell you that dealers are only too happy for their bikes to be tested by people who don't think they're in the market. That's where the potential sales conversions come from - if i know i'm going to buy a bike, testing it is largely academic.
4) I've loved almost every second that this thread has been live - the community of bikers here is amazing, and it's been properly galvanised - and yet every time you participate you make it toxic. Please stop doing it - what pleasure can it possibly give you?
I'm sure the dealers are well aware that for every 10 test rides there may be only one or two buyers. If the facility is there then it's there to be used. Personally the Diavel is not for me. I think it looks like one of those sky scooters off the old Flash Gordon movie.
I generally don't 'test' ride bikes I know I have no intention of buying. I will, however, ride whatever the dealership has available as a courtesy bike if mine is in for work/service etc. (even a Kawasaki scooter).
The bikes I test ride I have an interest in, and the rides are essential to inform my decisions, whether in the near or distant future, as to what direction my bike ownership will take. Besides, as a couple of dealerships told me, test rides are a way to get their bikes seen out on the roads and so are good, cheap and effective form of marketing.
Having recently ridden the KTM 1290 Super Duke GT and the Ducati 1260 Diavel, I now have a pretty good idea what my next bike will be (and what a future one might be).
It's all a funnel isn't it. So long as you're going through the and not just having a go on 10 bikes to be the next YouTube I think is the sentiment?
Tony, I'm not taking sides in this but we are all entitled to our opinions without being accused of "thread-spoiling" and "toxic".
Anyone who doesn't accept the risk of flack perhaps shouldn't stick their head above the parapet.
Oh FFS....here he goes again!
It’s s only a test ride at the end of the day. Just because you can’t buy now, doesn’t mean you won’t subsequently set the wheels in motion to purchase at a later date because the test ride had the desired effect.
Not sure what online persona has to do with it?
Indeed. Tony, please just stop the TMF impression and just enjoy the world of bikes.
i've tested quite a few bikes over the years that i probably had no intention of buying usually to -
1 / try something out i might otherwise dismiss out of hand
2/ to see if they are as bad /good as people/reviews say
3/ because they have been offered to me to try
i guess we can now add a 4 as well
4/ because it pisses some people off to hear that i've tried something out i had no intention of buying :)
Nah, this is more like a Flesh Gordon machine - as seen at a rally i went to over the weekend;
A Diavel wouldn`t get a look-in if this thing was parked next to it.
Last edited by E_2_Right-Force; 7th May 2019 at 17:50.
Someone stole the engine!!! But what a creationNah, this is more like a Flesh Gordon machine - as seen at a rally i went to over the weekend;
A Diavel wouldn`t get a look-in if this thing was parked next to it.
A little retro loveliness that’s has a significance to me
RIAC
This. 100%
It's poor form and a prickish p!ss taking thing to do.
It's motorcycle retail, not Alton Towers.
And don't get me started on the 'joyriders' who blog their efforts on YouTube.
Disgraceful.
Am I being obtuse when I say “what is wrong with test riding?” Testing a Ride, seeing how it feels, comfort, power etc. Bikes aren’t easy things, not like cars which take far less skill and offer far greater protection. After all it’s not called “Test Buying” is it?
It appears to have caused some passion amongst a couple on this thread, and you are the only two in all my years with bikers who appear to feel this way.
As for online test reviews, love them!
Unless you do a 1000+ test ride on a multitude od days in varying conditions and states of mind you’ll never know whether a bike is right or not. Ive rode dogs that Ive grown to love and fell in love with bikes Ive grown to hate.
Its a bike, buy what you love looking at because thats what you’ll spend most of your time doing anyway
RIAC
I have to say that I don't understand it at all, and have never heard anyone else express similar views. The test bikes at dealerships are nothing more than marketing tools; each minute that they're parked up is a wasted minute, and there's nothing they want more than for the bikes to be out on the road. Decisions are often made on the basis of a test ride, and a vaguely interested punter can be converted into a buyer even if that wasn't their original intention.
The palava on this thread is actually quite absurd. The dealer knew I was simply trying to plan 6-12 months ahead (because I told him), encouraged me to test the bike and invited me to re-test it any time I wanted to; I've actually decided to buy one on the basis of my test ride, so can now plan accordingly; and the dealer has been acknowledged multiple times both in my video itself and in the description of the video that appears below it on the YouTube page.
Testing is actually very useful for inexperienced riders like me, Kerry. We don't necessarily understand how a spec "feels" on the road, so it's difficult to make buying decisions without actually riding the things.
Love that bike you're selling, by the way. Had I not already upgraded the Twin to the Triple, I'd be buying it!
Skyman, why has Tony lit the fuse on your tampon so badly?
At no point did he say he had no intention of buying. You bring nothing useful or interesting to this thread, just pointless vitriol.
Test riding aside, you do have a point. I've always said when you own a bike, get off and walk away, if it doesn't make you look back, it's the wrong bike
I see nothing wrong with test riding, in fact I actually think it should be encouraged. Tony has a clear interest in the Diavel, maybe not to purchase immediately, but some time in the future perhaps. The dealer is aware of this and has encouraged a test ride, and will probably do so again, because as Tony says it may end up with a sale.
I only wish I had taken the S1000RR for a lengthy test ride before purchase, as even though I THOUGHT I wanted one, it was a totally unsuitable bike for me for various reasons. These reasons only became clear after living with the thing. That life was short lived, BMW sold, lost a fair bit of cash in the process. Lets be honest, bikes are an expensive hobby to most of us, why not make sure we are spending wisely, instead of blindly like I did and regret it later.
Loved the review as well Tony, I too may have another Diavel somewhere down the line. One of my mates has just got a new 1260S so I will have a blast on that and see how it is compared to my old Gen 1. If Duc bring out a V4 streetfighter though, that may be getting test ridden as well !! However I am loving the Street Triple RS way to much at the mo to consider swapping.
Stuart
Can't see anything wrong with test riding. It's the dealer's bike and unless they stipulate that you can only ride if you 'have intent to buy' where's the issue?
If a dealer did stipulate that i'd bet good money they wouldn't sell as many bikes. I for one would be walking away from any dealer who tried to get me to commit to buying a bike before i'd ever ridden it. Absurd behaviour.
I totally agree......all this nonsense has made me fancy booking a test ride
Seriously though, many years ago........after watching Charlie & Ewan's adventures and having newly passed my test, without a test ride, I bought myself a lovely shiny BMW R1200GS. One month on with my confidence in tatters from riding around on this big heavy monster I sold it! Off to the BMW dealers I went with my sights firmly set on the 'new' F800GS and this time test ride booked..........hated it! So instead had a ride on an F650GS, loved it, bought it and one month later happily rode down to Turkey and back.
You wouldn't buy a pair of shoes without trying them on for size so why on earth would you spend 100 times the amount of money (or more) based simply upon spec sheets and reviews????
We do lots of test rides where I work - I work with software so it’s not riding in the same manner but we know that if we get our test ride in first and the customer likes the product, when his buy cycle next appears in 12, 18 or 24 months time, we’ve already given ourselves a head start.
On the flip side, if the agenda is set by our competition, we’re climbing a mountain to get to the same level as them, so I’d rather “waste time” now than time x 10 next year.
It’s what my sales colleagues refer to as prospecting, forecasting and pipelining, I believe.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Exactly this...
My mate passed his test last Oct, and he’s test riding bikes all the time because he hasn’t got a clue what he really wants.. one minute it’s a sports bike, the next it’s an adventure bike, then a naked, then a retro. He’s early confused, and has already made a mistake, by buying a Thruxton R BEFORE he passed his test, so unridden. (I did advise him against it, but he was smitten)
He’s basically overbiked himself and he’s intimidated by the Thruxton, so intimidated that he bought an older 675 ST which he did after a test ride.
This chap has plenty of disposable cash, and can buy pretty much what he likes, but how does he find out what he likes without test rides?
He’s already dismissed a Ducati Scrambler, and a BMW GS based on test rides.
For new riders I would highly recommend just getting lots of miles under your belt and get some rider training (typically held on track where it is a safe environment without oncoming traffic or road furniture to deal with). Learn the nuances of body and bike control on the bike at different paces - especially as the pace goes up, the bike's dynamics and rider has to adapt.
The problem I have with an inexperienced rider 'reviews' of a bike is that they lack credibility as they do not have a good baseline of what separates a poor/average bike from an exceptional one. This is proven when the video shows them pootling along, never pushing the bike hard, making gushing comments that are not really warranted when the bike is operating at 5%, yet the rider thinks it is just incredible and must be a superlative bike.
Nothing wrong in doing a test ride per se - but a test ride and opinions drawn from it need to consider the reviewer's experience of many other bikes and equivalent road miles. If you were a new driver driving a 1.4 Fiesta for the first time at 40mph around some gentle bends, you'd be stoked and think it was incredible. But an experienced driver would think it nothing compared to their knowledge and experience of driving countless other cars in many other varied conditions and at higher speed where the car's dynamics and capabilities get properly tested. Same with bikes.
There are few 'bad' bikes being made today, they just have different characteristics. I think riding lots of different [new] bikes may actually prevent a new rider from establishing a good baseline for themselves. I'd say - get lots of miles in on one bike, learn how to ride well, and learn the dynamics of a bike when pushed hard. Then as you transition/try/test-ride other bikes, you'll be able to assess them better compared to your baseline. Establish lots of baselines over time/miles, and soon you'll figure out why some bikes are head and shoulders than the rest. Get rider training in as much and as early as possible... it is tough/dangerous for a new rider to learn the limits on the public road. Do something like Ron Haslam or CSS etc in the safe confines of a track. It isn't so much about 'track riding' as it is learning bike dynamics at pace and learning how to corner well.
Safe riding all, and great to see Tony learning to enjoy what many of us love. Share ideas, experiences, and keep it shiny side up!
>>edited to add: I think this is one of the reasons why Chris Harris' reviews on cars is well respected vs other less-experienced journos. Harris can drive, race, he's driven most things, and his views/reviews use adjectives and adverbs that have credibility.
Last edited by spareparts; 9th April 2019 at 10:44.
Totally accept all of that, Adrien - sadly I only had 45 minutes with the bike, though, and couldn’t get to any fast roads. I still found myself doing 70mph in 3rd gear without even realising, by the way, which was pretty telling in terms of power and delivery of that power.
I appreciate that I’m relatively new, but I had 10 years on bikes when I was younger, have owned a few 125s, a 250, the Street Twin and now the Triple. Inexperienced by some standards, certainly, but not a novice. And anyway, the only way to understand other bikes is to ride them.
Regardless of any of that, I’m loving every second on two wheels. Long may it continue.
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