Early retirement

[TomGW]

Work is looking to reduce office staff by 1 in 4 by November, and EoI (Expression of Interest) for voluntary redundancy opens shortly.

I’m fully paid up long serving employee so can walk away with 2 years salary plus 3 months notice, plus start my very good final salary pension at 55 with only a 15% reduction.

I paid off the mortgage but have a couple of kids to get through university. I know they can take the debt.

I’m sorely tempted, but actually enjoy my job and it is pretty stress free (I’m a professional engineer with no pesky line managerial responsibility crap).

Also lockdown had not given me a warm fuzzy feeling of spending long winters without work. I always envisaged I would keep my hand in by doing a little consultancy work, but Covid has put paid to that.

I’m 51 and it feels a little early to retire, but I’m sorely tempted.

The 2 years salary + 3 months will compensate for the 15% pension reduction for roughly 15 years, without allowing for the fact that there’s a tax advantage in the redundancy lump sum.
Go for it and there’s bound to be some consultancy work to add a little income and keep you occupied.
I did exactly this; 15% reduced pension at 57 and now 6 years later I’m enjoying the freedom to work as little or much consultancy as I want. To be truthful, I’m hoping that post-Covid will reduce my work to 2 or max 3 days/week.

[noTAGlove]

How long you got there?

Just coming up for 16 years - the magic number!! I contributed to the 15/35 pension option for many years which helped a lot.

I only live 6 miles from the ICBT so homeworking is not a priority for me.

[Maris]

I am sure the experts will be along soon, however once you start to crystallise your SIPP, take what you actually need. Therefore I am taking my full tax allowance from my 75% taxed pot, and whatever else I need from my tax free pot.

Interesting discussion. Can I ask a dumb question
Is it therefore tax efficient to draw down the whole 25% tax free element + £12.5k in the first year of retirement? If I took the 25% over more than one tax year wouldn’t I be losing the tax free allowance for each of those years.
I’m probably missing something obvious here

Thanks

Casper

Dont take the tax free cash unless you need it, you can take 25% of the pot tax free or 25% of each crystallised amount. It’s better to crystallise chunks as you go so that you take 12.5k tax free plus 25% tax free of the chunk you crystallised in a tax year. Doing it this way leaves your pot to grow therefore increasing the 25% tax free cash you take out.

[JuanKing]

Just coming up for 16 years - the magic number!! I contributed to the 15/35 pension option for many years which helped a lot.

I only live 6 miles from the ICBT so homeworking is not a priority for me.

I only live 10 miles from NSHQ but with home working we would relocate and live anywhere! Good luck mate.

[anton863]

If you are termed a good leaver (that comes with redundancy) it means you can take a reduced pension at 55 (15% discount). Those privileges do are not available if you are a bad leaver, i.e. if I leave without being made redundant.

Hence the reason why redundancy is so attractive.

Oh that's interesting, and swings it even more in favour of taking. Are you there until 60 if you aren't a 'good leaver'?

[noTAGlove]

Are you there until 60 if you aren't a 'good leaver'?

No. I can obviously quit any time I wish. But, I would lose the ability to take the pension at 55 with a 15% reduction, as that is only offered to good leavers.

If I quit, the reduction in pension at 55 would be so large that It would be sensible then to wait and live off savings, until I can take the pension unreduced at 60.

[noTAGlove]

I only live 10 miles from NSHQ but with home working we would relocate and live anywhere! Good luck mate.

I spent the best part of 2 years commuting Mon-Thurs to your office, and surrounding Contractor offices.

A lovely part of the U.K. for countryside, but the quiet life and weather (particularly in the summer) would always be a struggle for me.

The opportunity to relocate wherever you please sounds like a great plan if you can get it to work for you.

Best of luck to you too.

[MartynJC (UK)]

Plans firm now. After spending most of 6 weeks viewing it most be between 10 and 15 properties valued between 350.000€ and 550.000€.

We have had an offer accepted on a property in Portugal. Three bed, own water supply, central heating, wood burner, open plan kitchen and sitting / dining area, single story, 10x5m swimming pool, 8000sqm land currently (approx 2acres) mostly orange orchard, but we have plans. Amazing panoramic views down to the sea which you can just see as its 25mins drive to the coast. Big bonus it was a private sale so less than any of the agent properties.

We have a local lawyer (friend recommended) who is dealing with the legalities. Luckily we know one of the two UK qualified surveyors in Portugal so are getting a reputable impartial survey done. If all goes to plan we should complete by May!!!

back in the UK on Monday to see if our UK house is still in one piece. Apparently there’s been some high winds or something? Still plan to sell up in UK, but no pressure as this was priced well enough that we don’t need to sell immediately.

really can’t wait to start the next phase of our lives. Very excited. A bit of trepidation moving country but we are still young enough to do it and fortunate enough to be in a financial position to do so.

Not sure how this will affect abilities to trade in watches with UK folks post-Brexit, but that is another topic for a different thread (and forum).

Martyn

Quick update.

Well that went t@ts-up. Still here in the sunny UK.

Good news was in March various items completed

Our lawyer gave us a rent free address in Portugal.
We now have a Portuguese Tax ID,
Registered as a tax resident in Portugal,
Registered as Non Habitual Resident (before they changed to 10% tax on income, including pension income),
EU Bank Account.
Various FX accounts setup for low rate transfers from GBP-EUR - we have enough in EUR for any deposit we need for a property.


The bad news -

The property we wanted was built not to plan, it was not located on the land where it should have been. It's not possible to fix this under current legislation, but that may change. So we are not proceeding on that property.
Oh - COVID-19 means travel is complicated and flights cancelled
Brexit - may slow things down if we do not complete before end of year.


Better news
We found another property in budget! But the pool is not legal (what is it with this country), but this is in process of being made legal. We haven't seen it in person - but hope to soon.

[Andyg]

I saw something today on a website saying that the Sunak was going to change the rules regarding personal pensions, and that the access age would increase to 57 (from 55).

[MartynJC (UK)]

I saw something today on a website saying that the Sunak was going to change the rules regarding personal pensions, and that the access age would increase to 57 (from 55).

Yep. Bringing into law what they proposed in 2014, from 2028 the age you can access personal pension plans rises from 55 to 57. Slipped under the radar except for a few low key reports.

[Ruggertech]

Yep. Bringing into law what they proposed in 2014, from 2028 the age you can access personal pension plans rises from 55 to 57. Slipped under the radar except for a few low key reports.

From 2028 then and not now, is that correct please?

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[Passenger]

Ha still just nipped under the line, suck it Sunak.Jog on with yer Spoons vouchers.

[craig1912]

From 2028 then and not now, is that correct please?

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yep

[Andyg]

Yep. Bringing into law what they proposed in 2014, from 2028 the age you can access personal pension plans rises from 55 to 57. Slipped under the radar except for a few low key reports.

Well at least they have provided 8 years notice.

[Ruggertech]

yep

Phew! Thanks. 55 in January, and have been living on (voluntary) redundancy money since last year, which will run out just as my pensions start in the new year. Another two years would have been problematic to say the least.
I shouldn't have been concerned I suppose. Thinking about it, my pension providers who I have recently been dealing with for choosing options etc wouldn't have been able to proceed.

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[RD200]

Phew! Thanks. 55 in January, and have been living on (voluntary) redundancy money since last year, which will run out just as my pensions start in the new year. Another two years would have been problematic to say the least.
I shouldn't have been concerned I suppose. Thinking about it, my pension providers who I have recently been dealing with for choosing options etc wouldn't have been able to proceed.

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I took voluntary redundancy/early retirement at xmas but hadn't worked there long so the money didn't go very far.
Cashed in a small pension (16k) a couple of months ago which is tax free so that'll help till I take my final salaries in February.


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[Ruggertech]

I took voluntary redundancy/early retirement at xmas but hadn't worked there long so the money didn't go very far.
Cashed in a small pension (16k) a couple of months ago which is tax free so that'll help till I take my final salaries in February.


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Worth doing when the opportunity presents itself, and surprising how far your money will go with a little cautious budgeting. If I hadn't taken voluntary I'd have been laid off this month anyway but would have had to work through most of the year with only a month or two furloughed. I'd only been there nine years but everyone had a very similar package offer regardless of service.

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[RD200]

Worth doing when the opportunity presents itself, and surprising how far your money will go with a little cautious budgeting. If I hadn't taken voluntary I'd have been laid off this month anyway but would have had to work through most of the year with only a month or two furloughed. I'd only been there nine years but everyone had a very similar package offer regardless of service.

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It went down hill rapidly where I used to work.
They were on short time before coronavirus then a lot went on furlough followed by redundancies in August.
Half of the shop floor where I worked have either volunteered or been potted and they reckon there'll be more.
I'd miscalculated with the 16k pension.I thought I'd have some tax to pay but when I got in touch with HMRC I got the tax I'd paid rebated and some for the previous year too.
Are you in line for the full SP ?

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[ryanb741]

Is there any way you can offshore your pension? Seems like NI will be payable on pensions as part of a tax revamp to pay for Covid so that will eat into the amount received.

[valleywatch]

I retired in June this year, aged 60.

My "plan"! was to go to Thailand, Sept.-December, home for Christmas, then back to Thailand, Jan-April..........

Of course..this isnt going to happen now..."hopefully" , next year though.

I had a final salary pension, I have a small terraced house, no debts/mortgage etc...so im doing fine.

Of course. we all have different ideas on how much money is enough!.

I will be sound financially, Ive never been extravagant anyway....I didnt like the job I was doing anyway, though the pay was decent.........

Im more than happy, Ive finished, though of course! Id rather be in Thailand in the winter-times.

Where I used to work, (I was a train driver), some of the guys there, were "terrified" about retiring?! I couldnt (and still dont!) understand why...some were working in their late 60s? ...One guard was 70!..........as I say though, we are all different.......my view is, you cant buy time.

[Ruggertech]

It went down hill rapidly where I used to work.
They were on short time before coronavirus then a lot went on furlough followed by redundancies in August.
Half of the shop floor where I worked have either volunteered or been potted and they reckon there'll be more.
I'd miscalculated with the 16k pension.I thought I'd have some tax to pay but when I got in touch with HMRC I got the tax I'd paid rebated and some for the previous year too.
Are you in line for the full SP ?

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Sounds like you made the right choice!
I'm a couple of years shy of the full SP but when I looked a couple of years ago the amount I would have to pay to top it up, compared to the weekly rise it would give just didn't seem worth it. And it's still over a decade before I can draw it anyway, lots of water passing under the bridge between now and then.

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[Ruggertech]

Where I used to work, (I was a train driver), some of the guys there, were "terrified" about retiring?! I couldnt (and still dont!) understand why...some were working in their late 60s? ...One guard was 70!..........as I say though, we are all different.......my view is, you cant buy time.

With you completely on your concept of financial needs, I'm living exactly the same by the sounds of it.
Where I worked there were guys in their late 60s aswell who had acquired full final salary pension at 58 allied with a huge, sometimes 200k+ pot, but still working. We worked out that some of them were working a 3 shift pattern all week for less than £100 take home. They seemed terrified of stopping, but they have to this month because the factory is closing, and they've effectively lost a decade in my view.
I also say you cant buy time, but you can buy some of the time you've got.

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[RD200]

Sounds like you made the right choice!
I'm a couple of years shy of the full SP but when I looked a couple of years ago the amount I would have to pay to top it up, compared to the weekly rise it would give just didn't seem worth it. And it's still over a decade before I can draw it anyway, lots of water passing under the bridge between now and then.

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When I first checked my SP forecast I got a shock when I found uptil about 2010 kids at school including me were being paid a NI stamp as 15-18 year olds at school, college, in apprenticeships and other training.
At first I thought it was from doing a paper round

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[valleywatch]

With you completely on your concept of financial needs, I'm living exactly the same by the sounds of it.
Where I worked there were guys in their late 60s aswell who had acquired full final salary pension at 58 allied with a huge, sometimes 200k+ pot, but still working. We worked out that some of them were working a 3 shift pattern all week for less than £100 take home. They seemed terrified of stopping, but they have to this month because the factory is closing, and they've effectively lost a decade in my view.
I also say you cant buy time, but you can buy some of the time you've got.

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I "tried"! telling them, they were paying more in tax, than wages!

Ive seen too many people die before "enjoying" their retirement.

There were even some, who "wanted" to die whilst still employed!? When I asked them why? Thet answered, well..my family will get my "death in service benefits?!!

i tried telling them, that when they retire, they would get their "lump sum"..........plus weekly pension, plus their partners would get a pension (reduced of course) when they did eventually die...........it all fell on deaf ears of course!

People are so different! Just as well of course!..

[RD200]

With you completely on your concept of financial needs, I'm living exactly the same by the sounds of it.
Where I worked there were guys in their late 60s aswell who had acquired full final salary pension at 58 allied with a huge, sometimes 200k+ pot, but still working. We worked out that some of them were working a 3 shift pattern all week for less than £100 take home. They seemed terrified of stopping, but they have to this month because the factory is closing, and they've effectively lost a decade in my view.
I also say you cant buy time, but you can buy some of the time you've got.

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I took early retirement because of the state of my knees which I partly put down to being stood up all my working life.
When I was taking my redundancy we were in a meeting with the union solicitor and at 61 I was one of the youngest.
I only knew of one bloke who worked past his retirement and he could hardly walk.
The firm had lost it's final salary pension some years ago to save the factory.

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[Ruggertech]

I "tried"! telling them, they were paying more in tax, than wages!

Ive seen too many people die before "enjoying" their retirement.

There were even some, who "wanted" to die whilst still employed!? When I asked them why? Thet answered, well..my family will get my "death in service benefits?!!

i tried telling them, that when they retire, they would get their "lump sum"..........plus weekly pension, plus their partners would get a pension (reduced of course) when they did eventually die...........it all fell on deaf ears of course!

People are so different! Just as well of course!..

Even before the factory got into trouble I planned to finish at 55, and I'd have 67 year olds saying "think of all the money you'll lose". I'd say I wouldn't be losing a penny as I wouldn't have gone to work to earn it.

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[Ruggertech]

I took early retirement because of the state of my knees which I partly put down to being stood up all my working life.
When I was taking my redundancy we were in a meeting with the union solicitor and at 61 I was one of the youngest.
I only knew of bloke who worked past his retirement and he could hardly walk.
The firm had lost it's final salary pension some years ago to save the factory.

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Indeed, your health post retirement is beyond priceless.

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[RD200]

I "tried"! telling them, they were paying more in tax, than wages!

Ive seen too many people die before "enjoying" their retirement.

There were even some, who "wanted" to die whilst still employed!? When I asked them why? Thet answered, well..my family will get my "death in service benefits?!!

i tried telling them, that when they retire, they would get their "lump sum"..........plus weekly pension, plus their partners would get a pension (reduced of course) when they did eventually die...........it all fell on deaf ears of course!

People are so different! Just as well of course!..

I can remember years ago when some people got the chance for redundancy and a lump sum out of their pension to go at 64.
They were told they were actually losing money by staying.


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[RD200]

Indeed, your health post retirement is beyond priceless.

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I absolutely agree.
We've all known people who either haven't made it or have finished then lasted a matter of months into retirement.
Being told you'll live to 86 means nothing.

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[Passenger]

I absolutely agree.
We've all known people who either haven't made it or have finished then lasted a matter of months into retirement.
Being told you'll live to 86 means nothing.

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From observation it seems rather purgatorial for some tbh get out whilst your health is still good or at least decent if you can.

[RD200]

From observation it seems rather purgatorial for some tbh get out whilst your health is still good or at least decent if you can.

The last couple of years seemed like purgatory to me
I did some blood pressure checks at work and at home, 30 minutes after 2-10 shifts.
I wasn't in a high pressure job but it was physical and once I'd got home my BP was fine.

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[g40steve]

With you completely on your concept of financial needs, I'm living exactly the same by the sounds of it.
Where I worked there were guys in their late 60s aswell who had acquired full final salary pension at 58 allied with a huge, sometimes 200k+ pot, but still working. We worked out that some of them were working a 3 shift pattern all week for less than £100 take home. They seemed terrified of stopping, but they have to this month because the factory is closing, and they've effectively lost a decade in my view.
I also say you cant buy time, but you can buy some of the time you've got.

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Can you explain the bit about 200k?
Is this the amount in the pension pot or the amount they receive on top of the penion?

[MartynJC (UK)]

Is there any way you can offshore your pension? Seems like NI will be payable on pensions as part of a tax revamp to pay for Covid so that will eat into the amount received.

I bet that’s not publicised too much. Just when I got to stop NI they may slap it back on again.

[Ruggertech]

Can you explain the bit about 200k?
Is this the amount in the pension pot or the amount they receive on top of the penion?

This is the amount on top, consisting of a tax free lump sum plus a package that would be occasionally offered in small numbers to the most senior (in terms of service not age) staff.

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[MartynJC (UK)]

After intensive searches. We have another offer on the table. This could be my lounge if all goes to plan. 25C today!

[Carlton-Browne]

That's not going to work - where are you going to hang your ducks?

[bambam]

After intensive searches. We have another offer on the table. This could be my lounge if all goes to plan. 25C today!

That looks amazing! Good luck with it.

[thieuster]

As I've written a long time ago in this thread: I'd retired myself at an early age but started working in a school as a teacher and later as vice-principal again.

We're in the process of buying another house and moving. So it's a good moment to start counting all the money and savings. About an hour ago, after checking all the number, I came to the conclusion that retiring from education (I'm still involved in the classic car scene) is better for my financial situation than keep on working. After so many years (nearly 42 yrs of teaching), I've saved enough money so that my monthly 'retirement allowence' is higher than what I earn in school as a teacher/vice principal! That's without the pension everybody gets when he's 66 y/o.

Perhaps I would have continued working without Covid lurking around. I love my work. Despite the fact that teaching is regarded to be stressful and not always nice, I never had a problem. It has been fun. In fact, I would not hesitate to do it all over again if I was 20 yrs old. But, I strongly believe that children and teachers are part of a social & medical experiment in this day and age. (As I have explained in another thread, here on the forum). I'm simply afraid to be infected. And with a history of a cardiac arrest etc, I think that I, my health and schools are a bad combination. So I've written my resign letter and I will hand it to my boss next thing Monday morning. Sadly, my position comes a (legal) 4 months notice period. So, I'll close the doors behind me on Jan 31, 2021.

Menno

[hogthrob]

As I've written a long time ago in this thread: I'd retired myself at an early age but started working in a school as a teacher and later as vice-principal again.

We're in the process of buying another house and moving. So it's a good moment to start counting all the money and savings. About an hour ago, after checking all the number, I came to the conclusion that retiring from education (I'm still involved in the classic car scene) is better for my financial situation than keep on working. After so many years (nearly 42 yrs of teaching), I've saved enough money so that my monthly 'retirement allowence' is higher than what I earn in school as a teacher/vice principal! That's without the pension everybody gets when he's 66 y/o.

Perhaps I would have continued working without Covid lurking around. I love my work. Despite the fact that teaching is regarded to be stressful and not always nice, I never had a problem. It has been fun. In fact, I would not hesitate to do it all over again if I was 20 yrs old. But, I strongly believe that children and teachers are part of a social & medical experiment in this day and age. (As I have explained in another thread, here on the forum). I'm simply afraid to be infected. And with a history of a cardiac arrest etc, I think that I, my health and schools are a bad combination. So I've written my resign letter and I will hand it to my boss next thing Monday morning. Sadly, my position comes a (legal) 4 months notice period. So, I'll close the doors behind me on Jan 31, 2021.

Menno

After 42 years, you have more than earned a little time in your new workhangar.

[xellos99]

Your only here once and you wont come back so why not enjoy yourself.

Portugal though too hot for me lol

[MartynJC (UK)]

Your only here once and you wont come back so why not enjoy yourself.

Portugal though too hot for me lol

Yes - we may need to cool off and visit sunny Devon or Cornwall during the summer season.

[Mick P]

It's just August that's the hot month and it really is best to get out of it. I am still stuck out here (another flight got cancelled on Friday) and August was an absolute killer. The pool temperature was 36 degrees, so even a dip in the pool didn't cool us down.

Despite that, you seem to have made a good choice and you can become a member of that imaginary club of permanently boozed up expats who spend all their time moaning about the UK.

Today it is 31 degrees and a wonderful place to be.

[MartynJC (UK)]

It's just August that's the hot month and it really is best to get out of it. I am still stuck out here (another flight got cancelled on Friday) and August was an absolute killer. The pool temperature was 36 degrees, so even a dip in the pool didn't cool us down.

Despite that, you seem to have made a good choice and you can become a member of that imaginary club of permanently boozed up expats who spend all their time moaning about the UK.

Today it is 31 degrees and a wonderful place to be.

Thanks Mike! You are in Spain ? We have our offer accepted on a place 12km (15mins drive) from the coast near Gale / Silves etc. Now just the legal to sort out. Yippee!!

[Mick P]

Thanks Mike! You are in Spain ? We have our offer accepted on a place 12km (15mins drive) from the coast near Gale / Silves etc. Now just the legal to sort out. Yippee!!

I think you have done the right thing but you will need to adjust to a couple of things.

First you will tear your hair our when the shops and businesses shut for the daily siesta between 2.00pm - 5.00pm.

Secondly the Spanish will shout at you even though you are just few feet from them. They think of noise as a sign of life, so barking dogs, noisy radios etc are the norm. You certainly won't need a hearing aid out here.

Mañana can be irritating at first and they just cannot understand why we are so obsessed with punctuality. They say they will deliver the bed at 3.00pm and wonder why you are chasing them at 7.00 when you are still waiting for it. Eventually you cotton on that 3.00 really mean't 7.00pm.

They are extraordinarily kind and often dote over children. They also dote over family pets until something goes wrong and then they just dump them a mile up the road. The place is crawling with strays.

Things to do to help yourself is to at least make it look like you are trying to learn the language. They really do appreciate the fact you are not acting like a tourist. Secondly, never ever mention Franco, it is somewhat Taboo, they just want to forget him and are embarrassed that you know of him.

If you sit down at a table and order a beer or wine, alway order a tapas as it is considered poor form to drink on an empty stomach. They strongly believe that food soaks up drink and prevents drunkeness which really is a no no.

I don't actually live in Spain full time. I spend about 5 months a year over here and the rest in the UK and on holidays abroad in Europe or Asia. So legally I am just a tourist who just owns a property out here. I am due back in the UK in October.

[Dave+63]

I don’t know how much of that applies to Portugal too Mick but I learnt early on that “mañana” doesn’t mean “tomorrow”, it actually means “not today”!

[MartynJC (UK)]

But I am in Portugal!

I think you have done the right thing but you will need to adjust to a couple of things.

First you will tear your hair our when the shops and businesses shut for the daily siesta between 2.00pm - 5.00pm.

Secondly the Spanish will shout at you even though you are just few feet from them. They think of noise as a sign of life, so barking dogs, noisy radios etc are the norm. You certainly won't need a hearing aid out here.

Mañana can be irritating at first and they just cannot understand why we are so obsessed with punctuality. They say they will deliver the bed at 3.00pm and wonder why you are chasing them at 7.00 when you are still waiting for it. Eventually you cotton on that 3.00 really mean't 7.00pm.

They are extraordinarily kind and often dote over children. They also dote over family pets until something goes wrong and then they just dump them a mile up the road. The place is crawling with strays.

Things to do to help yourself is to at least make it look like you are trying to learn the language. They really do appreciate the fact you are not acting like a tourist. Secondly, never ever mention Franco, it is somewhat Taboo, they just want to forget him and are embarrassed that you know of him.

If you sit down at a table and order a beer or wine, alway order a tapas as it is considered poor form to drink on an empty stomach. They strongly believe that food soaks up drink and prevents drunkeness which really is a no no.

I don't actually live in Spain full time. I spend about 5 months a year over here and the rest in the UK and on holidays abroad in Europe or Asia. So legally I am just a tourist who just owns a property out here. I am due back in the UK in October.

[Carlton-Browne]

But I am in Portugal!

Probably best not to mention Salazar then. And definitely don't mention the Peninsular Wars, not even if you think you got away with it once.

[Devonian]

Mick won’t let that get in the way of a good story!

But I am in Portugal!

[MartynJC (UK)]

Probably best not to mention Salazar then. And definitely don't mention the Peninsular Wars, not even if you think you got away with it once.

Don’t menzion Zé war! ( to paraphrase Basil Fautly)

[jwg663]

...the Spanish...

But I am in Portugal!

It's all Iberia, innit!