Reply With QuoteYes the data shows more people “testing positive” but hospitalisations and deaths remain flat. Hopefully we will have similar experience to South Africa (who have a much larger unvaccinated population) and all the hype will be over.
I always remember from the outset that the PM said he would be guided by the science, that didn't last very long, now they're telling him this thing is spreading very very quickly and he's doing jack shit about it, yes you could argue that it's not as aggressive as delta but it's still infecting a substantial amount of people, so it gives it more chance to do damage to anyone that is vulnerable.
The NHS is still going to be overwhelmed and even more people are going to miss their routine app and ops, which in turn will lead to more deaths, I'm also fed up with hearing about saving xmas, surely saving lives so as you see another xmas is more important.
I saw first hand what an absolutely fabulous job the NHS do regarding covid, surely we could at least give them a fighting chance this time instead of thinking about a posh roast dinner whilst wearing silly hats and jumpers, ( it's a no brainer to me ).
Yes the data shows more people “testing positive” but hospitalisations and deaths remain flat. Hopefully we will have similar experience to South Africa (who have a much larger unvaccinated population) and all the hype will be over.
Big assumption. They don’t take the same view as me but at least I can recognize where the balance is from my own wishful thinking!Originally Posted by oldoakknives
Can you, because it seems you can’t?
Yes but don’t forget that more people will then take time off work due to being infected and ill, including the key workers, like healthcare, truck drivers, emergency services and supermarket workers. So it isn’t just the hospitalised that will be affected!
No I can't to be honest. I watch programmes like Newsnight and Question Time and fail to see any balance at all. Even the News in the mornings with the hand wringing Victoria Derbyshire always seems to have a slant.
So we will have to disagree, but thats fine, everyone's view is important.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
I don’t perceive any bias when watching BBC news shows, but maybe that’s because I’m proudly apolitical so I’m less sensitive than many.
https://youtu.be/-zg1j7Zquoc
Worth a watch.
Last edited by Neal666; 21st December 2021 at 22:16.
NO!
Only if you love quacks and conspiracies which you clearly do! You are sharing dangerous misinformation and should be ashamed of yourself. Clearly you are just looking for any old rubbish that supports your misguided position.
He is coming out will huge amounts of misinformation and outright lies about the deaths from vaccines. If the numbers were even close to what he is claiming then after 8 BILLION doses we would be swamped with excess deaths especially as he states they occur 48hrs post the jab then he states up to a week. This is simply not true as can be seen in the data on excess deaths.
A quick Google search shows that he supported unlicensed and ineffective treatments such as hydroxychloroquine and endorsed breaking medicine research safety standards. That is not indicative of a Good Doctor but a Mad Scientist!
Worth a read
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_A._McCullough
Here are some titbits:
McCullough testified before a committee of the Texas Senate in March 2021, posted to YouTube by the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons, in which he made false claims about COVID-19 and COVID-19 vaccines, including that people under 50 years of age and survivors do not need the vaccine and that there is no evidence of asymptomatic spread of COVID-19.[27]
McCullough gave an interview in April 2021 to The New American, the magazine of the right-wing John Birch Society, in which he advanced anti-vaccination messaging, including falsely claiming tens of thousands of fatalities attributed to the COVID-19 vaccines.[46] In May 2021, McCullough gave an interview in which he made claims about COVID-19 and COVID-19 vaccines which were "inaccurate, misleading and/or unsupported by evidence," including that survivors cannot be re-infected and so do not require vaccination and that the vaccines are dangerous.[28]
My conclusion is that your post is more absolute bollocks from you again.
Boom!
There is a time delay to remember though, i think its still slightly too early to say in the UK at least.
Maybe on the weekend i would expect the hospitalisations and deaths to start showing up more.
Hard to say, this virus is a real pig. It has more or less ruined my life before i even ever had the bloody thing.
Worth a read.
Don't just do something, sit there. - TNH
Really? Guys a menace.
https://factcheck.afp.com/http%253A%...m%252F9QW7UP-1
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
It's a broadcaster with an institutional political bias.
You’re a cultist so your perspective is already way off balanced to be even able to recognise what balanced would look like!
That’s fine book!Worth a read.
Loving your work paw3001
You have just quoted Wikipedia to make a point.... Wikipedia the free encyclopedia that ANYONE can EDIT.....
As you put it BOOM....
Whether you like it or not, there is people with alternative opinions its not dangerous or something to be ashamed of.... its exactly that an ALTERNATIVE OPINION.. what you do with that information is up to you! However you could argue following one narrative without question is potentially as dangerous, to make informed decisions you need ALL the facts good and bad. This is where the problem lies with the mainstream media.
You are not working in anything related to science, are you?
If you did, you would check the references at the bottom of the Wiki page. You would see that while scientists can formulate hypothesis based on their opinions, it is up to them to confirm their validity with facts. And that McCullough has a lot of opinions that others have demonstrated were wrong (i.e., by finding no evidence despite testing the hypothesis, which McCullough didn't do, or by proving the opposite). You will also find that the American Journal of Medicine is one of the leading and most respected medical scientific publications, and that when they publish a paper (which has already been peer reviewed, but in times of urgency like a pandemic the review may have been "light") there is plenty of research made using the published results and if something is not right it will flag up spectacularly.
As any individual MCCullough is entitled to his opinion. When he uses his credentials to give weight to his opinion, it stops being an opinion as it is taken by people like you as qualified evidence, which it isn't.
Last edited by Saint-Just; 22nd December 2021 at 10:41.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Looking at some of the claims by McCullough, that wouldn’t necessarily have helped! 😂
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
I’m afraid the whole “all the facts” thing rather depends on their actually being facts, as in verifiably true pieces of information - as opposed to nuggets of solid excrement sieved from the effluent of a diseased mind.
The Conservative Party is not a cult.
Are you mad? Serious question!
Clearly you haven’t read many of my posts where I have asked and outlined many different questions regarding COVID but I do accept evidence based medicine and scientific principles. I wrote 2 paragraphs of my own before linking to the Wiki page and then said here are some titbits. It wasn’t as if I was hiding where I got some of my information was it. Did you read that page and the Fact check link that was also posted by OOK?
It was a bit more than just dumping lies and running with a “Worth a Watch” when clearly it wasn’t and could be debunked within 5 mins!
Do you know what “Alternative Opinions” are called when checked for truth and found to be lacking - LIES. So yes, they are dangerous when they are about peoples health. I wonder if you would be happy to fly in a plane built with Alternative Opinions in Engineering and Physics?
I give you a Grade A for effort in trying to harm your fellow man but a Grade F for intellectual rigour.
Now go back under your Troll bridge with your rubbish or be brave enough to post in the Bear COVID thread and find out what people really think or you and your nonsense.
You say all the facts good and bad, unfortunately your sources of information have no facts just information or should I say misinformation.
Sad thing is lots of people like yourself, Facebook Karen’s, Covid preppers and anti vaxxers prefer to listen and act on information/misinformation rather than the facts from medical professionals..
We like facts at TZ
Don't just do something, sit there. - TNH
To be fair the Government did advise that we'd all had quite enough of experts so sadly the seeds were sown by our own leaders.
Does make me wonder if the government will just ride Omicron out, get past Xmas day and restrictions looked nailed on a few days ago but now I’m not so sure, if the NHS looks to be keeping its head above water I think government will back the vaccination program and keep the wheels turning…
I agree - the 'not ruling anything out' is indicative.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
On the BBC, I wouldn’t claim that they are entirely beyond bias as different commentators will have their views, though they do try to balance them. It’s also possible for them to have a degree of group-think, and they do represent a narrow slice of mostly middle class urban oxbridge types. However they also make a genuine attempt to show both sides of an argument and to check facts, which is more than some news sources do. The left think they’re right wing and the right think they’re left wing, and the people who accuse them of being politicised often seem to be the people who have strong opinions themselves, and are infuriated that the BBC won’t accept them as gospel truth. What I find particularly unconvincing is this kind of, ‘OMG I can’t believe you just said that do you work for the BBC or something?’ type comment, this really makes me wonder what variety of randomness the poster is pushing.
Meanwhile Bret Weinstein is a sad story, he started out branding himself as a kind of intellectual contrarian daring to ask the difficult questions, somehow ended up promoting Ivermectin and got thrown off YouTube, and then appeared to go completely off the rails and got wrapped up in paranoid American libertarian culture wars, getting disowned by Sam Harris and others in the process. It’s amazing how quickly things can spin out of control these days.
But this G&D thread is fast becoming political, argumentative and conspiracy based, while sensible discussion continues in the Bear Pit. Perhaps it would be better if this one remained on topic, given that it was originally for the many unfortunate people who have caught covid at Christmas. Some space and sympathy seems more appropriate than a thread hijack.
that was a brand new keyboard (one of the snazzy dark grey Apple ones) and no more coffee beans for another brew.
Debatable!
You certainly display signs of Cultist behaviour with your blind devotion to a single blonde figure!
Ah, now Apple - that's a cult.
Wishing everyone a peaceful and hopefully merry Christmas.
To everyone recovering - i hope its a quick and mild process - lets hope for a better 2022 !
cheers
Matt
the only computer that runs my digital back software, and the editing software i use without issues.
as opposed to the tory party who struggle to run anything...
I've been sick for three weeks now. Started with a slight cough that went away. Then the cold/flu symptoms escalated to the point that I pretty much slept through Saturday-Tuesday. Coughing constantly and struggling to breathe effectively.
The family has been convinced I have COVID, but I tested every day and did a PCR test on Monday- every test come back clear.
Doc prescribed Amoxycillin suspecting a secondary chest infection. I've have three tablets and a good sleep and feel so much better today. Just typing this feels like a big step!
For anybody looking to do something practical and worthwhile as the booster programme ramps up, both St John Ambulance and the NHS Volunteer Responders Programme provided by Royal Voluntary Service are registering interest for individuals willing to act as patient advocates, post-vaccination observers, sites stewards or volunteer vaccinators. Training is provided and many employers are offering volunteers special paid leave to support the NHS in delivering this mission. Details on how to register are here:
https://www.sja.org.uk/what-we-do/Co...virus-vaccine/
https://nhsvolunteerresponders.org.u...ward-volunteer
Don't just do something, sit there. - TNH
Sorry to hear that, hope you feel better soon.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
As opposed to your devotion to the cult of the BBC?
Last edited by oldoakknives; 22nd December 2021 at 16:19.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
Where have I said I was devoted to the BBC?As opposed to your devotion to the cult of the BBC?
Where are my posts of fulsome praise for the great director general and the BBC?
Don’t you think it would be strange to be devoted to an institution that as I have stated above does not reflect my views?
I realise critical thinking isn’t your forte but just because I am still able to defend it by recognising this situation which I believe indicates that it is more likely to be balanced is not cultist behaviour. That is a prime example of being open minded.
Therefore, I am not surprised your mistook it for devotion, as this is just another example of you are not reading things fully, making assumptions and jumping to conclusions as per usual OOK.
Where have I said I was devoted to the BBC?
Where are my posts of fulsome praise for the great director general and the BBC?
Don’t you think it would be strange to be devoted to an institution that as I have stated above does not reflect my views?
You're the one defending them old chap....
I realise critical thinking isn’t your forte but just because I am still able to defend it by recognising this situation which I believe indicates that it is more likely to be balanced is not cultist behaviour.
Eh?
That is a prime example of being open minded.
Therefore, I am not surprised your mistook it for devotion, as this is just another example of you are not reading things fully, making assumptions and jumping to conclusions as per usual OOK.
I realise that your lack of understanding is mostly driven by your eagerness to show off, and that explains your rather abrasive personal comments.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
Plead guilty to being in that one!
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
Some of us, at least.
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
I know forums are all about discussions but I really think this thread needs to get back to the original posters point, or somewhat near to it.
On that note, we had our septic tank emptied today, ( we know how to live, lol ), and the guy was telling me that very early on in the pandemic he had what he thought was a very bad cold, but it was different to what he'd had before, temp going up and down, smell and taste very strange, doctors couldn't really put their fingers on what was wrong. Since then he said he could be driving along and become really really tired, so much so that he would have to pull over and wait for it to get better, when I told him that I get exactly the same thing after having covid he was made up, he actually said I had made his day by confirming he wasn't going mad and imagining it, ( I didn't get a discount on the tank emptying though!! ).
If it's any consolation it feels like there is some mega lurgy going around that isn't COVID but comes close to it... I had three back to back chest infections (or I assume they were) in October I think.. was ill almost constantly for about 6 weeks, had three different courses of antibiotics... Felt like total crap. Awful cough that kept me awake all night for days at a time. Always tested negative for COVID (both lateral flow and PCR) so.. weird one. Maybe just badly weakened immun system from not being around people for the better part of a year and a half!
Had a chest infection and horrible cough for most of November. Definitely not Covid as had lft and PCRs in period. I got my booster last Friday and again thankfully no reaction at all. Let's see what Xmas holds
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On the plus side, losing your sense of smell is just the ticket if you are going to be emptying septic tanks.
Yeah OK. None of those quotes prove your point that I am devoted to the BBC. Look up the definition of devotion. It doesn’t say defence!
Can I remind you that the one thing you didn’t quote was the key post. When I stated I don’t agree with their point of view most of the time! That’s a pretty key point and hence why I say you are not reading and understanding as per usual.
Some good news in the headline, but unfortunately the small print is still worrying:
Researchers looking at real-world coronavirus cases in Britain reported Wednesday that the omicron variant of the coronavirus appears to be less severe than the once dominant delta strain. Early evidence from Scotland and England suggests that omicron is sending fewer people to the hospital. That surveillance tracks well with the latest observations from South Africa, where public health officials have reported that omicron is tending to result in milder illness. Scientists had not been sure whether that finding would hold elsewhere. “This is a qualified good news story,” said Jim McMenamin, National Covid-19 Incident Director at Public Health Scotland and one of the co-authors of the Scottish study. Public health experts remain worried that a sudden, massive surge of a highly infectious but less virulent omicron variant could still flood hospitals with very sick patients. New daily coronavirus cases recorded in Britain exceeded 100,000 on Tuesday for the first time in the pandemic.
Prime Minister Boris Johnson has said his government is watching the data but would not call for stricter measures to fight spread until after Christmas at the earliest. The early research from Scotland was led by the scientists at the University of Edinburgh, in a well-vaccinated population not too different from the United States. The power of the study lay in the wealth of data kept by the National Health Service in Scotland — records of vaccine status, age, gender, underlying health conditions and covid-19 infection for nearly 98 percent of the Scottish population. The study, which has not yet been peer reviewed, found that people infected with omicron were almost 60 percent less likely to enter the hospital than those infected with delta, the dominant strain around the world for much of 2021. The Scottish scientists said recently vaccinated people appear to have some protection against symptomatic infection from omicron, but less so than against delta. A third dose or booster of an mRNA vaccine was associated with a 57 percent reduction in the odds of developing symptomatic covid. Boosters gave better protection against the delta variant — more than 80 percent. The researchers estimated the potential for reinfection 10 times more likely with omicron than with delta. The numbers they were working with were small but statistically significant, they said — if omicron acted the same as delta, they would expect 47 people to have been admitted to hospital so far. Currently, there are only 15. The scientists said there were not enough omicron infections and hospitalizations among those over 60 years to reach confident conclusions, but they expected the overall trend would hold.
The evidence that omicron was causing less severe illness in England came out of Imperial College London. That group, led by Neil Ferguson, reported that those infected by omicron were 15 to 20 percent less likely to go to an emergency room with severe symptoms and 40 percent less likely to be hospitalized overnight, when compared to those infected by delta. Ferguson also urged caution. “Our analysis shows evidence of a moderate reduction in the risk of hospitalization associated with the omicron variant compared with the delta variant,” he said. “However, this appears to be offset by the reduced efficacy of vaccines against infection with the omicron variant.” Ferguson stressed that given the high transmissibility of the omicron virus, “there remains the potential for health services to face increasing demand if omicron cases continue to grow at the rate that has been seen in recent weeks.” South Africa’s top infectious-disease scientist, who has been leading the country’s pandemic response, told The Washington Post on Wednesday that the country had rapidly passed the peak of new omicron cases and, judging by preliminary evidence, he expected “every other country, or almost every other, to follow the same trajectory.” South Africa, though, has a younger average age than countries in Europe or the United States, and it was not in the middle of a delta surge when omicron arrived.
WaPo
Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.
That’s interesting Raffe, this part got my attention the most though.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
I've been following John Campbell for the last few months,he's been very good with the data.
Latest one has a clip from the Aussie pm which is interesting and hopefully we follow suit.
https://youtu.be/LVl5OkHcvf4
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Just discovered John Campbell. Really enjoy his no nonsense, but useful information.
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