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Thread: Leica enters luxury watch market

  1. #1
    Grand Master sundial's Avatar
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    Leica enters luxury watch market

    "Ö but the greatest gift the railways give to us is the proper treatment of time." John Betjeman , BBC Home Service radio broadcast 4 July 1940.

  2. #2
    Master Yorkshiremadmick's Avatar
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    Looks interesting,
    But it's not grabbing me.


    Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app

  3. #3
    Interesting move, like the dial - very classey but the price around E10,000 I really can't see them sell too many.

  4. #4
    Master
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    I like it...


    ...but not 10k worth of like

  5. #5
    Grand Master PickleB's Avatar
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    How about a red one (link)?


  6. #6
    Master
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    They were never going to make an Ďaffordableí mass production watch though. I think they look good if you want and can afford a clean looking and very highly finished watch with an equally highly finished and rare movement. Iíd imagine theyíll judge this initiative in 5-10 years, not the next 12 months sales.

    Iíd be interested if some of the professional photographers on the forum have any views on whether being a Leica adds anything to a watch.

  7. #7
    Craftsman
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    It's like a really bad Sinn.

  8. #8
    Grand Master seikopath's Avatar
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    Me no likey da leica
    Beyond ideas of good and bad, there is a field. I'll meet you there.

  9. #9
    I like it. Particularly the L1. Usually these efforts fall flat, but not this.

  10. #10
    Master
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    One of the better attempts at taking a brand name out of its natural habitat, it looks reasonably at home on a watch, given that they're already known for luxury level precision engineering.

    Some echos of NOMOS, but good too that they've come up with some unique features for the movement, and a simple and clever way to add a second timezone.

    Given the price of the cameras though it was always going to be painfully expensive for a watch from a brand without watchmaking heritage. Maybe there will be a LUMIX branded version for a fraction of the price? ;-)

    One potential snag for me though - if you own a Leica camera, it seems a bit much to wear the watch too, while if you don't own the camera, it seems strange to wear it.





    Last edited by Itsguy; 14th June 2018 at 10:39.

  11. #11
    Master
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    Ok?!

    I donít mind them but Iím not sure I like them at £10k ? Like others they look a bit like Sinn and I would rather spend a quarter of the price on one of those?
    Would be interested on whether they could use their skill to make a diver ? Not saying I would like it as Iím sure the price would end up at £20k but would be interesting to see why they would create and with what movements etc??

    Although after saying all of the above itís always nice to see a new brand enter the market even if itís not for me!!

    Chris

  12. #12

    You Leica.... or not....

    Nice clean looking black dial and some interesting features, from 10k....I suppose committed Leica users can afford to consider the exclusivity....but, for me, too much competition at that ballpark for my £.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by PickleB View Post
    How about a red one (link)?
    Taking the 'red dot' to the extreme

    I actually like the red - but overall pricey watches with a lot of competition in that price range...

  14. #14
    Master snowman's Avatar
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    Would be nice around the £500-£1000 mark, much like the cameras.

    Definitely a case of "You get it, or you don't" and I really don't, although I like the look of the black dial one and can see they're quality.

    I'm sure there's a market out there, they seem to sell enough cameras to keep going.

    M

  15. #15
    Craftsman Nuisance Value's Avatar
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    Far too expensive. The red doesn't seem to match the colour of the iconic red dot, maybe it's the photography!

    Black dialed one is quite nice though

  16. #16
    Grand Master Carlton-Browne's Avatar
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    It doesn't float my boat but, on the basis that Leica have many enthusiasts with deep pockets. I imagine they'll sell a few. I'm sort of surprised they didn't attempt to differentiate in some way with the spec of the crystals; given that Leica are rather good at glass I'm surprised there isn't an angle there.
    Die Zeit verwandelt uns nicht, sie entfaltet uns nur.

  17. #17
    Craftsman Nuisance Value's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlton-Browne View Post
    I'm sort of surprised they didn't attempt to differentiate in some way with the spec of the crystals; given that Leica are rather good at glass I'm surprised there isn't an angle there.
    Agreed, they've missed a trick there. Could have made it semi magnifying or some such?

  18. #18
    Grand Master SimonK's Avatar
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    I'll wait for the Fuji version, it'll do the same thing for a quarter of the price.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by SimonK View Post
    I'll wait for the Fuji version, it'll do the same thing for a quarter of the price.
    very good - Fuji or Panasonic!

  20. #20
    Grand Master magirus's Avatar
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    I like it. However, as with any watch my thoughts immediately go to the ease and cost of servicing, albeit if you can afford the watch and probably Leica camera/s and lenses too then this may not be an issue.

  21. #21
    Master Tetlee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SimonK View Post
    I'll wait for the Fuji version, it'll do the same thing for a quarter of the price.
    ďit has one key feature that really sets it apart: a crown that you push to reset the seconds to zero and enter a time-setting mode. This means you never pull out the crown or fiddle with multiple positions.

    Indeed, for a fraction of the cost I'd rather just fiddle with my Fuji.

  22. #22
    Odd that they haven't used the classic Leica font and made more of the iconic 'red dot'.

  23. #23
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by swatch View Post
    Odd that they haven't used the classic Leica font and made more of the iconic 'red dot'.
    I can only assume they considered making the sub-dial red but decided it would look like a superficial exercise in branding, and invite the inevitable comment that youíre mainly paying for the red dot. The red second hand is a more subtle nod to it, and keeps the focus on the movement and design. Itís tricky, to work it has to stand up purely as a watch, and not an accessory for someone who owns the cameras. Itís nice enough to get away with it, itís similar in a way to Posche design or Monthlanc watches, though itís always slightly confusing when you know the brand for something else.

  24. #24
    These watches are not for Those who are into watches and know about escapements, balances and Rolex dial types. They are for wealthy Leica collectors (I donít think the word photographer suits these buyers)

    At least they have made some effort though and not just slapped a name on an existing watch buy way overpriced like all Leica products.

  25. #25
    Grand Master
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    Looks to be well put together, but way overpriced! Cashing in on the name perhaps? I'm sure there'll be a few Leicafiles queuing up to but one.
    Best Regards - Peter
    Please Note: It is possible that Griswold may know nothing whatsoever about horology. It's even possible that he has never even owned a watch. It is also highly possible the he has a strange imagination. His wife insists he would be far better off paying more attention to taking his medication on time.

  26. #26
    The case is disappointingly generic, the handset is not to my taste and the price is very rich indeed. Only 5ATM? Don't get it wet...
    Love their binos though!

  27. #27
    Grand Master sundial's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmith View Post
    These watches are not for Those who are into watches and know about escapements, balances and Rolex dial types. They are for wealthy Leica collectors (I donít think the word photographer suits these buyers)

    At least they have made some effort though and not just slapped a name on an existing watch buy way overpriced like all Leica products.
    There are more than a few Leica users and collectors who are TZ UK forum members. Your remark is 'tunnel-visioned' wishful thinking.

    dunk
    "Ö but the greatest gift the railways give to us is the proper treatment of time." John Betjeman , BBC Home Service radio broadcast 4 July 1940.

  28. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by sundial View Post
    There are more than a few Leica users and collectors who are TZ UK forum members. Your remark is 'tunnel-visioned' wishful thinking.

    dunk
    It’s just an opinion from a sample of other working professionals who operate in the same area as me (london based advertising/design) nobody I know shoots on Leica, none of the rental house stock them, they don’t tether to the industry standard (capture-one) in 25 years I never once assisted on a shoot where a Leica was used. The S model was just not reliable enough as the af motors broke in the lenses and took months to fix, let’s not forget the sensor delamination issues with the early digital offerings either.
    As a business cost they are a non-starter, their main market is wealthy amateurs/collectors.

    Such as old slow hand here:



    I guess it’s much like dive/pilots watches it’s not Divers and Pilots buying them!

  29. #29
    Journeyman
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    Leica=rebadged Panasonic. The two companies have been in cahoots for many years.

  30. #30
    Craftsman
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    If I liked the style enough would go for Nomos, watchmaking history and in-house movements for a lot less money.

  31. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by alphajet View Post
    If I liked the style enough would go for Nomos, watchmaking history and in-house movements for a lot less money.
    Nomos are great watches but watchmaking history?

  32. #32
    Grand Master PickleB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmith View Post
    It’s just an opinion from a sample of other working professionals who operate in the same area as me (london based advertising/design) nobody I know shoots on Leica, none of the rental house stock them, they don’t tether to the industry standard (capture-one) in 25 years I never once assisted on a shoot where a Leica was used. The S model was just not reliable enough as the af motors broke in the lenses and took months to fix, let’s not forget the sensor delamination issues with the early digital offerings either.
    As a business cost they are a non-starter, their main market is wealthy amateurs/collectors.

    Such as old slow hand here:

    ...image...

    I guess it’s much like dive/pilots watches it’s not Divers and Pilots buying them!

    Agreed, Leica are not what you and I consider mainstream, but are you seriously suggesting that the "main market" for Canon, Nikon etc is other than "wealthy amateurs/collectors"? I believe that they may sponsor professionals to bolster their image / marketability.

    Then, maybe your opinion might be changed by looking into the more artistic side of photography where 'shoots' and tripods are not the common way of working. I think you'll find examples of world-class professionals using Leica. And you'll find others using medium and full-frame format cameras...it's 'horses for courses'.
    Last edited by PickleB; 14th June 2018 at 15:51. Reason: amend 2nd para...adding last sentence

  33. #33
    Grand Master sundial's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmith View Post
    It’s just an opinion from a sample of other working professionals who operate in the same area as me (london based advertising/design) nobody I know shoots on Leica, none of the rental house stock them, they don’t tether to the industry standard (capture-one) in 25 years I never once assisted on a shoot where a Leica was used. The S model was just not reliable enough as the af motors broke in the lenses and took months to fix, let’s not forget the sensor delamination issues with the early digital offerings either.
    As a business cost they are a non-starter, their main market is wealthy amateurs/collectors.

    Such as old slow hand here:

    I guess it’s much like dive/pilots watches it’s not Divers and Pilots buying them!

    http://www.procentre.co.uk/rental-cameras-leica.php There are other pro camera hire agencies renting Leica cameras and lenses … and I'm aware of professional photographers using them. The S lens motor anomaly has been remedied. And the professional camera market extends far beyond the advertising and design sector.

    dunk
    Last edited by sundial; 14th June 2018 at 15:56.
    "Ö but the greatest gift the railways give to us is the proper treatment of time." John Betjeman , BBC Home Service radio broadcast 4 July 1940.

  34. #34
    Craftsman
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    Quote Originally Posted by robert75 View Post
    Nomos are great watches but watchmaking history?
    OK not as long as the established Swiss brands but they did start with the reunification of Germany the same time that the rest of the Glashutte old brands reinvented themselves.

  35. #35
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    You have to admit that it would look a bit naff for someone to wear a Leica watch whilst using, say, a Nikon camera.

    Possibly they should restrict sales to those who actually own a Leica camera.

    Make it more exclusive and push the price of both the cameras and watches up.

  36. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by PickleB View Post
    Agreed, Leica are not what you and I consider mainstream, but are you seriously suggesting that the "main market" for Canon, Nikon etc is other than "wealthy amateurs/collectors"? I believe that they may sponsor professionals to bolster their image / marketability.

    Then, maybe your opinion might be changed by looking into the more artistic side of photography where 'shoots' and tripods are not the common way of working. I think you'll find examples of world-class professionals using Leica. And you'll find others using medium and full-frame format cameras...it's 'horses for courses'.
    iím well aware of the artistic side of photography, several meters of shelving weighed down by years of buying photobooks attest to that i also worked with renown Ďart photographersí in the past. the fact remains Leica operate in a luxury niche, they have even branched out into selling £10k wristwatches

  37. #37
    Grand Master PickleB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mick P View Post
    You have to admit that it would look a bit naff for someone to wear a Leica watch whilst using, say, a Nikon camera.

    Possibly they should restrict sales to those who actually own a Leica camera.

    Make it more exclusive and push the price of both the cameras and watches up.
    I never felt at all awkward travelling with my Leica binoculars and Nikon DSLRs.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmith View Post
    i’m well aware of the artistic side of photography, several meters of shelving weighed down by years of buying photobooks attest to that i also worked with renown ‘art photographers’ in the past. the fact remains Leica operate in a luxury niche, they have even branched out into selling £10k wristwatches
    Now "niche" I can agree with (rather than the parenthesis in #24), especially as I don't see their niche as anything to do with horology.

    As to the watches, I like the look and the, albeit limited, novelty...but, as several others have said, not at that price.

  38. #38
    Master mycroft's Avatar
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    It looks like a nicely built watch - but not 10 grand's worth.

    I don't like the fact that on the L2 there are 3 pushers or crowns and they are all completely different. Messy design on an otherwise almost Bauhaus approach. As has been said, I think Nomos does this style of design better, for a lot less money.

    Simon
    Last edited by mycroft; 14th June 2018 at 18:12. Reason: Spolling mistook...

  39. #39
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by swatch View Post
    Odd that they haven't used the classic Leica font and made more of the iconic 'red dot'.
    According to Hodinkee (not a particularly reliable source I know), the red dot is alluded to by the ruby set in the crown.


  40. #40
    Ahhh?!? Completely the wrong colour, looks a bit cheap too that..

  41. #41
    Apprentice philou31's Avatar
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    Nice looking watches, but not for 10k. Who's next entering on the watch market ? Hasselblad ?
    I'm not even sure of the market position, Leica cameras users are already wearing Rolex,PP, AP, etc...

  42. #42
    Craftsman Nuisance Value's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vulcangascompany View Post
    Ahhh?!? Completely the wrong colour, looks a bit cheap too that..
    Doesn't it. Should have gone with a nice coloured enamel or porcelain..

  43. #43
    Grand Master Carlton-Browne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alfat33 View Post
    According to Hodinkee (not a particularly reliable source I know), the red dot is alluded to by the ruby set in the crown.
    I know they say that but I think they have their wires crossed with the (occasional) red dot on the dial. I'm struggling to see what a purple bit of stone has to do with Leica.
    Die Zeit verwandelt uns nicht, sie entfaltet uns nur.

  44. #44
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlton-Browne View Post
    I know they say that but I think they have their wires crossed with the (occasional) red dot on the dial. I'm struggling to see what a purple bit of stone has to do with Leica.
    What does Bob call them? Hoodwinkee?

  45. #45
    Grand Master Carlton-Browne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alfat33 View Post
    What does Bob call them? Hoodwinkee?
    I think we all call them that.
    Die Zeit verwandelt uns nicht, sie entfaltet uns nur.

  46. #46
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by alfat33 View Post
    According to Hodinkee (not a particularly reliable source I know), the red dot is alluded to by the ruby set in the crown.

    Oof, that side angle has put me right off. Whatever happened to thin watches? Unless the whole package is way smaller than Iím imagining, Iíd expect it to take pictures too with that bulk.

  47. #47
    Grand Master Chris_in_the_UK's Avatar
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    Not for me at all.

    They will no doubt sell some - the Chinese market will lap these up in their Leica love.
    When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........

  48. #48
    Grand Master seikopath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Itsguy View Post
    Oof, that side angle has put me right off. Whatever happened to thin watches? Unless the whole package is way smaller than Iím imagining, Iíd expect it to take pictures too with that bulk.
    No worse than a black bay
    Beyond ideas of good and bad, there is a field. I'll meet you there.

  49. #49
    What do those dial cut outs do? They look like they should have a function but I can't see anything about them in the article, and they're blank so not like a triple date function.

  50. #50
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    Feels like a management pet project


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