Citizen Chronomaster

I'm looking an HQ quartz , have a decent budget , and the Citizen Chronomaster seem very underated .

The A4040-54Y is a special edition with hand made paper dial set under a crystal solar cell.

Versus the Grand Seikos their movements have perpetual calender , independent hour hand ( I know the FS new ones now do ) and accuracy +/- 5 pa ( only SE GS have that ). Plus titanium , Duratect and Ziratsu polishing , basically you get everything Citizen have in their locker.

So you get more for your money. Big downside is resale . A GS 44GS case with Ziratsu is sellable , for decent money, plus servicing and battery changes ( if your ever need it ) easier and cheaper.

But that kind of makes the Chronomaster more desirable, is a special purchase that the buyer would really appreciate .

Will have a think, what are your thoughts?

Some web pics. The paper dial is astonishing https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...71bb5a6735.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...9557560640.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...68b2d5279a.jpg

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daveya.

I'm looking an HQ quartz , have a decent budget , and the Citizen Chronomaster seem very underated .

The A4040-54Y is a special edition with hand made paper dial set under a crystal solar cell.

Versus the Grand Seikos their movements have perpetual calender , independent hour hand ( I know the FS new ones now do ) and accuracy +/- 5 pa ( only SE GS have that ). Plus titanium , Duratect and Ziratsu polishing , basically you get everything Citizen have in their locker.

So you get more for your money. Big downside is resale . A GS 44GS case with Ziratsu is sellable , for decent money, plus servicing and battery changes ( if your ever need it ) easier and cheaper.

But that kind of makes the Chronomaster more desirable, is a special purchase that the buyer would really appreciate .

Will have a think, what are your thoughts?

Some web pics. The paper dial is astonishing https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...71bb5a6735.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...9557560640.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...68b2d5279a.jpg

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My mate has got one of these. Very beautiful (although being titanium, slightly too light for me) and definitely amazing quality. The thing with these is, they are not that popular. Good luck finding one in the UK for good price. Where you can pick up SBGX261 here for under £1.5k in mint condition, good luck finding one of these for less than £2k. I think my mate paid £2.6k altogether after taxes/shipping etc. Oh and apparently servicing this is a little problem, it has to be sent to Japan at your own expense. And apparently Citizen won't send it abroad, so you'd ideally need someone in Japan to receive it and send it back to you (assuming you're in the UK). Don't quote me on that last bit though, it's just something I've heard.

Yeah I'm reading the same. It's a huge decision to buy one, nothing of what you've said I haven't read elsewhere sadly.

That Seiko you mention though is a 37mm and I don't think it's a 44GS case, that's why it's priced as entry level GS ( it's hard is working out which has the 44 case as the GS website isn't clear, some do, some don't) . The lugs are nicer but the 44 case is rather special

The Citizen is a high risk reward purchase and almost certainly has to be a keeper or you are doomed to lose money .



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Whilst my own Chronomaster is not the model you point out above (which is a lovely watch) it really is a beautifully made watch. This one, in Titanium, is smooth, light and extremely comfortable. I picked it up pre-owned here in the UK and I don't think I'll ever move it on simply because of what I state above and the certain "exclusivity" of it on our shores.
I also had a white faced stainless version which although I liked, I didn't like it quite as much.
I've owned around 12 Grand Seiko pieces (still have 4) in the last 8 yrs or so, of which at least 6 were HAQ models so I can attest to the Citizen Chronomaster quality and finish, personally.

The GS with SBGV in the title are I think all 44GS cases.

https://a4.pbase.com/o10/10/573910/1...203_111625.jpg

https://a4.pbase.com/o9/10/573910/1/...8ilrT.Cit9.jpg

https://a4.pbase.com/o9/10/573910/1/...XHxnG.cit1.jpg

https://a4.pbase.com/o9/10/573910/1/...6lRzP.cit5.jpg

That's lovely Reggie.

The latest 9F finally has an independent hour hand but only the special editions over 3k are adjusted to the same level of accuracy and the Chronomaster.

Head says get a GS, loads of choice, loads available second hand in the UK and cheap to service.

Heart says the Chronomaster. Don't know why, just the specialness of it pulls the string .

I also want to wear it on a croc and I think the Chronomaster would look nicer on one

Hmmmm

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daveya.

Yeah I'm reading the same. It's a huge decision to buy one, nothing of what you've said I haven't read elsewhere sadly.

That Seiko you mention though is a 37mm and I don't think it's a 44GS case, that's why it's priced as entry level GS ( it's hard is working out which has the 44 case as the GS website isn't clear, some do, some don't) . The lugs are nicer but the 44 case is rather special

The Citizen is a high risk reward purchase and almost certainly has to be a keeper or you are doomed to lose money .



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Yes, I think the 44GS are 40mm.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daveya.

That's lovely Reggie.

The latest 9F finally has an independent hour hand but only the special editions over 3k are adjusted to the same level of accuracy and the Chronomaster.

Head says get a GS, loads of choice, loads available second hand in the UK and cheap to service.

Heart says the Chronomaster. Don't know why, just the specialness of it pulls the string .

I also want to wear it on a croc and I think the Chronomaster would look nicer on one

Hmmmm

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Put a WTB up, someone will be along shortly. Maybe not for the white/paper dial but a Chronomaster nevertheless.

Lol already done that

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I have a CTQ57-1202 (A660, black dial, domed crystal, no lume) and it is as well finished as the best GS I have owned.
Its first battery has expired and I am to renew this shortly.
Its a keeper, so residuals are of no concern.
I expect it to remain under the radar for the foreseeable, unlike GS.

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Originally Posted by forpetesake

I have a CTQ57-1202 (A660, black dial, domed crystal, no lume) and it is as well finished as the best GS I have owned.
Its first battery has expired and I am to renew this shortly.
Its a keeper, so residuals are of no concern.
I expect it to remain under the radar for the foreseeable, unlike GS.

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Changing the battery yourself?

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https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/224309813154

Heads up.
The model you want used in London.
Neil

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Originally Posted by Daveya.

Changing the battery yourself?

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That's the plan. SR920SW apparently. Mine has a polished screw back - must find the instruction manual though (bought new). It never gets wet and if I mess up the calender its no big issue because I never use the date window anyhow. The prospect of mailing to Japan is too off-putting.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by neilf1965

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/224309813154

Heads up.
The model you want used in London.
Neil

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Cheers we are already exchanging messages rw the fact he is only using standard post

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It might be a similar styled watch but I am doubtful as to whether the case finishing compares to Grand Seiko. Ownees have said it's not as well finished and the pictures online don't appear to have the same mirror flat finish to the surfaces from sallaz / zaratsu polishing, looks more like run of the mill Pressage than GS.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by AKM

It might be a similar styled watch but I am doubtful as to whether the case finishing compares to Grand Seiko. Ownees have said it's not as well finished and the pictures online don't appear to have the same mirror flat finish to the surfaces from sallaz / zaratsu polishing, looks more like run of the mill Pressage than GS.

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Zaratsu isn't unique to Seiko, its just a polishing style and Citizen do use it.

As for which is better it will be personal preference but you are proving why Seiko resale is higher, you doubt it's not as good so you won't buy it ( despite online reviews suggesting they are very similar )

Thats the downside to the Citizens on the one hand bit also the kind of warm glow an owner gets knowing what they have that very few people appreciate

Don't get me wrong I love the 44GS zaratsu care and it's on my radar v Chronomaster

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That A4040-54Y is stunning. The dial is to my mind more interesting than the famous snowflake, as the indices float above it. I've long admired The Citizens but for my wrists they would simply be too small. It's a shame.

Anyway, Daveya all the best in your search for one.

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Originally Posted by dkpw

That A4040-54Y is stunning. The dial is to my mind more interesting than the famous snowflake, as the indices float above it. I've long admired The Citizens but for my wrists they would simply be too small. It's a shame.

Anyway, Daveya all the best in your search for one.

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Thanks, it's 2500 Inc import taxes

Whereas as someone rightly pointed out , you can easily get a sh GS for way less

Lots to mull over

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daveya.

Zaratsu isn't unique to Seiko, its just a polishing style and Citizen do use it.

As for which is better it will be personal preference but you are proving why Seiko resale is higher, you doubt it's not as good so you won't buy it ( despite online reviews suggesting they are very similar )

Thats the downside to the Citizens on the one hand bit also the kind of warm glow an owner gets knowing what they have that very few people appreciate

Don't get me wrong I love the 44GS zaratsu care and it's on my radar v Chronomaster

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The 44GS inspired case on the Grand Seiko SBGV207 / 007 is thing of beauty in my opinion.

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I agree

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by AKM

It might be a similar styled watch but I am doubtful as to whether the case finishing compares to Grand Seiko. Ownees have said it's not as well finished and the pictures online don't appear to have the same mirror flat finish to the surfaces from sallaz / zaratsu polishing, looks more like run of the mill Pressage than GS.

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I own only 1 Chronomaster against 4 GS watches. The CTQ57-1202 has to my untrained eye and using a loupe, the equivalent quality of finish as my finest GS, the manual winding SBGW001. My Citizen lacks the duratect or similar coating applied to several other Chronomaster models available at the time of my purchasing. But what do I know.

https://youtu.be/d_R0SNt-gOY

Outstanding

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I’m a fan of the Citizen chronomaster, and very clean and understated, with the new logo of GS, this is the be ultimate stealth watch, as it’s JUST a citizen. I also like the brand name Citizen on the dial for some reason, don’t know why, just sounds and looks a bit more cool than Seiko.

If you want BNIB Ocarat in France sells these and 15% off is doable.

That would take this down to 2192 Euros which is £1975. Add 20% Vat and just under £2.4k for a watch with full warranty and BNIB. Plus they will give a free watch winder (LOL this is quartz) which you could sell for £80 or so.

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https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...42e143d089.jpg

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Originally Posted by ryanb741

If you want BNIB Ocarat in France sells these and 15% off is doable.

That would take this down to 2192 Euros which is £1975. Add 20% Vat and just under £2.4k for a watch with full warranty and BNIB. Plus they will give a free watch winder (LOL this is quartz) which you could sell for £80 or so.

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https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...42e143d089.jpg

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Yep, they do them, you can get 10% off with first purchase, is it worth emailing for more?

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Originally Posted by Daveya.

Yep, they do them, you can get 10% off with first purchase, is it worth emailing for more?

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Yeah they will give me more as I bought a few things before (ZRC Grands Fonds plus a couple Seikos) there plus also you get a % of whatever you buy as store credit to be used against future purchases.

Email them as I doubt they are selling loads of these

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Cheers

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by ryanb741

Yeah they will give me more as I bought a few things before (ZRC Grands Fonds plus a couple Seikos) there plus also you get a % of whatever you buy as store credit to be used against future purchases.

Email them as I doubt they are selling loads of these

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What are import duties from France now?

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Originally Posted by Daveya.

What are import duties from France now?

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Will be 20% VAT. No duties. BTW the model you want is the Washi dial one I believe which they have at 2500 euros not 2300 (I linked to the wrong model)

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Originally Posted by ryanb741

Will be 20% VAT. No duties. BTW the model you want is the Washi dial one I believe which they have at 2500 euros not 2300 (I linked to the wrong model)

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There are 2 models, the latest has lume and screw down crown, is slightly thicker, it's AQ4030, the older model is AQ4020

20% vat and delivery it's £2520 after their 10% of, which is cheapest anywhere, so I've emailed see if they can go cheaper

Thanks for the help

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You can't get the free watch winder and the 10% off shame

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daveya.

There are 2 models, the latest has lume and screw down crown, is slightly thicker, it's AQ4030, the older model is AQ4020

20% vat and delivery it's £2520 after their 10% of, which is cheapest anywhere, so I've emailed see if they can go cheaper

Thanks for the help

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Good luck. If they wont go further for you I can ask if you like as I've spent a few quid with them before and they have typically offered me a bit more off.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by ryanb741

Good luck. If they wont go further for you I can ask if you like as I've spent a few quid with them before and they have typically offered me a bit more off.

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Thanks appreciate it

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by ryanb741

Good luck. If they wont go further for you I can ask if you like as I've spent a few quid with them before and they have typically offered me a bit more off.

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They've chucked another 100 euros off, so now about 14% off but to get that I have to renounce my loyalty points

Tbh the whole Japanese warranty thing is putting me off. You have only 1 year outside of Japan and to get the 10 years you have to register on a Japanese language site and even then use an intermediary. Higuchi have apparently been happy to act as intermediaries according to WUS so buying from a Japanese supplier may be the best approach.

But as much as these paper dialed Citizens are buzzing my bells, the hassle and cost is pushing me back to GS

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by forpetesake

That's the plan. SR920SW apparently. Mine has a polished screw back - must find the instruction manual though (bought new). It never gets wet and if I mess up the calender its no big issue because I never use the date window anyhow. The prospect of mailing to Japan is too off-putting.

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When I had a Citizen I sent it back via Higuchi for a 5 year service and new battery, which there was no charge for.
However, I got stung with import duties as HMRC wouldn't believe it had just been returned from a service!

I’m so pleased you posted this daveya. The paper dial is stunning and the whole under the covers Citizen thing, is a big draw.

However, it all seems just too much hassle. Which is a massive shame.

I’ve been looking at the HAQ world recently and after hovering over a number of cheaper options, I’ve decided I may as well save for something high-end. In an ideal world, the Citizen would indeed be ideal. We’re not in that mythical world though, so back to sticking the pennies in the GS fund. Which, to be fair, is hardly a dreadful thing.

Good luck with whatever you decide.


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Originally Posted by NCC66

I’m so pleased you posted this daveya. The paper dial is stunning and the whole under the covers Citizen thing, is a big draw.

However, it all seems just too much hassle. Which is a massive shame.

I’ve been looking at the HAQ world recently and after hovering over a number of cheaper options, I’ve decided I may as well save for something high-end. In an ideal world, the Citizen would indeed be ideal. We’re not in that mythical world though, so back to sticking the pennies in the GS fund. Which, to be fair, is hardly a dreadful thing.

Good luck with whatever you decide.


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Yes it's a shame. It's really a watch for the Japanese market only, just makes it a very difficult decision over here.

They are simply stunning watches but at that money, double what an HAQ GS can be bought of SC, it's probably a stretch too far

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Ref the accuracy of Seiko's 9F movement, I've owned an SBGA063 for a few years now and whilst I haven't timed it recently I noted it was no more than a couple of seconds out between the clocks changing a couple of years back. That's the 'standard' 9F, not a movement inside one of the models with a star on the dial.

My Spring Drive is the same, both are running extremely comfortably within spec and I get the impression that GS under sell how accurate their quartz regulated movements actually are.

Yes and online you'll get people having a whinge about GS and Citizen quartz not being as accurate as they claim but they are almost all not being worn

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daveya.

Yes and online you'll get people having a whinge about GS and Citizen quartz not being as accurate as they claim but they are almost all not being worn

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My 9F is currently at -0.0s after 79 days.


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Originally Posted by Stanford

When I had a Citizen I sent it back via Higuchi for a 5 year service and new battery, which there was no charge for.
However, I got stung with import duties as HMRC wouldn't believe it had just been returned from a service!

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Blimey!

During my fast and furious buying years, once my mind was made up I wouldn't be swayed from buying. Somehow, naysayers only served to sharpen my interest. I like watches but find all varieties of luxury branding most unattractive and perversely, this seems to define my taste. At present, I haven't got the stomach for high value mailing.

That's what's put me off the Chronomaster

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I have the 4030 chronomaster its a solar so i dont see a problem with sending it back to japan as its quartz and no battery change for 15 years.

If it was battery powered or a mechanical i could understand that thought process.

re the paper dial:

I was a little disappointed with it as the citizen and chronomaster lettering seemed to have a rectangle ofclear sellotape underneath which you can see thus killing the floating imagery.

If they had cropped the sellotape to the shape of the letters it would of worked IMO

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trott3r

re the paper dial:

I was a little disappointed with it as the citizen and chronomaster lettering seemed to have a rectangle ofclear sellotape underneath which you can see thus killing the floating imagery.

If they had cropped the sellotape to the shape of the letters it would of worked IMO

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That's the one with lime, screw down crown and dome sapphire right?

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daveya.

That's the one with lime, screw down crown and dome sapphire right?

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Yes that is the one

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trott3r

Yes that is the one

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Lol at lime

Anyway, that's a belter

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