Electric cars-got to be a viable option now?

[Franky Four Fingers]

To put it into context, my comment was in respect to those people who can get the Taycan on a salary sacrifice scheme and are paying tax at the 60% rate; they are still paying a grand a month for the car but the reduction in take home pay is only £400.

I don’t believe that there is a lease deal at £400pcm as thst would just be mental.

I Got you

[RobDad]

I’ve joined a couple of EV forums recently and it’s not what I expected. Most posts seem to be about software issues tbh, never a mention of the environment - in fact they don’t really seem like car forums at all!

[Mj2k]

To put it into context, my comment was in respect to those people who can get the Taycan on a salary sacrifice scheme and are paying tax at the 60% rate; they are still paying a grand a month for the car but the reduction in take home pay is only £400.

I don’t believe that there is a lease deal at £400pcm as thst would just be mental.

If that was a lease deal, everyone would be in one.

Despite rumours, they didn’t appear on our updated list which at least means I can happily keep one that sounds like a car!


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[Mj2k]

I’ve joined a couple of EV forums recently and it’s not what I expected. Most posts seem to be about software issues tbh, never a mention of the environment - in fact they don’t really seem like car forums at all!

I would not have expected them to talk about the environment, they can’t individually know the benefit they have made, and with so much tech in them, I’d see that the natural focus of topic / frustrations.


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[Dave+63]

Which takes me right back to my post where I said Eagletowers post re the Porsche dealers comment was believable.

[RobDad]

I would not have expected them to talk about the environment, they can’t individually know the benefit they have made, and with so much tech in them, I’d see that the natural focus of topic / frustrations.


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I agree - I just think it’s interesting that once people buy into an EV, it all becomes a bit computer geeky. I’ve decided to take the plunge - but there’s not even much talk of range or charging, it’s all software updates and settings menus.

[Mj2k]

Which takes me right back to my post where I said Eagletowers post re the Porsche dealers comment was believable.

100% with you on that, £400 a month is a no brainier for such a car, performance and quality interior to be in. Aside from sacrifice, you can’t achieve that level of car.

A 4th friend now has one, and now driven my second for an extended period. Great fun, getting the settings right is critical (forgot who mentioned that earlier), but still prefer slower & louder!

Equally as ours are all paid for in cash, the idea of a monthly cost just makes me feel meh.


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[Franky Four Fingers]

I agree - I just think it’s interesting that once people buy into an EV, it all becomes a bit computer geeky. I’ve decided to take the plunge - but there’s not even much talk of range or charging, it’s all software updates and settings menus.

Guess it depends on the car and forum, I'm on the ID forums and FB groups and range and the guessometer is a constant focus of discussion.

[Taxboy]

I agree - I just think it’s interesting that once people buy into an EV, it all becomes a bit computer geeky. I’ve decided to take the plunge - but there’s not even much talk of range or charging, it’s all software updates and settings menus.

But that's the new driving experience - unlike an ICE there's no injector, valve, timing chain issues etc to discuss, which you get in the usual car forum

Not saying that it's bad just different

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[Passenger]

But that's the new driving experience - unlike an ICE there's no injector, valve, timing chain issues etc to discuss, which you get in the usual car forum

Not saying that it's bad just different

Sent from my moto g(7) plus using Tapatalk

I´ve owned a new Ice car, it´s 5th birthday was this year...I´ve not once had to give a thought to any of those things you mention, just get in the thing and drive to where I want to go...I´m so turned off by tech I can´t begin to tell you...that EV owning people feel it necessary to ask for advice and help from others about software updates, settings menus, share their tech frustrations...makes me anxious, puts me off EV´s just reading about it...IF I spend money on something new, to me that should be for a simpler, easier experience-life... not require Me to then waste my time on upskilling, up knowledge on Computer geekery...sigh...and what´s with this new driving experience...it ain´t new you´re still driving the thing down the road, it´s not a flying car is it, like we were promised in the future! More pain, cost too, no real gain! Probably more spent on coffee´s too, if-when charging the thing out in public.

[Franky Four Fingers]

I´ve owned a new Ice car, it´s 5th birthday was this year...I´ve not once had to give a thought to any of those things you mention...I´m so turned off by tech I can´t begin to tell you...that EV owning people feel it necessary to ask for advice and help from others about software updates, settings menus, share their frustrations...makes me anxious just reading about it...

Not just EVs now though P, tbh i view all cars now as way too techy. Mind you some EVs are all done through the screen so i get your point.

[cyrusir]

I´ve owned a new Ice car, it´s 5th birthday was this year...I´ve not once had to give a thought to any of those things you mention, just get in the thing and drive to where I want to go...I´m so turned off by tech I can´t begin to tell you...that EV owning people feel it necessary to ask for advice and help from others about software updates, settings menus, share their tech frustrations...makes me anxious, puts me off EV´s just reading about it...IF I spend money on something new, to me that should be for a simpler, easier experience-life... not require Me to then waste my time on upskilling, up knowledge on Computer geekery...sigh...and what´s with this new driving experience...it ain´t new you´re still driving the thing down the road, it´s not a flying car is it, like we were promised in the future! More pain, cost too, no real gain! Probably more spent on coffee´s too, if-when charging the thing out in public.

That’s just new cars

[Passenger]

Not just EVs now though P, tbh i view all cars now as way too techy. Mind you some EVs are all done through the screen so i get your point.

It´s a bugger FFF... the phenomenon seems to be everywhere...IF as the adage goes, it´s simple to be happy but difficult to be simple...Why on earth has everything become more bloody complicated!!! Who are the true beneficiaries? Sure we´re clever monkeys not denying it but the tech needs appear to have taken on a life of their own, that´s before getting into AI...while we´re still at heart- brain, very much the same monkeys. So who is really gaining from the ´progress´.

Sorry slight topic segue.

[Passenger]

That’s just new cars

Fair point, I´m sure the tech- screen in ours can do all sorts, but apart from the radio which even a Ludd like me can work, I´m not required to engage with any of its higher functions to make the car do it´s primary purpose, drive.

[cyrusir]

Fair point, I´m sure the tech- screen in ours can do all sorts, but apart from the radio which even a Ludd like me can work, I´m not required to engage with any of its higher functions to make the car do it´s primary purpose, drive.

An ev shouldn’t be an issue then it could scarcely be easier to drive to be honest

[Franky Four Fingers]

It´s a bugger FFF... the phenomenon seems to be everywhere...IF as the adage goes, it´s simple to be happy but difficult to be simple...Why on earth has everything become more bloody complicated!!! Who are the true beneficiaries? Sure we´re clever monkeys not denying it but the tech needs appear to have taken on a life of their own, that´s before getting into AI...while we´re still at heart- brain, very much the same monkeys. So who is really gaining from the ´progress´.

Sorry slight topic segue.

Not sure who benefits from them tbh, probably people who really shouldn't be on the road in the first place. My car has a whole bunch of gadgets that I've not really used…as for the wife she touches nothing apart from the stop and go pedals and occasional turns that round turny thin in the middle. Heated steering wheel is ok, the ability to cool, heat or defrost the car from inside the house is nice but is it really essential of just making us a bunch of lazy twats?
I remember when we all used to be satisfied with electric windows and a cd player.

[Passenger]

An ev shouldn’t be an issue then it could scarcely be easier to drive to be honest

I imagine a bit like when driving in America,mostly no gears, you just pop in drive, then point and press...a dull experience.

[walkerwek1958]

while we´re still at heart- brain, very much the same monkeys. So who is really gaining from the ´progress´.

A reasonably intelligent monkey could probably maintain my 1970 MGB too......some would say he does!

The degree of modern tech in the latest cars puts me off, wifeys 2017 Focus is bad enough, the car's supposed to be able to park itself but neither of us have the nerve to try it. Handbook's 400 pages long too.

All I want in an everyday car is an automatic with reasonable performance, comfortable, and a good stereo player that'll play CDs. Provided the car's got electric windows and remote central locking I`m happy, I don`t want anything else. I don`t care about the age or the badge on the front any longer, I do like a nice sensible colour (none of that hideous dull grey or beige crap that seems fashionable) and silver alloy wheels (NOT black, looks shite).

EV would make some sense for me, I have a big drive so a charging point isn`t a problem, and I do mostly short local driving. But the cost to buy one puts me right off, when my Jag finally bites the dust I won't spend big money on a replacement, currently I`d have to do that for the dubious privilege of owning an EV so it makes no sense.

Just paid £320 to tax the Jag for a year (ouch), that's over 10p/mile, but depreciation on a 13 year old car is zilch so I guess it evens up.

[Passenger]

Not sure who benefits from them tbh, probably people who really shouldn't be on the road in the first place. My car has a whole bunch of gadgets that I've not really used…as for the wife she touches nothing apart from the stop and go pedals and occasional turns that round turny thin in the middle. Heated steering wheel is ok, the ability to cool, heat or defrost the car from inside the house is nice but is it really essential of just making us a bunch of lazy twats?
I remember when we all used to be satisfied with electric windows and a cd player.

Lazy, soft ´clever´ monkeys, our lunch gobbled up by smarter, faster AI?

[Passenger]

A reasonably intelligent monkey could probably maintain my 1970 MGB too......some would say he does!

The degree of modern tech in the latest cars puts me off, wifeys 2017 Focus is bad enough, the car's supposed to be able to park itself but neither of us have the nerve to try it. Handbook's 400 pages long too.

All I want in an everyday car is an automatic with reasonable performance, comfortable, and a good stereo player that'll play CDs. Provided the car's got electric windows and remote central locking I`m happy, I don`t want anything else. I don`t care about the age or the badge on the front any longer, I do like a nice sensible colour (none of that hideous dull grey or beige crap that seems fashionable) and silver alloy wheels (NOT black, looks shite).

EV would make some sense for me, I have a big drive so a charging point isn`t a problem, and I do mostly short local driving. But the cost to buy one puts me right off, when my Jag finally bites the dust I won't spend big money on a replacement, currently I`d have to do that for the dubious privilege of owning an EV so it makes no sense.

Just paid £320 to tax the Jag for a year (ouch), that's over 10p/mile, but depreciation on a 13 year old car is zilch so I guess it evens up.

Seems we´re singing from pretty much the same hymn book. Thinking we might well look at an EV, do have a drive, but not until the prices return to earth and the current car´s still performing well.

[Dave+63]

EV would make some sense for me, I have a big drive so a charging point isn`t a problem, and I do mostly short local driving. But the cost to buy one puts me right off, when my Jag finally bites the dust I won't spend big money on a replacement, currently I`d have to do that for the dubious privilege of owning an EV so it makes no sense.

When your jag packs up, and I agree that theres little point in changing it until it does, you’ll undoubtedly find plenty of EVs within whatever budget you set for your next car.

With regards to tech, we all just use what we want and leave what we don’t. Just because it’s there, it doesn’t necessarily have to be used. EVs are literally push and go; they are the easiest vehicles in the world to drive. Everything else is really just fluff.

[Mj2k]

A reasonably intelligent monkey could probably maintain my 1970 MGB too......some would say he does!

The degree of modern tech in the latest cars puts me off, wifeys 2017 Focus is bad enough, the car's supposed to be able to park itself but neither of us have the nerve to try it. Handbook's 400 pages long too.

All I want in an everyday car is an automatic with reasonable performance, comfortable, and a good stereo player that'll play CDs. Provided the car's got electric windows and remote central locking I`m happy, I don`t want anything else. I don`t care about the age or the badge on the front any longer, I do like a nice sensible colour (none of that hideous dull grey or beige crap that seems fashionable) and silver alloy wheels (NOT black, looks shite).

EV would make some sense for me, I have a big drive so a charging point isn`t a problem, and I do mostly short local driving. But the cost to buy one puts me right off, when my Jag finally bites the dust I won't spend big money on a replacement, currently I`d have to do that for the dubious privilege of owning an EV so it makes no sense.

Just paid £320 to tax the Jag for a year (ouch), that's over 10p/mile, but depreciation on a 13 year old car is zilch so I guess it evens up.

Agree completely on the auto park. Briefly engaged it on a previous car but took control very swiftly as I like my black alloys black & not showing silver through them.

Disagree on black alloys not looking good, depends on the car & vibe.

I do toy with a Taycan through the usual route, but possibly many years ahead with an EV and fewer with modern ICE, so will stick presently. Cannot justify 4 cars with 2 of us, and my mileage is so low as I no longer have a commute, so weekend mileage only.

Coffee and Cars at Thruxton tomorrow, will be interesting to see the EV turnout. Cannot recall at the Motorshow at Farnborough earlier in the year there being a Tesla club or equivalent there vs lots of the other owner clubs.

Given there was even an MG club there (not the proper ones, the Rover rebranded ones), I’d have thought there would be some show types of owners, who knows.


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[Tooks]

Agree completely on the auto park. Briefly engaged it on a previous car but took control very swiftly as I like my black alloys black & not showing silver through them.

The first car I had with auto park was the Golf GTE, called park assist.

I tried it and it duly found the space at the side of the road, took my hands off the wheel and let it do its stuff. The subsequent experience had me calling it ‘park like a tw@ assist’ as it set off backwards at a rate of knots with the steering wheel whirring at wrist breaking speeds, and braked very abruptly when I felt sure it was going to hit the car behind.

But park successfully without damage it did. Being a bloke, I didn’t read the manual until after I’d tried it, and only upon reading it did I see the crucial information that the driver ‘should moderate the speed of the auto parking using the brake pedal’…

What a muppet! It was a good system, very competent once I learned how to use it, but it was one of those features that left me feeling ‘why’, as I prefer to park myself.

[cyrusir]

I imagine a bit like when driving in America,mostly no gears, you just pop in drive, then point and press...a dull experience.

Well it’s a comfortable experience, most modern cars are auto anyway , evs have no gears and are far smoother than the auto diesels you see with their stop start etc

[Mj2k]

The first car I had with auto park was the Golf GTE, called park assist.

I tried it and it duly found the space at the side of the road, took my hands off the wheel and let it do its stuff. The subsequent experience had me calling it ‘park like a tw@ assist’ as it set off backwards at a rate of knots with the steering wheel whirring at wrist breaking speeds, and braked very abruptly when I felt sure it was going to hit the car behind.

But park successfully without damage it did. Being a bloke, I didn’t read the manual until after I’d tried it, and only upon reading it did I see the crucial information that the driver ‘should moderate the speed of the auto parking using the brake pedal’…

What a muppet! It was a good system, very competent once I learned how to use it, but it was one of those features that left me feeling ‘why’, as I prefer to park myself.

Genuinely laughing at the imagery of that!


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[stuie-t]

The electric unit price goes negative for a few hours tonight with Octopus Agile so a 35kwh top-up on my e-tron should earn me about a pound!


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[Franky Four Fingers]

The electric unit price goes negative for a few hours tonight with Octopus Agile so a 35kwh top-up on my e-tron should earn me about a pound!


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Think its less that that tbh, they pay us for a few hrs and the highest it goes between midnight and 05.30 is just over a penny.

[stuie-t]

-4.20p between 1:30 and 2:00 and averaging -2p for most of the night according to the app?


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[Franky Four Fingers]

-4.20p between 1:30 and 2:00 and averaging -2p for most of the night according to the app?


Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app

Midnight to 00:30 is -2.21
00:30-01:00 is 1.06
01:00-01:30 is 1.08
01:30-02:00 is -4.41
02:00-02:30 is 0.10p
then its well in to negative until 5.30.
Your bill will be nowhere near a quid

Sorry My bad…read it wrong. Yes earn you a pound sorry!!

[ryanb741]

The first car I had with auto park was the Golf GTE, called park assist.

I tried it and it duly found the space at the side of the road, took my hands off the wheel and let it do its stuff. The subsequent experience had me calling it ‘park like a tw@ assist’ as it set off backwards at a rate of knots with the steering wheel whirring at wrist breaking speeds, and braked very abruptly when I felt sure it was going to hit the car behind.

But park successfully without damage it did. Being a bloke, I didn’t read the manual until after I’d tried it, and only upon reading it did I see the crucial information that the driver ‘should moderate the speed of the auto parking using the brake pedal’…

What a muppet! It was a good system, very competent once I learned how to use it, but it was one of those features that left me feeling ‘why’, as I prefer to park myself.

The issue I've always found with self parking cars is that particularly with parallel parking it only works if there's enough space to get an Airbus A380 in the gap. That's no use whatsoever in London. I had it on my previous Audi and Velar but my Tesla doesn't have it (unless you pay the extra £4k or so to activate it).

[Mj2k]

The issue I've always found with self parking cars is that particularly with parallel parking it only works if there's enough space to get an Airbus A380 in the gap. That's no use whatsoever in London. I had it on my previous Audi and Velar but my Tesla doesn't have it (unless you pay the extra £4k or so to activate it).

Yeah it’s not the most space efficient is it. Despite all the clever tech, likely due to the cars all indicating imminent collision with 3ft to spare - it has no chance with this parameters.

Loved my Intravee box in my old E85/86 Z4s could have the really old fashioned low res display give you cm / inches from each sensor. That let you get some proper parking on. Amazed we rely on colour and beeps vs proper facts that can help more.

[wileeeeeey]

Yeah it’s not the most space efficient is it. Despite all the clever tech, likely due to the cars all indicating imminent collision with 3ft to spare - it has no chance with this parameters.

Loved my Intravee box in my old E85/86 Z4s could have the really old fashioned low res display give you cm / inches from each sensor. That let you get some proper parking on. Amazed we rely on colour and beeps vs proper facts that can help more.

The Tesla tells you in inches which is great but once it gets to something like 12 inches it replaces the exact measurement with the word STOP! Really annoying but you can always use the camera (for the back anyway)

[gunner]

My two Volvos have the 360° camera which is brilliant for manoeuvring. XC90 has self park but I never use it.

[Tahiti]

I found myself toying with a work salary sacrifice electric X1 in a quiet period of time on Friday. Circa £400 per month essentially all in (insurance, maintenance etc). I can see the draw for many people.

For those on these schemes, it crossed my mind what would happen if a future government adjusted BIK. I know a change is already built in to the future numbers (the price quoted rises on the projections as the tax year changes) but let’s say that Toyota came up with a wonderful alternative to electric that could be mainstream and the government pivoted as they did with diesels, could you find yourself on a 3 or 4 year lease and scuppered with a BIK change?

Off at a tangent, I then found myself looking at iPace’s second hand and they offer a lot of car for the money on the face of it.

Electric makes perfect sense for my usage these days I’d say, but I still found myself naturally more interested in cars that burn something.

[Tooks]

For those on these schemes, it crossed my mind what would happen if a future government adjusted BIK. I know a change is already built in to the future numbers (the price quoted rises on the projections as the tax year changes) but let’s say that Toyota came up with a wonderful alternative to electric that could be mainstream and the government pivoted as they did with diesels, could you find yourself on a 3 or 4 year lease and scuppered with a BIK change?

I suppose the answer is they could be, but any such paradigm shift would take longer to achieve than your average lease.

Off at a tangent, I then found myself looking at iPace’s second hand and they offer a lot of car for the money on the face of it.

Just be aware of the huge insurance premiums some have been quoted with them, but if you can get a sensible quote they do appear to be good value at the moment.

[Taxboy]

I found myself toying with a work salary sacrifice electric X1 in a quiet period of time on Friday. Circa £400 per month essentially all in (insurance, maintenance etc). I can see the draw for many people.

For those on these schemes, it crossed my mind what would happen if a future government adjusted BIK. I know a change is already built in to the future numbers (the price quoted rises on the projections as the tax year changes) but let’s say that Toyota came up with a wonderful alternative to electric that could be mainstream and the government pivoted as they did with diesels, could you find yourself on a 3 or 4 year lease and scuppered with a BIK change?

Off at a tangent, I then found myself looking at iPace’s second hand and they offer a lot of car for the money on the face of it.

Electric makes perfect sense for my usage these days I’d say, but I still found myself naturally more interested in cars that burn something.

Its always a possibility but worse case scenario what's the BIK on an equivalent ICE for you. No government is going to tax EVs harder than diesel/petrol plus it's unlikely to be an immediate cliff edge - although you never know with politicians!

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[noTAGlove]

Thousands of people in Kingston navigating this successfully this afternoon

I have seen no grazed elbows, knees or disgruntled wheelchair users.

[noTAGlove]

My two Volvos have the 360° camera which is brilliant for manoeuvring. XC90 has self park but I never use it.

And it auto brakes for if you ignore the rear parking beeps and you keep reversing on the monotone.

[Mr Curta]

Thousands of people in Kingston navigating this successfully this afternoon

I have seen no grazed elbows, knees or disgruntled wheelchair users.

It’s difficult to tell from a photograph but that looks like a much more gentle profile than the cable protector you use across the pavement. But it sounded like virtually no footfall (or wheelfall) at the times you were using it so no big deal.

[Chris_in_the_UK]

It’s difficult to tell from a photograph but that looks like a much more gentle profile than the cable protector you use across the pavement. But it sounded like virtually no footfall (or wheelfall) at the times you were using it so no big deal.

It's not DDA compliant, neither is noTAGlove's version.

Matters not if it works, it only matters when it does not and it involves somebody who is minded to try and claim. Always best to do it correctly from the get go.

[Mr Curta]

It's not DDA compliant, neither is noTAGlove's version.

Matters not if it works, it only matters when it does not and it involves somebody who is minded to try and claim. Always best to do it correctly from the get go.

Does it need to be if there's a reasonably close alternative route that is DDA compliant?

[noTAGlove]

Still a tough crowd.

[Mr Curta]

It's not DDA compliant, neither is noTAGlove's version.

Matters not if it works, it only matters when it does not and it involves somebody who is minded to try and claim. Always best to do it correctly from the get go.

This cable protector ramp looks just like the one in the image below to my untrained eyes, and claims to be DDA compliant. What am I missing?

https://www.truesoundhire.co.uk/hire...rotector-ramp/

[Snowdon]

I was surprised to see that the Costco charger just kept on giving me power today. I thought they were capped at 2h at 7kwh per hour?

I got 20 kWh by the time it came to leave.

[gunner]

You were at Costco for 3hrs?! I'd rather pay for electricity

[Chris_in_the_UK]

This cable protector ramp looks just like the one in the image below to my untrained eyes, and claims to be DDA compliant. What am I missing?

https://www.truesoundhire.co.uk/hire...rotector-ramp/

Might be - a lot of the newer stuff has a longer and shallower lead in/out.

[gunner]

Quick update after 12 months of all electric Volvo C40 use. Covered 5k miles @ an average of 37kWh per 100km.

Pros:
Quick, quiet etc, exactly as you'd expect
Cheap to run as still not used a public charger and lots of free charging over the summer from solar
Much better mileage in the summer, more like 20-25kWh per 100km

Cons:
Range definitely not the 280 miles suggested, probably more like 220 unless you turn everything off
"mpg" not as good as I see others quoting
Terrible rear visibility (the XC40 would be a smarter choice)
Software has had a few glitches and really not much of an improvement on the 65 plate XC90

Overall:
Not perfect but definitely a viable option for our particular set of requirements.

[Passenger]

Quick update after 12 months of all electric Volvo C40 use. Covered 5k miles @ an average of 37kWh per 100km.

Pros:
Quick, quiet etc, exactly as you'd expect
Cheap to run as still not used a public charger and lots of free charging over the summer from solar
Much better mileage in the summer, more like 20-25kWh per 100km

Cons:
Range definitely not the 280 miles suggested, probably more like 220 unless you turn everything off
"mpg" not as good as I see others quoting
Terrible rear visibility (the XC40 would be a smarter choice)
Software has had a few glitches and really not much of an improvement on the 65 plate XC90

Overall:
Not perfect but definitely a viable option for our particular set of requirements.

Interesting thanks...am I right these are about a 50k car new, if buying one, not on a scheme?

[gunner]

Interesting thanks...am I right these are about a 50k car new, if buying one, not on a scheme?

More like £60k, from memory, not that I'd pay that for it. Ours is on a salary sacrifice/company car scheme.

[Passenger]

More like £60k, from memory, not that I'd pay that for it. Ours is on a salary sacrifice/company car scheme.

Thanks.