Reply With QuoteBetter winning ugly than losing pretty.
Jeez! Despite all the ‘positives’ being thrown about - I’m left with the impression that England barely scraped through.
After the cheating Colombians scored - it was England’s game to lose.
Better winning ugly than losing pretty.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
I’m not sure I’d agree if Columbia had won that shoot out. That wasn’t football they were playing most of the time.Originally Posted by Saint-Just
The odd thing is, when they stopped mucking about on the most monumental scale and started actually playing football they were great to watch with buckets of flair and talent. That sadly was just for a few minutes of their whole “performance “.
I didn’t say better playing pretty
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
You bet.
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
I did say should beat; it’s not going to be easy though.
I still remember when Thomas Brolin scored the goal that knocked us out many years ago.
It’s knockout football and nothing can be taken fir granted, especially with England!
Whilst I can’t speak for everyone, I would have thought that the silent majority do; it’s just the vocal minority that create the impression of universal animosity.
Reflecting on it overnight:
Regardless of what happens now our young team have done us proud. Columbia were a dirty team who thoroughly deserved to lose.
Our lads have conducted themselves with decorum and decency throughout, and in the face of extreme provocation. Last night they were a credit to themselves- they hung in there, and didn’t respond to the outrageous cheating from their opponents.
Our team really are a team - and that’s the first time in nearly two decades I’ve thought that. They aren’t preening primadonnas with a constant eye on their best angle and next sponsorship deal.
Harry Kane is a role model for how players should be.
So clever my foot fell off.
Agree - it’s childish and puerile.
So clever my foot fell off.
I’m Scottish and I’m kinda ambivalent to it. As close to a neutral observer I guess. I follow many of the players in the prem but I’m not an actual supporter - well I’m not English so why would I be? Couple of observations ...
1. As a neighbour I’d like to see you do well and I certainly didn’t leap off the sofa cheering when Colombia scored.
2. I don’t go into a frenzy hoping Germany lose every time they play - never understood the England Germany hatred. It can’t be the war - look at the love on here for the Japanese after all? And Scotland lost plenty in the wars with Germany also so that doesn’t compute for me. Is it the penalties thing?
3. For the record I’ve watched several Scotland games on tv while in English pubs and on majority of occasions we lost (of course🤣) and seemingly to the delight of the locals which I found a little ironic given the view of us as England hating bravehearts.
4. If you DO win the trophy I will be happy for you, but I won’t watch the TV or listen to talksport on the radio for a while afterwards - as your media is something that does grate on me I confess.
Quite right! The whole concept of starting 'fresh' with a totally renewed squad (including the staff) is in itself a victory. Southgate's emphasis on taking pens has paid off as well. Training = self-confidence = dealing with pressure. Kane leading the troops with his first penalty (that struck the net like a grenade) was another way of letting everybody know: "We're ready for it!" After all, an infographic on Dutch TV showed 3x WC and 3x EC penalty losses. So the pressure must have been immense.
Robin van Persie was commenting in the Dutch studio. He said that walking up to the goal is the hardest part. Trying to get into 'the zone'. You feel every ache, every muscle that's been beaten during 120 mins and the pain brings the doubt. That's why he praised Southgate's approach: training the penalties including a 'walk-up' from the centre of the field.
Menno
Hear Hear Columbia were an absolute disgrace...good riddance
C O L O M B I AHear Hear Columbia were an absolute disgrace...good riddance
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
Never,we are English it’s our game we expect it to be played fair without cheating.
Spot on, it’s what I said we are a team.
It was not the best match, I felt Loftus-Cheek played very well in the group stages and deserved a start over sterling - who was terrible as always. Sterling out and rose for young would be my call for Sweden.
As much as the English obsession with Germany, all rather childish and puerile.
Agreed, but it was a complete accident though, thanks to big old Sam who the FA overlooked Gareth for in the first place.
Agree. Very odd tactics, they looked quite good when they finally started to play in the 70th minute instead of taking people out.
Agreed…. He seems so well prepared and has got the group playing as a team and menatally resilient
And (gulp) - I have to admit that Kane is a real leader and inspiration for the team…. He was so canny slowing things down playing for and generally getting fouls…. He was out on his feet a little in ET, but, effective in his deeper position…. And his nerve for the penalties he took was astonishing…. I have a newly found admiration for him
That was tough to admit!
That’s what my grandma said when she didn’t see my grandad for 5 years and several times thought he was dead.
Need to bin Sterling for the next match.
He may shine when pitted against lower table Premiership defenders, but he’s done nothing on the world stage, and he’s had his opportunity.
This position seems like a real problem if England are going to progress further, as Rashford/Varys are looking rather tame too.
I'd wondered why Vardy did not take a penalty last night. It would appear he had a groin strain 5 mins into ET and is now a doubt for the Sweden game. Fair play to Dier for stepping up and the system/process they use to slot the players in as required.
It doesn’t explain the gushing over Japan though.
Apparently he had to have an injection to play last night, definitely out for Saturday.
Forgive and Forget though.
Sins of the fathers and all that.
Relations of mine fought for the Allies in both world wars, what's you point ?. Both (Imperial) Japan and (Nazi) Germany have both moved on as countries and are now close allies with the UK. It seems it's only the English who still portray this childish nonsense. As for the English media, it's like being in a school playground.
Bugger…. All my mates were telling me that Vardy was a bottler for not taking a pen…. I thought it was odd as he has a good record for Leicester
Hope he’s ok the semis!!!
I have no problem with England fans celebrating Germany's defeat in a football match in the same way I have no problem with Scots cheering when England go out.
It is a football rivalry and doesn't equate to hatred of the other nation.
There are of course "fans" who will take this rivalry to another level and it becomes racist in nature which is abhorrent to any decent minded people. Just enjoy these rivalries for what they are as it gives an extra spice to things.
+1
Agree, no one has a problem with a bit of banter, but you don't have to look too far even on this thread for the worst elements of narrow minded nationalism.
It's a few grown men kicking against a ball, no more no less, we shouldn't blow it out of proportions.
I'm always enjoying those tournaments to the max, with or without the Dutch, but never understood the misplaced rivalry between nations.
I was shouting, swearing and jumping up and down and shaking my fists at St James's when Newcastle were 0-4 down against Arsenal at half time in 2011 and even more vocal when the "comeback of all comebacks" produced a 4-4 at the end of the match. But when you leave it's all over and done with, back to normal, rivalry forgotten.
Got a new watch, divers watch it is, had to drown the bastard to get it!
That's why I like watching Rugby Union. None of that rolling around on the ground play acting, and wearing a hair band. 80 minutes of pure brutality, total respect for the officials and leave the field of play having shaken hands in respect for the opposition.
It's cute that Scotland see themselves rivals with England.
Not for a lot of Magpies and Mackems that I know it isn't.
F.T.F.A.
Spot on. I’ve been really impressed with their mental attitude and togetherness which is unlike anything I’ve seen for decades.
They’re young and learning all the time. I have hope for the next Euros and World Cup.
Thought Harry Kane was a good captain last night to be fair. Stopped the English players abusing the ref.
Unlike Falcao who should be ashamed of himself.
Not sure on this. I get he hasn't done much for England but there were a few times when he came off last night and we had one man upfront. I know he's scored a load for City but I think he plays a different game for England.
He seems to do well as a support player upfront, a feeder, and a bit of a grafter - not necessarily a goal scorer which I don't mind.
I think he gets a bit of stick yet Lingard gets away with everything!
Agreed. Sterling has been atrocious at this tournament, offering absolutely nothing. I couldn’t believe he was in the team last night. He loses the ball a good 90% of the time he has it, can’t beat a man, can’t cross a ball, couldn’t even control a pass last night and doesn’t score goals. It beggars belief why he’s in the team.
I was stuffed in my Airbnb as my travel mates were asleep going crazy watching the game, fantastic
Really ugly game, Colombia were shocking and I hope they get shamed back home for how they played the game. We did alright in the first 20 mins before it descended into a farce and it ended up being a game you needed to just get through than judge England on.
On Sterling - he actually played ok, played a lovely pass into Alli who should have scored. However I think I'd go with Vardy next game as he looked decent in the second extra period.
Alli doesn't look right IMO and I think may not start - Loftus Cheek is clearly the designate replacement for Alli and I see that happening.
I would say Ashley Young was excellent, the man can adapt to playing ugly which is what we need sometimes.
Has AndyG been on the thread?
I'll preface this with what I've posted earlier. I too, would love Sterling to be dropped from the squad, I'd actually be happier if he told you and the rest of the happy clappers to do one and retired from International football along with the rest of his City teammates. I recall when he signed for City and your comment then was that he'd only signed for the money , right? That tells me that no matter what Raheem does for his country, he'll never be accepted by you and your ilk. The kind of person that is spoon fed football and believes everything that the Daily Mail and MOTD tell them. Even the post you quoted is from a Liverpool fan, no? He's always going to be bitter about Sterling leaving his beloved club, citing all kinds of rumours about him being a money grabber whilst ignoring the fact that James Milner ran his contract at City down to get a big signing on fee and inflated wages at Liverpool.
The game last night highlights exactly why your opinion on Sterling is one eyed and biased. He is doing an unfamiliar role. He's a winger , shoehorned into a supporting role to Kane. OK so far? Time and again he is asked to drop deep to receive the ball , turn and face the opposition and take them on from a standing start. One time (18 mins if you're bothered) he collected the ball from the defence in his own half. Did you see Kane do this? Ever?
He works well with Lingard, he works well with Young and the rest of the defence. If you ask Rashford to do the same job v Sweden, we will be beaten, no issues. I have no issues with Rashford , or indeed, any of the Utd players. I could be on here bemoaning Youngs misgivings, Rashford awful miss v Belgium or Lingard s terrible mispass to Sterling but I choose to simply watch and enjoy.
Obviously , what Hoddle mumbles on TV matters to you.
Fortunately, the team isn't picked by people who have little knowledge of the game and I'm positive that Mr Southgate will continue to pick Raheem and use Rashford and Vardy as impact subs where they can do huge damage to a team knackered by Sterling and co having them run ragged for the previous 80 minutes.
It's telling, last night I was in a bar with two Barca fans , who said Sterling was the one player they'd love from City. Four Swedes who hoped he wouldn't play against them on Saturday, just not for the reasons you've gone on about and a Colombian fan who applauded when he was taken off .
Now, I'm under no illusions that you'll come back with proof of my delusion and my loyalty to a City player. What you won't come back with is cold hard facts about Sterlings performances unless they come off the back of done United/Liverpool loving journo with a grudge.
There's a thread on Bluemoon about Sterlings persecution by the media. You could do with half an hour to catch up on that.
He was kidnapped by the German national football team?
I thought Sterling did ok last night. They packed the defence and he was playing centrally but it pulled defenders towards him and created space out wide. No idea why he isn't playing wider for England though as his asset is raw pace and dribbling. I'd keep him in for Sweden and swap Alli for Loftus Cheek.
He did ok against Panama too - nice one two with Lingard for the third goal.
Dele Alli has been the biggest disappointment.
Assuming no injuries we're not aware of, team selection seems pretty straightforward to me...
Rashford for Sterling. Deserves his chance and I think he'll cause Sweden more problems than Sterling - better in terms of competing physically, plus they'll be wary of his pace and ability to run at/turn defenders.
Loftus-Cheek for Alli. Alli didn't look fit to me last night and had a poor game. The system England play relies on everyone contributing, so L-C should play. Deserves his chance.
The one thing that shouldn't change is the tactics. Southgate has clearly drilled the team pretty rigourously to play a certain way, so it would be dangerous to start fiddling with it imo. Rose looks a good option if we're chasing the game - dangerous going forward, but not convincing defensively. Sterling also a good option from the bench (though he's been disappointing so far).
Roll on Saturday afternoon...
Rose for Young
Loftus cheek for Ali
But, having said that Ali is quality and has the potential to have a bigger influence and Young did better last night then in his previous outings and Rose looked sharper as Colombia were knackered
I imagine he’ll stick with the same team and that wouldn’t bother me... he has to manage team spirit too and it’s important to get the whole balance right... they seem like a happy camp and I’m not sure I’d want to disrupt that...
Sterling has been a passenger for the entire tournament and it was hard to see on last night's evidence why he continues to be picked. Is it assists/passes/tackles/shots/goals? I have no club axe to grind with him, it's just having watched England for 30 years I cannot see what added dimension he brings to the team.
Trippier has been the revelation of the tournament for me. He looks like he's on a massive roll at the moment and he was the one player who looked certain to score his penalty last night.
Let's see how we get on against Sweden on Saturday.
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