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Thread: Bitcoin

  1. #1551
    Grand Master Dave+63's Avatar
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    Bitcoin

    Well John MacAfee says so and he’ll eat his dick if he’s wrong!
    Last edited by Dave+63; 5th April 2019 at 07:23.

  2. #1552
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    I bet you it won't. Your amount.

    Actually. I bet you it won't reach 10k before the year is out.
    $20K was slightly tongue in cheek but what makes you think $10K isn't even on the horizon? What's your thinking? Range bound, more bearishness or the death of BTC for the 200th time? Hope it does something - I'm in the red until $6K :0

  3. #1553
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    Quote Originally Posted by relaxer7 View Post
    $20K was slightly tongue in cheek but what makes you think $10K isn't even on the horizon? What's your thinking? Range bound, more bearishness or the death of BTC for the 200th time? Hope it does something - I'm in the red until $6K :0
    I still think it will go to zero. BTC has no intrinsic value and there is absolutely no reason it would be worth anything.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  4. #1554
    Master Tony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    I still think it will go to zero. BTC has no intrinsic value and there is absolutely no reason it would be worth anything.
    A bit like gold, then.

    Even if it does go to zero, it's where it goes before it gets there that matters.

  5. #1555
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    I still think it will go to zero. BTC has no intrinsic value and there is absolutely no reason it would be worth anything.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tony View Post
    A bit like gold, then.

    Even if it does go to zero, it's where it goes before it gets there that matters.
    Well, gold has value in electronics, phones, medical, dentistry etc etc. It's a very specialised material.

    BTC has no intrinsic value at all.
    Cheers,
    Neil.

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  6. #1556
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil.C View Post
    Well, gold has value in electronics, phones, medical, dentistry etc etc. It's a very specialised material.

    BTC has no intrinsic value at all.
    If people stopped using gold as a store of value its price would be very low.

  7. #1557
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony View Post
    If people stopped using gold as a store of value its price would be very low.
    Difficult to sperate, especially in jewellery.

    But BTC has none, that much is sure.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  8. #1558
    Master Tony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    But BTC has none, that much is sure.
    Unless people decide it does.

  9. #1559
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony View Post
    Unless people decide it does.
    You are mistaking value with looking for a greater fool.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  10. #1560
    Master mr noble's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    You are mistaking value with looking for a greater fool.
    Is that the same theory that Rolex successfully employ?

  11. #1561
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    You are mistaking value with looking for a greater fool.
    This can apply to many things that people invest in speculatively (shares, gold, property, watches).

    Does art that is bought for investment purposes have any intrinsic value?

  12. #1562
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony View Post
    This can apply to many things that people invest in speculatively (shares, gold, property, watches).
    I am afraid you haven't understood the concept. All of those things have intrinsic value, the question is if their traded price is a fair representation of this value (-> valuation).

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony View Post
    Does art that is bought for investment purposes have any intrinsic value?
    Very little. You are getting closer.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  13. #1563
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    I am afraid you haven't understood the concept. All of those things have intrinsic value, the question is if their traded price is a fair representation of this value (-> valuation).



    Very little. You are getting closer.

    You haven't quite understood the concept that 'value' is decided by supply and demand. That's how any market works. 'Fairness' is utterly irrelevant to market value.

    A doctor may have a greater intrinsic value than a footballer. Whether that plays out 'fairly' is of no relevance as far as the market is concerned.
    Last edited by Tony; 6th April 2019 at 10:37.

  14. #1564
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony View Post
    You haven't quite understood the concept that 'value' is decided by supply and demand. That's how any market works. 'Fairness' is utterly irrelevant to market value.

    A doctor may have a greater intrinsic value than a footballer. Whether that plays out 'fairly' is of no relevance as far as the market is concerned.
    Now you are confusing value with price.

    Maybe you shouldn't discuss topics which you have no clue about.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  15. #1565
    Master stoneyloon's Avatar
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    Surely paper cash has no “value” then?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  16. #1566
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stoneyloon View Post
    Surely paper cash has no “value” then?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    You cannot be serious?

    Know what? You continue the debate with Tony while I enjoy the sun outside. Deal?
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  17. #1567
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    Quote Originally Posted by stoneyloon View Post
    Surely paper cash has no “value” then?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Technically it doesn’t

  18. #1568
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Sold all my BTC today.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  19. #1569
    Master petethegeek's Avatar
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    Nice darts squire.

  20. #1570
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    Quote Originally Posted by petethegeek View Post
    Nice darts squire.
    Maybe
    RIAC

  21. #1571
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    Was that 3800 to 5000?

  22. #1572
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Der Amf View Post
    Was that 3800 to 5000?
    To be precise, bought at 3,350 BTC/EUR and sold at 4,700.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  23. #1573
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    To be precise, bought at 3,350 BTC/EUR and sold at 4,700.
    Is that you out of crypto then or do you have some sneaky alt coins too?

  24. #1574
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    Quote Originally Posted by relaxer7 View Post
    Is that you out of crypto then or do you have some sneaky alt coins too?
    Never owned anything but BTC (on four occasions if memory serves me right).

    I am out now and am contemplating a short position for the next sell-off. Not sure it's a good idea to short against a religious sect, just like Tesla...
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  25. #1575
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    I’m still holding on to mine as I’m convinced of higher highs in the future but if I was looking to short I’d think a rejection at the 50 day moving average ($5600ish) would be a good bet.

  26. #1576
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    To be precise, bought at 3,350 BTC/EUR and sold at 4,700.
    What’s the tax implications of this?

  27. #1577
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    Quote Originally Posted by demonloop View Post
    What’s the tax implications of this?
    Where I live: capital gains @ income tax rate, tax-free if held longer than six months.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  28. #1578
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    Where I live: capital gains @ income tax rate, tax-free if held longer than six months.
    I’ve seen it argued that due to the volatility of crypto it could be argued its straightforward gambling, and therefore tax free in most places.

  29. #1579
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by demonloop View Post
    I’ve seen it argued that due to the volatility of crypto it could be argued its straightforward gambling, and therefore tax free in most places.
    Not here.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  30. #1580
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    Quote Originally Posted by chard101 View Post

    As for Bitcoin my personal view is that you can make lot of money from it in the next market boom when all the average Joe's pile into the retail market and buy up the 1st mover household name that is Bitcoin however as a long term investment it is not going to last. This is where the large FIs that currently own 80% of Bitcoin will offload it, you would be wise to do the same. It is 1st generation old tech, it is inefficient and very energy intensive, there are many other better privacy coins, like Monero for example. Transactions are very slow and it is anyone’s guess which entities control the mining hash power which validates the transaction. Once other less tech savvy people realise this it will be too late and it will take a dive. The head of blockchain at Nasdaq already realises this:
    Going to revise what I said specifically on Bitcoin here as through the last month of digging various events and new information have come to light.

    It looks like Bitcoin is here to stay and its specific use case is that it will become a replacement for traditional stores of value like Gold. It is going to be packaged as digital gold. Greyscale is already pushing this with a TV advert. Essentially too many FI's have been buying up Bitcoin in 2018 to let it fall by the wayside.

    https://www.coinspeaker.com/drop-gol...v-ad-campaign/

    I expect that in the next few years we will see them change the algorithm from POW to POS (considerably more energy efficient) or just freeze mining altogether and continue to run the network with the number mined of coins up to a certain point in time. Either way it will have to evolve from what it is now as it is too resource intensive.

    What this means for those of you that are holding Bitcoin now, I think you will do well out of it in the future so hang on, you will need to be patient and wait a few years for the best gains. If you don't currently hold Bitcoin then I don't think right now is the time to buy. Much of this recent pump in price is from USDT being dumped into BTC and I see pain coming. Remember, there is no regulation or laws in the space so Market manipulation is happening all the time and I think this is just another one of those times. Just take a look at the link below and you will see what I mean.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAOX7Hcdrag

    I am not saying don't buy Bitcoin at all, I'm just saying I'm sure the price is going to come crashing back down again soon so have your money ready to jump in at a prince you think it a bargain.

    Once regulations happen the whole market is going to rocket up and little people like us will no longer be able to invest that the bargain prices we've see this last year. What a gift this bear market has been.

    As for me, well I'm 95% in XRP, plus a few other projects I think will do well in years to come. I am expecting not to be cashing out until 2025 to 2030 as this is how long it is going to take for the market to properly mature and full adoption of DLT / blockchain tech to permeate the world, which it will. Just last month Christine Lagarde of the IMF told the world that Distributed Ledger Technology is going to be “shaking the system” and the only company with a fully functional, high speed, sub 3 second transaction system is Ripple. Technology has now waiting for laws to catch up.

    Do your own research, be very patient, ignore the idiotic FUD flying around at the moment (espically on Twitter). This going nowhere until regulation and tax laws have been agreed between most of the big nations. The G20 is in July so I don’t see this happening until later in the year or next, none of us will know for sure. We are also going to see the likes of Facebook / Google and other tech companies enter the banking sector, this is the really causing the traditional banks concern. Some very exciting times coming in the finance sector, unfortunately most people out there just don’t see it and instead ridicule. Never mind, their loss.

    https://news.bitcoin.com/japan-g20-c...cy-regulation/

    Just to answer someone about Digital Assets and Gambling. It is only gambling if you don’t bother to do your research and you blindly invest in projects without understand their use cases, current status, competitors and backing. So personally I think no, you can’t argue that really without looking very silly.

    I wish you TZ lads and ladies the best of luck!

  31. #1581
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Me thinks it's about time to go short bitcoin.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  32. #1582
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    Me thinks it's about time to go short bitcoin.
    If I had to choose I would go short too.

    The tricky part is when longs or shorts pile up in one direction then the market mysteriously seems to go in the opposite. Take mid April for example, when everyone was getting excited and jumping on their beds shouting "The bull run is here". BTC longs went up like a rocket and what happens next?... The market dumps on the 26th of April.

    The problem that retails investors like us have is we are at the mercy of the whales that can move price in whatever direction they desire whenever. Until we have laws in place we ride the waves they make. Just bare than in mind. Most of the guys in the research group I'm in that place longs / shorts, it rarely seems to go their way.

    If you are thinking of having a punt I would get myself on TradingView. Compare the ratio of BTC LONGS and BTC SHORTS to get an idea of what other traders are thinking.

    I mostly HODL but when I’m buying I always swing trade and just be patient. ¾ of the time I get what I want that way. Wish I had been doing this last year instead of reacting to FOMO, I would have accumulated so munch more. Wiser now.

    If you do have a punt I really hope it goes your way. I’m also planning of placing some swing orders soon in anticipation of a price drop. Thing is USDT does not look so great now…

    Good luck!

  33. #1583
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    At least volatility is back. Storming through 6,500 USD like it was nothing, peaking at 7,500 for a quick setback to 6,750 and the settling at 7,000 - all in less than 48 hours. Not bad.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  34. #1584
    Master petethegeek's Avatar
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    Any of these belong to you perchance?


  35. #1585
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    Quote Originally Posted by petethegeek View Post
    Any of these belong to you perchance?
    Well, we know that 95% of the reported volumes are fake, don't we?

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/cbovair.../#9b23f8d67175
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  36. #1586
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hewjardon View Post
    Knowing that a TZ-UK members word is his bond....
    I'll take that. Coinbase price currently: USD 7399
    Interesting: This bet has been in the green for me every single day since we struck it, but has flipped into red today. Something's happening, much speculation about a connection to criminal indictments and pump-and-dump at Bitfinex.


    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  37. #1587
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffe View Post
    Sold all my BTC today.
    Still a good decision a month ago??
    RIAC

  38. #1588
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 100thmonkey View Post
    Still a good decision a month ago??
    You from Hindsight Asset Management?

    Waiting for document clearance so that I can shortsell BTC, unfortunately they have been sitting on my documents already for 24+ hours.
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  39. #1589
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    Joking. Although have enjoyed seeing the pot almost double this last month.
    RIAC

  40. #1590
    Master petethegeek's Avatar
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    Why heft a bitcoin wallet around everywhere with you when you could just put it on your watch face?

    https://franckmullercrypto.com/

    Florid press release available here if you enjoy reading that kind of thing.

  41. #1591
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    Wow! Not even sure what to say about that.

  42. #1592
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    Accessing your wallet with the dial is quite neat. I'll buy a carbon one if I ever make millions in bitcoin.

  43. #1593
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Bargain alert - only 38k$!
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  44. #1594
    Master petethegeek's Avatar
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    If you find that one a touch flashy and cheap, then you could always hang back to see how the offering from A. Favre & Fils turns out. Apparently to be pitched somewhere in the range CHF100,000 – CHF150,000, or however many BTC that happens to equate to on the day of purchase.

  45. #1595
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    Has anybody yet purchased anything using bitcoin?

    Coinbase has release its new service/app, CoinbaseCard, for which I’ve applied and I’ve now received the physical card.

    Bought a pack of cigarettes yesterday for £8 using 0.0012 BTC

    I wonder, was it worthy?

    Or is going to be the case of, the guy that bought 2 pizzas using BTC, and those 2 pizzas costed him a fortune?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  46. #1596
    Craftsman trott3r's Avatar
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    I have been contemplating buying bitcoin to buy more annual sub to VPN.

    Never get around to buying BTC though

  47. #1597
    Master TKH's Avatar
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    BSV starting to happen

  48. #1598
    Quote Originally Posted by -Ally- View Post
    Anyone going in rather than out ?


    100thmonkey ?
    If you did, when you posted this (Nov 2018), I suspect you'll be about 150% up!! Still watching from the sidelines here.

  49. #1599
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    10% up overnight!

  50. #1600
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    Quote Originally Posted by davida View Post
    10% up overnight!
    I think a lot of this is on the back of the Facebook announcement about entering the market. When crypto hits the news channels prices tend to go bananas.

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