Reply With QuoteAlmost impossible to prove that she didn't smash it imo
A relative of mine has just told me of an accident she had shortly after moving into a privately rented property.
whilst she and the kids were in the bathroom, a glass shower door shattered spraying the kids with glass causing cuts. If this was due to a defective shower door i am inclined to tell her to claim for the kids injuries. The property is let through an agency so they should be insured.
How should she go about claiming? Anyone tried one of these claims lawyers advertised on TV?
Almost impossible to prove that she didn't smash it imo
This is true, however smashing a glass door over your kids is a little extreme.Originally Posted by Sweepinghand
Maybe not deliberately but most people will probably take the view that a glass shower door will not just spontaneously shatter.
I think the landlord will probably be looking to your relative to reimburse them the cost of a new door.
Should shower doors be made of a specific type of glass and be certified/approved like oven glass or car glass? I wonder if the wrong glass was used this could explain things?
I'm only going on what she's told me so far so will ask more questions regarding the breakage.
Should be made of tempered (toughened) glass like car windscreens, phone boxes etc. Should shatter but unlikely to cause cuts.
I wonder how much you'd get for (presumably) superficial cuts? Unless they left scars? Not much I wouldn't have thought. I must admit, I'm not a massive fan of the claim culture.
Well, having spoken further here's more info.
The shower door was fitted brand new prior to her moving in. It's one of those swinging glass doors that cover half the bath tub stopping splash going on the floor. The kids were in the bath and one of them simply touched the glass and it exploded into pieces causing cuts to the head, arm and body of one child and cuts to the body and arm of the other. An ambulance was called and so was the estate agent. The kids ended up in hospital and some of the cuts will likely scar.
Apparently the estate agent contacted the bathroom fitter who attended the house and cleared up the mess, apologised and subsequently fitted a new shower curtain instead.
The agent speculated that it could have been already damaged when fitted and should have been designed to take much more force than a child could have produced by touching it.
Even if it was damaged prior to fitting, it should certainly be able to withstand the force of a child (or anyone) just touching it. Very unusual indeed. Hopefully they get sorted.
When the glass was fitted in it's frame if it was somehow slightly twisted any additional force at all could tip it over the edge , so to speak.
Unfortunately, as said above, how would you prove it? I believe what you say but how would your relatives solicitor prove it in a court of law?
Are you sure about that? My friend recently bought a glass coffee table from a local store and within a few days of ownership tripped and fell through it severely lacerating his hand. I'm assuming that there was no legal requirement for this to be tempered glass and it would be much, much more likely for an accident like this to happen than the one the OP describes. Also that would imply that everything in the home would need to be tempered glass even things like glass door panels and double glazing units if they go to, or near the floor.
Does sound like it may have been fitted incorrectly causing it to fail once pressure was applied at a certain point. Hope the children are all ok poor things, must have terrified them, and the parents.
It will be toughened glass as a legal requirement because of the risk of breakage.
Any glass doors or windows less than 800mm above floor height MUST also be made from toughened glass, as must oven doors and presumably (although I don't know for certain) anything else made from glass in and around the home.
http://www.leadbitterglass.com/safet...egulations.htm
Last edited by Dave+63; 8th February 2015 at 08:05.
We had a glass patio table, A few years ago I was outside having a cigarette, I was watching two magpies fighting over something in a nearby tree when one flew over our garden and dropped what looked like a twig, it landed on the table and the whole glass top exploded into thousands of bit's, The twig was flimsy and very thin not what you would expect to be able to shatter a table dropped from around 20 ft.
Anyway I went back to the garden centre for another table just thinking it was a case of bad luck but after chatting to the staff and a few phone calls they said the company who supplied the table would replace it for free as they had Identified a problem with some of the production process on some of the glass tops, he gave it a name for the fault but I can not remember what the fault was called, but apparently it can not handle the stress's that the table was tested to be put under during Normal use.
We used to have lunch on this table all 4 of us so the flimsy twig hitting the table was probably like a plate or a glass being placed down on the table under normal use, but it put the wife off so we have a wicker woven one now.
The chap from the company said there are loads of glass products out there that are ticking time bomb's.
Last edited by Fords; 8th February 2015 at 08:47.
Not disbelieving them but I remember as a kid using the excuse ' I never touched it' or in one instance ' I just lent my fishing rod against it' after putting a football through the garage window.
I was called into huge solicitors office in Liverpool to replace a piece of 12 mm toughened glass panel we had recently fitted which had simply " blown up" according to the chap on site. As much as I explained to him that they simply do not spontaneously combust, he wasn't backing down.Not disbelieving them but I remember as a kid using the excuse ' I never touched it' or in one instance ' I just lent my fishing rod against it' after putting a football through the garage window.
Much to my amusement , not 30 seconds later , a junior comes careering around the corner with a trolley full of correspondence and clattered full on into the adjoining panel.
They paid up for the replacement.
To the OP, you probably won't be able to prove it was improperly fitted. Even if it was " in twist" it's unlikely to just blow up. I'd guess it's caught on something ( perhaps the bath edge) or been hit on its edge which is the weakest point. Now the bathroom fitter has removed it, you'd be hard pressed for someone to blame.
Probably difficult to tell now, but the glass should have a Kitemark.
They can spontaneously 'explode' - plenty of examples on internet.
From another forum
http://www.grumpieroldmen.co.uk/foru...hp?f=3&t=32308
Can see why you like this one.
I've seen it happen; large automatic doors in an office complex in Warrington that open with a key-card. I was coming down the stairs just opposite them as a guy was coming in - he tapped his wallet to the sensor pad and and at the exact moment I heard the motor start to hum the whole panel exploded - no exaggeration!
One of the civil engineer blokes in the building told me that glass in such applications is pre-stressed in such a way so that when it breaks it crumbles rather than shatters, but if this is done incorrectly - or if the panel is slightly damaged without triggering the collapse - then a slight knock or change in temperature can set it off.
He speculated that perhaps the piece of glass in that door was not tight in the rubber seal of the frame and that whenever it slid open the glass tilted slightly and knocked against one of the spacers or the frame itself which eventually chipped the edge of the glass.
Well if it's on the Internet, then it must be true.
I fit 000s of these toughened panels each year , have done for 25+ years and have never had one just blow without reason. You'd be surprised how much abuse they can take. I'll say again, they don't just blow up .
I don't think anyone is saying they just blow up, what i think most are saying is that a big boy did it and ran away, which is a legally sound argument.
For this phenomenon see 'prince ruperts drop'.
It'll be a manufacturing defect in the screen.
"Bite my shiny metal ass."
- Bender Bending Rodríguez
Not to be confused with Prince Albert's Balls.
Quite. Or princess Elsas knockers.
"Bite my shiny metal ass."
- Bender Bending Rodríguez
Dude, let it go...
It's snow joke. I'm obsessed.
"Bite my shiny metal ass."
- Bender Bending Rodríguez
So, on the strength of what i have read i think there is a good possibility of showing that the glass could indeed have shattered after the child had touched it. The bathroom installer did a quick job of clearing away the exidence but the fact that he replaced it with a curtain is also saying something. I'll point her in the direction of the citizens advice beureau and see what they say.
I don't see how you can possibly show what happened.
"Bite my shiny metal ass."
- Bender Bending Rodríguez
Glass panels can and do explode, but normally there is a trigger source that casuses the explosion.
Questions that must be answered for an insurance claim to be made
1) Who is liable ?
2) Why are they liable ?
3) What loss has been suffered ?
4) How is that loss calculated ?
5) How can that losss be compensated ?
If all 5 questions cannot be answered then the claim will fail
The problem you will have is proving liability. Yes the glass shattered, but how and why ? Basically, what evidence do you have ?
Unfortunately, from what you have said, all the evidence is gone, so now its your word against ... well whoever.
Soorry, but i cant see that this would work out as a claim. It may end up as a game of brinksmanshp with the landlord or bathroom fitter, but to be honest I dont think you would find a no win, no fee firm willing to take this on.
In terms of value, generally minor cuts would be worth between £350 and £1,000. If the scarring was significant and noticable then, depending on the extent and visibilty it would be worth any where from a couple of hundred to several thousand if it was significant, disfiguring facial scarring to a young girl.
Move to America. A newspaper seller told an American to have a nice day; he didn't so sued...!!!
There is a long thread (it started in 2007 and is still running!) here
http://forums.edmunds.com/discussion...oding-sunroofs
dealing with the subject of glass car sunroofs spontaneously imploding or exploding on a range of different cars. Some manufacturers are much more helpful than others in taking responsibility for fixing the cars when it happens.
By the sounds of it, ultimate liability would end up with the manufacturer of the glass. It had not been cooled correctly in the tempering process and this led to a weakness. Finding out who they were and getting to them will not be very easy. My suspicion would be that a 'no win, no fee' lawyer will not take the case on as there is no clear case with regards liability and too much work involved for them to take up. Unless the kids are scarred perhaps it may be best to let it drop. By all means use the emotional leverage to get the landlord to replace it but he is under no responsibility to do so.
Glad they weren't badly hurt.
Not necessarily - the glass could have sustained minor damage (for example a small scratch at the edge) which can lead to it 'exploding' after a very small impact (like the twig dropped on the table someone posted above) or even temperature change.
Either way, I don't think you'd be able to make a claim without an awful of hassle and cost, which no 'free' lawyer will ever take on considering how little there is to claim for in terms of injury
I have become quite familiar with toughened glass in recent years as I'm forever helping to throw stuntmen through them.
Contrary to popular opinion we rarely use sugar glass; as its expensive and ridiculously fragile. If someone is going face first then maybe.
The glass is usually towards the thicker end of the spectrum too. Its squibbed up with small explosives , blasting caps or little "trunion" guns that punch a spike through the glass using a squib.
The glass gets "blown" just before the stuntman goes through it giving the illusion he broke it. If its timed badly and goes too early its no big problem to reset another pane in 20 minutes. If its too late the stuntman will usually bounce off it , thats why we use toughened glass. When it shatters it forms cubes rather than shards which are comparatively safe. They will cut but are not heavy enough or big enough to give anything other than nminor cuts.
So most of the toughened stuff used in the home is comparatively safe.
Float glass on the other hand is lethal ; makes big huge shards that can cause massive damage. I'm more nervous breaking 2 foot square sheets of that stuff that 8 foot square sheets of toughened.
Glass is one of the strongest materials human beings make ( in fact I think it is the strongest). Toughened glass is comparatively safe even if it fails.
I did reply trying to justify why a successful claim could be made; but I've deleted it. Being legally entitled to claim compensation doesn't morally justify it.
Last edited by RobinMasters; 10th February 2015 at 23:58.
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