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Thread: ETA 2824. Something odd/unusual about this movement.

  1. #1
    Master doug darter's Avatar
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    ETA 2824. Something odd/unusual about this movement.

    I bought this 40mm Oris Big Crown pointer date from a UK dealer on EBay on friday, and it arrived this morning. In 3 hrs, it hasnt lost a second. It was described as mint. I'ts not, but not far off.

    I have a bit of a problem with the movement. It was advertised as an ETA 2824, and it looks like one, but the regulator is a vernier screw, quite unlike any I've seen before. It's clearly marked 2824, otherwise I would suspect that it's a Sellita variant, which are ETA copies.

    Pics attached. Has anyone else seen this sort of regulator on an ETA movement??





    Last edited by doug darter; 25th April 2016 at 13:51.

  2. #2
    Master
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    I am by no means an expert but something about the whole watch looks off to me.

    Hands look like they have been re-lumed, some of the lime dots also look poor (and a different colour to the hands), some of the numbers on the dial don't look perfectly aligned, and the text engraved on the back of the case is completely wonky and off centre.

    Don't want to scaremonger but I would say it may be a fake

  3. #3
    Master
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    The writing on the back does look rather odd, though may be the angle of the photo. Who was the seller? There's quite a few on eBay who do "vintage" Oris that are just old style knock offs.

  4. #4
    Master
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    Compare and contrast – http://forums.watchuseek.com/f239/1s...te-293336.html
    I’d be sending yours back forthwith for a full refund.

  5. #5
    Master dice's Avatar
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    That dial isn't right, mate. I'd be sending it back if I were in your shoes.

  6. #6
    I'm no expert and it my be the angle but the numbers don't look straight especially the 6


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  7. #7
    Grand Master PickleB's Avatar
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    Another one here wondering about the dial...6, 10 & 12. The 6 looks skewed and the 1 digits look too big. I did find one other on the net where the '1's may be similar, and it could be the angle. The same can be said of the date hand. It looks to be too long with the 'cup' intruding beyond the track and not sitting below to 'support' the digits.

    I'll be happy to be wrong...

  8. #8
    Craftsman
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    I'd send it back just based on the lume alone - shocking job!

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by PJ S View Post
    Compare and contrast – http://forums.watchuseek.com/f239/1s...te-293336.html
    I’d be sending yours back forthwith for a full refund.
    That is fairly damning.

    I'll tell you what though - that text on the caseback is more wonky than an orange drawf populated chocolate factory when compared to the caseback notches - but I didn't spot it at first. Some people have very good eyes for details. Kudos.

  10. #10
    Master DMC102's Avatar
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    The regulator doesn't look like the one in any of the ETA 2824s I own, and there seems to be a screw missing directly below the 'E' in 'RESISTANT'. Not sure, but I think the Oris calibre number (754?) and jewel count should be stamped on the movement and visible in the second picture.

  11. #11
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    Apart from its alignment, I would also say the OPs caseback has been acid etch engraved, whereas the other one posted has genuine cut-in engraving.
    D

  12. #12
    Master
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    I'm shocked that anyone would bother to produce a Fake of this model. They are cheap enough to begin with and certainly not to everyone's taste (I like the BTW).

    Was it advertised as vintage?

  13. #13
    Craftsman
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    I know zip about watches really and can in fact barely tell the time, but that looks wronger than a wrong thing on National Wrong Day.

    Ebay you say? Refund else open a dispute. Good luck.

  14. #14
    Grand Master
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    i'd say fake, these are available in kit form on ebay.
    ktmog6uk
    marchingontogether!



  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by redmonaco View Post
    I'm shocked that anyone would bother to produce a Fake of this model. They are cheap enough to begin with and certainly not to everyone's taste (I like the BTW).

    Was it advertised as vintage?
    It seems just about anything gets faked nowadays.
    This is clearly a fake. I'd send it back for a refund today!

  16. #16
    Master pacchi's Avatar
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    Everythings looks wrong here, the lume on the hands the plots, the pattern on the dial, the movement.....

  17. #17
    The regulator arm looks ok to me. See a picture of a 2824 in my Tudor 75090.

    Picture courtesy of Cannop, taken during the strip down of a service he carried out for me recently.

    You can see the same screw on the regulator arm. As to the rest of the movement, the finishing details look sadly lacking, but I'm not qualified or experienced enough with this movement to say if it's a fake or not.

    (Trying to enlarge the image in the regulator area only for clarity here....)
    Last edited by nickyboyo; 25th April 2016 at 15:01.

  18. #18
    The dial finishing looks far too agricultural to be an Oris. The guilloche lines are fat, the fonts are thicker and the numbers are chunky, rather than slim like on the genuine Oris.

  19. #19
    Dial looks bad. Bad lume, the odd-hour markers aren't the correct shape, the even-hour numerals are the wrong font. Caseback text is well off. Other things too most likely. Clearly not genuine.
    Dial looks flat white too.

    Yea the guilloche lines are fat.

    The proper one looks nice though!
    Last edited by rogerf; 25th April 2016 at 16:14.

  20. #20
    Master
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    Definitely a shonky watch. Sorry.

  21. #21
    Craftsman Layin_Cable's Avatar
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    Just incase there was still any doubt...


  22. #22
    Grand Master Der Amf's Avatar
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    ^^^^Do you see it as black and blue or as white and gold?

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Der Amf View Post
    ^^^^Do you see it as black and blue or as white and gold?
    Or fake or homage (as in fromage).
    "Bite my shiny metal ass."
    - Bender Bending Rodríguez

  24. #24
    Master Thewatchbloke's Avatar
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    This may be of interest although I'd say your movement is at least an ETA. Possibly :)

    http://forums.watchuseek.com/f63/fak...th-932985.html

  25. #25
    Master doug darter's Avatar
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    Thanks to all replied. Initial less than sharp pictures led me to believe that this was OK. As soon as I saw the movement I suspected something. I have had a without question refund from the seller, who says that he sold it in good faith. I believe him.

    Alls well that ends well.

  26. #26
    Master
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    Looks like they've let the guide dog do the lume on that minute hand.

  27. #27
    Master lysanderxiii's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by doug darter View Post
    I bought this 40mm Oris Big Crown pointer date from a UK dealer on EBay on friday, and it arrived this morning. In 3 hrs, it hasnt lost a second. It was described as mint. I'ts not, but not far off.

    I have a bit of a problem with the movement. It was advertised as an ETA 2824, and it looks like one, but the regulator is a vernier screw, quite unlike any I've seen before. It's clearly marked 2824, otherwise I would suspect that it's a Sellita variant, which are ETA copies.

    Pics attached. Has anyone else seen this sort of regulator on an ETA movement??





    It is not a standard regulator.

    It is a better regulator. Probably made just for Oris . . . .

  28. #28
    Craftsman
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    Quote Originally Posted by doug darter View Post
    Thanks to all replied. Initial less than sharp pictures led me to believe that this was OK. As soon as I saw the movement I suspected something. I have had a without question refund from the seller, who says that he sold it in good faith. I believe him.

    Alls well that ends well.
    Good news. Phew!

  29. #29
    Master doug darter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lysanderxiii View Post
    It is not a standard regulator.

    It is a better regulator. Probably made just for Oris . . . .
    t may be better, but I'd hate to have to adjust it. It's a watchmaker job only I think.

  30. #30
    Master
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    I don't think that is a fake. It is clearly not a great example of the breed but Oris are made to a price, those big crown models were being sold new for less than £400 not so long ago and the same basic designs have been used with subtle variation for decades. It wouldn't surprise me to learn that this is 10-15 years old, has dirt on the dial and has been clumsily relumed at some point. The caseback is a mess but is entirely consistent with Oris's low end output, I purchased a similar model from an AD 6 months ago and the casebook was acid etched like this. There are better out there so you are right to send it back but I think many on here love to jump to the 'fake' verdict when sometimes a simpler explanation may apply.
    Last edited by Padders; 25th April 2016 at 20:10.

  31. #31
    Not a fake

  32. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Der Amf View Post
    ^^^^Do you see it as black and blue or as white and gold?
    lol

    Quote Originally Posted by RAJEN View Post
    Not a fake
    Is there really that much variation between genuine dials, even ignoring the lume and being generous with lighting/photo quality?
    Wonky text on the caseback is OK for Oris?

    A quick google image search shows a few examples of this watch that all look very similar to each other and much better. Compared to photos from the OP: Different font and placement of the hour-marker numerals, odd-hour markers different shape and placement etc.
    Last edited by rogerf; 25th April 2016 at 20:19.

  33. #33
    Master
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    Here is the caseback on the one I had briefly. Does it really look all that different to you?



    Bearing in mind they have been producing designs like this one since the 1930's, are you surprised there is a bit of variation?
    Last edited by Padders; 25th April 2016 at 20:18.

  34. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Padders View Post
    Here is the casebook on the one I had briefly. Does it really look all that different to you?
    The text does, yea: It has a consistent distance from the edges. OP's has no space between "WATER" and "RESISTANT". OP's has "50M" and not "5 BAR".
    I dunno, I'm not looking very closely and I've never owned one. I'm sure variation exists for genuine examples, but the OPs doesn't look at all right to me.
    Last edited by rogerf; 25th April 2016 at 20:52.

  35. #35
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by rogerf View Post
    The text does, yea: It has a consistant distance from the edges.
    Yes I see your point now. Perhaps it is a second and being sold out of the back door of the factory so to speak or just the result of crap quality control. I still don't think it is fake, just nasty.

  36. #36
    Master Onelasttime's Avatar
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    I would also note the spelling of 'waterresistant', i.e. alloneword.

    Mind you, the genuine article has 'shockresistant' as one word so maybe Oris are just pants at spelling. Interesting.

  37. #37
    Craftsman
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    ETA 2824. Something odd/unusual about this movement.

    The case back from my Pro Pilot Date...I believe this is a Sellita movement though...



    I think Oris offer a lot of watch for the money personally...I have no issue with the quality of the finishing or the timekeeping...
    Last edited by Watchfreek; 25th April 2016 at 20:39.

  38. #38
    Master Thewatchbloke's Avatar
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    If you google the serial number the first hit is a fake one that was denounced by an Oris service centre.

  39. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Cannop View Post
    If you google the serial number the first hit is a fake one that was denounced by an Oris service centre.
    That's pretty convincing!

  40. #40
    Craftsman Layin_Cable's Avatar
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    I do think this is fake.
    Among other things the date hand is too long, it shouldn't cover any of the number surely?

  41. #41
    Master Bloobird's Avatar
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    Also, the notches on the back for a case back opener are about 3 different sizes on the op's (former) watch

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAJEN View Post
    Not a fake
    You don't have a high opinion of Oris, do you?

  43. #43
    Master Christian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cannop View Post
    If you google the serial number the first hit is a fake one that was denounced by an Oris service centre.
    Hmmm...that just about swings it for me.

  44. #44
    Grand Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Padders View Post
    Yes I see your point now. Perhaps it is a second and being sold out of the back door of the factory so to speak or just the result of crap quality control. I still don't think it is fake, just nasty.
    That would never happen. Really, you thick that's a possibility? :)

    Oris's QA isn't perfect but that one's pretty bad. There would have been no need to relume it, as the case shape long follows after the move to Luminova. I call shenanigans. At least the dial is fake, the hands are shonky...
    ...but what do I know; I don't even like watches!

  45. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by andrew View Post
    That would never happen. Really, you thick that's a possibility? :)

    Oris's QA isn't perfect but that one's pretty bad. There would have been no need to relume it, as the case shape long follows after the move to Luminova. I call shenanigans. At least the dial is fake, the hands are shonky...
    Third Shift. It happens.

    http://archive.fortune.com/magazines...5455/index.htm

  46. #46
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    No chance
    It is a fake
    There is too much wrong with everything to be attributable to poor QC, which may affect one, possibly 2 compnents.
    But this is a mess.
    My wife has the ladies size BC date, no pointer from quite a while back. It is really quite well put together, and not at all like this.
    Dave

  47. #47
    Master Christian's Avatar
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    If you do an ebay search, there are a lot like this one with ropey luminous paint.

  48. #48
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    No point in faking one, fake loads
    Search for the serial number.
    The results are a WUS post about an Oris Service centre confirmed fake in France, and a disturbing number of Ebay listings, many of which are flaking the red paint from the movement rotor as well as exhibiting other fails
    For me the case is closed, verdict in.
    Dave

  49. #49
    Master
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    Yes I have been persuaded too. Must be a fake or possibly a franken done by a 13 year old apprentice in the far east practicing his dial restoration skills; very badly. The fact that the dial, caseback and rotor all look substandard should be telling I guess.
    Last edited by Padders; 26th April 2016 at 12:37. Reason: because the spell checker always changes caseback

  50. #50
    Journeyman
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    This was back in 2013 http://forums.watchuseek.com/f63/fak...th-932985.html

    Do you think there are multiple 26-58574's out there then? Would be easier to fake stamp and repeat the same!

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