Who is paying the over inflated prices for Rolex or any of the other brands at the moment with the Omega LE in mind.
Seems to be a standard 30% mark up at all the usual places, WF, Blowers etc and how do they get all these unworn brand new models before the people on lists.
Wouldn't do it, currently find myself disgusted at the high street chain who are now promoting used rolex. Nearly 9k for a blnr and 7-7.5 for a sub it honestly makes me boil. I'd much rather wait and savour the anticipation of the call (or work hard and phone round to try and find stock first) at rrp
People on lists who get their watch sell them to dealers for more than RRP, and then people who don't want to wait buy them at an even higher price over RRP. Not too difficult to understand.Originally Posted by Flasher
The key function of a business is to make money, so it stands to reason they will charge what the market is willing to pay. Don't like it, don't buy it. Absolutely nothing to stop you going on a list and waiting.
Bought a Silver Snoopy for £8.5k and a second one for £9k and people said I was mad. These are now trading at £13k, so who's mad. Unfortunately I didn't get £13k for mine.
If you can buy a white dial Ceramic Daytona below £14k there is some logic to it. Leave you name on the lists and if you are lucky enough to get the call then sell one and recover your earlier premium. If you keep it for 7 years and then get the call see what the RRP is at that time against what you paid today and you have had ownership for 7 years.
If you flip you won't lose much money at all with WF asking £17.5k these days and each one sells within a day or two.
Sure, some premiums are a gamble such as the SD43, but the two above are rock solid at present.
I can’t imagine wanting any watch badly enough to pay over list, I would simply find another watch to like!
As for going on lists to obtain the ‘darling’ watches with the sole intent to sell for profit, I’ve got mixed feelings on that. I wouldn’t rule it out on moral grounds but deep down I’d be thinking that the guy who was buying from me was stupid.
I prefer doing deals where I can maintain respect and admiration for the guy who’s prepared to deal with me, whether it’s a watch repair or a watch I’ve restored to sell. If I decided to start buying these rarities to take advantage of the bubble efect I wouldn’t sell the watches on this forum. Some may struggle to grasp my logic on this one, but that’s my take on it.
Paul
I’m all for supply and demand, but not at an artificial level brought on by flippers and dealers. It’s not supply and demand, it’s more like hostage and ransom.
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I think I know who you are talking about and as a new gimmick they now include “collectible” in the sales description.
If anyone is buying their stock, I would be amazed.
How much do you expect to make on selling a new sub etc to a dealer, as I do not know many dealers who pay over RRP for any model or is it that the dealers have AD connections which allows them to pick them up at RRP and then maximise their inflated profit .
It's standard practice in most high end industries.
Take cars. Limited production models available to preferred customers. Cars then get flipped for multiples of their worth almost indefinitely, even as they age.
Try getting your head around this happening with multi-hundred thousand and even million pound plus purchases.
I find it hard morally to consider paying over list price for any commodity, especially non-essential.
I would be tempted to buy decent water in Cape Town at the moment however regardless of price!
Agreed, but there must be enough folks buying at the big prices to keep the merry-go - round turning, and that’s the bit I find hard to understand.
Dealers pay over list for sought after models.
If they didn't, the people who buy them at Ad's at list would have lesser incentive to sell them on immediately.
Last edited by verv; 24th January 2018 at 21:20.
I usually drink half a pint of tasty Yorkshire tapwater before going to bed.........I’ll enjoy it all the more having read this
If you're minted and don't want to wait, you buy over rrp.
For some an extra 4k is buttons.
Wouldn't have the foggiest. But if they can sell a Daytona's for 14k then they'll happily pay over list for one. They are highly sought after models which are very limited in supply from ADs, its very simple.
While it's not for me, I don't see how paying over retail for an in-demand Rolex is any more foolish than buying a new IWC or Montblanc or Hublot or whatever and instantly losing considerably more value than the typical watch-scalper's premium.
That seems to be were the Rolex market is at right now. Buyers with money to throw away and are not bothered about RRP but who just want the new bling now.
Would think the extra spend over RRP would make more sense paying off your mortgage early rather than a piece of urgent wrist flash.
Different strokes for different folks I suppose.
There are five bedroom houses across town from me that cost 40 times my flat. 4 grand divided by 40 is £100. If £100 was the difference between my having the watch I really want and not, I would probably pay it, and certainly wouldn't feel like I had done my finances any mischief.
I tend to liken it to airport express security tickets.
Can't be bothered to wait? Buy a ticket for the express lane.
It's a silly price to save five minutes but enough people use it to make it a viable moneyspinner for the airport.
Buying over list isn't always throwing money away anyway. The times I've done it (few hundred not thousands) I've also sold over list and broken even. Depending on the model and private buying the prices can be quite stable.
Plus give it a couple of price hikes and above list can soon go to below rrp.
As beligero said, there are other watches that will guarantee you taking a bath for higher sums.
With that line of thinking you may as well not bother with the luxury watch at all, just buy a Casio F-91W instead and be done with it. I personally wouldn't pay over RRP for any current watch, but it's no more ridiculous a concept than buying a multi-thousand pound watch in the first place. Of course any money spent on non-essentials could always be used on something more fiscally responsible, but that would be pretty dull.
I have no idea how they get hold of them. Maybe someone buys one from AD, changes mind after 30 days and has enough money to take a hit on resale to WF etc?
I wouldn’t pay ott especially for a rollie.
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Buying from an AD in a country where RRP is higher than the UK (so pretty much anywhere in the world) ... does that count as paying over RRP? If so, I’ve done that and very glad that I did. I couldn’t get the watch here despite trying very hard. Few months later, we had a price rise and my “over rrp” watch became “under rrp” exactly like verv said.
I’d happily pay £1k over list for a batman , hulk and steel Daytona . And I reckon everyone on this forum would too
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Nope, sorry. Glad I waited the three months for my BLNR. To pay that kind of money is madness.I’d happily pay £1k over list for a batman , hulk and steel Daytona . And I reckon everyone on this forum would too
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A couple of years ago, everyone was asking for advice on what discount they could achieve at an AD and also how to haggle at the grey dealers who, back then, undercut the AD's.
Today the AD's don't have any of the fast sellers because they sell them onto chains who resell to us at increased prices above RRP.
We sliced the dealers to bits when we could and now they are doing the same to us.
It's called the market and there is no escaping it.
I don't understand why people get upset over a made-up number.
Rolex releases a watch with an RRP of £9k, none are available at that price but are, say, at £10k - people are absolutely outraged, and refuse to pay. But if Rolex had released the watch with an RRP of £10k (which they could easily have done given the completely arbitrary nature of their pricing) and the watches were readily available, then those same people would apparently be queueing up, credit card at the ready and a big grin on their faces.
Bizarre.
Be.ieve it or not, there are folks on this forum who have no desire to own these tatty fashionable trinkets.....can you imagine that, NOT wanting to wear one of these objects of desire?I’d happily pay £1k over list for a batman , hulk and steel Daytona . And I reckon everyone on this forum would too
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As I said earlier, there are plenty of other watches to like.
Um, nope.I’d happily pay £1k over list for a batman , hulk and steel Daytona . And I reckon everyone on this forum would too
Time to put the koolaid down dude.
Do not think too many would have grins on their face if handing over £10k for a steel Sub even if using the credit card to ease the burden, although if using a credit card to buy it in the first place is probably not the wisest financial choice.
The RRP is there to show me what the manufacturer believes their watch to be worth in the current market place and not for some Del Boy dealer to abuse with there profiteering.
Can I justify an RRP Rolex purchase, probably in some round about way to ease my conscience but when you are seeing 30-40% profiteering, something has gone wrong with the world.
In what way are those watches "tatty"?
All subjective of course - I like mine and wouldn't be without it. I see many "forum's darling" brands here, all highly praised and people going googly-eyed over them. Most of these don't do anything for me, some even look total trash to me and some look good only because they have copied designs from other brands. I think: "why all the fuss?" but don't say anything negative when I see those watches being hyped up because obviously some like them and as long as they are happy, that's all that counts.
I once challenged an e-bay seller over the outrageous mark up he had placed on an item and he told me "Its Capitalism"....
The situation concerned the 1st generation Apple Watch and the likes of this person who bought multiple watches as soon as the pre-order option became live on the Apple website with the sole intention of making money. Fortunately I was lucky enough to buy mine, sat at work extra early and refreshing the web page...... but there were a lot of people, genuine Apple fanboys/girls who wanted the new Apple watch to WEAR and USE.... and their order delivery dates were pushed further back just because of greedy people who are just in it for the money.
Everything I've ever bought is for me to enjoy, somethings I might not use, keep as "safe queens" / collectable items that I am Genuinely interested in. The thought of making a profit is alien to me.....
Any evidence of ADs selling the fast sellers onto "chains" Mick?
Don't know about 'tatty' but the Daytona isn't the most readable chrono and the Hulk readbility underwater isn't great either (who thought a green bezel for underwater use was a good idea?). Certainly, neither would be on my go to list.
Look at is this way, with the Rolex (unlimited but constrained supply), if you can't wait and don't want to fanny about calling a dozen dealers, you need to pay over the odds. With the recent Omega LEs (finite supply), if you want one at all and you didn't have your name down a year ago, you need to pay over the odds. No one is forced to do anything, it is rather a first world issue to be getting ones knickers in a twist about. If it worries your ethics then walk on by and shake your head.
Last edited by Padders; 25th January 2018 at 10:12.
Have a word with shop keepers, they are quite loose with their tongues and that is in the UK and mainland Europe. Nothing is ever put in writing of course.
If you want a 116500, try getting one from your AD. Let's see how long the waiting list will be. Now add a few grand to the RRP, you could buy one from a dozen independents today.
Rolex are ok with it, the ADs despite bluster are ok with it as are the grey dealers. It's the market, you just cannot buck it.
I agree with Mick. In addition, the waiting lists are a dark science. I have been into Goldsmiths several times and rang them asking how many Daytonas they have received in the last year and could they please confirm where I am on the list. I have never received a straight answer to that question.
Then before Christmas I was chatting to a fellow member on here who had just collected one from the same shop. I asked him how the hell he managed it. Apparently he was on the list as well, but a few friends had just bought some watches from them and the manager told them that she had just received a White Dial Daytona. They asked if on the back of their purchases could the guy who I was chatting to have it. She agreed and he got the phone call. I have no idea if he was top of the list or not, but I suspect the manager controls who get them.
I also love it when dealers like Haywood state in their listings where the Watch came from. Mischievous fun on his part I suspect. Naming and shaming Goldsmiths on several occasions with their hand picked trusted customers immediately flipping for a big fat profit, but an honest listing especially with the paranoia about wanting a 'UK' Swiss watch.
Okay, think banker, footballer or any other well paid individual. Trots into Goldsmiths only to be told the watch at RRP has a 7 to 10 year waiting list, but he can cross the road and have it today for £15k.
I totally don't get why people moan about premium prices, if you cannot bring yourself to part with a penny over a 'recommended' price, then either wait your turn or do without - simples.
Last edited by Wallasey Runner; 25th January 2018 at 10:37.
I think a lot of people would be quite happy to hand over £10k gif a steel Rolex, look at the demand for the Dkydweller when it was first released.
Paying with a credit card may not seem like the wisest financial choice for you but for those of us who have cashback (or other benefits) credit cards and pay the balance off in full, it’s a no brainier!
Edit: If I were in the market for an over RRP watch then I’d happily pay the market value. I’m not so I won’t but I really don’t see an issue. And no, I’m not minted, just realistic.
Last edited by Dave+63; 25th January 2018 at 10:57.
+1. In addition to the above, it helps build credit history and improve credit score/worthiness. That is very useful for those bigger purchases where one actually needs credit e.g. a mortgage. I use my credit cards as much as I can but make sure I pay them off in full every month.
Yeh I think they are passed on via a customer but I don’t think UK ADs are giving greys direct access to professional Rolex at the moment when demand is so high.
Maybe I am being naive though.
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Can't comment on haywoods favourites but for smaller locals it's not worth the threat to their AD status. Usually the stuff is passed on from customers early on the wait lists.
As said above unless you have money to throw away then it makes no sense. Get on a waiting list and pay rrp when it is available. If it is a doscontinued item then that’s a different story.
This is all a complete matter of perspective.
It makes sense for people who don't want to wait for years (in some cases)
If you calculate a 4 year waiting list with 2x 10%+ price rises you can add 1-2k before you lay a finger on your list price watch.
With the used market remaining buoyant there are still 4 year old watches selling over RRP so it can all become a bit muddy and slightly irrelevant depending on the costs involved.
Plus, again, people are happy to buy new from other brands knowing that they'll lose heavily if they sell, which to me seems to hold even less logic imo. They don't persistently have to explain their choices though.
Common sense in collecting is a bit of a sticky wicket anyway.
Last edited by verv; 25th January 2018 at 12:38.
I am someone who is unwilling to pay over RRP for a current model watch, but somehow I am willing to pay for one when it’s “vintage” (ie. a couple thousand for a watch from the 50s). It is madness but as stated many times, things will sell for the market price.
WTF are you talking about ? My mind is boggled! Not meaning to be rude but ? Can anyone ELI5 it for me ?
From what I can understand from the post is that he lives in a flat valued at £4000 and people across the city have much bigger houses.
I would never pay over list for a watch and never have.
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Definitely worth it to buy a watch over RRP if you intend to keep and wear it... satisfaction of having that perfect watch on your wrist is.. priceless..
Nice clear computer though :)Don't know about 'tatty' but the Daytona isn't the most readable chrono and the Hulk readbility underwater isn't great either (who thought a green bezel for underwater use was a good idea?). Certainly, neither would be on my go to list.
Personally I won't be paying over RRP for any Rolex.
M
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Breitling Cosmonaute 809 - What's not to like?
Not sure there is ever a perfect watch, going by the secondhand market a lot of so called perfect watches or grail etc end up getting passed on.
Would look forward to seeing how many keeper BLNR or hulks are still perfect if a Coke bezel or green bezel with black dial were released.
Im seriously considering buying a White Ceramic Daytona from a grey to complete my “trilogy” (anybody here thinking of selling to a grey let me know?)
I missed getting on a list, the lists are stupid long and being a owner of the former model I know it will be a keeper etc hence as Wallsey says - give it 5/7 years and the current grey price will prob be thereabouts the new RRP anyhow. I have no chance getting one at RRP as my trusty AD lost its Rolex dealership so im facing the fact grey is my only option.
Last edited by kultschar; 30th January 2018 at 00:17.
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