An appeal the the sparks on our forum...
We are at the back ens of our house extension/renovation and there is a difference of interpretation about an aspect of the electric supply to the bathrooms.
We have gone for self contained shower cabins (Insignia) and they specify a ‘fused 13 amp spur’ for the supply - for those not familiar with the shower cabin principle, they are a self-contained unit which has a lid on the top which encloses it completely. Our ‘sparks’ has interpreted the regs by fitting a 2 gang socket above the top of the unit to plug the 12v transformer into for the sealed shower cabin.
Our builder however has kicked off about having a mains supply socket above the shower.
Any advice greatly received.
Last edited by Chris_in_the_UK; 8th February 2018 at 21:50.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
My lad is an apprentice spark and I showed him this. He agrees with the builder that you cannot have a socket in a bathroom and the shower should be supplied through a 13amp fuse spur (in the loft for example) and straight into the back of the shower unit (hard wired).
^^^^ ThisOriginally Posted by Wallasey Runner
Not that simple - complicated by the shower cabin being a sealed unit and it is supplied with a moulded 3 pin mains adaptor.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
18th edition regulations allow sockets in bathrooms (albeit 3m away from any water) and now also allow surface switches (apparently).
I do not want to fall out with the sparks but I kind of agree with the builder.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
These are from the edition that my lad has, they may be useful for reference. These are the industry standard regs.
Very useful Ken - many thanks.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
It is that simple, cut the moulded plug off and wire in to the spur. Why would anyone want a socket in the bathroom let alone above a shower?
That won't work as it is transformer, even if it was a plug you would be bypassing the plug fuse, not a good idea.
Sent from my SM-N910F using Tapatalk
The moulded plug is a 12v 500ma one, so it needs th be a bit more eloquent. I agree with your sentiments and the current position is not what I envisaged.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
Is it even in a bathroom?
shocking!
The fuse is in the spur......
Fair enough, lose the plug with built in transformer and buy a 12v PSU and fit in the loft and drop the feed down the wall to the shower like mentioned above.
My original thoughts - complicated in that the room has a vaulted ceiling but possible to get it elsewhere - back to the sparks methinks.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
how about running the feed from another room, under the floor then up the wall. 500mA is a very low supply. You could get a 1amp PSU that's designed to power an intruder alarm very cheaply. They have replaceable glass fuses in them. Swap the fuse for 500mA fuse and it will last forever. You can run a 0.75 2 core flex to the shower and use wego connectors to couple it to the shower. Or if possible an IP 66 junction box.
Last edited by D4RK1; 8th February 2018 at 23:11.
Many thanks = current 240v is from a fused spur in adjoining bedroom - this could be easily swapped for what you suggest?
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
yes. The spur can power the PSU. Run a feed from that to the shower. Very simple for the sparks to do.
While it's correct that an outlet could not be sited above a normal bath/shower that's not what the OP is installing: it's s fully enclosed cubicle with a lid something like this:
In this case why would a socket above the roof of the shower pod not be acceptable? It's not in a splash zone.
That is the issue in one.While it's correct that an outlet could not be sited above a normal bath/shower that's not what the OP is installing: it's s fully enclosed cubicle with a lid something like this:
In this case why would a socket above the roof of the shower pod not be acceptable? It's not in a splash zone.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
Because it would look terrible? Does the 12V 500mA just do some LED lights in there?
I’d get a separate PSU in there as well.
That's not a bathroom. Its a bloody living room
Essentially yes (and an FM radio).
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
Technically because it's a sealed cabin what has been done is allowable however I wouldn't do it that way and feed it from another room or loftspace. I don't agree with anything other than a shaving socket in bathrooms power wise
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
But you're superimposing your person view over a set of official regulations. What gives you the right to do that? If it's your house then fine, but as an electician why should you be able to do so?
I had this arguement with an electrician when changing the CU in a house where the lighting circuit earths aren't made off. He insisted the house needed complete rewiring despite the fact that regulations specifically provide a relief mechanism for this particular situation. Needless to say he was booted off the job.
Because he has a responsibility to do what he thinks is safe? Safer, neater, what's not to like?
Because you're saying you know better than the organisation legally charged with drawing up the regulations. Are you really that arrogant?
If it’s only 12v dc at 500mA max you could probably hide a dry cell 12v square battery somewhere which would last 3 months+
Either way I wouldn’t use the wall wart transformer, get one that fits inside a fuse box and fit this new fuse box in the loft above. Overkill but neat, safe and legal and will last longer than the shower. I would also put in 12v 5A and upgrade the radio for decent choonz.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Really? So why is installing a fused spur less safe?
Why not just contact NICEIC and just have them verify what’s advised?
Isn’t the problem here that’s it’s unsightly and that the solution proposed by the electrician is, well frankly lazy on his part?
If it’s a moulded plug with the correct CE going into a mains outlet an appropriate distance from the fitting and other sources of water it seems the safety isn’t in question??
Aren’t we discussing aesthetics here? Failing to see how suggesting a better looking solution can be thought of as arrogant but there you go.
Can your sparky not call the NICEIC to confirm his interpretation?
For added protection the you could use an IP65 socket (with RCD if the circuit is not already protected) or if the adaptor is too big the socket could be enclosed in an IP65 enclosure.
My under floor heating is controlled by a switched fused spur outside of the bathroom.
Because if I'm signing my name to it and I'm the one who would be sent to prison if there was an accident I will stick to what I believe is the safest/best installation that will at least meet current regulations or exceed them. If a customer told me they know better etc etc they'd be told to do it themselves and leave me out of it. I don't believe that's arrogance just common sense the regs regarding bathrooms etc change constantly and electricity and water don't mix well so I will always err on the side of caution.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
