Buying a dog

[Zolawinston]

Hi all, I'd appreciate your thoughts on this please.

Now that the kids have grown up a bit (7 and 10) my wife and I are considering getting a dog, we've had dogs before and have a particular affection for Bulldogs. Our dilemma is, do we get a pup from a breeder or do we get an older dog (between 6 and 12 months) in need of re-homing? The later appeals but with the kids can we really trust a dog with what will be a bit of an unknown history?

We'd obviously do as many checks and use our common sense before deciding on any dog, especially an older one, but I'd really like your thoughts if possible as I know we have a lot of dog lovers on the forum

Thanks

[ach5]

I have to say, having a pupper right from 8 weeks old is a fantastic experience and you really bond *however* there's so many beautiful rescue dogs out there and it's heartbreaking to see them.

Depends what you want - if you want a strong, robust larger dog to work or go on long walks - rescue.

If you want a pretty handbag dog (nothing wrong with that - I have one!) then pedigree pup from a breeder.

But as a newly converted dog lover, I'd get rescues in the future.

- - - Updated - - -

PS don't underestimate the sharpness of the needle teeth of puppers - it can make the first few months of play a somewhat painful and frustrating experience!

[ach5]

The other thing is that pure breed pedigree dogs (again like mine) can be a nightmare of genetic problems even from really good breeders - "mongrels" tend to be far more hardy and healthy.

If going with a breeder just ensure they're kennel club registered.

[Saint-Just]

The other thing is that pure breed pedigree dogs (again like mine) can be a nightmare of genetic problems even from really good breeders - "mongrels" tend to be far more hardy and healthy.

If going with a breeder just ensure they're kennel club registered.

Especially with bulldogs...

[seikopath]

if its a particular breed you want, get in touch with the club for that breed. each club will have a rescue section. they will know the dogs history and also be able to give any advice.

[ach5]

PS I started a similar thread and got excellent responses back in October 2014 but I can't for the life of me find it, and "dog" is too short a search term for the forum search to work. It was in G&D if anyone can work their search magic?

[Neil.C]

The other thing is that pure breed pedigree dogs (again like mine) can be a nightmare of genetic problems even from really good breeders - "mongrels" tend to be far more hardy and healthy.

If going with a breeder just ensure they're kennel club registered.

Especially with bulldogs...

Yep, personally I'd stay away from Bulldogs.

They are just a caricature of how they started out and with enormous health problems. With their gigantic heads they have to be born by cesarean section.

My sister has had a couple, they don't live that long either.

Probably best to decide if you want a dog to accompany you on long walks, a lap dog or something in between.

There will definitely be a breed that will suit although certain breeds will be more more disposed to hereditary ailments than others, but you can easily research that.

[mtagrant]

PS I started a similar thread and got excellent responses back in October 2014 but I can't for the life of me find it, and "dog" is too short a search term for the forum search to work. It was in G&D if anyone can work their search magic?

Here you go
http://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.ph...14#post3247514

[GC2012]

We purchased a King Charles Spaniel puppy in February to keep our older King charles company. The older dog (Toby) came from a rescue shelter in Spain when I was working over there about 3 years ago now. He is the best behaved dog I have ever had and he is unbelievably loyal to me however my girlfriend wanted a pup.
We searched all the usual online classifieds and finally chose one in Bradford (about 2 hours from where we live), the breeder showed us all his HMRC paperwork & he was registered with Bradford council so we had no reason to doubt him, he seemed really genuine. The one problem was we never seen the parents, apparently he was selling these for a friend, he showed us various photos of the pups with the mam etc however my girlfriend had her heart set on one and that was it.

The following weeks we had horrendous problems, he was not putting on weight, there was blood in his poo for weeks and he was going 5-8 times per day (diarrhea 90% of the time). About £300 in vet bills later he only just sorted out, turned out he was riddled with worms which took a high dose to clear, another infection (forgot the name) and a couple of other minor problems.

Moral of the story is go to a recognised breeder and save your self the hassle. It came to light about 6 weeks ago on a King Charles page that the 'breeder' we bought from actually buys litters from puppy farms in Wales for half the price, brings them to Bradford, cleans them and makes up a story about the mam to sell on for double.
He had scammed other people on the forum with fantasy stories and he is still on Pets4homes website with another litter, he has been reported to RSPCA, Bradford council etc but no stopping him yet. He is also a notorious 'breeder' of Basset hounds.


Anyway, enough of that. Here is Toby and the puppy Reggie, best of mates now!



gif upload

[Neil.C]

Although rescues can be really worthwhile I would counsel you to be sure what you are taking on if thinking along these lines.

I have known a couple of people who took on rescues only to find out why they were rehomed in the first place!

A novice dog owner could be completely overwhelmed by such a dog.

Many of the well trained rescues i.e from older folk who cannot now manage them tend to be getting on in years which can lead to expensive insurance and large vet bills.

[Zolawinston]

Hi all, thanks for the responses so far and to be absolutely clear.

We will only get a pure bred bulldog, that's a done deal. We have our name down on the main bulldog register for rescue dogs for a number of months but given the cost and relative rarity of the breed its proving to be fruitless. You can however find 'adult' bulldogs for sale on a number of 'gumtree' type sites which breeders also advertise on and these are the dogs we are considering along with pups. Sorry for not being clearer initially.

Thanks

[Steve27752]

Don't do it, we have a dog and it is the worst thing we ever did (wife and kids idea).........They tie you down and are a burden for 12-15 years, I would never get another one.

[thieuster]

When choosing a dog with for a family life, it is good to consider the age of your children - they are still relatively young, your housing situation and the time you'll be able to spend on the dog. In short: it is like having a third child that will never out-grow his toddler age, no matter the intelligence of the dog.

Not all dogs are suited for a family with younger children; very large or strong dogs can be a menace. Other dogs, despite the owners' good intentions can be a handful to raise and to make sure they will be obedient (thinking along the lines of a Bull Terrier: some are the most adorable dogs ever, others need a daily reminder that they are not in charge of the pack!)

Housing situation: where do you live? Is there enough space for a bench? Not for the house-training period, but for years to come. You can learn kids and the dog that the bench is the dog's domain: when it is in the bench, it shouldn't be disturbed - even with the door open. Ideally, a bench needs to be situated in a pantry or hall.

Housing situation II: how difficult / easy is it to take the dog for a proper walk? Walking the streets is nice, but free open space can be so much more fun for a dog! A properly 'walked' dog is a happy dog!

That's connected with the time you can spend on the dog. Despite the fact that children promise to walk the dog every day, it's you who's going for the daily walk, evening walk and early morning walk. For 12 yrs in a row. No matter the weather.

Personally I would opt for an easy to train dog with a history of family life in the bloodline. Labradors etc. And get it spade/neutered. It makes life so much easier for you and the dog.

Finally: looking at a Dutch website for dog shelter-dogs, it's clear that most dogs in a shelter are a terrier-type dog. Which is rather sad. After raising a Rottweiler when I was a young lad and -when I met my wife- taking care of her Bull Terrier, I think I have enough experience with the more 'difficult' dogs. But I wouldn't try that route with small children in the house.

[Zolawinston]

When choosing a dog with for a family life, it is good to consider the age of your children - they are still relatively young, your housing situation and the time you'll be able to spend on the dog. In short: it is like having a third child that will never out-grow his toddler age, no matter the intelligence of the dog.

Not all dogs are suited for a family with younger children; very large or strong dogs can be a menace. Other dogs, despite the owners' good intentions can be a handful to raise and to make sure they will be obedient (thinking along the lines of a Bull Terrier: some are the most adorable dogs ever, others need a daily reminder that they are not in charge of the pack!)

Housing situation: where do you live? Is there enough space for a bench? Not for the house-training period, but for years to come. You can learn kids and the dog that the bench is the dog's domain: when it is in the bench, it shouldn't be disturbed - even with the door open. Ideally, a bench needs to be situated in a pantry or hall.

Housing situation II: how difficult / easy is it to take the dog for a proper walk? Walking the streets is nice, but free open space can be so much more fun for a dog! A properly 'walked' dog is a happy dog!

That's connected with the time you can spend on the dog. Despite the fact that children promise to walk the dog every day, it's you who's going for the daily walk, evening walk and early morning walk. For 12 yrs in a row. No matter the weather.

Personally I would opt for an easy to train dog with a history of family life in the bloodline. Labradors etc. And get it spade/neutered. It makes life so much easier for you and the dog.

Finally: looking at a Dutch website for dog shelter-dogs, it's clear that most dogs in a shelter are a terrier-type dog. Which is rather sad. After raising a Rottweiler when I was a young lad and -when I met my wife- taking care of her Bull Terrier, I think I have enough experience with the more 'difficult' dogs. But I wouldn't try that route with small children in the house.

Thank you, proper food for thought. We live in a very rural area and walk a lot, this is the main reason for wanting one as walks are so much better with a dog! Our local is very dog friendly, we love an early evening pint and when we've looked after friends dogs its been wonderful having a long walk and a few pints with the dog and kids in toe.

[ach5]

Here you go
http://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.ph...14#post3247514

Brill (for future refernece, what search term did you use?)

[100thmonkey]

Research the breed and make sure it is a true fit for your lifestyle and has the characteristics you love and make sure you read the first few chapters of The Dog Listener By Jan Fennel

[Chinnock]

As previously stated above, I would strongly avoid a Bulldog. Not the best of breeds, very expensive to purchase and numerous health problems. Not great for long walks either.

Definitely do your homework and be sure you have the time / energy / lifestyle etc required for the type of dog you prefer.

Always had pups myself as I love the whole bonding process and training from an early age. With your children I would have thought a puppy would be a great choice as they are old enough to get involved in its development and discipline. Magical process in my book.

[JonRA]

I met a couple walking a 'bulldog-like' dog earlier this week - it looked like a bulldog but with a longer (not long) snout. When I asked about it, it was a bulldog and apparently some breeders are starting to breed them more responsibly (the very short snout is responsible for breathing problems). Also, a friend lost her pedigree bulldog aged 5 earlier in the year - it was never very healthy and when out walking it slowly pottered behind my friend panting heavily. Needless to say, she was devastated when he died.

I know others have said it, but I would think very carefully before buying a bulldog. I wouldn't.

We bought a staffie labrador cross - she loves people and dogs. We adore her even though she is an excitable, wilful and very strong handful!

If, however, we bought another dog I think a working cocker spaniel or cockerpoo would be high up on our list - they are lively, trainable and a good size for long walks and not too strong if they pull on their lead.

Whatever you decide, I hope you have many years of joy from your new family member :)

[walkerwek1958]

Over tha past couple of years I've become a part-time dog keeper, looking after stepdaughter's labrador (Ozzie). He's currently living with us for a couple of weeks whilst they do up their newly purchesed house.

Much as we love the dog there are pros and cons to having him around. Doghairs and dirty paws are constant issue, you end up not being as house-proud and fussy, and when you take them out on wet days you get the lovely aroma of wet dog. They are definitely tying, we're suposed to be out all day Sunday but we'll end up cutting our trip short to get home for the beast.

I' d definitely go for a puppy, and train it well. A poorly trained dog that won't behave is no joy.

Paul

[draftsmann]

I would never keep a single dog. Ideal number is 2-3. Currently I keep 4, of which 3 are rescue dogs. The oldest is now 15 so I won't have him much longer and when he goes I will stick with 3.

[Kiki Picasso]

No contribution to this post, other than to say, hurry up and get a Dog, and post a pic on the 'show us your Dog' thread.

I love that thread.

[mtagrant]

Brill (for future refernece, what search term did you use?)

Just looked at your profile and the link to the threads you had started around that time

[Wolfie]

Having dogs completes our family…. The boys walk with us, regularly come on holiday with us and are generally lovely to have about

We really looked hard into breeds that would suit is ans our family…. The fact they looked cute was a bonus !!!

[itsgotournameonit]

Just had the same experience.Both my partner and I have both had dogs before.With me working full time and her having a boy 9 and a girl 7 we decided against a puppy.After 2 months of searching we found "Bella" by chance in the end on facebook.

A 9 month old rescue Chocolate Labrador.We had a 9 hour return journey to meet her and obviously took the kids with us to make sure they would bond.Had her now for 2 weeks.I think for me at this age she is already "House" trained and will react to basic commands.At her age we can still train her to a higher level.

She pulls a bit on the lead but we can sort that out with some training.

One down side that with a rescue is that you may be told about previous vaccinations,worming, etc etc but we have found it hard work getting the evidence.The upside is that from rescue you can get the right dog for less money.


"Bella"

[awright101]

We went for a pup and it's been the best experience of our lives. The benefits out weigh the cons for us (tie, mess etc)

[Mulligrub]

We have a rescue Yorkshire terrier had him for 18 months now, he was 10 earlier this month. Had a few issues when we first got him with separation anxiety.
We wouldn't be without him, it's good to re-home a dog to give them a second chance. Dogs get you out in all weathers and keep you fit, and you meet some nice people along the way.

[seikopath]

Buying a pedigree from a site like gumtree?
I wouldn't go about it like that
If I was set on getting a good pedigree then i'd take the time to do my research. I'd start by going to visit local breeders and then go to some shows, talk to a few breeders there (they love talking about their dogs) and take it from there.
Once you're in the loop you'll get a good idea of who it would be good to buy from and you can get your name down for a puppy in a litter.
Personally I wouldn't buy a pedigree for many many many different reasons.

[RobDad]

We've been thinking of getting a dog for a few years now, my youngest is 14 and has Down's syndrome and loves to cuddle anyone and anything, so we'd need something fairly robust. We now live somewhere with plenty of space, and I started researching different breeds etc - looked into insurance, asked people about their dogs when we were out and about. To cut a long story short, the whole process seemed fraught with issues and potentially huge insurance costs. But I think the biggest barrier is my wife and I just don't 'get' the dog thing. I consider myself a nature lover, but when I look at a dog I just don't feel any more connection than looking at a cow or a pigeon. Dogs generally seem to like me, lots of wagging tails and I have no fear of them - I'm just totally ambivalent towards them, as is my wife. So no dogs for us, or am I missing something? - genuine question, sometimes difficult to admit in a nation of dog lovers!


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[seikopath]

Having a dog is great Rob, some people love it and some people, it's just not their thing.

It's a big change in lifestyle though. To think of it along the lines of having another kid isn't too far off or as ridiculous as it sounds. In my view, it's a similar sort of commitment.

Edit : just to add, dogs and kids go together very well. Insurance doesn't have to cost as much as you think. Anyone that gets a dog, get it insured, that's my advice. Young dogs are alot cheaper to insure than older ones with existing conditions etc.

[itsgotournameonit]

^^If you don't connect with dogs then to be honest you probably never will ^^


I can't connect with pigeons and have therefore never owned one.

Sorry Dave got in the way .

[RobDad]

Having a dog is great Rob, some people love it and some people, it's just not their thing.

It's a big change in lifestyle though. To think of it along the lines of having another kid isn't too far off or as ridiculous as it sounds. In my view, it's a similar sort of commitment.

Edit : just to add, dogs and kids go together very well. Insurance doesn't have to cost as much as you think. Anyone that gets a dog, get it insured, that's my advice. Young dogs are alot cheaper to insure than older ones with existing conditions etc.

That's probably what scares me tbh Dave. When my youngest was diagnosed with Down's I had no idea how much hard work it would add to being a parent! Actually he's great fun - still knocks me off my feet with a hug every time I come in the front door, still wants a bedtime story every night, and laughs his head off from dawn to dusk - but I'm not sure I've got the energy to cope with a dog too!



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[seikopath]

That's probably what scares me tbh Dave. When my youngest was diagnosed with Down's I had no idea how much hard work it would add to being a parent! Actually he's great fun - still knocks me off my feet with a hug every time I come in the front door, still wants a bedtime story every night, and laughs his head off from dawn to dusk - but I'm not sure I've got the energy to cope with a dog too!



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90% of owners don't walk their dogs enough. Why don't you find someone near you who's dog needs walking? Owner will probably be very grateful, you'll make the dog happy too, and by spending some time with mutts you can all get a better idea if you want to go down the route

Ps I think a black LaB would really suit you!

[Gurmot]

Ps I think a black LaB would really suit you!

Exactly what I was thinking. We lost our black lab Elsa last year. We had her as a rescue when she was 2 years old and we were her third owners (poor thing). She proved to be the most loyal, placid and easy to train dog I have known and everyone's best friend.

We are not ready for another dog just yet but I would highly recommend a black lab for anyone with a family.

Oh, and a good puppy trainer is priceless. There are a few points, mostly based on dog psychology and pack mentality that really helped us and the dog (e.g. Not allowing them to eat before your mealtime, not letting them go through a door before you, not allowing them on the furniture, etc - all help the dog know its place in the pack).

[Neil.C]

Don't do it, we have a dog and it is the worst thing we ever did (wife and kids idea).........They tie you down and are a burden for 12-15 years, I would never get another one.

It's a wonder you ever had any children.

[geoffcotton]

I would buy a cat instead. Don't need walks and won't eat your shoes and slippers.

[verv]

It's a wonder you ever had any children.

Or a wife ;)

They are a big responsibility and you have to put them first. But so so worth it.

[Steve27752]

It's a wonder you ever had any children.

I love my wife and children, just not a pet person. I walk it and clear up after it and would not harm it. But it's not for me......................It incase you are wondering is a four year old Chocolate Brown Lab.

[Rodder]

It's a wonder you ever had any children.

It's a good comment though. I see so many families buy dogs on a whim now. They're busy working parents with kids and decide to get a dog. And then everyone starts to suffer, especially the dog.

If you make a sensible decision they're great.

I'd never get a Bulldog though. Too many problems.

[Mr.D]

Having a dog is really like having another kid in the house. They are totally dependent on you and you have a responsability to take care of it properly and give it a good life. If you have any doubts on that don't get a dog.

When I was about 8 years old my parents got us a golden retriever. He was great and part of the family. However my parents made me and my brother take care of him. We had to walk him several times a day regardless of weather and clean up after him. (I don't know many parents who would send a 10 year old out at 9pm at night in a wet Scottish winter to walk a dog these days).

It certainly taught me a thing or two about responsability for someone else. And I have to say both myself and brother looked after that dog dutifully and without cajoling until he passed away in our early twenties. (I fully admit to being at the time embarrasingly devastated at his passing)

When my own kids (one with Down's also) were harassing me for a dog I finally agreed that we'd get one when we moved. After looking at multiple breeds and insisting we only get a small one... we ended up with another golden retriever from a reputable breeder with full pedigree history , hip scores and kennel club registration. Went for a retriever because we needed a totally trustworthy and gentle dog for my daughter with Down's and despite swearing not to get a big dog I kept coming back to a retriever as the safest option which my own childhood dog experiences also reinforced.

We also test drove a friend's retriever beforehand for a week whilst they were holidaying and the kids loved it.

As a pup he grew up with my kids and completely and utterly dotes on them. He'll sit in each of their rooms until they both fall asleep and then return downstairs. This is the only reason he ever ventures upstairs (unless there is a thunderstorm... soft lump) and he always did this behaviour unbidden.

I really enjoy taking him for walks in the mornings in Epping Forest.

However he is a fair amount of work. The kids are sadly useless at taking care of him (despite warnings given and empty assurances before I got him). Forget carpeting downstairs.

Luckily my wife loves him to bits (although she won't admit it and complains that he is forever by her side) and is home all day. My in laws also are very happy to babysit him when required (to the extent he has his own toy collections at both my brother in law and mother in laws houses). And he has a "buddy" golden retriever and the two of them have "sleepovers" at each other's houses whenever its holiday times (much better and cheaper than kennels although having two mad muddy retrievers running through the house is not to be taken lightly).

I feel genuinely happy knowing he's in the house with the children when I'm away a lot. I have great quality time with him keeping me company in the kitchen as I like nothing better than cooking on my days off whilst sneaking glasses of red wine and listening to radio 4.

I heartily recommend getting a dog especially for children from about 8 and up but do not underestimate how much of a responsability and work they are. Also you will be devastated when they go. ( although over the years I've come to the conclusion that getting another dog after a year is the best remedy for that).

[JonRA]

What a great story Mr.D

Thanks further taking the time to share your heartwarming experience

Jon

[redmonaco]

Thank you, proper food for thought. We live in a very rural area and walk a lot, this is the main reason for wanting one as walks are so much better with a dog! Our local is very dog friendly, we love an early evening pint and when we've looked after friends dogs its been wonderful having a long walk and a few pints with the dog and kids in toe.

I think k there are so many dogs more suitable for long walks and kids companions. Id go so far to say that a bulldog sounds unsuitable for your needs

[lawler]

I would get a rescue dog with the amount out there

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[jools]

I love my wife and children, just not a pet person. I walk it and clear up after it and would not harm it. But it's not for me......................It incase you are wondering is a four year old Chocolate Brown Lab.

I bet you'll miss it when it's gone

[Zolawinston]

I think k there are so many dogs more suitable for long walks and kids companions. Id go so far to say that a bulldog sounds unsuitable for your needs

I do agree that there are certainly dogs that will walk for longer and be more athletic but having had Bulldogs in the past I find that you can still walk them for decent distances on all but the very hottest of days. Keeping them in good shape can also address some of the health issues they seem to suffer with.

They have a reputation of being lazy and they certainly can be happy sleeping for long periods, but they can also be equally happy out and about.

We have perhaps been lucky in the past but we've never really had any issues with our Bulldogs and my wife absolutely loves them so its a done deal

[Roth1]

I do agree that there are certainly dogs that will walk for longer and be more athletic but having had Bulldogs in the past I find that you can still walk them for decent distances on all but the very hottest of days. Keeping them in good shape can also address some of the health issues they seem to suffer with.

They have a reputation of being lazy and they certainly can be happy sleeping for long periods, but they can also be equally happy out and about.

We have perhaps been lucky in the past but we've never really had any issues with our Bulldogs and my wife absolutely loves them so its a done deal

Totally agree with this. Have had 3 bulldogs over the years and currently have my fourth. They can be lovely active dogs if they are treated correctly, exercised regularly and not over fed. However, care must be taken with them in hot weather and its better to be safe than sorry if there's a chance of them over heating.
If going for a pedigree dog such as a bulldog then be very diligent with regards to the seller/breeder and be prepared to wait. Also don't take it as an insult if a good breeder interviews you when buying as they will want the best for their dogs. Each one of my bulldogs have been fantastic family pets, and great with both children and other animals.

[Mr.D]

Also don't take it as an insult if a good breeder interviews you when buying as they will want the best for their dogs.

Yes ...mine wanted updates and photos for the first two years every Christmas. Eventually I started to resent the long distance judgement as a capable dog owner and stopped sending updates. With hindsight though its no bad thing.