Reply With QuoteYou got to be kidding me, I'd be contesting it aswell mate.....what a bell!
I was working today fitting a set of electric gates to a private property, I parked over the road and carried my tools/materials over to the gate and set them down, behind the gates where I would fit the control box. As I assessed what I had and what needed to go were, I finished my cigarette and put it out on the tarmac and placed it next to my tools. Immediately a council chap pounced (and I mean pounced as I had noticed him watching me from the end of the drive while I smoked) and I was told I had a £75 charge for littering with my cigarette. I told the chap it was my workspace, which I would have to clean up later, I told him we were on a road marked 'private' and I was over the threshold (behind the gates) of a private property. It didn't matter as he had already printed it off.
I think he was in the wrong, I have these pics and am going to contest it, but just thought I would see what other people think because I'm generally interested in opinions as this is a first for me. The whole thing is on CCTV ,which was strapped to him, so these pics show as it was and as would appear in court on his CCTV.
You got to be kidding me, I'd be contesting it aswell mate.....what a bell!
If you are on private property, then tell them to do one
100% on your side re this one. Of course, if he managed to capture on CCTV the part where you decked him, then that's obviously a separate legal matter entirely ;-)
Wow, what an obsolete ****! I'm sure if you're on private land he's got no say. Would you expect him to pop up and fine you in your own garden? He perhaps tried to be sneaky by printing it all out to avoid a prolonged confrontation and didn't notice it's private. Ie not paid or supported via the council, so no power to enforce littering (on council land!). He's probably bluffed it hoping you won't contest, and if you do, ....I'm sure most that contest on council land get let off! Contest it, you'll get it quashed easily.
Good grief.... That is unbelievable...
Come to think of it, did he have a withered hand?
The only worry I have contesting this is the "industrial language" I used whilst "discussing the ticket" and whether or not that would go against me? : DOriginally Posted by Mouse
He asked me to accept the ticket and I said I wouldn't. He then said it would arrive by post if I didn't but I still wouldn't take it off him. I told him to leave it by my stuff on the floor, which he did and walked away from it!! Surely that's littering??
He was a class A job knockey! I asked him to show me some Id . He pulled out his Knowsley Council Id card and said "this is my warrant card"!!
I'm sure only the police have them.
Last edited by joeytheghost; 12th February 2016 at 20:13.
How can it arrive by post....I'm assuming you didn't give him any of your details, or did he take your car registration or something?
This is where I'm the job knockey, I told him my name. My name is also in 2ft high letters on my van along with my office address. :(
Contest it.
Stasi jobsworth.
You have nothing to worry about but Jesus Christ!!!! Crazy.
I can't see how that could possibly stand up if you contest it. The guy is an idiot.
Glaring example that natural selection no longer applies to the modern way of life #zombyappocalypse #cretinsunited
It's like being done for smoking in your own garden. Looney tunes!
We get these litter facists all the time down our way. They have no powers of detention and can't touch you so when I've been caught a couple of times for throwing a rollie butt in the filthy dirty diesel-stained bus lane outside the tube, I just walk on while they read me 'my rights'. They're all power-crazed simpletons.
I celebrate fining people for chucking Maccy D bags and cans out of their cars and dropping dirty fried chicken boxes on the path, but one ciggie butt?
Unbelievable. Contest it, clearly he was on commission on each one he dished out.
Common sense??? Nah, reminds me of my Compliance dept, Internal Audit dept, Risk dept, Quality Assurance dept all in my workplace - no joke!
Keeps us informed on the out come
He's in need of a good slapping - fcukwhit!
Jobsworth.
Tell the tz hard man about it he will ride over him on his bicycle.
I'm more interested in the electronic gates.... But that's probably best on another thread!
Oh and fwiw I don't think the fine will stick.
Some people just have nothing better to do.He needs to get a life.Thats just madness.
Quality!It's like being done for smoking in your own garden. Looney tunes!
We get these litter facists all the time down our way. They have no powers of detention and can't touch you so when I've been caught a couple of times for throwing a rollie butt in the filthy dirty diesel-stained bus lane outside the tube, I just walk on while they read me 'my rights'. They're all power-crazed simpletons.
I celebrate fining people for chucking Maccy D bags and cans out of their cars and dropping dirty fried chicken boxes on the path, but one ciggie butt?
22 posts and everyone's singing from the same sheet.....what's going on?
Yes you're right, and that's something I'm going to have to change....
But I just can't.
Let us know how you get on, I can't imagine you would lose. They must have a quota to fill like traffic wardens.
Does pooing through someone's letterbox count as littering?
21st century Britain gone mad! I bet he knocks one out around the corner each time he issues a ticket.
Did you take a photo of him littering with his ticket? That would be sweet karma
It's like a war zone over here. Fag ends whizzing by your face, left right and centre. I prefer the fag ends to the oysters some of them pull up and gob out though!
Cigarettes are only 85p for a pack of Malboro lights. IIRC that's 10% of UK prices. Another sign of rip off Britain.
Check if the council have adopted the road if they are responsible for it since the sign was put there, if not tell em to jog on.
If I've looked at the photo correctly, that's irrelevant. He put the cigarette end on the floor inside the gate, so essentially on private property anyway.
It's not clear whether it would help but if the official was wearing some kind of "official" body cam then you should be able to ask for the footage under an FOI request.
Last edited by Carlton-Browne; 13th February 2016 at 10:54.
Jobsworths like that are quite dangerous (quite frankly that type could don two top hats and crawl under a snake's belly without touching the snake.)
In this situation the temptation to flatten the provocative tosser must have been very very strong.
I would let the council know that he says he has a warrant card too, that's surely a bit naughty....
Cheers..
Jase
Having thought abut this a bit more, what the feck was Sadocop doing hanging around a residential street looking for victims? They normally wait outside known litter areas, like in my case, outside the tube or outside a row of take away shops or whatever?
The sign says it's a T-road so this is even weirder if it's not a main commuter thoroughfare?
This is a great story! Just embarrass the bloke. Local papers, national papers (dare I say it the Daily Fail). I'd get the body cam footage if you can and tout it around. TBH if it was me in your situation I'd hope I'd just laugh at the stupidity of the bloke.
Contest this BS and then quit smoking, best thing I ever did.
^^^^^^Sorry about this but as a non smoker seeing folk chuck their cigarette butts in the street makes me gip!
OP I have sympathy for you, a private road where the jobs worth probably shouldn't have been in the first place, good luck.
Thanks for all the opinions chaps, glad to see I was correct in my thinking . As I said at the start Im 100% contesting this. I wouldn't mind getting the CCTV footage but wouldn't know where to start!
Unfortunately, I think you're bang to rights:
"EPA Section 87 and 88 – Dropping litter / Fixed Penalty Notices
It is an offence to drop litter in any place open to the air, including private land, and land covered by water. A person found guilty can be fined up to £2,500.
Fixed Penalty Notices (FPNs) may be issued by local authorities to people caught in the act. If paid on time the offender avoids facing a criminal prosecution."
Source: CleanHighways
Ridiculous!
tell the police about his warrant card as well.
Surely it's only littering if you walk away.Unfortunately, I think you're bang to rights:
"EPA Section 87 and 88 – Dropping litter / Fixed Penalty Notices
It is an offence to drop litter in any place open to the air, including private land, and land covered by water. A person found guilty can be fined up to £2,500.
Fixed Penalty Notices (FPNs) may be issued by local authorities to people caught in the act. If paid on time the offender avoids facing a criminal prosecution."
Source: CleanHighways
Filthy habit.
I think your user name is quite fitting, you will soon be a TZ ghost once you're arrested and sent to prison.
Yeah contest that, he's mistake
Good luck contesting that chickenshit 'violation.' I tried doing so myself once, including photos............they didn't care!
Speaking of an expensive cigarette, in 1970 I bought a beautiful new Fiat 124 Coupe, like this one:
In my first week of ownership, I happened to notice the flame of my cigarette was gone, and of course it had fallen between my thighs onto the beautiful tan fabric of my driver's seat. I frantically tried brushing it off, but it was too late. The seat was ruined forevermore, with a black-edged hole burned right through.
I take it this is a joke, but no, even if you stand by your litter, it's still litter.
I guess, but it's surely only when you walk away from it that you show your intention to leave it where it is, I think it would be a reasonable defence ( as in the op ) to say that as the butt was placed near his tools, the intent was to gather it and subsequent ones after the job was done to dispose of them properly, if I'm sitting on a bench and put my coffee cup on the seat or floor am I littering? I would argue it's only when I walk away from it that I am.
Cheers..
Jase
Typical bully boy tactics of these mugs, contest away, if it had have been me I would t have given him details as by doing this you are entering in to a verbal contract with them.I was working today fitting a set of electric gates to a private property, I parked over the road and carried my tools/materials over to the gate and set them down, behind the gates where I would fit the control box. As I assessed what I had and what needed to go were, I finished my cigarette and put it out on the tarmac and placed it next to my tools. Immediately a council chap pounced (and I mean pounced as I had noticed him watching me from the end of the drive while I smoked) and I was told I had a £75 charge for littering with my cigarette. I told the chap it was my workspace, which I would have to clean up later, I told him we were on a road marked 'private' and I was over the threshold (behind the gates) of a private property. It didn't matter as he had already printed it off.
I think he was in the wrong, I have these pics and am going to contest it, but just thought I would see what other people think because I'm generally interested in opinions as this is a first for me. The whole thing is on CCTV ,which was strapped to him, so these pics show as it was and as would appear in court on his CCTV.
They are worse in Glasgow, check out Glasgow's 'not so safe' community officers on Facebook, to cheer yourself up, there is plenty of videos of them getting some of their own medicine from David Cardwell, a local guy who decided to fight back against them...
+1.
If you use the same twisted logic you could be having a picnic in the park and plan to take all your rubbish to the bin as you leave but if it's empty next to you you're littering?
I've just googled 'legal definition litter'
It shows the environmental protection act 1990 which states:
Section 87 (1)
A person is guilty of an offence if he drops, throws down or otherwise deposits any litter in any place to which this section applies and then LEAVES IT. (My capitals)
Seeing as you didn't leave it but left it next to your tools then I don't see any offence committed
These jumped up little Hitler's get a bit of power and it all goes to their head
it reminds me of Alan Partridge when dealing with another jobsworth who explained he was just doing his job, to which Alan responded 'that's what the concentration camp guards said'
+1 should have slapped him
Councils do readopt roads and footpaths.
He's not left it so no problem.
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