Reply With QuoteMy first thought when reading was £3 a day is very good, esp for electric.
What’s that, about 10kwh…. So around 5 heaters on 2 hrs a day
I have no actual experience but nearly went for electric skirting board heating before I went for wet ufh.
We have an 800sq ft terrace which only has an electricity supply. I'm trying to work out how best to heat it. This isn't necessarily just about the cheapest option as I shall need some remote access and controllability. It's not occupied all the time so we need background heat through the winter and the ability to crank it up for when we use it.
Currently heating is slightly random. We have a couple of very old storage heaters that were already there on a e7 tariff, a wifi electric oil towel rail, a small oil radiator and 2 woodburners.
Initially I thought I'd remove the storage heaters and replace with new wifi electric radiators, rointe or the like. These clearly are not the cheapest option but allow us the control we would like. I see we can get new HHR storage heaters some of which have remote control or we could go the whole hog and look at ASHP but this will mean plumbing the whole house for CH which is perhaps more than we had planned just yet.
This winter we are spending about £3 a day which includes a couple of weekends use a month. Now we may be able to reduce that through trial and error with background heat levels but this has the rad stats set at 14 degrees when we aren't there for 12 hours a day, evenings and mornings. When we are there it covers eveything, showers, cooking heating etc.
We aren't actually using a e7 tariff currently.
Next door have GCH so the supply is there but would be a more major undertaking and cost.
What do others do who only have electric options for power and heating?
My first thought when reading was £3 a day is very good, esp for electric.
What’s that, about 10kwh…. So around 5 heaters on 2 hrs a day
I have no actual experience but nearly went for electric skirting board heating before I went for wet ufh.
I changed my daughters NSHeaters for Dimplex ceramic with Wi-Fi control.She seems happy with the change,not sure what she pays tho.The two HS heaters and emersion was 180.00 a month two years back.
A friend of mine sells traditional cast iron rads, converted for electric. They are not remote programmable AFAIK, but you could just use a wifi enabled adaptor plug I imagine
He appears to be selling quite a lot of them
electricast.com
Air to Air Heat Pump ( air con) is possibly the least disruptive and would be the most economical to run
Find out what electricity tariff you are on/can use. The older tariffs were the best.
Update the storage radiators and include remote control. The new ones are far more sophisticated and controllable than those of old.
Air/air heat pump will in all probability (in a small property with small garden) - make an intrusive noise.
Out of interest - why wet over electric?Originally Posted by tz-uk73
Mainly because it’s 45sqm in a new extension and therefore new insulated slab and poured screed so easy enough at that stage of build to get pipes laid in screed. Plus elec prices were like 45ppkWh at the time iirc and I’d have needed some serious kw’s for 45 Sqm and it’d have cost a fortune to run
This opened up in our high st just recently
https://infraredheatingspecialists.co.uk/
I have no connection whatsoever but I’m curious about whether it costs out? Not curious enough to have wandered in yet mind!
Our neighbours have those white squares on the ceiling. it's a strange feeling the first time you experience that sort of heating, because the air doesn't seem that warm initially (this one was above the coffee table and we were sitting on armchairs and couch) and you soon realise that it's actually quite comfortable. It's a strange feeling, cold(ish) air yet you're warm. I am sure you only notice it at the beginning, a bit like your first showers when you start using a water softener (it feels like you're still covered in soap).
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Electric UFHis usually between 1.5-2 kw/m2 so up to 9 kw per hour. It wouldn’t be continuous because it would maintain a set temperature but sounds a bit pricey nonetheless.
There is no cheap way to heat with electricity, but if you are getting away with 3 quid a day, you are already sorted.
But seriously, I have seen almost zero change in the electrical heat business in the last 30 years.
Back then it was an electric resistive element of whatever wattage takes your fancy, if you wanted you could cover the element in a heat retaining medium like ceramic, blocks, oil etc and as re. control you could switch it on or you could switch it off. You could use convection to distribute the heat or you could add a fan for assistance.
Roll on 30 years nothing has changed, the storage heaters may look prettier, you can switch them on off with your phone blah blah blah, but most of the blurb is snake oil.
Bottom line
Small wattage = small bill = small heat
Big wattage = big bill = big heat.
The only changes I see is that the insulation of the buildings have improved, so the heat is kept in much better nowadays.
Parents use economy 7 overnight to charge up their two hulking old school storage heaters but they do there job well enough for their small flat, modern versions certainly look better but neighbours say switching was a mistake.
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Agree with this. My parents fitted expensive Fischer heaters, no better than old storage heaters (which these aren't) and like any, 1kW in, 1kW out. All equally efficient.There is no cheap way to heat with electricity, but if you are getting away with 3 quid a day, you are already sorted.
But seriously, I have seen almost zero change in the electrical heat business in the last 30 years.
Back then it was an electric resistive element of whatever wattage takes your fancy, if you wanted you could cover the element in a heat retaining medium like ceramic, blocks, oil etc and as re. control you could switch it on or you could switch it off. You could use convection to distribute the heat or you could add a fan for assistance.
Roll on 30 years nothing has changed, the storage heaters may look prettier, you can switch them on off with your phone blah blah blah, but most of the blurb is snake oil.
Bottom line
Small wattage = small bill = small heat
Big wattage = big bill = big heat.
The only changes I see is that the insulation of the buildings have improved, so the heat is kept in much better nowadays.
Slightly intrigued by these. We only have fairly small rooms so ceiling mounted might work well. Ultimate running costs are the same no matter what the modality, 1kw cost 1kwh to run per hour.Our neighbours have those white squares on the ceiling. it's a strange feeling the first time you experience that sort of heating, because the air doesn't seem that warm initially (this one was above the coffee table and we were sitting on armchairs and couch) and you soon realise that it's actually quite comfortable. It's a strange feeling, cold(ish) air yet you're warm. I am sure you only notice it at the beginning, a bit like your first showers when you start using a water softener (it feels like you're still covered in soap
It does seem that you can get away with lower wattage devices and be comfortable mind.
They are quite a lot cheaper to buy and ceiling mounts give more floor space. I do wonder how well they would manage as the background heat we need when not present.
Migth find a couple cheaply on gumtree or the like and have a go.
Neighbour has a very efficient solar array on his roof, and is with octopus with his 2 EVs, but I will ask him about background heat in absentia :)
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Fischer are con-artists! There adverts are a disgrace!
That’s not my experience, since 2018 storage heaters have to be Lot20 compliant so relying on a dial with a bent piece of wire and a crude bi-mettalic strip is out the window. Modern better insulated fan assisted heaters with computer control are for more economic to run as they emit heat when it’s needed and charge up overnight with far more accuracy that old units where you use a coin to adjust a dial and hope you will be warm the next evening.There is no cheap way to heat with electricity, but if you are getting away with 3 quid a day, you are already sorted.
But seriously, I have seen almost zero change in the electrical heat business in the last 30 years.
Back then it was an electric resistive element of whatever wattage takes your fancy, if you wanted you could cover the element in a heat retaining medium like ceramic, blocks, oil etc and as re. control you could switch it on or you could switch it off. You could use convection to distribute the heat or you could add a fan for assistance.
Roll on 30 years nothing has changed, the storage heaters may look prettier, you can switch them on off with your phone blah blah blah, but most of the blurb is snake oil.
Bottom line
Small wattage = small bill = small heat
Big wattage = big bill = big heat.
The only changes I see is that the insulation of the buildings have improved, so the heat is kept in much better nowadays.
I have had Quantum storage heaters fitted since 2014, they are not the newer app controlled ones but they saved on my bills and more importantly gave me heat when I wanted at a level I wanted. I could tell them if i was ‘in all day’ or out all day’ and they charged up accordingly, I can tell them how many days of ‘holiday’ mode i needed and they only charge up the night before the day i’m due to return. with the old storage units it was baking hot in the morning but when returning in the evening there was hardly enough heat retained to be comfortable.
What is snake oil is 1kw heater manufacturers claiming they are more efficient than other 1kw heaters. unless they are using cheaper electricity they are all using 1kw/hr.
what does need to change is the pricing of electricity, especially economy 7/10 the unit price overnight is way to high yet car charging plans are offering units at 1/3 of the price. electricity needs to be nationalised and with dynamic pricing reflecting the generation methods and not some fictitious price tied to generating it with gas. add in an infrastructure investment portion and stop paying shareholders. should never have been privatised in the first place.
Exactly as above
We had similar dilemma recently, old cottage , new extension with Elec underfloor heating and storage rads in the old part of house. Last winter after all the madness with energy prices it was not uncommon to get a few bills in sucession of £480 plus per month. After talking to many people we got a quote from British Gas to fit full Gas central heating system, not cheap at £8k but work was completed in 3 days working around an old building, the payments were/are £ 170 pr month at Zero % for 4 years, monthly bills for cold snap less than £200 pr month so cost of installation and bill is still less that electric alone. Yes I know it's not "Eco" but I have a comfortable home heated by high quality components (Bosch boiler 98% efficient and a Hive system) so for me it was a no Brainer, possibly not what you want to hear but well worth considering. Cheers, John B4
We walked our dogs together this morning so I asked and now reporting back.
What I understood is that basically those things do not warm up the air directly: They warm objects that absorb the IR, and the air warms up when it contact with those objects. Think of it as a personal sun: you can have your mulled wine in T-shirt in January at the terrasse of your favourite ski resort if no wind and bright sunshine.
So my impression was correct: the house temperature is regulated to 19ºC with the thermostat, but when you sit underneath or close to underneath you receive more heat and it feels warmer.
In no one is home, the system will still radiate to the walls, floor and furniture in the house who in turn will warm up to allow the air to be kept at the temperature you've set. I find it very comfortable.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Thankyou sir that is very useful. I might just have a go with a couple.
Ahh thanks makes perfect sense
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