Protecting bee species.

[seikopath]

protecting the survival of the bee is the same as protecting our own survival. If the bee goes, so do we. Its that simple. I dont really forward emails of this type , but today I do.





Now that two leading UK retailers have declared their intention to remove bee-killing pesticides from their shelves, we have some leverage to request that supermarkets follow suit.

We have a perfect opportunity now to 'close the deal' by asking leading supermarkets to demonstrate their bee-friendly credentials and follow the lead of B&Q and Wickes.

Below you will find a sample letter you can adapt and send to any of the following, or any supermarkets in your own country (if you are outside the UK).

Here are some contact emails and web forms to get you started:

Sainsbury's - http://www.sainsburys.co.uk/sol/cont...contact_us.jsp

Waitrose - customersupport@waitrose.co.uk

Morrisons - http://www.morrisons.co.uk/Help-and-...on/Contact-Us/

Lidl - http://www.lidl.co.uk/cps/rde/xchg/l...s.xsl/6491.htm

Tesco - cr.enquiries@uk.tesco.com

Here is a sample letter:

Dear Sirs,

You will be aware by now that two leading UK retailers are to remove products containing

neonicotinoids from their shelve:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/gardening...illers-blamed-

for-decline-of-bees.html

We ask you to follow their example and make a point of demonstrating your 'bee-friendly'

credentials to your customers, who will, I am sure, respond positively.

The European Food Standards Authority has established that neonicotinoids pose an

unacceptable risk to bees and there is considerable scientific evidence that they are also

lethal to other important pollinators.

Friends of the Bees request that you consider:

Removing all garden products, include lawn treatments, and spray presticides containing

neonicotinoids, from your shelves.

Ensuring that suppliers of plants, bulbs and seeds have not and will not use neonicotinoids

in soil, or neonicotinoid treated bulbs and seeds.

Neonicotinoids include the following chemicals (some not present currently in garden

products, but for your information): imidacloprid, thiamethoxam, thiacloprid, clothiandin,

Acetimacloprid, Dinotefuran and Nitenpyram.

Yours,
etc


We have a strong position now - don't let this opportunity slip by!

Regards
Phil Chandler
www.biobees.com
www.friendsofthebees.org

[cypermethrin]

I think you are perhaps presenting a rather polarised view. if you read the EFSA review published just a week or so ago it show acknowledged shortcomings in scientific knowledge but no proven causal relationship betwwen pesticides and observed bee decline.

[Hamish]

So is this purely a marketing exercise by B&Q?

[cypermethrin]

So is this purely a marketing exercise by B&Q?

Bingo!

[hogthrob]

Balance in all things. OK, it's Wikipedia, but still:

Criticism

EFSA has been criticised for their alleged overregulation, and promotion of conflict of interest. For example, Corporate Europe Observatory and Earth Open Source have documented cases where EFSA has used industry scientists and information in risk assessments used by EU institutions and national governments, accusing the agency of basing their decisions on industry data rather than independent science. They also claim that many EFSA panel members have ties with biotech, food, or pesticide companies, paving the way for blatant conflicts of interest.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europea...rity#Criticism

[oldstock]

there is a native breed of bee around where i live, it is called the galtee bee, as it is near a mountain range called the galtees, also unusual as they have no rock on their summits onlybog.

[Cul a Cnoic]

http://thewatchers.adorraeli.com/201...save-the-bees/

Nice bit here on the subject and a link to a petition to get the Bayer shareholders to act on the deadly pesticides been manufactured in their company.

there is a native breed of bee around where i live, it is called the galtee bee, as it is near a mountain range called the galtees, also unusual as they have no rock on their summits onlybog.

Oldstock, possibly the best breed of bees in Ireland. Hopefully I can get a queen or two off them this year.

[Bravo73]

I'm normally pretty sceptical about avaaz petitions but for some reason, this one really strikes a chord with me:

http://www.avaaz.org/en/hours_to_save_the_bees/?tglTbdb


Please sign it.

[laser8]

As an organic food producer I can vouch that using or not using pesticides does make a difference. Maybe not a big one in the product itself, but to the whole ecosystem for sure.

Next time you go for a walk in the countryside, do take a look at all the insects, birds and flowers that can bee seen in an organic field vs in one tended using "traditional" systems.

[Carlton-Browne]

there is a native breed of bee around where i live, it is called the galtee bee, as it is near a mountain range called the galtees, also unusual as they have no rock on their summits onlybog.

I had to google this, not least because the only exposure I've had to anything Galtee-related in the past was cheese. I had a good giggle when I came across this particular picture which has to have the makings of a caption competition.


More info here
http://www.gbbg.net/recordmorepics.html

[cypermethrin]

As an organic food producer I can vouch that using or not using pesticides does make a difference. Maybe not a big one in the product itself, but to the whole ecosystem for sure.

Next time you go for a walk in the countryside, do take a look at all the insects, birds and flowers that can bee seen in an organic field vs in one tended using "traditional" systems.

Those rose tinted spectacles completeley counteract and contradict all the peer reviewed scientific literature published on modern farming practices in the last decade.

[seikopath]

Those rose tinted spectacles completeley counteract and contradict all the peer reviewed scientific literature published on modern farming practices in the last decade.

and the vast majority of scientific literature is funded by who exactly?

[cypermethrin]

and the vast majority of scientific literature is funded by who exactly?

Funded by you and I the tax payer via the UK Government. Google it.

[seikopath]

Cypermethrin eh ?

[laser8]

Those rose tinted spectacles completeley counteract and contradict all the peer reviewed scientific literature published on modern farming practices in the last decade.

Oh yes, for sure. I am now enlightened and will go buy some systemic chemicals and some Monsanto shares. Sorry for not trolling this post as it deserves, and not exposing any environmental awareness thread for the nonsense and public disinformation it tries to shamelessly perpetrate.

[seikopath]

It's pretty obvious which side of the bread his is buttered

[laser8]

It's pretty obvious which side of the bread his is buttered

I really do not mind different opinions, but do like them to be fairly argumented. What I do not understand is claiming that any chemical substance of industrial provenience can be innocuous, or better than a natural one (for the environment). It can lead to an easier process of tending a specific crop, or to less effort in the daily work, but for sure not to better soil, cleaner water, or help, protect or improve biodiversity. Having a vision requires a broader approach than just having a view.

Let's be clear, I do not think antibiotics and vaccines should be banned, or that we should live in a cave and eat just what can be gathered, however we are at a point where our technology and knowledge allows us to be kinder to our environment, and I think we should (and I try to).

[cypermethrin]

I am all for an open discussion.... It seems that you guys are rather closed to understanding another view to your own. Which is indeed fine and very healthy as we are entitled to our own opinions.

So can you educate me understand why organic producers can use substances like copper sulphate which have an inherent environmental toxicity to many synthetic pesticides; but are still "natural" and hence organic?

[jk103]

I am all for an open discussion.... It seems that you guys are rather closed to understanding another view to your own. Which is indeed fine and very healthy as we are entitled to our own opinions.

So can you educate me understand why organic producers can use substances like copper sulphate which have an inherent environmental toxicity to many synthetic pesticides; but are still "natural" and hence organic?

I don't think you have found any closed opinions but rather formed opinions just like yours. The neonicotinoids reports were originally glowing reports funded by the chemical companies themselves. The EPA had originally accepted the Bayer study based on a Bayer funded report the EPA has now since discredited it and distanced themselves from it. It seems the EFSA you speak about is now considered to be unreliable as they seem to receive their funding from the people making the products, I guess in their pocket rings true.

You'll find plenty of info about the harm imposed on honeybees from neonicotinoids from many scientific resources, groups and publications. You will also find most research proves that they do harm honeybees. The year Bayer introduced neonicotinoids here in the US 2006, was the first year of Colony Collapse Disorder (CCD) within honeybees and ever since. Do you remember wide spread use of DDT or what about Agent Orange? DDT was good it killed bed bugs, American Bald Eagles, and Eastern Bluebirds and is blamed for birth defects as well.

I'm just wondering how Neonicotinoids (insecticides) don't harm honeybees (insects) cypermethrin? Curious why you choose that name and wonder how anyone could really look at your opinion even remotely as unopinionated?

Here is a recent news report from the UK:
http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/nature/no-ban-on-pesticides-that-threaten-bees-8114020.html

If you read the beekeeping forums you will find there are pro/con views on neonicotinoids there. You'll find the mostly pro views are from commercial farmers/beekeepers that use it themselves.

You will also find there are plenty of organic farms that operate profitably without the use of insecticides as well, check the Rodale Institue and Organic Magazine out sometime.

[laser8]

I am all for an open discussion.... It seems that you guys are rather closed to understanding another view to your own. Which is indeed fine and very healthy as we are entitled to our own opinions.

So can you educate me understand why organic producers can use substances like copper sulphate which have an inherent environmental toxicity to many synthetic pesticides; but are still "natural" and hence organic?

Well, I thought we were having a discussion - I hope you did not think I would be converted in two posts!

Copper is one of the rare substances which can be hardly substituted in certain circumstances. Some clays are good for the job, but in drier areas. If there is an average high humidity, there is simply no chance (yet, or still) to avoid using copper. This is valid for plants with high vulnerability to foliar diseases (grape). I grow olives, and mostly use clay. Sometimes though (every few years, one treatment) I have to use copper to avoid total destruction, but obviously there are some limitations. As I said earlier, I am not a fanboy of living in caves and gathering food. The latins used to say, all things should be taken "cum grano salis". One the other side, I do believe I am being friendlier to the environment and fair to the coming generations by limiting my weaponry.

[Chris_in_the_UK]

Funded by you and I the tax payer via the UK Government. Google it.

WTF? .

[cypermethrin]

Well, I thought we were having a discussion - I hope you did not think I would be converted in two posts!

Copper is one of the rare substances which can be hardly substituted in certain circumstances. Some clays are good for the job, but in drier areas. If there is an average high humidity, there is simply no chance (yet, or still) to avoid using copper. This is valid for plants with high vulnerability to foliar diseases (grape). I grow olives, and mostly use clay. Sometimes though (every few years, one treatment) I have to use copper to avoid total destruction, but obviously there are some limitations. As I said earlier, I am not a fanboy of living in caves and gathering food. The latins used to say, all things should be taken "cum grano salis". One the other side, I do believe I am being friendlier to the environment and fair to the coming generations by limiting my weaponry.

Thanks for explaining how and why it is used from an agronomic perspective.... I was more enquiring as to why the use of copper is considered "better" and hence organic when its physico- chemical properies, environmental fate and environmental toxociology is comparable to that of carbamates which are considered typical old school pesticides ?

[cypermethrin]

WTF? .

https://secure.fera.defra.gov.uk/bee...News.cfm?id=47

[laser8]

Thanks for explaining how and why it is used from an agronomic perspective.... I was more enquiring as to why the use of copper is considered "better" and hence organic when its physico- chemical properies, environmental fate and environmental toxociology is comparable to that of carbamates which are considered typical old school pesticides ?

They have different functions. Copper is used for fungi (funguses?), and as I stated earlier, we really do not have that range of alternatives. Insects are a different beast (no pun intended) - more expensive, or time consuming, or/and less effective solutions that do not have a wide range of side effects exist and are available, hence the somewhat wrong perspective on the statement that "copper is better". I agree it has a lot of downsides, but sometimes there is no other solution. I'd appreciate if a product would be available for that specific purpose with less side effects, but it isn't. This is why its use is allowed. And remember, copper is used during winter, when the animal life it could affect is not really present. Pesticides, on the other hand, do have a number of "better" alternatives.

Seikopath, sorry for having hijacked the topic.

[cypermethrin]

They have different functions. Copper is used for fungi (funguses?), and as I stated earlier, we really do not have that range of alternatives. Insects are a different beast (no pun intended) - more expensive, or time consuming, or/and less effective solutions that do not have a wide range of side effects exist and are available, hence the somewhat wrong perspective on the statement that "copper is better". I agree it has a lot of downsides, but sometimes there is no other solution. I'd appreciate if a product would be available for that specific purpose with less side effects, but it isn't. This is why its use is allowed. And remember, copper is used during winter, when the animal life it could affect is not really present. Pesticides, on the other hand, do have a number of "better" alternatives.

Seikopath, sorry for having hijacked the topic.

Everyday is a school day... Did not appreciate the timing of application of Cu was in the latter of the yeat and hence benficial insects would be less prevalent.