Dead man's watch

[triumph coupe]

I put this in G&D rather than watch talk. Although if anyone is offended by the thought I shall not be offended if this gets moved elsewhere. Although this post is not intended to be controversial in any way.

I am a lover of vintage watches although the thought could be applied to all second hand watches.

I was wondering about the forum's thoughts about watches that people had dies wearing. No doubt many of us are wearing or have in our collections watches that were being worn when someone died. I don't know what the terminology for such a watch would be, perhaps there is not one. I shall use the phrase "death-watch" until a suitable alternative is offered.

We are most likely unaware that our watch has been strapped around the cold dead wrist of a previous owner. Would it affect the way you felt about your watch? Or perhaps you would not think any different knowing you are wearing a death-watch. I'd be keen to hear the thoughts of the forum.

Perhaps it might not be a best selling point which is why we don't see "Death Rolex for sale" written much in SC!

Hit me with your thoughts. Oh, and of course pictures of seat-watches appreciated!

[Cirrus]

Look at it from the other direction... if you died wearing your pride and joy would you want it cremated with you or passed on to be enjoyed by someone else as much as you did? I know which I would I would prefer.

Slightly off the topic (but not really) a friend of mine who worked in the A&E of a local hospital told me she once had to bag up the watch and other effects of a patient who had died in, I think, a motorcycle accident. The watch was in a zippo seal type bag of its own and completely caked in blood to the point where it was stuck the bag and you couldn't even see what it was... the man's daughter told her to throw it all - keys, wallet, watch etc. - in to the burn bin, and so it was done.

A few days later the man's son turned up looking for his dad's vintage something-or-other watch that was worth many thousands of pounds and proceeded to kick-off when told it had probably already been incinerated, or was at the bottom of 40 tonnes of clinical waste awaiting that fate. Luckily hospitals have Forms which protect them from being sued in such circumstances!

[Glamdring]

Doesn't bother me at all. Many inherit watches; I got a 1970s Zenith El Primero when my uncle died. I have a mint Russian twin barrel watch that's inscribed 1973, probably a presentation piece. The owner has probably passed on by now and I see it as part of history.

It's not so much grave robbing as archaeology.

[triumph coupe]

As I said, I am sure that many of us could have a potential "death-watch" but the thought does not worry us. But saying that we only potentially have a death-watch as it may have been in the drawer of a desk of the previous owners when they died. Would it be different if you were buying a watch and was told the following:

"yeah, this was my brothers/uncles/fathers/sons/neighbours watch and he died/committed suicide wearing it and I found him and remember taking the watch off his wrist before the funeral directors/police/paramedics dealt with the body"

You'd know for sure that you had a death-watch then. No question about it. Would it make you feel different?

I don't think it would worry me enormously. But I can't help that thinking that if I knew it was a certainty that I had a so called death-watch that I might think of that when thinking about it's history and it might make me think differently about it.

Take for example you had the watch that JFK was wearing when he was shot, or the watch that Hitler was wearing when he died or . I guess that those watches might well appeal to some people because of this whilst it might well put some people off wearing them for the very same reason.

[unclealec]

I nearly bought the watch George Harrison had on when he died.
Sort of a Death Watch Beatle.

[Christian]

Interesting and weird thread! I have never thought about it before, so I guess I'm not that worried. I guess I would feel differently if the watch was advertised as having been on a dead man's wrist who died of ebola or something like that!

[wellsy]

""""""""""I nearly bought the watch George Harrison had on when he died.
Sort of a Death Watch Beatle. """""""""""


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Without doubt , pun of the week.

[swanbourne]

My father wasn't wearing a watch when he died but I've since worn his watches, it doesn't worry me in the slightest.

Eddie

[GRK]

I would probably draw the line at wearing a dead man's shoes or suit but I have my father's watch and my grandfather's signet ring both of which I've worn on occasion and been proud to do so.

On a related theme all the houses I've ever bought or lived in were all Edwardian or Victorian therefore the odds are that several people have died in them over the years. Again it's not something I'm bothered about but I've always been careful not to mention it to the kids in case they started seeing/hearing ghosts

regards
grant

[triumph coupe]

My father wasn't wearing a watch when he died but I've since worn his watches, it doesn't worry me in the slightest.

Eddie

That's another good point you've made me think of Eddie...

Your Fathers watches can be described as just that - your fathers watches, they could not be said to be "death-watches". The feelings and memories of them are, most likely, positive

However, I often read on threads on the forum that people associate things that have happened when wearing a certain watch to the watch and this makes the watch special or gives it a sentimental quality. For example - I wore this watch when I got married, or it is the watch I was wearing when my children were born and so on. It would logically follow to have negative feelings when something bad happens whilst wearing a watch (e.g. my uncle drowned at sea wearing this Breitling Emergency...)

[Cirrus]

On a related theme all the houses I've ever bought or lived in were all Edwardian or Victorian therefore the odds are that several people have died in them over the years.

Again with the flip-side, but in houses of that age the chances are a fair number of people were also born :-)

[TheFlyingBanana]

Doesn't bother me in the slightest. We are all just stardust after all...

[seikokiller]

I only feel bad about it if I killed the bloke myself.

[docd]

My father was wearing my Zeno Phantom (bought from SC) when he passed away at Pontefract Hospice in 2007.
During one of my visits there he mentioned he wanted a reliable, easy to read, quartz. It so happened I was wearing the Zeno at the time and as it fitted the bill nicely I passed it over.

It won't ever be put up for sale, not because of grizzly connotations but because I treasure it.

I inherited most of the rest of his watch collection as my brother and sister weren't really interested in Rolex and Omegas
So I have quite a few death watches but as has been said they are in fact father's watches .

[peterv]

I have a "death watch" , it was my best friends . He was wearing it when he died , and it was given to me by his wife after he died. It doesn't bother me in the slightest that he was wearing it when he died. I work as an Embalmer, and am frequently asked to put jewellery and watches on deceased by their families . I always ensure the watches are set to the correct time before putting them on, it just seems the right thing to do .

[unclealec]

That's the way - dead accurate.

[RJM25R]

My mum wears the watch my dad had on when he died. He always wore a watch every single day, always owning a few (this must be genetic LOL) and even though its only a quartz Sekonda on a leather strap that he wore at the end, its now one of my mums most treasured possessions along with my dads wedding ring and a chain and a cross he always wore....

Funny watch related story, on the day my dad died, my uncle (among other family) was at the hospice talking to me, talking about my dad and how he always liked the latest gadgets, and liked watches and stuff and mentioned he remembered that my Dad had a wooden watch. The case was wood, as was the dial but had a quartz movement.

I'd not seen it for years but remembered it from probably the late 80's/early '90's. anyway, my dad died at three o'clock and after a few hours at the hospice we de-camped to my sister house and I proceeded to get absolutely w4nkered on beer and vodka, having just suffered the worst day of my life.

A couple of days later, at my mams, she asked me and my sisters to clear some stuff that she didnt want like his tools, camcorder, aftershaves, sock drawer etc and I found a box with his cuff links (which I still have), keyrings, old keys and the bloody wood watch! It was a bit battered, no strap and didn't work. I took it to the watchmaker in oldham and he fitted a battery and it worked! He put a strap on it and I gave it to my uncle and he wore it at the funeral!

Strangely, as I've mentioned before, the last thing my mam and dad bought me while he was alive, was a watch (only an armani but its one that will never be sold) so watches give me a link to my dad....

[Atlantic]

It wouldn't bother me at all. If you walk into an antique shop, then everything there belonged to a person now dead. Seats sat in, crockery used, mirrors peered into and so on.

A watch is all about the implacability of time, so what better memento mori than one that has come from someone for whom it has run out?

[wajhart]

Doesn't bother me in the slightest. We are all just stardust after all...

Yeah, and we are golden, and we've got to get ourselves back to the garden...

[Bibbs]

Wouldn't bother me. Give it a good clean and it'd be fine (just like I'd do with any pre-owned watch).

[seikokiller]

The mrs car is a dead mans car. As in a family member literally died in it. In the drivers seat.

I still refer to it as the cursed car of death.

[johnbaz]

Hi all

This was one of my dads watches, he didn't have many but they were dished out to his mates and me..

When I wear it, it makes me remember my old dad, it doesn't bother me wearing it...





John

[triumph coupe]

I think some of you may have misunderstood the "death-watch" definition.

I'm not talking about stuff that belonged to someone who is now dead - these things are in my eyes just things that belonged to someone that had died. To qualify as a "death-watch" the person would have to have died using it.

The examples from above would be Eddie's Father's watches are not death-watches as his father was not wearing one when he died. So they are best described as Eddie's Father's watches.

GRK's Father's watch and grandfather's signet ring would only qualify as death-watch or death-ring if they were in use when your father / grandfather died. Otherwise they are just their possessions.

Antiques don't qualify just because they are old. You may have an antique dining table (I have one myself dating to circa 1810) and age itself does not make it a death-table. It would only qualify if someone died eating at it or playing monopoly on it or something. Otherwise it is just an old table owned by people who may or may not have died. Now my table may well be a death-table but because i have no evidence of it in my mind that is not a qualified death-table.

Elvis Presley's lavatory would be a death-lavatory, but his car would just be Elvis Presley's car.

Likewise - my old Triumph is from 1962. It was first owned by a doctor. Lets presume he was 40 when he bought it (I don't know), we could probably safely assume that he is now dead. This, however, does not make my car a death-car because he didn't die in it as far as I am aware. However, if I had evidence that he did then it would be a death-car.

This leads to my point that knowing that the object was in use when someone died does change your thoughts about it. Perfect example is:

The mrs car is a dead mans car. As in a family member literally died in it. In the drivers seat.

I still refer to it as the cursed car of death.

[Cirrus]

I think we understood the definition well enough, just most people didn't see any difference between dying wearing a watch and dying whilst owning a watch - its all the same really. Unless the person died of necrotising fasciitis, in which case some cleaning of the bracelet may be required...

[o u t a t i m e]

I really don't see a problem with it. Unless the watch was the cause of death. In which case I'd be slightly nervous.

[triumph coupe]

I think we understood the definition well enough, just most people didn't see any difference between dying wearing a watch and dying whilst owning a watch

Would you therefore see no difference between a racing car that Senna raced versus the car he crashed and died in?
Would you see no difference between the car that JFK drove about to the shops versus the car he was shot in?

Maybe you don't... I think many would.

Say, perhaps someone dies in an armchair in a room with two armchairs. Would you see no difference between the two armchairs or would you think of one as one that whoever died in? You may not be concerned about it, but bet you would see the two chairs differently.

[Cirrus]

Would you therefore see no difference between a racing car that Senna raced versus the car he crashed and died in?
Would you see no difference between the car that JFK drove about to the shops versus the car he was shot in?

Maybe you don't... I think many would.

Say, perhaps someone dies in an armchair in a room with two armchairs. Would you see no difference between the two armchairs or would you think of one as one that whoever died in? You may not be concerned about it, but bet you would see the two chairs differently.

There is no difference except that which you attribute to it; the process of dying in, on or adjacent to an object does not alter it's physical properties in any way.

[gray]

A watch, chair, wardrobe are all inanimate objects and I treat them as such.

For all I know many vintage, especially wartime, watches I've had may have been prized from the wrists of dead men.

If I knew for sure that was the case it changes nothing, it is still an inanimate watch.

I am more concerned with a watch dying on me than a watch having been on the dead.

[triumph coupe]

I agree with you. However, I am not sure that it is that easy to remember that in your mind. I guess that some people would find it more significant than others.

Whilst the thought does not worry me in the slightest I cannot help feeling that I would associate the event with a watch and whilst it would not necessarily make me feel weird about the object I think I'd have in the back of my mind that this was the watch that Mr X died in.

[biglofty77]

Would not bother me at all , we could be sleeping in bedrooms people died in, you may even be sleeping in a bed someone died in !!!

[walkerwek1958]

I get to handle a lot of old watches and I have to admit this has never crossed my mind!

Can`t say it would bother me at all. It's likely that I`ve owned and worked on watches in this category.

Since starting to work on watches I`ve grown quite dispassionate about them, although I do occassionally wonder about the history of a 50-60 year old watch I`m more concerned with sorting out problems and trying to source parts. It's only when the watch is fully assembled again that I see it as an item with great sentiment for someone.


Paul

[fiddler69]

Interesting thread, which immediately sparked a memory of a thread from a couple of years ago which is particularly relevant - to quote: "As you can see, the watch has a history. In addition to the wabi and badly corroded dial, the movement was not functioning, supposedly irreparable - all due to having spent a few days submerged in the English Channel, attached to my uncle Fred..."

http://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.ph...mes-of-a-Watch

[verv]

It wouldn't bother me.
I can't see a dead wrist being any more eew inducing than some of the gunky watches you get from live ones.
Once cells are deposited on bracelet links / case backs they're dead anyway.

[triumph coupe]

Interesting thread, which immediately sparked a memory of a thread from a couple of years ago which is particularly relevant - to quote: "As you can see, the watch has a history. In addition to the wabi and badly corroded dial, the movement was not functioning, supposedly irreparable - all due to having spent a few days submerged in the English Channel, attached to my uncle Fred..."

http://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.ph...mes-of-a-Watch

That is exactly what I was talking about. Thanks for digging that out of the archives, I'd not read that before.

It's not about physical touching of a dead person, dead cells or that kind of thing. It's about knowing a watch was being worn whilst someone died. The above example is exactly the sort of thing I was getting at. The very knowledge that poor old Uncle Fred was hanging about in the English Channel with the watch strapped to his wrist must have an influence on the way that people would view the watch. Perhaps for the better, perhaps for the worse but either way it will make you feel different about the watch.

[verv]

still wouldnt bother me.. fascinating thread to read about freds watch though! i think it was posted before my time.

[gray]

That is exactly what I was talking about. Thanks for digging that out of the archives, I'd not read that before.

It's not about physical touching of a dead person, dead cells or that kind of thing. It's about knowing a watch was being worn whilst someone died. The above example is exactly the sort of thing I was getting at. The very knowledge that poor old Uncle Fred was hanging about in the English Channel with the watch strapped to his wrist must have an influence on the way that people would view the watch. Perhaps for the better, perhaps for the worse but either way it will make you feel different about the watch.

No. It's still a watch. If it were my favourite uncle the fact he had it on him when he died, rather than one from the drawer, would not make me feel any different towards it. It's an inanimate object. Nothing would pass from my uncle to it at the time of death to change the watch or my feelings towards it - I would still value it for it's association with a favourite uncle, "death watch" or not.