Financial sense needed

[stiglet]

[sensible mode] pay off the mortgage and lease a quick-ish car [/sensible mode]

However I've spent a hideous amount on my Mk1 Mini over over the last few months making it really scary,

I also bought an Aston Martin this morning that I cannot justify in any way whatsoever

Accordingly you may be inclined to completely ignore my advice

[100thmonkey]

I’m delighted to read your own take here Kerry but plenty of people have the same comfort with managed, understood “debt� (for want of a better phrase) that put them in the same apparent comfort zone you state you are in.

Either way is not wrong, as it’s a choice relative to financial planning and then it’s execution.

But for me the over arching point is that (cliche alert ahoy) we are all a long time dead so if you have any kind of aspiration to experience, enjoy or just go for an expenditure (outright and/or sensibly leveraged) that you feel will add a little something to your life then, really, why not?

I agree but once you have had all the experiences you could dream of and more and trinkets you want you realise only one thing matters. Ignorance is truly bliss also.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CcZsE...d=MDJmNzVkMjY=

[100thmonkey]

"When I had less I wanted more and now I have more I want less."


Yeah pretty much

Im very proud of that line now as I reflect on it.

[Tokyo Tokei]

I was thinking draw the 50, and do a 5y fixed at around 1k pm coveri the house and car.

If that mortgage rate and term is achievable, and you see no likelihood of unemployment, low-cost debt financing of assets during inflation is generally financially prudent. The original sum and repayments are diminished in real terms by inflation.

(A lot of heavily debt-ridden governments understand this well, as you might surmise from the fairly “relaxed” approach to tackling inflation in certain countries…)

Whether a dream car will make you happy or not is entirely a different matter, of course. Regrets can gnaw at people for a long time though, whether due to action or inaction. You seem young enough to be able to risk potential regrets.

John Greenleaf Whittier's poem, about missed opportunity, ends…

… pity us all,
Who vainly the dreams of youth recall.
For of all sad words of tongue or pen,
The saddest are these: "It might have been!"

TT

[Passenger]

I may be the odd one out here but it seems to me that these days it doesn’t really matter what you drive, all cars are much the same dealing with traffic jams, speed cameras, dash cams, cyclists, speed bumps. Also, I have realised that the difference in fun between driving a 20k Porker and driving a 90k Porker is approximately 3/5ths of bugger all, plus you’re less likely to worry parking 20k in the local supermarket car park. I’d pay the mortgage off if you can, drive something just as much fun for a lot less cash and concentrate on finding a way to spend less hours working.

I haven't driven in the UK for perhaps 4 or 5 years but my recollection of the roads, traffic, and speed monitoring/ control systems would all support your viewpoint here...IF sitting in an expensive car tickles your pickle then go for it but I can't see there's much pleasure left on the business of actually driving it, least ways not on the roads.

[NikGixer750]

I haven't driven in the UK for perhaps 4 or 5 years but my recollection of the roads, traffic, and speed monitoring/ control systems would all support your viewpoint here...IF sitting in an expensive car tickles your pickle then go for it but I can't see there's much pleasure left on the business of actually driving it, least ways not on the roads.

Depends where you live, in London I would agree having a nice car makes little sense. I live south of York and work north of York, most of my commute is back roads and you can easily have some fun driving on them.

[Passenger]

Depends where you live, in London I would agree having a nice car makes little sense. I live south of York and work north of York, most of my commute is back roads and you can easily have some fun driving on them.

Fair enough, though I'd only add the roads in fairly out the way, much of it rural Lincs where I grew up, do seem to be mostly camera'd, treated with other measures...perhaps they'll get to up your way eventually.

[Boss13]

I haven't driven in the UK for perhaps 4 or 5 years but my recollection of the roads, traffic, and speed monitoring/ control systems would all support your viewpoint here...IF sitting in an expensive car tickles your pickle then go for it but I can't see there's much pleasure left on the business of actually driving it, least ways not on the roads.

Don't forget the car in question is perfectly suited to track days, this will be where it really comes alive.

[Passenger]

Don't forget the car in question is perfectly suited to track days, this will be where it really comes alive.

That makes sense.

[Devonian]

Being in the industry imagine you are more likely to see those who are bothered and making plans. Many people, like myself, have no dealings with financial advisors or similar.

Most people do have get some sort of financial advice though, majority of our clients are purely mortgage only, as most people want the options of many lenders as opposed to their own banks. Most of them want to make sure the children are covered and that they will inherit, even if the children are now adults. As I said not everyone wants to leave their children assets, but most do.

[100thmonkey]

Most people do have get some sort of financial advice though, majority of our clients are purely mortgage only, as most people want the options of many lenders as opposed to their own banks. Most of them want to make sure the children are covered and that they will inherit, even if the children are now adults. As I said not everyone wants to leave their children assets, but most do.

Do you do much with putting assets in Trust?

[gunner]

Or you could hedge your bets and spend £20k on a Caterham...

A hoot on track and the road (30 feels like 60 when your backside is 3" off the tarmac) and puts a much smaller dent in your finances.

[pete-r]

Well it didn’t go to plan. I rang my nearest 5 Porsche dealers but can’t get an allocation.

Any fellow TZers have a connection and can pull some strings?

😉

[mondie]

It has been difficult to get an allocation for the past 18 months, Pete. Does it have to be a new GT4? If not just buy a nearly new car as it's your best chance.

I was lucky enough to secure an allocation on a GT4 last May after only three months on a waiting list but I turned it down in the end, and I suspect since then it's only got more difficult.

What other cars have you considered?

[Boss13]

I would go for a used 911, you can't really go wrong with any generation...GT4 is a Cayman after all which I am pretty sure a Tesla will beat in a 0-60 albeit not around a track (no offence to any owners) !

[xxnick1975]

Well it didn’t go to plan. I rang my nearest 5 Porsche dealers but can’t get an allocation.

Any fellow TZers have a connection and can pull some strings?

😉

Rolex speculators moved on, frightened off by sales corner no doubt!

Sent from my M2101K7BNY using Tapatalk

[aa388]

Depends where you live, in London I would agree having a nice car makes little sense. I live south of York and work north of York, most of my commute is back roads and you can easily have some fun driving on them.

I lived in Wensleydale and worked just north of York the daily commute was the only thing that kept me sane. Nice Volvo 850 T5 on the limit most days


Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app

[Chris_in_the_UK]

Well it didn’t go to plan. I rang my nearest 5 Porsche dealers but can’t get an allocation.

Any fellow TZers have a connection and can pull some strings?



Sadly the Porsche market mirrors the Rolex fiasco - what are seen as 'halo' models are near impossible to buy.

[julian2002]

If paying the increased mortgage isn’t an issue, spend the money on what you damn well please. I’d hesitate to spend that much on a Porsche but if that floats your boat then cool. I’d be looking at something like an Ariel atom or an R8 v10, Aston or Bentley.

[Hood]

It has been difficult to get an allocation for the past 18 months, Pete. Does it have to be a new GT4? If not just buy a nearly new car as it's your best chance.

I was lucky enough to secure an allocation on a GT4 last May after only three months on a waiting list but I turned it down in the end, and I suspect since then it's only got more difficult.

What other cars have you considered?

Used GT4s are quite a bit more than new ones.
718 Spyders are up about 10K in the last month too and the 4 Litre 718s going for well over too as the waiting lists are huge.
Although there may be a recession not far away the wait on these things should make them solid for a while yet but I'd say this is the peak.

[459GMB]

Downsize the house and have no mortgage AND the Porsche !

[eagletower]

Why downsize an appreciating asset if you can afford the mortgage payments? My property has gone up 3 times the amount the mortgage payments have been over the last 5 years.

[murkeywaters]

With the news that you are struggling to get an allocation I would buy something far cheaper that rocks your boat for play time, preferably something that has little depreciation like the suggested used Caterham, keep plugging away at the mortgage and wait for what looks like the inevitable recession within the next couple of years.

You’ll then be in a stronger position to move onto the GT4 that will probably be in less demand.

I still have a decent sized mortgage but the house has doubled in value since I purchased it 12 years ago, I have savings and assets including a dream car that I have had a love affair with since I bought it 24 years ago, I could sell up everything, pay off the mortgage and be okay cash wise but that would be boring.

Life is about more than paying off a mortgage, I have seen too many people die what I consider early, as we are currently the living we can make decisions and best of all enjoy the life we have - none of that is applicable if your dead..

[andy tims]

As per the title of this thread. Pay off the mortgage first. It's a nice feeling.

[100thmonkey]

Life is about more than paying off a mortgage, I have seen too many people die what I consider early, as we are currently the living we can make decisions and best of all enjoy the life we have - none of that is applicable if your dead..

This is very true its about working out what makes you truly happy, thats in the moment, short and long term. if you are buying the trinkets and cars and watches to fill a hole then fill the hole first and find contentment. The immediate warmth of a car can feel as good as the long term warmth of security and we are all different but make sure you are protected as your physical health can chose its own path albeit there are measures you can take to mitigate however your mental health is a projection of your emotions so maintain that and always ask why

[joe narvey]

Genuine question - how many of you consider your children when making these decisions?

I’m old enough to aspire to pay off the mortgage, max the pensions and maintain some cash, but covid, interest rates and crap returns on bonds have shifted my priorities.

Having said that, I’ve been thinking passing assets to child more important at this time.

Do you factor children in or is that a given, or are they out of scope in your deliberations ?

[Passenger]

Genuine question - how many of you consider your children when making these decisions?

I’m old enough to aspire to pay off the mortgage, max the pensions and maintain some cash, but covid, interest rates and crap returns on bonds have shifted my priorities.

Having said that, I’ve been thinking passing assets to child more important at this time.

Do you factor children in or is that a given, or are they out of scope in your deliberations ?

We consider our' un because we just don't know if independent living, a job, is on the cards for him, learning difficulties plus a couple of extras'... so the plan is to leave him with enough for a decent, happy life, I'll not risk the 'state' and it's benevolence...but obviously other's are going to have different circumstances and perspectives, rightly so.

[eagletower]

I do consider my kids - but not am hell bent on leaving them something. I know of parents who have transferred house titles etc into their kids name , to avoid inheritance tax , only for a messy divorce to then cause the parent to lose their home. I would rather my kids had an Inheritance tax bill than risk anything like that.

I invest a lot in my kids futures with good schooling , classes , experiences etc to me that is a better investment than leaving anything behind. I know people are obsessed with paying off a mortgage but for my circumstances I am not.

Once my mortgage falls below a certain amount (multiples of what the OP has left) I wouldn't bother or worry about paying it off. I have buy to lets I can cash in if I ever had to in the future. Instead of paying down my mortgage I bought into rental market and its allowed me to have more financial freedom as it would cover my mortgage and lifestyle . My current house would be far too big for me and the wife if the kids leave and in current market conditions I could easily downsize and be left over with spare. Hence not being fussed about paying it off.

You hear of people scrimping and saving to pay off the mortgage only to do an equity release later anyway. What was the point. I don't think kids need a huge inheritance. If they have half a brain they'll make it on their own,. or they'll just lost a bigger amount with a huge inheritance anyway.

[Passenger]

This is very true its about working out what makes you truly happy, thats in the moment, short and long term. if you are buying the trinkets and cars and watches to fill a hole then fill the hole first and find contentment. The immediate warmth of a car can feel as good as the long term warmth of security and we are all different but make sure you are protected as your physical health can chose its own path albeit there are measures you can take to mitigate however your mental health is a projection of your emotions so maintain that and always ask why

But isn't it generally the case that those 'holes' don't stay filled for long, that type of 'contentment' is shortlived, by design! For example some of our Tesla converts who drive the future for a price, have admitted it ain't all that...agree though everyone must find ther own path, ask questions.

[Jambo]

I don't know much about cars, or mortgages. Bikes were always my thing, and living somewhere where house prices are basically insane a mortgage was always a fantasy.

Coming at it from the similar petrolhead angle though, I were looking to buy the next hot $#&* super-duper high performance sports bike, and it was well known the next generation model would be a hybrid, I would imagine the last generation of the of the solely petroled engined R1/Fireblade/S1000RR type bike would become pretty sought after.

[TimeThoughts]

Great place to be. Something you might need to think about;

I'm in a similar position to you, very small mortgage left on a property and I'm mid forties. The house is in a good neighborhood.

I realised the other day the house that looks 'ok' today in 2022 is inevitabley going to need modernising in the coming years.

I enquired recently about some energy upgrades and an attic conversion and some modifications to enlarge the kitchen. Nothing dramatic, Sarah Beeney won't be showing up.

Tell you what, £120k dosent go far today.

So I think even though a fella could have almost 100% equity in his home he also probably has a significant hidden liability in keeping the place up to date.

I've busted a gut to kill this mortgage early (by monthly overpayments & dropping my bonus on the mortgage).

I now reckon it's likely at close to 50yr old I'll be going back for a £100k mortgage to modernise the house one last time.

[murkeywaters]

This is very true its about working out what makes you truly happy, thats in the moment, short and long term. if you are buying the trinkets and cars and watches to fill a hole then fill the hole first and find contentment. The immediate warmth of a car can feel as good as the long term warmth of security and we are all different but make sure you are protected as your physical health can chose its own path albeit there are measures you can take to mitigate however your mental health is a projection of your emotions so maintain that and always ask why

Yes, it’s a balancing act between financial security and spending to enjoy, add in as you say physical and mental health and to keep all these elements in balance isn’t easy.

[Omegamanic]

I don’t see the point in paying off the mortgage, not when the borrowing rate is currently so low. I paid off my previous mortgage, and must admit I did feel good about it.

But…

Personally, I made the decision to buy a much bigger place the other year, during the start of Covid. Friends thought I was mad and that the property market would collapse - thankfully the opposite appears to have happened. I’ve now sold my old property after leaving it empty for two years, and if I cashed in most of my assets I could likely be mortgage free again with the new place - but…. debt is cheap, inflation is high - why would I want to pay off the mortgage when the rate is comfortably under 2%, if fixed for 10 years, although slightly better rates for 2 or 7 years.

So…. I’d treat yourself. I’ve lost a few friends in the last few years. Most were very frugal and didn’t enjoy the type of lifestyle they could, and probably should have, as they were saving for a much more comfortable retirement. Who knows what the future holds.

I’m going to treat myself, pay the higher mortgage costs, and hope there’s always slightly more money coming in than going out.

I’m planning out performing the 2% mortgage rate with a few pound in investments, and if that partially offsets a couple of car and motorbike purchases in the next 10 years - I’ll be very pleased. If not at least I’ll have enjoyed having the experiences that they have brought me.

[pete-r]

Morning all, really interesting views above so thanks for contributing to my dilemma 😀.

I’ve decided to continue to try and get a slot, and as mentioned if anyone has a connection with Porsche or works at a dealership and can help please get in touch.

The lead time on a gt4 is around 18months so I’m going to take the mortgage to a nominal balance when the fixed term ends then start accumulating savings.

If the used prices tank I’ll get one in 2023.
If an allocation comes then I’ll take it.
If prices rocket then it was never meant to be and I’ll buy another toy.

It’s a first world problem for sure.