Originally Posted by mycroft
Well there is that... But I do think that parts of it succinctly sum up the community spirit with just a few inconsiderate gits out to spoil things.
I take it you don’t agree with the legislation that was introduced in 1994 to restrict ticket touts?
They (touts, scalpers, whatever you call them) artificially inflating the market in restricted supply items and as a result governments reacted.
Thinking that capitalism and market forces will always prevail is wrong!
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Isnt stubhub and co just as bad as ticket touts?
Not really the same , they arnt restricted supply either .
Goods are sold the world over for a profit , it’s called Capitalism . It has good sides and bad like most things but at least it allows people to make a living and also supply good people would not necessarily be able to obtain.
If a guy wants to sell something for a certain price and another would pay more then that’s life I’m afraid . It’s pointless bitching about it . Otherwise you have a state run scenario pretty much like what people are suggesting on here in relation to buying items on SC and not being able to offer at a fair market price !
So could you explain why ticket touting has been made illegal? Surely they are just “people who make a living and also supply good people would not necessarily be able to obtain”?
Please explain what the difference between an illegal ticket tout and somebody buying a Rolex SS sport purely to make a profit (and denying somebody else the purchase in the process)?
Why is one illegal and the other seen as a provider of a service?
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Isnt buying cheap and selling for a profit exactly what grey dealers do ??
Stuart
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Its exactly what any commercial outfit in the business of selling things does. From Asda to AD's to Greys. This is not news.
Could sellers simply state that traders should hold off making a purchase until after a predetermined time? Or until the seller indicates on their thread that traders are welcome to purchase.
Obviously the seller wouldn’t necessarily know if the buyer is a trader but if the item ever came up for sale (externally) at least there would be some kind of redress possible eg, a ban or warranted forum flaming!
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Do some research!
Last edited by Tomaitch; 8th May 2018 at 18:14.
I’m really not seeing the problem here.
As long as sellers are at liberty to sell to whomever they choose, then it is the seller’s choice. They can sell to a ‘hoover’, or to anyone else for that matter.
I’ve sold and bought a fair few watches in my day and be i the seller or the buyer, I want to know who I’m dealing with. In my mind, that’s just good sense. So I’ll do my DD. If I’m not happy I either don’t fork out any money or don’t sell the watch.
It sounds like some would like a utopian situation where there is simply no need. While I agree it’s a lovely sentiment, it just isn’t realistic. There will always be a need to conduct some due diligence. The exceptions will be few, in the grand scheme.
So if buyers and sellers alike take the time to know who they’re dealing with, they get to make an informed decision to buy or to sell.
I don’t see that the situation is any more complicated than that and so I’m not sure where the ill feeling comes from....
Because the dealers are being underhand and not declaring their intent.
Because the dealers tend to watch SC more often and move quickly thus taking watches out of “our” normal circulation.
Because the watches they buy are are just to make a quick buck.
for example.
I get that.
How is this anything but a lack of DD on the part of the seller? I think I’ve read in the posts that the dealers are not difficult to spot, well known in some cases. One performs some DD and then simply declines the sale.... or accepts.
It reads like a case of sour grapes over missed bargains in some, but not all, cases. I’m not sure I see this as a genuine problem.
When you’ve been here a while I’m sure you’ll come to realise that it is an issue.
Sales corner is not eBay or gumtree or just another Internet sales platform; it’s actually quite special and built on trust. When that trust is broken, it is an issue.
Once you’ve been here long enough to gain full access to SC, you’ll start to appreciate its uniqueness. It’s one of the reasons that there are rules governing access.
Everyone loves a good effort at patronising, thanks for that.
Doesn’t sound like anyone’s trust has been broken. Everyone got what they bargained for. Watches were bought, money was paid. Sour grapes were had after the fact.
That’s not a breach of trust, that’s immaturity.
If you don’t want to sell to dealers, don’t. If you don’t want to find out you sold to a dealer, do your due diligence.
I’ll show you “thanks for your message about my random watch - I’m interested in doing a deal but I like to keep watches in the community as far possible. I hope you don’t mind but I wanted to ask if you’re a dealer.”
Simple. The seller’s interest in the watch is over the moment the deal is done. Some members may not feel that way, but they’d be quite wrong. The only way to keep an interest in it, is to keep it or to lay terms. There was a gentleman above who asked for first refusal when watches he has sold are sold on - that seems a nice agreement to have.
Saying that someone who sells a watch you have sold them on at a profit is a breach of trust is naive.
You are being very naive, and overly simplistic.
Yeah, whatever!
You haven’t even seen SC yet but obviously know it intimately.
I’m sure that’ll work!
Nonsense. You’re reading things into transactions that aren’t there and you are looking to govern things that, in the nicest way, are none of your business.
You’re looking to fight the nature of business. There aren’t too many occasions where that has gone well.
What a mature response.
SC was never intended to be about commerce. It was to allow enthusiasts a safe trading platform among themselves.
Sadly, due to the rapid expansion of social media & the constant 'pushing at boundaries' that is part of modern life, it's rather been left behind.
______
Jim.
It was the response your post deserved!
I’ll tell you again before I leave this thread; sales corner isn’t like other sales platforms. It has evolved in a different way from the norm as a platform where like minded individuals can share experiences of different watches at “mates rates”.
Yes, it’s changing still and into more of a normal market place but there are still members who deal in the old way ie. sell watches cheaply so that others may enjoy them.
When the stealth dealers (note the word stealth- amateurs who think they’re Arthur Daley!) sweep up these cheap watches to flog on eBay or elsewhere, it further erodes the old SC. That’s why people don’t like it, it’s nothing to do with sour grapes or jealousy!
The open and honest dealers are welcomed with open arms and respected for the insight they can give. As a rule, they font bug from SC because the margins aren’t great enough. Occasionally they will see a bargain that no one else seems to want and will offer to buy it openly and only if no one else wants it.
It’s all about openness and honesty rather than underhand tactics used to make a fast buck!
Like I said before, once you’ve experience of SC first hand, maybe you’ll understand why profiteering and stealth dealing is frowned upon.
Shouting your mouth off about something you clearly have no knowledge or understanding of isn’t going to do you any favours!
It's indicative of the wider problem when people even struggle to grasp the concept of a club/community and that money and profit is a secondary issue.
Just doesn't compute for so many of our generation.
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I don’t know what it is that happened to you to make you so unpleasant to people you don’t know. I don’t like it, I can’t imagine you like feeling like that or being like that. I hope you work at it.
I understand the problem very well, I didn’t really need it rehashing for me. Thank you for taking the time. I was also glad you didn’t use any big words. Being extremely thick, I wouldn’t have coped.
And I’m not shouting my mouth off. I’m disagreeing. I’m allowed to do that from any platform. I suggest you go and have a word with yourself because if this is how you react to challenge about something immaterial, god only knows how your family will rely on you in a crisis.
I’m going to do what some of you bickering children ought to have done a long time ago, from some of the childish rants I read occasionally. I’m going to judge that you’re not worth any more time and choose to ignore you. If you can’t discuss without being vile, you’re a waste of my time.
This +1
Well summed up.
I understand post count feeds ego in many online communities but I’d expected better from watch enthusiasts. The idea that the price to play is expensive means one must have the way to acquire means before playing. People who can string a few pounds together tend not to be completely daft. Or so I’ve always liked to think.
So, it’s disheartening to see some quasi-tribal mentality when it comes to dissenting voices. If you want to be agreed with all the time, might I suggest talking to your dog?
In all my working days I’ve never met an intelligent person who concluded that anyone who disagreed with them didn’t understand or wasn’t worthy, or hadn’t qualified to have an opinion. That sort of bigotry would be more at home in right wing politics than a forum about watches.
I understand perfectly well the point, I don’t need to have experienced the sales corner to get it, just as one does not need to experience being shot to know it will hurt.
I don’t understand why, beyond apparent laziness or complacency, sellers don’t simply make enquiries if this is a concern. Buyers can lie, of course, but as people lie and the forum is made up of people, lying is inevitable (and wishing it were not so will not change that). Liars will only last so long if you have a heroes and villains section (I think I read you do).
So beyond a feeling of entitlement or a futile clinging to a sentimentality that won’t solve the problem, what’s to stop sellers doing their due diligence before releasing a piece?
Are you being deliberately obtuse? This place is a community, not a shop window. But you know that already... this isn't your first rodeo.
Sometimes verbosity isn't required.
This appears to be something that you have failed to absorb in the same way that the views on SC which oppose your own haven't sunk in either.
Not sure you've really grasped what this forum is about. Dave made some fair points and you took umbrage.
Time will tell whether you fit in on here or not....frankly it doesn`t look promising.
Paul
Wow.... if that means fitting in with an attitude like that, I’ll be happy to be an outcast.
Have you ever heard anyone say anything like what you wrote just there, and not wanted to laugh at them?
1950 called, they want their backward, elitist views back.
Suit yourself buddy
Can’t wait to see you over in the Bear Pit, PSTW.
PSTW?
Peterborough Sewage Treatment Works?
Might've been better to have used the Water Treatment Works as inspiration, because you're just talking sh*t.
I bet it took you all evening to think of that.
Why, oh why have you resurfaced with a different forum ID to post cr@p, again?
Go and get some help, seriously.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
I tried that, but Mr Smith fundamentally disagreed with everything I said...
Might be time to lay the Vicodin down on the table, take off the foil hat and stop talking to the fairies.
As ever (and previously) , you are unable to help yourself.
Go and get some help, seriously.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
What a strange thing to say. You’re quite odd.
What’s wrong with you that you get to being so personally unpleasant?
Last edited by PSTW; 9th May 2018 at 21:56.
Make no mistake, there are enough people here who recognise your behaviour and rhetoric - and my mate Kev who is ace at tracking down people via VPN's and other clever stuff.
As for odd?
Go and have serious look at yourself.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
I think it’s fair to say I’m not having any of your bullying nonsense. Perhaps it’s time for you and your mate to seek out sex and travel.
Fair?
What is fair about revisiting a forum under a new ID, posting nonsense and then claiming 'not me guv'?
You have become more pathetic in your short absence.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
Does everyone who disagrees with you get this treatment? You took this to eleven fairly quickly. I imagine you sat in someone else’s stolen underwear in a basement, fuming that anyone would dare speak against you.
And you’re telling me to get help. A guy this outwardly aggressive who has spent 30k plus posts worth of time on the internet thinks I need help. Don’t let anyone tell you that you don’t understand irony.
Not against me.
You have (again) disrespected the forum owner and it's members.
We know who you are and where you are.
Enjoy.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
That’s not a nice thing to say at all.
What do I do with that? Is it a threat? Do I call the police? Do I disregard it as nonsense? Am I expecting you to go through my bins or to sit outside my house?
Chill out man.
Mainly the dual ID's get this sort of treatment, deservedly so IMO. Do you deny you're one of them?
R
Ignorance breeds Fear. Fear breeds Hatred. Hatred breeds Ignorance. Break the chain.
Rather stop claiming to be 'new and offended' .
Do what you want - the boss will do likewise.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
Nice try pal, do not PM me ever again.
Go away and get yourself sorted, seriously.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
I think you’ve threatened me.
Was it bravado, do you mean to threaten? Are you telling me that you know where I live and are you implying I should be afraid of that?
And what am I meant to enjoy?
Those are very cowardly words.
If you don’t want a PM, have it here -
Do not private message me ever, ever again.
Make no mistake Chris, if you threaten me again in any way, I’ll report you to the police. This is your one warning. Nothing that may be going on in your head makes it ok to say something as malevolent as that.
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