Perusing the web, as you do, I happened upon this little article by Ariel Adams on his site – makes for interesting and eye-widening reading.
http://www.ablogtowatch.com/roger-sm...-unique-watch/
Roger W Smith's watches are nonsense, in that it makes no sense to hand-make every part of a watch, when present-day micro-engineering can do it just as well, if not better.
It is then nonsense for someone to pay £70,000 to £100,000 for one of his watches, when the majority of his work is unseen and, indeed, cannot be seen unless the watch is disassembled.
So, it's nonsense, compounded by nonsense.
Last edited by Tinker; 18th January 2014 at 12:41.
Mind you, they are pretty.
Nice find, a true artisan!
"I looked with pity not untinged with scorn upon these trivial-minded passers-by"
To pay £70,000 to £100,000 you'd certainly be getting Rogered !
If all the components are hand made for each movement, why is the entire winding stem threaded? Why is it threaded at all rather than the crown and stem being of one piece?
It is very, very nice though ;)
I so want one of these.
It's somewhat out of my realistic price range but should I ever be fortunate enough to be in the position to own one...I'll be there like a shot.
There are a huge number of brands making watches costing multiples of this one that use of the peg components. I don't see the point in them at all (IMHO).
I love the fact they are made the way they are.
The sum up, for me at least, everything is beautiful and completely stupid about this hobby...and are made in Great Britain.
My Grail.
Though, not normally a fan of Mr Smiths dial designs. In this case I love to make an exception. :)
The movement is beautiful and stunningly crafted.
And most of all its British.
That guilloche dial really is fantastic, and the movement ain't ugly either.
Value for money is academic at this level, but it's certainly more exclusive than e.g. a Patek perpetual for similar money.
So the crown could easily be replaced if need be.Originally Posted by Cirrus
The dial is amazing!
I'm in Mikee's camp on this one. I'll never be able to afford one, but if I were in a position to throw away that amount of money, I'd be proud to own one of his pieces. I might ask him if he can produce an unthreaded stem, though: now Cirrus has pointed it out, it's going to annoy me every time I see a picture...
Chris
Spectacular! Not totally sure about the dial design myself, but that's just personal taste and I can see that it's an amazing work of craftsmanship.
As we see almost every week on this forum, its utterly pointless to argue about "value for money" when discussing luxury watches.
At the level that Roger Smith is at it goes beyond pointless and becomes a failure to grasp the point.
Its wonderful that elements of George Daniels' techniques live on but, taking nothing away from Smith, its equally wonderful that, while there are people walking around with £70,000 watches made using mass-production techniques and machinery, there is still someone out there who can make a watch from scratch for the same price.
I also, rightly or wrongly, take some pride in the fact that this level of craftsmanship is to be found in Britain.
Cards on the table, I cant comfortably afford one. But if I could I would.
Interesting read - I can not think of wanting or being able to buy such a watch at any time, but interesting none the less
This is simply an extrapolation of the nonsense argument for buying a £1,000 automatic, when a £10 quartz watch will be more accurate.
I'm not sold on the designs myself either, not am I in the wealth category who could consider buying one, but compared with the likes of Greubel Forsey, Roger Smith's watches are not too bad price wise.
Andy
Wanted - Damasko DC57
A Roger Smith watch would be my "grail".
I can't see me ever being able to afford one, and I'd probably be terrified to wear it, but if I had the means I'd have one.
And the Great Britain watch is a great looking watch.
Lucky enough to see a few of Roger's and Dr Daniels' watches / pocket watches last year (and to spend time with Roger at SalonQP). The Daniels Method is not one that I should ever want to see lost. It is (IMVHO) essential that skills such as those displayed by Roger Smith are maintained, and that more people learn them, if we are to continue Daniels' legacy.
I agree entirely. The artistry and skill at show here is outstanding and too easily lost if not cherished. I will never get anywhere close to owning one of these, but I want them to be made and appreciated for what they are. We can all enjoy them at that level.
Why?
They're irrelevant to modern technology.
And, indeed, to modern life in general.
I've never liked his hands ...
And they take so long to finish ...
http://uk.yhs4.search.yahoo.com/yhs/...e=sd-msd&rd=r1
Massive rogering there. Agreed.
I thought the starting point for many of the movements used in his watches was the ETA2892?
Eddie
Whole chunks of my life come under the heading "it seemed like a good idea at the time".
Have you ever thought that might be the very reason?
Absolutely.
Im glad.
Genuinely.
Really?
I think some people are saying that the skills Roger Smith is demonstrating are not relevant for modern life. A camera may be able to record an image more accurately but there are still many people who enjoy going to art galleries to view paintings. If you wish to tell the time buy a functional watch, if you would like a work of art then Roger Smith is an artist.
The movement is a work of art, thou im wondering what collection I could have with 70,000
The Daniels Millennium Watch (LE of 50) was Omega cal 2500-based modified with Daniels' co-axial escapement.
The Omega 2500 starts life as the ETA2892-A2.
http://www.monochrome-watches.com/om...al-escapement/Omega caliber 2500, is an ETA 2892 derivative that was supplied with the co-axial escapement and a free sprung balance.
Eddie
Whole chunks of my life come under the heading "it seemed like a good idea at the time".
The limited edition watches you refer to were Daniels watches, not Roger Smiths (although they were built by Smith, they were his 'apprentice pieces').
I don't think its fair to label the man in this way because of something he did for his former employer. Now he is on his own, he is his own man doing his own thing.
You seem to think that my comment was a criticism, which it was not. It was claimed that the Roger Smith movements were made entirely by him when he is on record acknowledging that they are not.
(Interview with "The Purists" October 2002) - http://www.tp178.com/ct/rogersmith/Unlike his pocket watches, Roger does not make all of the components for his wristwatches. To create a product that is more price conscious, Roger realized some specialists firms would need to be employed. To this end, the going train, winding work, escape wheel and pallets are purchased from Switzerland. This allows Roger to sell his watches at the reasonable price of 12,000 GBP (apx. $18,700). All parts, except where just noted, are made by Roger Smith in his workshop or George Daniels workshop, where he is always welcome.
I salute Roger Smith and his talent, I don't criticise him.
Eddie
Whole chunks of my life come under the heading "it seemed like a good idea at the time".
Now if only Roger Smith can team up with (please insert name of British Investor) and do for the UK Plc Balence of Payments what Konrad Damasko probably does for that of Germany...if only it was that simple.
I suppose there are many ways to skin cat, putting the price aside I really have to appreciate the skills and dedication that go into being able to making a piece like this in this particular way. I think it is a lovely piece.
Some people will and some won't consider that these skills are necessary in today's world- like a lot of things it's personal opinion. I admire those who continue to pursue skills or interests in such things and help preserve a way of life and way doing things that is no more should. I think these skills and others such as roof tatching, steam engine preservation, water mill restoration craft brewing , metal working preserve a way of life all but gone.
Back to the watches not sure if this has been posted before
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-24211691
Couldn't of put it better myself.
The point about skills no longer needed are harsh. The ever need for quality watchmakers has increased today. If you can remember, not long ago on this and every forum, there were plenty of threads about the demise of the watchmaking industry and loss of experienced watchmakers. Skills once held by the experienced and passed down through apprenticeship.
In today's society, lesser jobs where people once learned certain skills and the industry died so did those skills. How do you get them back? From scratch I'd guess and to lose hundreds of years of skills is a waste.
Whether you like his watches, concept but not his price tag we need his skills and so does the watch industry. I wonder how many hours he works to build and finish a watch.
I can't seem to find prices of his other watches online and the articles refered to here are somewhat out of date (not the GB watch which I can't afford).
I see Eddie mentioned some at around 12k ?
Is there reference to these anywhere or am I being a bit slow?
In a world of cheap tat these creations are a wonderful work of art and worth every penny.
£30 an hour x 2500 hours gets ya 70k
Seems a bargain in the world of art and creative output.
Lovely engineering but I wouldn't ever call that pretty!
Mind you, they are pretty.
"A man of little significance"
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote