Electric cars-got to be a viable option now?

[Passenger]

New Tesla Model 3 coming out next month, stop faffing about with BMWs and the like, this will be the class leading car again with the best network, best standard equipment (rear seat video entertainment is standard!). Elon is a cretin but his cars are still best in class.

Can it finally drive itself, as was promised by Elno some time ago I´m led believe?

[walkerwek1958]

It's a long time since I learned to drive (1975), hand signals had just been phased out!

The driving test has to evolve and change with the times, the manual/auto debate is a tricky one because learning to use gears and clutch on a manual car is a fundamental part of being able to control it safely, possibly one of the hardest parts of learning in my view.

Mrs W and I drive automatics as everyday cars, I`ve owned mine for 12 years and I`d never go back to a manual for day to day driving. My 1970 MGB is a different matter, a classic car should always be manual IMO but even I find it strange going back to a car with manual and overdrive.

I don`t plan to buy another car anytime soon, but it'll be a tough decision when I do. My head says I should consider a small electric or chargeable hybrid, I`ve plenty of driveway space for charging etc and I don`t drive far, but my heart says get another nice big turbo diesel, I love 'em.

[Lazydonkey]

First experience of NEEDING to use a public charger last night.

Google maps took me to a plug point near to where i needed to be - tick

Loads of spaces - tick

Hmm pod point haven't got that app.

Hmmm don't have reception down in this car park

Get logged into wifi

Download app

Register app

Plug in and start charging

Yes it works, go to the pub

In the pub check the car and it's stopped charging

F*cking thing

Walk back to car park and find out that i needed to hit "committ"

Hit commit and then i don't have enough funds in my account.

Ah didn't know i had to pay.

Add money to account...how much do i need? Doesn't tell me the charging tarrif

F*ck it, £10 it is

Ok it's charging now.

Walk away and finally enjoy my night.

Come back and it's added more than enough range and it's cost me £6 I'll take that.

The next time i use that system it will be easier but it wasn't a great first experience and i can totally see why people get so frustrated. The availability of the chargers is one issue but even when they fix that there is a huge problem with the proliferation of different apps and providers.

And i only NEEDED charge as the dino juice powered car isn't well and threw a warning light, but it was an interesting experiment.

[StackH]

New Tesla Model 3 coming out next month, stop faffing about with BMWs and the like, this will be the class leading car again with the best network, best standard equipment (rear seat video entertainment is standard!). Elon is a cretin but his cars are still best in class.

I'm inclined to agree, although moving the indicators from a stalk on to the steering wheel is, in my opinion, a dangerous design decision. I guess they don't have to think about roundabouts in the US.

And doesn't the UK have to wait until 2024 to be able to buy the new M3? Europe in October I believe, but not us.

[noTAGlove]

New Tesla Model 3 coming out next month, stop faffing about with BMWs and the like, this will be the class leading car again with the best network, best standard equipment (rear seat video entertainment is standard!). Elon is a cretin but his cars are still best in class.

I’m never going to be a Tesla lemming. Too many of them on the road. Boring buying option. Ford Cortina of the 2020s.

At least with some other brands of EV cars, like my C40, you barely ever see another one on the road, and I like that.

I’d take the new Volvo EX30 over a Tesla any day. Starting price is £10k cheaper too.

[Chris_in_the_UK]

Pirate copies then!

I know it’s a joke paying through the nose for a bit of software but is it any worse than paying through the nose for a Rolex when fakes are available for peanuts?

Pirate, yes.

If they want to use it as a revenue stream then they at least should have the ability to make it so it can't be copied quite so easily. At least with the BMW stuff you have to provide a chassis number etc. before you receive a unique activation code - once it's activated it is no good even if it's copied by someone.

[Chris_in_the_UK]

Elon is a cretin but his cars are still best in class.

The fact that he is involved is enough to stop me ever having one TBH.

[Dave+63]

I’m never going to be a Tesla lemming. Too many of them on the road. Boring buying option. Ford Cortina of the 2020s.

At least with some other brands of EV cars, like my C40, you barely ever see another one on the road, and I like that.

I’d take the new Volvo EX30 over a Tesla any day. Starting price is £10k cheaper too.

That’s the great thing these days, we all have a choice of EVs and are no longer restricted to one or two options.

[Michael 38]

I understood they were phasing out manual/automatic tests and that you could take a test in either. I can immediately find the evidence to back that up, but I'm sure I read it.

In the article it said that auto outsold manual annually now, with most manufacturers having more autos than manuals due to strict emission regulations.

Personally I've not owned a manual car for 10+ years.

I have a volvo and I don't think they have even made a manual for 4 or 5 years

[Michael 38]

The fact that he is involved is enough to stop me ever having one TBH.

I think your safe he seems to have his uninvited nose stuck firmly in the Ukraine war at the moment

[Dave+63]

Pirate, yes.

If they want to use it as a revenue stream then they at least should have the ability to make it so it can't be copied quite so easily. At least with the BMW stuff you have to provide a chassis number etc. before you receive a unique activation code - once it's activated it is no good even if it's copied by someone.

So it’s their own fault for not making it harder to copy?

It’s always going to be IP theft, and who’s to know whether there’s some Trojan malware sneaked in just for good measure?

[dougair]

New Tesla Model 3 coming out next month, stop faffing about with BMWs and the like, this will be the class leading car again with the best network, best standard equipment (rear seat video entertainment is standard!). Elon is a cretin but his cars are still best in class.

Except for the interiors which have more than a whiff of IKEA budget line furniture. Always thought the cabin was a horrible place to be.

[Tooks]

New Tesla Model 3 coming out next month, stop faffing about with BMWs and the like, this will be the class leading car again with the best network, best standard equipment (rear seat video entertainment is standard!). Elon is a cretin but his cars are still best in class.

The ‘outgoing’ M3 is still a very good EV, note I say EV as it’s just an average car.

I like the styling tweaks to the nose and tail, the interior tweaks and the sound insulation are much needed in my opinion. Moving indicators to buttons on the steering wheel though, mad idea.

I hope they fix the paint as well, whilst ours was beautifully painted with no orange peel or panel gaps, the blue paint itself is very thin/soft and prone to horrendous stone chipping.

I had to fit the £50 paint protection pack on the front of the rear wheel arches after a few thousand miles, the paint would be gone by now otherwise. Those patches should be standard.

Best in class EV? Possibly if efficiency is your only interest, and the new model is supposed to be better again, but there are equal or better EVs across a balance of needs, never mind cars.

[bigweb]

So over 2 weeks and counting without my Taycan Turbo now after it was put out of action by rodents.

Called Porsche again today as they haven't called me back and got told they haven't had the time to start on the job yet because it is a big job and they will try get to it next week!

It's like I'm an inconvenience to them because Porsche decided to make the wiring loom out of some plant-based material rats love to eat!

The service manager just tells me that the car is very technological and they only have a few people who can work on them.

Sounds like I will have been without my car for close to a month and when I get it back I also have to pay them £4k for the privilege of fixing my "in warranty" car all while it's probably depreciating at the rate of £2k per month!

In the meantime I'm driving a BMW hire car (supplied by them)

Can't be right this can it?

[Chris_in_the_UK]

So it’s their own fault for not making it harder to copy?

It’s always going to be IP theft, and who’s to know whether there’s some Trojan malware sneaked in just for good measure?

I am not accusing anybody of anything, I simply pointed out that this was freely available on eBay, nor am I condoning it's purchase and subsequent use (malware included or not).

[Franky Four Fingers]

So over 2 weeks and counting without my Taycan Turbo now after it was put out of action by rodents.

Called Porsche again today as they haven't called me back and got told they haven't had the time to start on the job yet because it is a big job and they will try get to it next week!

It's like I'm an inconvenience to them because Porsche decided to make the wiring loom out of some plant-based material rats love to eat!

The service manager just tells me that the car is very technological and they only have a few people who can work on them.

Sounds like I will have been without my car for close to a month and when I get it back I also have to pay them £4k for the privilege of fixing my "in warranty" car all while it's probably depreciating at the rate of £2k per month!

In the meantime I'm driving a BMW hire car (supplied by them)

Can't be right this can it?

Yeh, they don’t care. When they say they have only a handful of techs who can fix it that’s probably right. Dealers of all makes and models generally have only a few master techs or specific techs that can work on certain cars, electric cars of course even more so. As for the organic materials used for cars, been happening for years, JLRs are essentially made out of cream cheese and rodents make a B line to them
Fuel tanks on Defenders, small elbow breather, the spout is made out of cheddar and they love it.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[noTAGlove]

So over 2 weeks and counting without my Taycan Turbo now after it was put out of action by rodents.

Called Porsche again today as they haven't called me back and got told they haven't had the time to start on the job yet because it is a big job and they will try get to it next week!

It's like I'm an inconvenience to them because Porsche decided to make the wiring loom out of some plant-based material rats love to eat!

The service manager just tells me that the car is very technological and they only have a few people who can work on them.

Sounds like I will have been without my car for close to a month and when I get it back I also have to pay them £4k for the privilege of fixing my "in warranty" car all while it's probably depreciating at the rate of £2k per month!

In the meantime I'm driving a BMW hire car (supplied by them)

Can't be right this can it?

https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/www.porsche.com

Not as reassuringly expensive as you think, and as your experience illustrates.

[mrushton]

Bit of a doom monger piece in the Telegraph today about reluctance for ev's

[Tooks]

Bit of a doom monger piece in the Telegraph today about reluctance for ev's

Have they ever written a positive piece?!

I seem to see more and more on the roads, whilst I think the meteoric rise in sales bubble has punctured, it’s merely deflated to sensible year on year growth.

Used EVs are coming down in price and becoming within reach for more and more people too, which can’t be a bad thing.

[RobDad]

Auto's the norm in the US, been thus for a long time.

Oddly manual models of the same car have lower emissions than an auto. I’ve only ever owned 1 automatic car - a Volvo XC60 - didn’t really enjoy it - and my wife positively hated it! Mind you we live in the countryside now so very rarely crawl in traffic. Tbh it’s the main reason we just bought 2 new ICE cars, really enjoy a manual gearbox, we must both be weird! I will say my wife is an extraordinarily good driver in a swift little car, all heel and toe and deft with the wheel, like being in the Italian job when we first met and she gave me a lift across town in her 205 gti. Something sexy about that level of skill - that was 35 years ago and I still find it a bit sexy!!

[Passenger]

Oddly manual models of the same car have lower emissions than an auto. I’ve only ever owned 1 automatic car - a Volvo XC60 - didn’t really enjoy it - and my wife positively hated it! Mind you we live in the countryside now so very rarely crawl in traffic. Tbh it’s the main reason we just bought 2 new ICE cars, really enjoy a manual gearbox, we must both be weird! I will say my wife is an extraordinarily good driver in a swift little car, all heel and toe and deft with the wheel, like being in the Italian job when we first met and she gave me a lift across town in her 205 gti. Something sexy about that level of skill - that was 35 years ago and I still find it a bit sexy!!

My American Missus, somewhat against the grain, prefers to drive stick... just more engaging, fun than auto point a press.

[Pitch3110]

This week marks three years and 45k miles in my Model 3 Performance and I have genuinely had a blast, loved every minute.

Yes, the quality of the early yank built ones are not great (and after 20 years of BMW and Audi) and the black paint is not the best. Lights, interior materials and the odd glitch aside the car had been faultless with SC staff and service superb and so refreshing from the b@locks of the upper end marques customer service.

The super charge network is a breeze and still makes Tesla the go to for any serious EV distance travelling. Yes, public network improves with each passing year but boy they can charge.

The performance is simply bonkers and I don’t know if I would bother next time, I’m sure the LR is the best option.

Pitch

[Mj2k]

Have you seen/considered these - from Flat Power ?



Just popped up on my LinkedIn feed.

https://flatpower.tech/

z


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Looks a smart solution that, assuming weighted to keep it in place and allows push / wheel chairs ability to cross without taking part in some Red Bull sporting event.

A luminescent coating would have been the final full marks for me; hope they do well with the initiative.

[jaytip]

So over 2 weeks and counting without my Taycan Turbo now after it was put out of action by rodents.

Called Porsche again today as they haven't called me back and got told they haven't had the time to start on the job yet because it is a big job and they will try get to it next week!

It's like I'm an inconvenience to them because Porsche decided to make the wiring loom out of some plant-based material rats love to eat!

The service manager just tells me that the car is very technological and they only have a few people who can work on them.

Sounds like I will have been without my car for close to a month and when I get it back I also have to pay them £4k for the privilege of fixing my "in warranty" car all while it's probably depreciating at the rate of £2k per month!

In the meantime I'm driving a BMW hire car (supplied by them)

Can't be right this can it?

Give Cleevely EV a call and explain your problem to them. They may be able to fix it much cheaper than the main dealer.

[adrianw]

It’s insurance renewal time again, every year the electric car goes up whereas our ice cars go down, LV we’re the lowest last year at. £700, the renewal quote us £1200, who are people finding good for electric cars at the moment?

[noTAGlove]

It’s insurance renewal time again, every year the electric car goes up whereas our ice cars go down, LV we’re the lowest last year at. £700, the renewal quote us £1200, who are people finding good for electric cars at the moment?

Out of interest do you live in a low, medium or high risk postcode?

[Tooks]

It’s insurance renewal time again, every year the electric car goes up whereas our ice cars go down, LV we’re the lowest last year at. £700, the renewal quote us £1200, who are people finding good for electric cars at the moment?

My LV quote went up last year, so switched to Admiral who were cheaper than I had been paying with LV.

Insurance is such a personal thing though, you just need to find the insurer that matches your risk profile. I’m still amazed at how much they vary, the higher ones being ‘we don’t want your business’ pricing.

[adrianw]

Out of interest do you live in a low, medium or high risk postcode?

Just checked, B which I assume is medium, It hasn’t changed

[Mj2k]

Just checked, B which I assume is medium, It hasn’t changed

Medium risk here too, before the wife’s 3 points were added, the increase from existing was ludicrous, but still the cheapest.

BIL was dirt cheap to add to insurance for the last few months, 36p from memory. Suddenly he has become a £100 liability.

Whatever the AI running behind the scenes, it needs a serious update, unless the CEO has just hit the PROFIT button on his business modelling solution.

[Middo]

I’m a lotus fan, but the new EV saloon and SUV are ugly as hell.

[Franky Four Fingers]

I’m a lotus fan, but the new EV saloon and SUV are ugly as hell.

The Envya?

[Middo]

Lotus still make great sports cars the EV included

[bigweb]

Give Cleevely EV a call and explain your problem to them. They may be able to fix it much cheaper than the main dealer.

Just had a look at them. If they were closer I would probably get it lifted to there.

I think I am just going to lose the plot with Porsche Customer Services today and try to get as much goodwill payment as poss.

I love the cars and have had Porsche before but the grief I have had with this one since I got it will definitely make me think again about buying another from the brand

[MB2]

Looks a smart solution that, assuming weighted to keep it in place and allows push / wheel chairs ability to cross without taking part in some Red Bull sporting event.

A luminescent coating would have been the final full marks for me; hope they do well with the initiative.

There is also Kerbo Charge who cut a slot in the pavement for the cable. If the OP is using the 3pin each night then maybe an EV charger once a week would be a good way to reduce the risk ?

https://www.kerbocharge.com/#howitworks

[noTAGlove]

Just had a look at them. If they were closer I would probably get it lifted to there.

I think I am just going to lose the plot with Porsche Customer Services today and try to get as much goodwill payment as poss.

I love the cars and have had Porsche before but the grief I have had with this one since I got it will definitely make me think again about buying another from the brand

You have to wonder why such premium brands can offer such poor customer service.

I can only think that they believe that they have such a long line of future aspirational customers who dream of owning a Porsche, that there is not as much need to keep potential repeat customers completely satisfied with the brand.

[noTAGlove]

There is also Kerbo Charge who cut a slot in the pavement for the cable. If the OP is using the 3pin each night then maybe an EV charger once a week would be a good way to reduce the risk ?

https://www.kerbocharge.com/#howitworks

I love those photos of beautifully tarmacs flat pavements.

Our pavement has been dug up and re-dug up multiple times for a multitude of cables and water meter etc.

Not sure the solution is appropriate for anything but a flat pavement, and ours is anything but.

[Brian]

Just noticed in the local Fiat dealer - Fiat 500 electric £31k...................Errrrrr................Just saying 🤣🤣🤣

Ec's are Ok if yiou have a home charger and only use that - at the moment that is on a good tarriff.

The road tax comes in 2025 and, currently using the extensive public charge network, it means that you are paying more than a diesel driver.


B

[noTAGlove]

Just noticed in the local Fiat dealer - Fiat 500 electric £31k...................Errrrrr................Just saying 🤣🤣🤣

Ec's are Ok if yiou have a home charger and only use that - at the moment that is on a good tarriff.

The road tax comes in 2025 and, currently using the extensive public charge network, it means that you are paying more than a diesel driver.


B

List prices are what you paid 12 months ago.

Deep discounts available on EVs now.

https://youtu.be/KMNbrxJdSWo?si=BQLszR_LX3l9ka6l

[bigweb]

You have to wonder why such premium brands can offer such poor customer service.

I can only think that they believe that they have such a long line of future aspirational customers who dream of owning a Porsche, that there is not as much need to keep potential repeat customers completely satisfied with the brand.

Landrover are the same, Most Rolex AD's too. It's just a complacency thing and it pisses me off massively. I'm sure that the Super premium buying experience exists (Yachts, Rolls-Royce, Jets etc) but as a person who isn't even close to that I don't think I've ever even experienced a premium buying experience.

[Dave+63]

Just noticed in the local Fiat dealer - Fiat 500 electric £31k...................Errrrrr................Just saying 🤣🤣🤣

Ec's are Ok if yiou have a home charger and only use that - at the moment that is on a good tarriff.

The road tax comes in 2025 and, currently using the extensive public charge network, it means that you are paying more than a diesel driver.


B

£22k here

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-det...02211282059486

But agreed, still a fair whack more than ICE

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-det...02307199817780

As for your subsequent comments, that may be your opinion but that’s all it is and clearly not everyone shares that opinion.

[Brian]

£22k here

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-det...02211282059486

But agreed, still a fair whack more than ICE

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-det...02307199817780

As for your subsequent comments, that may be your opinion but that’s all it is and clearly not everyone shares that opinion.

The comment on the diesel costs was from an AA report. up yours

https://www.petrolprices.com/news/aa...running-costs/

B

[Lazydonkey]

To be fair they were using those petrol 500s were used by the romans so not exactly a cutting edge car right now. Not really apples for apples.

EDIT : Fun fact, the entire budget for the 500 project was paid for when FiAT sold the panda platform to Ford to use for their Ka. As such, even though it's stupidly cheap they still make great margins on them.

[Dave+63]

The comment on the diesel costs was from an AA report. up yours

https://www.petrolprices.com/news/aa...running-costs/

B

Don’t believe everything you read; if the report said that driving a diesel can be cheaper, then it would have merit. Saying it is cheaper (by definition under all circumstances) then it can’t really be taken seriously as it’s just not true!

Very mature response btw.

[adrianw]

Still trying to get a comparable insurance quote to last year for the Ipace, the companies that will quote are considerably more than last year, Aplan are having difficulty getting anyone to quote.

Has anyone else insured ther electric car recently? And who with?

[Dave+63]

Still trying to get a comparable insurance quote to last year for the Ipace, the companies that will quote are considerably more than last year, Aplan are having difficulty getting anyone to quote.

Has anyone else insured ther electric car recently? And who with?

I wonder if it’s just the ipace? That would explain why prices of used ones are dropping like a stone.

[adrianw]

I wonder if it’s just the ipace? That would explain why prices of used ones are dropping like a stone.

Could be, Aplan told me out of 29, 22 companies no bid and the others were very high. Aviva no bid, so did Direct line

I think they’ve worked out how much they cost to fix , the taycan fiasco can’t do EVs any favours

[ryanb741]

Nope it is all EVs. Repair costs are high, also performance can be very high even on base spec models (eg the cheapest Tesla Model 3 will accelerate faster than a Porsche Boxster or Cayman) so I suspect quite a few drivers with heavy right feet may be contributing to the increase

[Tooks]

Could be, Aplan told me out of 29, 22 companies no bid and the others were very high. Aviva no bid, so did Direct line

I think they’ve worked out how much they cost to fix , the taycan fiasco can’t do EVs any favours

Did Admiral return a quote?

I insured the ID.4 GTX with them at the end of May.

Maybe the I-Pace is an expensive thing to repair, the motors are Jaguar only I believe and doesn’t it use aluminium extensively in the chassis/body construction?

[adrianw]

Did Admiral return a quote?

I insured the ID.4 GTX with them at the end of May.

Maybe the I-Pace is an expensive thing to repair, the motors are Jaguar only I believe and doesn’t it use aluminium extensively in the chassis/body construction?

The Ipace is made by Magna so I would have expected a fairly high percentage of shared parts, obviously I don’t know what Jaguar dealers charge to fix them

[adrianw]

Nope it is all EVs. Repair costs are high, also performance can be very high even on base spec models (eg the cheapest Tesla Model 3 will accelerate faster than a Porsche Boxster or Cayman) so I suspect quite a few drivers with heavy right feet may be contributing to the increase

This will be the fifth time we have insured it, last year it increased a bit, this year it seams that the market has changed completely