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Thread: 17C 'Mission Timer'?

  1. #451
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    Years of trying to strap-match multiples or Tutima, Heuer 500s and Orfina Porsche Design watches have taught me that they look odd on most types of strap. They look great on their own bracelets, but little else

  2. #452
    Grand Master snowman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweets View Post
    Years of trying to strap-match multiples or Tutima, Heuer 500s and Orfina Porsche Design watches have taught me that they look odd on most types of strap. They look great on their own bracelets, but little else
    Obviously, though, that's all a matter of preference - I like watches on leather, probably more than bracelets which I often find are not quite the right size or get excessively tight or loosen as the temperature changes and think these renders look great on leather.

    Sinn do a number of watches with this style lug and they look good on leather - My own Breil Manta looks great to me on a rallye strap.

    I think traditional lugs would make this just another chrono... I hope Eddie sticks with his design (experience suggests he has a good feel for what works).

    Version A on leather looks spot on to me!

    M
    Last edited by snowman; 10th June 2021 at 10:16.
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  3. #453
    I like both renders, but please do a date version too. I think it will be then more every day watch.


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  4. #454
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweets View Post
    Years of trying to strap-match multiples or Tutima, Heuer 500s and Orfina Porsche Design watches have taught me that they look odd on most types of strap. They look great on their own bracelets, but little else
    Likewise the only reason I moved on (strictly speaking moved back as I sold it to the person I bought it from) my Speedy 4.5 was that my spindly wrists never worked with the bracelet but it never looked right on a strap.

  5. #455
    Master Timelord's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweets View Post
    Years of trying to strap-match multiples or Tutima, Heuer 500s and Orfina Porsche Design watches have taught me that they look odd on most types of strap. They look great on their own bracelets, but little else
    Iíve found that the Di-Modell Chronissimo strap often works in these situations because it is notched, i.e. the lug to lug distance is narrower than the full width of the strap. This extra width often fits these sorts of watch cases and itís a good quality padded leather strap, if not the cheapest. However, I would agree that an original bracelet usually looks better.

  6. #456
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kister View Post
    I like both renders, but please do a date version too. I think it will be then more every day watch.


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    I agree.

  7. #457
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    Quote Originally Posted by swanbourne View Post
    Still tweaking.



    Eddie
    I think that I prefer the look of the countdown bezel to the previous rendering.

  8. #458
    Grand Master Daddelvirks's Avatar
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    Please, no date, it ruÔns the design.
    Got a new watch, divers watch it is, had to drown the bastard to get it!

  9. #459
    Administrator swanbourne's Avatar
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    I should get revision 4 tomorrow.

    Eddie
    Whole chunks of my life come under the heading "it seemed like a good idea at the time".

  10. #460
    Administrator swanbourne's Avatar
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    And still twealng.





    Eddie
    Whole chunks of my life come under the heading "it seemed like a good idea at the time".

  11. #461
    Grand Master Daddelvirks's Avatar
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    Is it a screwdown crown Eddie? I couldn't find it on the drawing.
    Got a new watch, divers watch it is, had to drown the bastard to get it!

  12. #462
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    That case is great Eddie, a huge improvement for me. I think I am in the white running seconds hand camp too. It's looking to be a great watch this.

  13. #463
    Master Timelord's Avatar
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    Looking really good!

  14. #464
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    Great job Eddie - this is so close to being everything I want - the 251.264 movement with quickset hour and resettable, lumed chrono hands AND a lumed bezel.

    I'd agree about the preference for white running seconds so that running hands are white and chrono hands are yellow.

    About the only other things I'd really really want would be the date - Pleeeze! Pretty pleeeze! - and a 0-12 bezel option, perhaps as a self-fit add-in to the package. The 0-12 bezel would turn a chrono which was limited to 60 minutes into a timer which could count up to 12 hours, and the 0-12 bezel would make it a great GMT watch, especially given the jumping hour hand.

  15. #465
    Grand Master snowman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daddelvirks View Post
    Is it a screwdown crown Eddie? I couldn't find it on the drawing.
    Looks like it from the images.

    M
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  16. #466
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    2 please, versions A and C.
    Lovely
    I prefer no date, personally.
    Great design.

  17. #467
    Picturing it on my wrist already.


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  18. #468
    Administrator swanbourne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kister View Post
    I like both renders, but please do a date version too. I think it will be then more every day watch.


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    I tried it with a date and given the size olf the case and the movement, this is what it would look like.



    Eddie
    Whole chunks of my life come under the heading "it seemed like a good idea at the time".

  19. #469
    Quote Originally Posted by swanbourne View Post
    I tried it with a date and given the size olf the case and the movement, this is what it would look like.



    Eddie
    Thatís perfect date placement! Last thing would be only swapping that 12hr on the bezel for triangle and it would even more perfect, easier to time hours or any other events.


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  20. #470
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    I personally think the date placement spoils the dial symmetry (which is otherwise spot on), so would be happier without it. Are you tempted to do both, or will you opt for one or the other?
    D

    ps - I agree that an arrow instead of 12 would suit athat better, if the bezel is to be 0-12, not 60-0

  21. #471
    Master Timelord's Avatar
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    The alternative date placement is to have a black on white date wheel with the aperture instead of the 4 hour marker like the Tutima Field Chronograph:

    https://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.p...amp-Tutima-768

    This in view my spoils the dial symmetry less than a date aperture between the 4 and 5 hour marker.

  22. #472
    Grand Master snowman's Avatar
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    Not bothered about the date and I tend to agree with Sweets on this one, it upsets the symmetry as it seems a bit 'off'.

    I like the countdown bezel best, if you're choosing between the two.

    M
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  23. #473
    Administrator swanbourne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timelord View Post
    The alternative date placement is to have a black on white date wheel with the aperture instead of the 4 hour marker like the Tutima Field Chronograph:

    https://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.p...amp-Tutima-768

    This in view my spoils the dial symmetry less than a date aperture between the 4 and 5 hour marker.
    ETA will only supply with the date placement as shown in the image above. They won't print white on black and they won't remove the ghost date position, even though it's being manufactured to order.

    Eddie
    Whole chunks of my life come under the heading "it seemed like a good idea at the time".

  24. #474
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    Quote Originally Posted by swanbourne View Post
    ETA will only supply with the date placement as shown in the image above. They won't print white on black and they won't remove the ghost date position, even though it's being manufactured to order.

    Eddie
    Okay no worries. I donít really mind date or no date from an aesthetic point of view, itís just that I tend to miss it when a watch doesnít have a date function.

  25. #475
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swanbourne View Post
    ETA will only supply with the date placement as shown in the image above. They won't print white on black and they won't remove the ghost date position, even though it's being manufactured to order.

    Eddie
    It is currently drawn as white print on black, does that mean it will actually be black print on white disk? I think that would be not nearly so good on this dial.

  26. #476
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timelord View Post
    Iíve found that the Di-Modell Chronissimo strap often works in these situations because it is notched, i.e. the lug to lug distance is narrower than the full width of the strap. This extra width often fits these sorts of watch cases and itís a good quality padded leather strap, if not the cheapest. However, I would agree that an original bracelet usually looks better.
    I agree, and the Di-Modell Pilot too, but both of these straps are very heavy duty, quite stiff and wide. They are not a very comfy summer option, at all, as they get pretty sweaty.

  27. #477
    Definitely no date. It's perfect without.

    Generally, the nerd in me would insist on the running seconds hand being a different colour than the chrono hands but in this case, I prefer the running seconds in yellow. Cleaner, probably more legible, also I think the yellow just looks better.

  28. #478
    Master freeloader's Avatar
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    No date for me it makes the dial look too busy.

  29. #479
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    Nooooooooooo.....date, please.

  30. #480
    Much preferred the lugs on the earlier draft. I'm in the no date camp too.

  31. #481
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    Quote Originally Posted by swanbourne View Post
    And still twealng.





    Eddie
    All 3 versions with (1) normal drilled lugs as above and (2) date indicator will be really useful!

    1) Ease of strap change & compatibility with various straps/bracelets
    2) Since ETA won't remove the ghost date position and it is real practical to have a date display
    Last edited by 9V-STV; 12th June 2021 at 05:21.

  32. #482
    Grand Master snowman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kace View Post
    Much preferred the lugs on the earlier draft. I'm in the no date camp too.
    Me too, I thought maybe I wouldn't care if I saw it, but I think it looks much better with the shrouded lugs.

    Now the bracelet looks like an afterthought, IMO.

    Lugless and with a countdown bezel, I'd definitely have one - This version, I'm not so sure.

    While I think it looks better without a date, I'm not too bothered either way and if there's a ghost position, maybe it's better to have the date...

    M
    Last edited by snowman; 12th June 2021 at 13:12.
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  33. #483
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    The thing is that without a date, you will hardly ever need to unscrew the crown and encounter whatever ghost position there is, it will be almost irrelevant.
    Especially as the first crown position for this movement is not date setting, but hour hacking.........

  34. #484
    Grand Master abraxas's Avatar
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    For a mission-timer a 60 minute totaliser is very limiting. With a 12 hour bezel it makes more sense.

    What is a countdown bezel for?
    Your watch matters

  35. #485
    Quote Originally Posted by sweets View Post
    The thing is that without a date, you will hardly ever need to unscrew the crown and encounter whatever ghost position there is, it will be almost irrelevant.
    Especially as the first crown position for this movement is not date setting, but hour hacking.........
    Youír kinda right, because first position is non hackable quick hour change/ date change and the second position is hacking and normal time changing. There wonít be ghost date position noticed then.


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  36. #486
    Quote Originally Posted by abraxas View Post
    For a mission-timer a 60 minute totaliser is very limiting. With a 12 hour bezel it makes more sense.

    What is a countdown bezel for?
    You can count up and down, in theory. In practice [and I say this through clenched teeth] a 12hr one makes it more practical, to be a 12hr chrono rather than a 60min one. I'd keep the 'pip' at 12 though, just easier to set.

    Date? I'm 'meh' either way [if done then it must at least be white on black, if not, I'd go without].

    'Time = white, chrono = orange' in relation to the subdial hand. I thought about the scale on the subdial, thinking minimal but on reflection I think it's good as it is - it distinguishes it as a circle rather than 'bits on the dial'.

    Much prefer the unshrouded lugs, much more flexible with different straps - I've noticed on my 'shroudies' anyway.

    If you lose the lume on the constant second and put it on the minute chrono hand you'd have one of the only chronographs you can use in the dark, practically speaking.

    Just my musings.

    I'd have the DLC in a heartbeat and twice on Sundays, really really good work.
    Last edited by andy111s; 12th June 2021 at 18:24.

  37. #487
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    The original case with shrouded lugs looked great. The new, lugged version is a bit of an ugly duckling.

    I like the quick release spring bars!

    Date? Not fussed either way on this one. Both versions look great.

    As to choice of bezel markings? Either works, but a large lume pip at 12/60 would be very useful.

    C3 lume is a great choice, as is the yellow. It'll make for a really useful, legible chrono.

  38. #488
    Prefer the shrouded lugs by far. More distinctive. Goes better with the general 70/80s look.

  39. #489
    Quote Originally Posted by snowman View Post
    Me too, I thought maybe I wouldn't care if I saw it, but I think it looks much better with the shrouded lugs.

    Now the bracelet looks like an afterthought, IMO.

    Lugless and with a countdown bezel, I'd definitely have one - This version, I'm not so sure.

    While I think it looks better without a date, I'm not too bothered either way and if there's a ghost position, maybe it's better to have the date...

    M

    Totally agree that the bracelet looks an afterthought. I've got a real dislike of seeing the straight end of a bracelet like that. It either needs to have a proper endlink or not be visible.

  40. #490
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    I'd prefer conventional lugs as I suspect they will more easily take a NATO. which would suit a watch like this.

    I respect the views of those of prefer no-date symmetry but am keen to have a date, since with a 12-hour bezel and the quickset / jumping hour movement this would be practically perfect as a travel chrono - the best one I've seen since the PRS-17C was offered with a 12 hour bezel. And when you travel you do usually want to know the date, if only to ensure you're in the right place at the right time.

    As a sailor, I found that no-date watches were a PITA - I used to have an issued CWC Quartz RN Diver but gave up using it because I had to look up navigational data in tables. That's why the CWC G10 watches with dates were known as "Navigators" - because Navigators need dates.

    On my last offshore trip to Hobart last December, I used my Omega SMP 2264 for navigation purposes, but this watch, with a date, would have gone instead, had it been available then. Without a date, it'd have stayed at home.

    In relation to the running seconds, white but lumed would be my preference.

  41. #491
    Administrator swanbourne's Avatar
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    The movement is only manufactured to display the date between 4 and 5 and given the size of the watch and the size of the movement it would be displayed like this, which I personally think looks terrible



    I have, however, reverted to a white luminous running seconds hand (see, I do listen).



    Eddie
    Whole chunks of my life come under the heading "it seemed like a good idea at the time".

  42. #492
    Grand Master number2's Avatar
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    I find that the "yellow hands" on my current 17c don't make for quick recognition of timing's, Sinn and others have used orange / red which looks altogether more legible, IMHO.
    As an aside can anyone recommend someone to paint the hands of my 17c?
    Last edited by number2; 13th June 2021 at 10:15.
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  43. #493
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    17C 'Mission Timer'?

    Duplicate post - sorry
    Last edited by HappyJack; 13th June 2021 at 11:42.

  44. #494
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    Quote Originally Posted by swanbourne View Post
    The movement is only manufactured to display the date between 4 and 5 and given the size of the watch and the size of the movement it would be displayed like this, which I personally think looks terrible



    I have, however, reverted to a white luminous running seconds hand (see, I do listen).



    Eddie
    The Revue Thommen with the same movement had upright numbers in the date window

    http://lh6.ggpht.com/_M_ygWKcHRmQ


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  45. #495
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    The Revue Thommen Airspeed with the same movement has upright numerals:

    RT Chrono2 May2011 .jpg


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  46. #496
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    Quote Originally Posted by swanbourne View Post
    The movement is only manufactured to display the date between 4 and 5 and given the size of the watch and the size of the movement it would be displayed like this, which I personally think looks terrible



    I have, however, reverted to a white luminous running seconds hand (see, I do listen).



    Eddie
    Well I think the date window doesn't look too bad at all. I mean it is very handy to have the date with the flick of your wrist being a tool watch.

    The countdown bezel looks good as well. Good to have both chronograph and countdown function altogether in a single mission timer.
    Last edited by 9V-STV; 13th June 2021 at 13:45.

  47. #497
    Administrator swanbourne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HappyJack View Post
    The Revue Thommen Airspeed with the same movement has upright numerals:

    RT Chrono2 May2011 .jpg


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    They must have had a custom date wheel printed but the position on the dial is the same. It's also a larger watch, which is why the date isn't at the edge.

    Eddie
    Whole chunks of my life come under the heading "it seemed like a good idea at the time".

  48. #498
    Master sweets's Avatar
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    The movement in the RT (as well as the old Heuers and everything elsecthat used the 251.262 movement with horizontal date) has been moved on several iterations, so I would not be surprised at all if thst is not possible now.

  49. #499
    Master freeloader's Avatar
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    I'm surprised with myself in that after looking at the shrouded and open lugs I'm now in the shrouded camp. The head looks far better proportioned and there's a design continuity with the flat profile of the pushers that results in a more coherent look. The bezel overhang with the open lugs just doesn't look right at all and as previously mentioned they result in a budget appearance with the flat profile on the end link on the bracelet.

    I'd also prefer orange or red for the chrono hands as opposed to yellow.

  50. #500
    Master Timelord's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freeloader View Post
    I'm surprised with myself in that after looking at the shrouded and open lugs I'm now in the shrouded camp. The head looks far better proportioned and there's a design continuity with the flat profile of the pushers that results in a more coherent look. The bezel overhang with the open lugs just doesn't look right at all and as previously mentioned they result in a budget appearance with the flat profile on the end link on the bracelet.

    I'd also prefer orange or red for the chrono hands as opposed to yellow.
    Ironically the current case shape is starting to look a bit like the PRS-17 case that was the original idea for the Mission Timer. I prefer the shrouded lug case, but the current render is not a deal breaker for me. I like the countdown bezel, the NaBo dial, the new airplane tip of the central chronograph minutes hand, the bracelet and the white hand on the running seconds. Iím also happy with it being dateless if people think a date will spoil the symmetry of the dial. Overall I think the design is moving in the right direction.

    I also like orange or red for the chronograph minutes and seconds, but maybe a precedent has been set for Precista with yellow hands with the PRS-17C? Yellow is certainly distinctive.

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