So I’ve been up and down with my mental health for over 25 years and been on medication for most off this , I function ok I just have waves of either I’m up or down I don’t do the middle part of being ok if you get what I mean , I went through some really rough times from and the age of 17 to early 20s and the doctors said it was depression and they have never really revisited the diagnosis , when I do see the doctor they ask how the meds are and that’s about it really
So it’s been on my mind for many years ,has anyone ever challenged and asked the doctors for a proper diagnosis as I feel that years ago so much was just labelled as depression and mental health has many different avenues
Just thought I would put it out in the open
After that period of time you definitely need to have a review of your condition. Understanding of mental health has progressed so much, even recently, and there are some great non-medication based treatments available but the first step is getting the correct diagnosis.
Originally Posted by Iceblue
In my experience of metal health in the NHS is very under resourced, over subscribed and often gives a poor outcome.
If you have access to any type of counseling outside of the NHS and haven't been through it recently, I would look down that avenue. I'm very lucky to have the resource available through my work.
My experience with the NHS has been excellent so you're right, it's pot-luck sometimes. Have a look at the MIND website for info and signposting.
I can't speak from personal experience, but I know someone who has said Counselling has been helpful to them.
It doesn't need to be cripplingly expensive either.
M
Breitling Cosmonaute 809 - What's not to like?
It's such a shame because I love the NHS and think they really could get it right if given the funding
I work with clients who all have a mental health diagnosis.
From what I can see, the difficult part is to get the initial referral but once your in the system, it’s easier to access help and service’s.
I would expect you will have regular reviews for your medication, so if you can’t get an appointment to have a reassessment elsewhere it may be a suitable time.
Many years ago, I was diagnosed with depression and went on mild anti-depressant medication.
This was reviewed a few years later, and my doctor explained that depression could be suppressed with medication, but a more long-term solution would be counselling or cognitive behaviour therapy.
It was decided that CBT would be more appropriate for me.
Of course, it's not for everyone, but speaking for myself, it is without question the best thing I have ever done.
My outlook on life has completely changed, and I have a much more positive outlook.
CBT may not be appropriate for you, but it may be worth researching.
Good Luck
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Some great info above I’m 85% of the time on a up and feeling very positive but when I’m not I fully understand my cycle as I get emotional and quiet, will try and speak to the doctors next time I have a appointment to see if I can get things assessed, had a fair few talking therapy sessions over the years and must admit great to talk to someone but I’m a fairly open book and don’t mind talking about my mental health as long as I’m not on a down
My out look on my mental health I always say i have colourful days with a few grey days chucked in
I have been on citalopram for about the last 8 years after a few years away from them. I went through a bad work situation & it all triggered again.
Start of pandemic I struggled with being at home all the time and working there vs in the office (I now struggle to want to go in!). I reviewed my meds with my doctor and was increase to 40mg.
Having moved roles internally to something where I felt valued vs simply a 12+hrs a day consulting commodity, I started to look at coming off & reducing my dose.
Couple of wobbles, usually involved me being an arse to my wife over trivial things that just got to me, saw me back on them. I was trying too hard to come off them ‘visibly’ I think.
I’m now 4 weeks off, have the odd low but know my triggers and how to respond etc. I mentioned to my wife that I had not taken them, and this time she had no idea as I was more aware of my own well-being.
I found meditation really helped me, and can now quite happily sit on my own in a quiet room for hours with nothing else to do / watch / read and really enjoy ‘my time’.
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Well done fella for marking that step and I can associate with a few things you have said , citalopram 20mg for me the same as you fella and forgotten how long I’ve been on them ,
Choosing information about where to study resources on health, diseases, and other topics is very tough today. It's crucial to take charge of your situation and yourself. See and read about it at https://gentaur.co.uk/learning/ , which I suggest. I am therefore entirely satisfied. I wish you luck as well, and I hope I was able to assist you.
Last edited by bobocat; 7th March 2023 at 04:23.
I'm not doing great right now. I can feel it creeping up. I've had two breakdowns so I know the signs. My head's in perpetual chaos. I get myself into these situations and I'm so sick of it. I don't know why I do it. I'm so shit. I've spent so long thinking about why I'm so shit I'm exhausted. I could literally sleep all day every day.
That you've noticed the Black Dog coming means the chemicals in your brain are changing. Try to anticipate how you can cope. This may be helped by an activity or a distraction. Having lived with PTSD for 24 years I can usually cope. The out doors helps me tremendously, I don't do so well in the summer. I've done all sorts of counselling over the years. You can try NLP or Havening. Paul Mckenna does some interesting stuff I have followed. Tough time of year in the UK for mental help, I wish you well. PM me if you wish to talk more.
Sorry to hear this, keep speaking to people about your challenges. Read up on biased self perception, this will scientifically explain some of why you feel they way you do. All the very best and keep communicating
No real personal experience, but have just been involved in re-tending our private health care provider at work.
All the suppliers shortlisted had some element of mental health support. Ive not been involved in this for a decade or so, so hadn't seen it before.
Maybe of help to someone if they are lucky enough to have access to such a scheme.
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Echo both of the above comments on distraction & also the self bias you’re experiencing. Talking to people helps, even if things just watch freaks on a forum.
The fact you can feel it looming is a positive as you’ve not let it get as far as before. You need to make an effort to make a change / do something different, as much as you don’t feel you can. Small steps and you will find positivity.
Take care of yourself and here to chat if you need to, just drop me a PM.
It's really tough and I think in these northern countries with short winter days it sometimes feels unbearable. Without daylight we instinctively slip into a perpetual state of anxiety. I am generally goal motivated, but a lot of my fun interests are dependent on decent weather, so the winter months require so much more work to stay on top of my mental state. I found the winter of 2020-21 unbearable, as documented in my post regarding my troubles with cars. In retrospect I realise it was mostly down to having almost all distractions from the winter gloom forcibly removed. It forced me to confront a lot of demons from the past and accept just how much PTSD I have. I had to become much more objective about it all and almost have two personalities, letting my rational side protect the emotional one. That separation of the "reptilian brain" from the rational one was probably the biggest breakthrough I made in dealing with my mental health (while before I just swallowed everything and soldiered on). It still sounds so "self help" to me, but being able to take a step back and assess a stressful situation objectively has been life changing.
If I sleep well I can deal with anything. If not, I descend quite quickly. So my main focus now is to create an environment which allows me to sleep well. If I feel the drudge of our miserable winters creeping in, I immediately make a plan to do something I'm looking forward to. Sometimes I just go and fix something in the garage, sometimes I just put on a watch that I like, other times we book a holiday or a concert, etc. Then I can go to bed thinking about these exciting plans and drift off with ease.
Thanks everyone, nice to know the community is there in tough times.
I’ve found more benefit talking to people on here via pm to understand and learn more than formal processes tbh, but meditation, talking & exercise do all help & I hate the last one.
So happy you opened up and started sharing though, that’s the hardest part; I hid it for years in my early 20s and then 30s, as it was seen as being weak, father never understood how I could be etc, despite mother having suffered.
His view was I earn a good salary, I have no real stresses on spending, how can I possibly be depressed - it’s a hard one to answer and it took me years. He never knew about the 40s episode as there was no point sharing with him.
With what I know now, it is the bravest that share what they feel & wish I’d known that years ago.
I’m 100% sure it’s not the black dog for me with my current energy crisis, my oura resilience is through the floor, so sensing some viral load I’m shifting still.
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My mental health has been quite a journey. Have had both private and NHS care. Both good. I'm pretty well these days, but I do have to work at it. In a nutshell, what I needed and what helped: Diagnosis, medication, talking therapy, exercise, meditation, cut out alcohol etc, routine, plenty of sleep, low stress lifestyle, friendship. It requires self-discipline and hard work for me to be well. I'm not complaining though. I love my life now and every day I don't wake up in hospital is a win. Be well friends.
I'm sure I'm not the only one, or at least hope so. I seem to have done well compared to many but have very little sense of fulfilment or joy.
In my 50's, living comfortably and thinking "Is this it?"
I'm not sure why I feel this way or if it's even classed under mental health but boy is it tedious....
A great post with all the fundamental ingredients listed. Too many of us (me included) expect life/happiness to just happen. When it doesn't the wheels fall off rather sharpish. Money can paper over the cracks, but I've seen wealthy musicians implode when the drugs/women/cars/homes/etc stop working. Take life one day at a time, sometimes maybe just an hour or two. We are all different so the menu will have to change slightly but the important stuff is listed above. Be kind to yourself and others.
You’re not the only one. I often have to take a step back and give myself a good talking to.
I don’t think stuff helps either, having a decent income means we can have things and buying is a short term hit/fix. Trying to declutter you house and avoid buying things can help declutter your brain too. Access to SC on here certainly doesn’t help and eBay/Facebook/gumtree is such an addictive drug it should really be banned.
Last edited by Dave+63; 21st February 2024 at 14:12.
I’m completely with you here, and was something my leadership coach said to me a few years back, to look back and reflect on what you have actually achieved vs looking for the next work opportunity to grow.
I often have to have a quiet word with myself especially when I’m retiring at 57, wife at 52 and we will be living a life we never dreamed of when we first moved in together. Yet still seems to your point, is this it.
I have to pull myself out of a rut sometimes and it’s usually removing and prioritising the same things .
Cut out: binge eating, unstructured meals, processed foods where possible, staying up until 1/2am, being on my phone in bed, binging on absolute junk.
Do: make sleep a priority, stay hydrated, calm down on the coffee, have leftovers ready to go in the fridge, try get out and go for a walk.
One thing which gives me an insane mental boost for a week or two is giving blood. Might work for others. Giving something which costs nothing and means everything.
Finally I don’t know about you guys but if I have something on my mind or have some stress the worst thing I can do is tell my wife. Makes it 10x worse. It’s like a beeping alarm clock with no snooze button.
I’ve never suffered with mental health, but the big question “is this it?” Is something I’ve pondered. Having thought about it a lot, I’ve accepted that everyone’s life is what it is. Everyone has a different journey, there will be highs and lows and none of us get out the other end.
I’m a devil for setting myself a challenge, that passes some of the daily grind for me (currently in the final stages of our 2nd self build) and I know I’ll think up something else to occupy myself as soon as this is done, maybe that’s what keeps me going?
I know from friends with mental issues that exercise is the biggest help they’ve ever had, running in particular
Short answer; yes, this is it!
You're not alone in thinking this way, I've certainly had similar thoughts in recent years. The transition through middle age into old age is mentally challenging, to a greater or lesser extent, for us all. Provided you don't spend disproportionate amounts of time dwelling on the negativity I think it's perfectly normal, even if you stay in good health physically and are financially comfortable life can seem a bit lacking compared to being younger.
Maintaining hobbies and interests has helped me a lot. I never had any kids of my own but my (second) wife has two who are now grown up and have kids of their own. I`m not brilliant at the grandad role, I`ll admit that, I see lots of my peers getting totally immersed in it and getting fulfilment, which is fine, but there's a danger of becoming what I term 'professional grandad/granny' whereby their sole source of joy and fulfilment is by proxy through the growth and achievement of their offspring and grandkids. My belief is that you should continue to have your own individual goals and pleasures, sources of joy and fulfilment that are yours and yours alone. Ideally a balance should be struck between helping others and pursuing your own goals, family responsibilities shouldn't be neglected but I think it's a mistake to become totally defined by the role.
Transition from work to retirement can have its downsides, loss of status affects some folks who struggle to go from being 'somebody' to just ordinary Joe on the street, especially if the decision to retire wasn`t completely their own. For me it's something I was aware of but coped easily with, a bit like walking on a wide path close to a cliff edge, you recognise the hazard but stay mindful to avoid the drop.
The one piece of advice I`d give anyone approaching retirement is that you HAVE to find something to do, something that will fill the void left by work and provide intrinsic satisfaction. You cannot treat it like a lifelong holiday, it doesn`t work that way. I fix watches (amongst other activities) Mrs W spends 2-3 days/week looking after grandkids, we keep busy and (more importantly) get intrinsic satisfaction from what we do.
I`m in no position to say much about depression, it's a condition I admit to not understanding and I suspect I`m not alone in that. Do I get depressed? Yes, occasionally I do, I think there's a degree of depression that accompanies the ageing process and I`ve felt that since turning 60, but like my path along the cliff top analogy I`m aware the black hole is there to fall into but I don't feel at risk. If I start feeling negative I kick myself up the arse, reminding myself how fortunate I am compared to many. It's a cliché, but you have to focus on the positives.
Another piece of advice I`ll give is to try and decouple your sense of pleasure away from materialism, retail therapy may work for some but in my experience it's a very short-lived high that eventually fails to provide any sense of fulfilment. I`ve felt a whole lot happier now I don't care about such things, and it's a hell of a lot cheaper too.
Keep smiling, stay positive, easier to say than do, but it does help.
It is simple to be happy but can be difficult to be simple.
Love what you do and do what you love. If you hate what you do you will probably end up hating yourself.
Count your blessings.
There can be lessons in good and bad experiences.
Mental health like physical health takes work... the 2 are intertwined so it's a 2 birds 1 stone scenario, how good is that!
Sunshine. But don't forget the sunscreen.
A wife is ideally for life, so before you both commit make sure you really do know each other and still love/ like/ accept the other.
Last edited by Passenger; 22nd February 2024 at 07:39.
oops technically I'm a Ludd! Well, no one is perfect.
Last edited by Passenger; 22nd February 2024 at 09:33.
Be mindful we're bombarded constantly with messages that stuff represents happiness, makes us more attractive/ successful, winners!...be mindful this is in large part horseshit!
Certainly own stuff that enhances, brings enjoyment to your life but apply some consideration, don't let it become a endless treadmill of empty pursuit, you'll waste your own time/ energy in the churn...this however in large part underpins our consumer economy/ way of life...so reject this you'll be a heretic, deviant to some.
''Getting and spending we lay waste our powers''
Dave, you are not shit.
The thoughts you have are not based in reality, they are caused by an imbalance of chemicals in your brain. Being exhausted is a sure sign of depression
If you come to terms with that it may hopefully help you a bit.
All the very best mate.
Neil.
Cheers,
Neil.
Thanks to everyone who has posted and PMd me, it means the world that people take the time to do that.
grown men talking about their mental health openly and honesty........
we all deserve a little pat on the back for that alone; it wouldn't have happened a few years ago and we'd be worse off because of that..
I dip in and out of extreme lows and the 'is this it' mood. Second divorce 8 years ago hit hard and I've never really managed to re-balance my emotions ever since; unaided by the ex still being in the periphery either leaning on me for support or abusing me verbally and emotionally!
I tend to get focused on keeping busy and this has led to still playing football 3 times a week at 55; as it assures me of at least 3 good nights sleep. Then i keep social by going out to too many gigs for my own good, but this also helps me stay off the meds that didn't really agree with me. I managed to get through lockdown by the skin of my teeth with the support of a few mates from football on a couple of random whatsapp groups that turned into group therapy. Sometimes just sharing and understanding that others feel the same does help you rationalise it a little bit.
the main thing is to not keep it to yourself, even if as mentioned, its just chatting to some other watch or football nerds..... a problem shared and all that.
Stay healthy guys
I have not noticed any of your posts reflecting this, so shows how we do tend to default to 'hiding' it.
Well done to you too, it takes a lot to make these comments; in my early 20s with my first bout it was almost unheard of to discuss. Lost touch with my, at the time, closest and longest friend; he couldn't deal with it & always just talked about how wonderful his life was. Not spoken in over 23 years now, which saddens me a little - but his profile and statement on LinkedIn reminds me exactly of why I ceased contact.
55 and football 3 times a week, wow that is astounding! Glad you have found things that work for you, that is the most important thing & sorry your ex still gives you hassles, that sucks.
I pulled away from my mates for the same reasons, always had easy lives, loads of cash, amazing houses, cars and holidays and when we did all go out it always had to be to “somewhere nice”. We drifted from them because we couldn’t keep up and were always criticised when we pulled out of things. My brother is still part of that group and it’s still the same 25 years later.
A few years ago we all went to my sister’s wedding in Ibiza. We struggled to afford it but made sure we didn’t miss it anyway. A few of us met up at our accommodation for a few drinks and it was awful. They were clearly looking down on us and our accommodation, mocking and sniggering. I felt so small. These people wouldn’t entertain anything less than five star. It confirmed we’d made the right decision all those years ago.
I’m sure I’m still suffering the affects of years of being around all that. I crave validation through material things that I can’t really justify owning. Most of my mental health problems stem from financial worries. There, I’ve said it.
I’ve worked really hard to get my career to where it is now. I’ve achieved my career goal and I earn a great salary. I’ve also been clearing down debts and have done well. Despite years of struggling I now only have my mortgage and a four figure debt. But now I’ve hit a wall in that I’m servicing that debt at high interest rates and because my credit report still isn’t where I’m trying to get it to, I can’t get cheaper finance to clear it and so the cycle continues. That’s where this current bout of darkness has come from.
Not being able to see a way out of it kills me mentally. I get so down. I feel like no matter how much I’ve tried I just can’t get over the line. I have the income now to pay back a loan quickly if it’s at a sensible rate but can’t get one. This might all seem very alien to most people but being in the cycle is exhausting. I can see the end of the tunnel but can’t seem to reach it.
Now, think about what I said earlier about seeking validation through material stuff. Add that to my mix and I end up making silly and regretful purchases to feel good.
I’ve seen today that Cristiano Ronaldo has earned £203m in the last year. Mate, can I borrow a few grand and I’ll pay you back quickly? I wish.
So there you are, a look into my psyche. I’m a pretty decent bloke trying to do the right things whilst battling some demons. Not unlike millions of others I expect.
Thanks for reading. I’ve hovered over ‘Submit Reply’ for ages as this is a lot for me to share but if it helps even one other person it’ll have been worth it.
I lost my Mum young and my Dad has always been all about him. Successful, wealthy and a total knob. He’s never been there for any of us kids for any of our needs. So I’ve always been someone who has had to do everything for myself as I’m sure loads of people reading this have been too. I’ve also always been the type to help others and take on their problems which I now realise added to my stress levels over many years.
If anyone fancies my three nice watches for £330 on SC, that would help too ;)
Thanks for reading.
Last edited by TaketheCannoli; 22nd February 2024 at 21:57.
Dave, big respect for the post.
Material things never validate anybody or anything - it's a false narrative of the highest order. Use the money differently - go out for a nice meal, a short break, a show. Breaking the cycle works, it's just not easy sometimes.
Best wishes.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
we all put on a brave face or bravado when it suits us. luckily I've a PA/best mate who is always there for me and groups of friends who just listen and support each other (whilst also taking the piss constantly, as we are men after all)
also at the age where one of my best mates wives has terminal cancer and another has similar illness; all help to add a little perspective to my pity party. But still remember that it is my pity party and also relevant.
the football does have its issues as i'm nursing a broken nose from a clash of heads last week
keep chatting chaps, as it really does help
As each door closes on me the pressure gets greater and more insufferable. The best way I can describe it for those who don't know is to imagine a massive clear glass sphere, like a goldfish bowl but without the hole at the top. Inside that bowl there's a million butterflies flying about in manic fashion. Imagine what that chaos looks like. Each one of the butterflies is a thought, a problem, a worry, a stressor or something to deal with. The aim is to have them all flying around the bowl in formation and at the same pace. Calmly. Orderly.
Usually there's one huge 'Queen' butterfly that's agitating the chaos, making it worse, exacerbating the problems and draining you of energy. Only there isn't just one of those, every butterfly has the potential to rise up and become the Queen. My current Queen is financial. I also have a few other difficult butterflies I'm dealing with daily. They're pretenders to the throne. Lurking and biding their time to be The Queen.
If I could remove the current Queen I know I could manage the rest of the little buggers.
Just as there are millions of people who will understand 100% the description I've just shared, there are millions who fortunately won't recognise it at all. By painting this picture I hope I can help some people, even just one person, understand the chaos in some peoples' heads and lives.
My mates father took his own life 22 years ago today. He couldn't control the butterflies any longer, couldn't cope with them at all. We have moved on immeasurably in those 22 years I'm pleased to say. Suicide numbers in males is still far too high but at least we're starting to talk to each other about our lives, worries and anxieties and not just sport, shagging and our knobs.
Take care out there chaps.
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Thanks for sharing this David. I know I have been been harsh and unpleasant to you in the past but after you have opened up here I understand better where you’re coming from. I apologize for my previous behaviour towards you.
I have been sliding down a slope for the past ten years or so. I have just forced myself to go on despite feeling overwhelmed. The root cause for my depression comes from my strict and harsh upbringing. Due to that I have, from a very early age, set my standards very high. I have been strict, harsh and demanding to others and even more so to myself. I had some personal problems that led to me underperfoming (relative to my standards). That of course made me feel bad about myself and depleted my energy levels, which in turn caused more underperfoming and the vicious cycle was complete. The more I spiraled down, the bigger all my problems seemed.
My experience was not quite like the fishbowl described. I felt like I was in thick haze all the time. I was so tired that I felt detached from myself. I was physically present but mentally I was behind the mist, not quite there in the moment. I was drudging through my responsibilities and the rest of the time I spent pretty much horizontal on the couch exhausted. Doing anything seemed to deplete my energy levels rapidly. It was almost like the kind of nightmare, where you’re trying to run, but you’re body is moving in slow motion no matter how hard you try.
The main reason for not seeking medical help was the fear of losing my job. Last fall my situation got so bad that I realized it can’t continue like that anymore. I found myself thinking about suicide more often. I didn’t yet have any plans to do so, but it was clear that it would be the end of the line if I continued the way I had been going. I balanced the possibility of losing my job against the certainty of losing my life and suddenly it was an easy decision to seek medical help.
Fast forward five months or so and boy am I feeling better. Medication and therapy have pretty much taken care of my depression symptoms. I still have the classical burnout symptoms, meaning my energy levels are still low and I get tired easily. One of the major breakthroughs for me was actually understanding how much I had mentally tortured myself for not reaching my standards. Most of it has been on a subconscious level rather than thoughts that can be put to words. Now I know that I have an illness that is not my fault and I actively try not to accuse myself of my misgivings.
In this light what you David said about the thinking why I’m so shit really resonates with me. One thing anyone battling with these kinds of thoughts should know: you are not shit. You feel like shit because you are sick. You have caught an illness that is not fair. It is just as any other illness, you did not choose it and getting it is not your fault. It clouds your judgment and has you make stupid decisions and makes you suffer but it does not make you any worse as a person.
When I was at my worst my problems seemed unmanageable. Now as my depression symptoms are under control all my problems are manageable and unlike before I have some energy to manage them. I understand that financial problems can be detrimental to your mental health but I think also that better mental health is helpful in managing financial problems. David, you said that you feel like your other triggers to depression would be manageable if you got your finances in order. It may well be so, but I’d hazard a guess that you have financial difficulties because of your condition rather than vice versa. In any case I hope you are feeling better and that you receive proper professional help.
I know my experience is limited and others’ situations and conditions may differ. One thing I believe to be an universal truth no matter what kind of mental health problems you are struggling with: seeking professional help is the best thing to do. If you are struggling with any mental health issues, please see your doctor sooner rather than later. I know I have had it relatively easy but I’m sure it would have been a lot easier if I had seeked help earlier.
Cheers,
Antti
Antti - thank you so much for your honest and heartfelt response, it's sad that you've been through that but fantastic you've managed to get help that's making things better for you. Thanks for your apology but it really isn't needed. We can all be less than pleasant at times so certainly no hard feelings my end.
Take care my friend :)
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