Patek Nautilus 5711/1A-010 - Thoughts please!

[kaiserphoenix]

Hi guys, I got quite interested in the Patek 5711/1A-010. What is it like with Pateks? Never owned one, are they easy to come across or do you have waiting lists etc. Should you pay list like Rolex? or can you expect some discount etc.

What is the current UK MSRP on the 5711/1A-010? is it any good?

I was going for the AP 15202 (new version) when I recently found a guy wearing the Nautilus and found the bracelet to be super comfy! Got me thinking...

Any thoughts welcome!!

[Tokyo Tokei]

It's a Rolex Sub for those that find Rolex Subs too cheap.

In other words, it's absolutely superb.

Yet ... almost a dull choice because it's so obvious. Having said that, it has more class, in my opinion, than the versions with more complications. Then again still, if you are spending that kind of money on a wrist ornament, you really shouldn't care a hoot what I or anyone else thinks.

With that said, for what it's worth, after trying a few at the PP Salon in Tokyo, my favourite was the Aquanaut Dual Time ref #5164


(pic from internet)

My view on extravagant items, be they clothes, trinkets, cars, fine art or whatever, is that if they must be bought and if they must be exhibited, then one should do so in the most offhand way possible. Lowry in the water closet, cashmere cardy for the gardening, and a rubber strap on a PP. That sort of thing. Anything else is a touch tedious.

Paul

[W44NNE]

I tried a Nautilus the other week. Hated it. Literally. I couldn't understand why people pay £30,000 or so for a steel watch. If it was a precious metal, I'd see it in a completely different light, however I'll be sticking to "lesser" brands such as Rolex... Not that I can afford a Nautilus lol.

[donny]

A 5711 will be my next aquisition

[kaiserphoenix]

The bracelet on the PP Nautilus was amazing I felt. I was trying on the RO 15202 but then the sales guy had the PP and that bracelet just hugs the wrist...Plus Im thinking more from a prestige/investment perspective probably the PP is a better buy? also it costs 17970 vs the 16000 of the AP and makes me feel the PP is the better buy?

[kaiserphoenix]

A 5711 will be my next aquisition

Will you go with the new WHITE dial or the standard blue one?

[robcat]

The bracelet on the PP Nautilus was amazing I felt. I was trying on the RO 15202 but then the sales guy had the PP and that bracelet just hugs the wrist...Plus Im thinking more from a prestige/investment perspective probably the PP is a better buy? also it costs 17970 vs the 16000 of the AP and makes me feel the PP is the better buy?

From a VFM/investment perspective, the Nautilus is much better - it's one of the (regular) PP's that seem to hold the most value. Used prices seem to be strong, and discounts modest (if any). The 15202 on the other hand, is overpriced compared to the 15400 IMO, and a quick look at Chrono24 show that although there's not many around, they don't seem to hold their value particularly well.

The 5711 blue dial would be my choice, but it is a hell of a lot of money for a steel 3-hand watch - probably only PP could get away with that. Otherwise pick up a 15300/15400.

[Mark020]

If it was a precious metal, I'd see it in a completely different light,

Why?

[wolfeyes1974]

I've a PP Nautilus..it feels light on the wrist and the bracelet is indeed more comfortable than AP RO. The blue dial has different hues under different lights (blue or grey). It's sporty yet able to double up as a SS dress watch that fits well under the sleeve. It's also very thin and it's a nice movement which you can admire from the see-thru caseback. You'll love it more eventually.

cheers

james

[W44NNE]

Why?

Do I really need to answer that when the values of the metals are on a completely different level? I understand the movements are held in high regard, I've been to Geneva and I've seen the love for PP there. However, I think all that money for a steel watch is just crazy.

Not that £5k etc isn't a huge amount of money anyway for a Rolex etc, but what are you paying the extra for? What's going to put the extra smile on your face when you've got home and spent the money?

The flat bezel also puts me off as I'd be terrified of dinking it etc.

This is my personal opinion which I'm sure want match with other lovers of the brand.

[kaiserphoenix]

Do I really need to answer that when the values of the metals are on a completely different level? I understand the movements are held in high regard, I've been to Geneva and I've seen the love for PP there. However, I think all that money for a steel watch is just crazy.

Not that £5k etc isn't a huge amount of money anyway for a Rolex etc, but what are you paying the extra for? What's going to put the extra smile on your face when you've got home and spent the money?

The flat bezel also puts me off as I'd be terrified of dinking it etc.

This is my personal opinion which I'm sure want match with other lovers of the brand.

No I completely see your point and it is quite outrageous for an SS watch true. But you have to think in terms of market value/perception. The fact that a 2nd hand SS PP Nautilus still commands such a high price means that the market does not really percieve the SS as in anyway negative seems like.

I personally see it the Nautilus as a "bad" investment but an investment nonetheless. When I say "Bad" I mean that you probably cant buy it, then wear it and expect like 5-10% returns on it on a year, but what you will get is "dividends" in terms of pleasure every day wearing it, and then in 5-10 years if I decide to flip it, I will probably get back what I paid for as the prices would have increased by then etc

[kaiserphoenix]

I tried a Nautilus the other week. Hated it. Literally. I couldn't understand why people pay £30,000 or so for a steel watch. If it was a precious metal, I'd see it in a completely different light, however I'll be sticking to "lesser" brands such as Rolex... Not that I can afford a Nautilus lol.

Also its not 30K for the 5711, its "only" £17,970.00

[W44NNE]

No I completely see your point and it is quite outrageous for an SS watch true. But you have to think in terms of market value/perception. The fact that a 2nd hand SS PP Nautilus still commands such a high price means that the market does not really percieve the SS as in anyway negative seems like.

I personally see it the Nautilus as a "bad" investment but an investment nonetheless. When I say "Bad" I mean that you probably cant buy it, then wear it and expect like 5-10% returns on it on a year, but what you will get is "dividends" in terms of pleasure every day wearing it, and then in 5-10 years if I decide to flip it, I will probably get back what I paid for as the prices would have increased by then etc

True, but a full service, strap replacement, crystal replacement or bezel replacement would soon wipe out any investment potential should you have a clumsy moment.

I do understand that all these "investments" seem like crazy money to most non-watch folk, however I think we all have a limit of what we see as... "Woah, I wouldn't go there!" and PP seems to be mine

Also its not 30K for the 5711, its "only" £17,970.00

Sorry, I didn't realize they started at that, however I'm guessing that's for a simple three hander and a date window with perhaps a gold rotor etc? Still seems an awful lot of money for such a watch when there's no gold, platinum or palladium involved in decent quantities.

[donny]

Will you go with the new WHITE dial or the standard blue one?

The white one is not for me so it will be the blue version and likely to be pre-owned if I can find the right watch/deal - I've decided it is my quest for 2013

[kaiserphoenix]

The white one is not for me so it will be the blue version and likely to be pre-owned if I can find the right watch/deal - I've decided it is my quest for 2013

Yeah I think I am going to buy a Nautilus as well lol love at first sight!

[jegger]

Sorry, I didn't realize they started at that, however I'm guessing that's for a simple three hander and a date window with perhaps a gold rotor etc? Still seems an awful lot of money for such a watch when there's no gold, platinum or palladium involved in decent quantities.

the amount of gold used in a watch does not add 10s of thousands of pounds to the cost, maybe that's how you can justify an expensive watch, we all need to justify them some how, just don't kid yourself that a gold watch is some how better value for money, as many times they are anything but.

[kaiserphoenix]

Annoying thing is to buy a Nautilus, I have to be on a waiting list....

[Manxdiver]

.....

[rob-vicar]

Sorry, I didn't realize they started at that, however I'm guessing that's for a simple three hander and a date window with perhaps a gold rotor etc? .

Yes that's the one. BTW they all have 22ct gold rotors.
All auto Pateks have them, as when they first started producing them, gold was the only malleable metal that could be easily formed into the shape they needed with a consistent weight & density.
At the time other metal / alloys varied greatly depending on batch and producer, therefore could not be relied upon for the level of consistency they required for a balanced rotor.

[W44NNE]

the amount of gold used in a watch does not add 10s of thousands of pounds to the cost, maybe that's how you can justify an expensive watch, we all need to justify them some how, just don't kid yourself that a gold watch is some how better value for money, as many times they are anything but.

I understand this. For example, a Breitling Emergency 18K gold version that weighs a tonne, still only has probably at most £5000 scrap value. This is probably relative to the cost of a steel version which costs much less. However to me, at least it has some kind of value for money somewhere in there with a precious metal.

Anyway, I'll leave this one now as PP always throws up arguments of some sorts in regards to cost. In this case, I probably started it lol.

[Mark020]

Do I really need to answer that when the values of the metals are on a completely different level?

Yes because the value of the gold might be 2k.

[Philip]

That sort of thing. Anything else is a touch tedious.

Amen.

[jrpippen]

Its a diving watch without a timing device.

Useless.

Stunning though.

[kaiserphoenix]

Its a diving watch without a timing device.

Useless.

Stunning though.

Is it actually a "Diving" watch? I thought it was a "Stainless Steel Sports Watch" just like the RO was pitched at?

[Andyg]

Yes that's the one. BTW they all have 22ct gold rotors.
.

Franck Muller use platinum Rotors, which (i am told) are less senstive to temperature changes and are more hard wearing)

Andy

[Andyg]

Interesting thread this. I have been looking at PP's recently and have come to a few of conclusions.

1) They wear a bit small, so I would need a Jumbo before I could consider it.

2) The servicing costs are eye watering.

3) There is no real point buying a PP unless it has a complication (Power reserve and date are not a real complication in my book).

4) If it has a complication then I cannot really afford it without selling a shed load of watches.

5) Whilst they are fanstatic pieces of engineering, what are you paying for. A state of the art highly complicated COSC movements (nope), the hand fact they are hand made (well most Swiss manufacturers claim this), or the fact that someone has spent a lot of time and money (yours ) polishing the crap out of of the movement components - in which case good , but is it worth the premium?

So my conclusion is that a PP really is the Rolls Royce of the watch world,, but of little real value to me as I want a garage full of Porsche, Ferrari and Astons.

Nope I shall be sticking with my dozen or some boring vintage Rolex, Blancpain, Panerai and JLC for the time being, but no doubt will re-consider it when I am old (currently only 52).

Andy

[kaiserphoenix]

Small is fine with me as my wrist is like 6" so perfect. I find the simplicity of the 5711 amazing, my first watch was a rolex explorer I when I was 21 and it didnt even have a date. The result was that it just kinda blended in, but I never got bored with it. I wore it for 10 years and now is in service.

I am hoping the Patek will be that kind of watch, something I can wear daily, with 120m water resistance, its superior to the 50m of the RO and with a stainless steel body, should be reasonably tough (ill still baby it tho).

[744ER]

I understand this. For example, a Breitling Emergency 18K gold version that weighs a tonne, still only has probably at most £5000 scrap value. This is probably relative to the cost of a steel version which costs much less. However to me, at least it has some kind of value for money somewhere in there with a precious metal.

Anyway, I'll leave this one now as PP always throws up arguments of some sorts in regards to cost. In this case, I probably started it lol.

FWIW i agree with you fully. This kind of dough for stainless steel is crazy, no matter what the movement... and where will it stop, will they increase prices until it retails at £100000? If the market for these should suddenly sway and lose a bit of interest, values could go down rather sharply.

At least with the gold watches you get the intrinsic value of the material, plus the relative discounts available are huge compared to steel. Still not cheap, mind... :)

[Malcolm68]

Small is fine with me as my wrist is like 6" so perfect. I find the simplicity of the 5711 amazing, my first watch was a rolex explorer I when I was 21 and it didnt even have a date. The result was that it just kinda blended in, but I never got bored with it. I wore it for 10 years and now is in service.

I am hoping the Patek will be that kind of watch, something I can wear daily, with 120m water resistance, its superior to the 50m of the RO and with a stainless steel body, should be reasonably tough (ill still baby it tho).

I've had a 5712 for about 6-7 years and when I first owned it, it was hardly ever off my wrist so yes, it can be quite easily used as an everyday watch. Very comfy and very light. In fact, when I first got my paws on one, it didn't feel right, it just felt too light.

If you have the chance, I'd definitely get it. It's also probably my only Patek that my wife likes.

Malc

[markosgr28]

I certainly don't own one, but have seen a couple of times and have tried a Patek Nautilus once in the past. I really love these models! Their looks and their quality.

[robcat]

Will you go with the new WHITE dial or the standard blue one?

They had a white dial one in WOS Manchester before Xmas - it did look very nice, far more 3D and dynamic than photo's depict, and this was just through the window! I would still go blue dial though - it's classic.

[baronetto]

Have to say I really love the Nautilus. A client I speak to wears it as his daily watch and I always admire with great envy. However, given the choice and price difference I'd opt for the Aquanaut which has, if you find the correct model, the same 324c calibre. Personally I prefer the look of the dial but the bracelet certainly isn't as nice.

Good luck with the watch hunt.

[proby24]

I have a 5711 Nautilus and it is a great watch. But I have to admit, I prefer my far cheaper Aquanaut (5165 rubber strap).

[33JS]

Annoying thing is to buy a Nautilus, I have to be on a waiting list....

Nah, they are all available instantly if you call around. I was looking seriously at them and could get any model of SS Nautilus quickly, but spread about the country. The AP's can be had for a good discount though, if that changes your mind...

I just didn't get on with the Nautilus and bought an AP Diver on a bracelet instead.

[kaiserphoenix]

Nah, they are all available instantly if you call around. I was looking seriously at them and could get any model of SS Nautilus quickly, but spread about the country. The AP's can be had for a good discount though, if that changes your mind...

I just didn't get on with the Nautilus and bought an AP Diver on a bracelet instead.

The AP can be had with a discount which is true BUT that means resale values also suffer. One thing I learnt over the years, buying goods is that items that rarely gets discounted, such as Louis Vuitton, Rolex, Patek, these things hold their value, precisely because they don't discount and you wont find them in outlets etc (ofcourse many other reasons as well).

I will call a couple of ADs, the Patek Salon on Bond Street unfortunately had a waiting list but I may try M&W etc.

[puffy]

the 5167 is great too

[kaiserphoenix]

WOW, thanks for the shots!! man that blue dial is stunning, was slightly contemplating the white possibly but now im 100% sold. What a stunning watch.

[puffy]

WOW, thanks for the shots!! man that blue dial is stunning, was slightly contemplating the white possibly but now im 100% sold. What a stunning watch.

no worries

don't buy the white, the dial looks like a garage door

http://www.henderson-garage-door-cen...el-horizol.jpg

[kaiserphoenix]

hahahahahahahahaha

[puffy]

hahahahahahahahaha

you also need to think of the resell value of the white

they're not exactly fast sellers and you can buy them all day long for less than the blue

[kaiserphoenix]

you also need to think of the resell value of the white

they're not exactly fast sellers and you can buy them all day long for less than the blue

Yeah, definately getting the blue. Resale value is definately a consideration even though I probably wont sell it, but knowing I could and not lose a bomb is nice.

- - - Updated - - -

have you had yours serviced yet? Howe much is servicing? Is it pretty much along the lines of what Patek lists on their website? 800 swiss frances or something for the standard maintenance?

[robcat]

Lovely watch. Those shots really show off the dial to it's best. The 5167 is one hell of a watch as well.

[puffy]

Lovely watch. Those shots really show off the dial to it's best. The 5167 is one hell of a watch as well.

the 5711's dial is one of the best, it's grey, black, blue, purple, green... list goes one... it's amazing

a few more showing off the colours... you don't get that with the white.. it's just.. white..

[kaiserphoenix]

Ok contacted a few ADs, can get a Vacuum wrapped one for around March! should I pull the trigger.....In Japan there is a 10% PP price increase too in Feb not sure about the UK, havnt heard any yet but most likely there will be soon I assume...

Should I go for it? I currently have no SS sport/dress watch in my collection, can definately use one on rainy days haha

[robcat]

Ok contacted a few ADs, can get a Vacuum wrapped one for around March! should I pull the trigger.....In Japan there is a 10% PP price increase too in Feb not sure about the UK, havnt heard any yet but most likely there will be soon I assume...

Should I go for it? I currently have no SS sport/dress watch in my collection, can definately use one on rainy days haha

Do you really need to ask??

The Naut is arguably the ultimate steel sport/dressy hybrid, and it would compliment the JLC very nicely.

[puffy]

Ok contacted a few ADs, can get a Vacuum wrapped one for around March! should I pull the trigger.....In Japan there is a 10% PP price increase too in Feb not sure about the UK, havnt heard any yet but most likely there will be soon I assume...

Should I go for it? I currently have no SS sport/dress watch in my collection, can definately use one on rainy days haha

i would post a wtb and see what is out there. a nice pre loved 5711 should set you back £15,500 - 16,500

i've heard there's a global increase taking place soon... not sure when or by how much. it's been ages since PP increaed their prices so increase due

[kaiserphoenix]

i would post a wtb and see what is out there. a nice pre loved 5711 should set you back £15,500 - 16,500

i've heard there's a global increase taking place soon... not sure when or by how much. it's been ages since PP increaed their prices so increase due

Yeah thats what I thought...and typically it goes up by 10%...thats another 1800 GBP if it does happen, probably the price of a service...I will try it again today later and then decide!! was going for the AP 15202 but might have to go for the PP now! I sold 70% of my collection to fund this lol

[markrlondon]

Should I go for it?

Got the money? Like the watch? If yes to both then of course you should got for it. :-)

[robcat]

Yeah thats what I thought...and typically it goes up by 10%...thats another 1800 GBP if it does happen, probably the price of a service...I will try it again today later and then decide!! was going for the AP 15202 but might have to go for the PP now! I sold 70% of my collection to fund this lol

Funnily enough, you seem to have made the classic quality vs quantity play - it will be interesting to see how that goes. (I personally would much rather have the Naut over the 15202).

[farmkid]

The Nautilus is pure class....it's not the sort of watch you see disco kids wearing-
so if you can afford one just get it ordered now.......
It may be worth dropping Pragnell an email- they sometimes have a short wait time compared to London AD's.
http://www.pragnell.co.uk/products/w.../nautilus.aspx

I would have bought one ages ago but sadly they look too small and puny on my wrist.....I wish they did a 44mm Nautilus.