Reply With QuoteWas it sold as waterproof Doug?
I bought a watch last week. Not a cheap watch, at least I don't think so, over £150Watch was delivered on time, no box, no warrantyn but I expected this, it was a vintage classic. Even so, one would have expected it to be serviceable??
It arrived on Monday. It was keeping perfect time, just about to the second in fact, dial and crystal were perfect, chronograph functions also functioned perfectly, so I was feeling quite content.
Yesterday morning, I got caught out in a shower, just a few seconds, before I got back into the house, and it was just a few seconds. I thought nothing of it. A couple of hours later, I glanced at the watch, and saw that there was a mist under the crystal, and two or three small droplets of water also!!!
I whipped off the case back, put the open case in a petri dish and put a vented cover on top, and then put it in a dish containing pellets of moisture absorbing crystals, and put it on a radiator. I refastened the caseback this morning, put it in the freezer for half an hour, and no condensation. Ther are no signs of rust on the movement.
I have contacted the main service agent, and an independent, and have got a price for a full service and re-seal from both.
I have also contacted the original seller, and explained the circumstances, and asked that given the fact that I had only been wearing the watch for 4 days, he might wish to meet the service costs 50/50 with me. I also told him that he was in no way at fault, and that because he probably had no way of knowing that the seals were gone (and in a big way) I could not hold him responsible.
Now, this is what really bugs me, quite apart from the fact that he has not offered to share the cost, he hasn't even bothered to apologise, and not even answered my PM. I know he has been on the forum since I sent it to him. Standards are seriously dropping!!
Was it sold as waterproof Doug?
Is it supposed to be water resistant?
There’s a lot of my vintage watches I wouldn’t get wet, even in that way.
Two sides I guess and depends what the Watch in question is.
I always try and put myself in the other person’s shoes, he may have had the Watch a while and never got it wet. He sells it, you get it wet and then expect some sort of warranty on a used Watch deal (is that even a thing?)
Just trying to offer a bit of balance but to be honest I’d just take it and move one if I were you. With vintage watches I’d always expect them not to be in any way water resistant. Anything old I buy I assume it’s got zero water resistance and quite often find the watches without gaskets even! I wouldn’t risk getting them wet until I’d personally satisfied myself that it was sealed. I’d say you’ve got to bare a fair amount of the responsibility given it’s an old watch and you essentially made the decision to get it wet before having it tested.
On the other hand if it was sold as serviced and sealed, that’s a different story.
Doug, you’ve two exact same threads running at the same time..maybe shut this one down.
^ Let sleeping dogs lie.
Agreed.Originally Posted by -Ally-
"Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action."
'Populism, the last refuge of a Tory scoundrel'.
A watch can leak in 3 places, ( around the glass, around the caseback seal, around the crown/ pushers) All are sealed in some way, and the seal can be compromised due to the material aging or the metal becoming scored/ pitted. Most vintage watches can be made splashproof again if the original design was water- resistant, but it’s a big mistake to assume an old watch will still be waterproof regardless of what it says on the dial. Once the seals are failing the watch will almost certainly have zero WR, and a few splashes of rain will be enough for water to find it’s way in.
Unless a seller will vouch for the watch being waterproof I would never trust a vintage watch to keep water out. I think the OP’s expectations gave been unrealistic in this case.
People bang on about water resistance and wanting 100metres minimum etc. What you really need us for the watch to keep the wet out under the conditions you’re exposing it to; 5 metres WR will keep the rain splashes out!
Paul
Last edited by walkerwek1958; 17th March 2018 at 21:54.
This is a duplicate of a closed, contemporaneous, thread here: http://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.ph...ected-too-much.
I have now and I’ve amended my comments re the PM etc.
For me (if I was the seller) it would depend if I believed the watch was waterproof or not. I wouldn’t like to sell someone something that they immediately had a problem with in normal use. It is a bit of a confusing one though - I have a JLC rated for 300m but not tested since manufacture so outside JLC’s recommendations. If I sold it and someone dived in it I think that would be their risk. If the watch was rated as waterproof and gave way in light rain I would probably help but I can see why the seller and purchaser are conflicted.
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To be honest even when people say it waterproof and even if I have had it confirmed back from a service on a vintage piece I don’t go near water?!?!
Ive not really read all the other thread but unless it had been guaranteed with proof of pressure test you can’t blame the seller surely??
If someone has a vintage watch that under your own initial description keeps perfect time then sells it as keeping perfect time but not serviced then surely that’s upto the next owner to pay??
If the owner got it serviced and then sold it for more money with this service plus guaranteed it was waterproof, then I suppose it goes back to the place it was serviced or if you felt the reason for water ingress was a crap service then go halves on a service from somewhere else??? That’s the only way I can see the seller being responsible in this situation?
Anyway, moral of the story is “don’t wear vintage near water”
Chris
I grew up in the 1960’s and witnessed the death of many watches on the wrists of the people around me. Droplets on the inside of the glass followed by a fruitless trip to an airing cupboard and a final resting place in the back of a drawer.
Admittedly, I didn’t know anyone who could throw the serious money needed at a top quality watch which would be successful at repelling the ol’ H20. The vast majority of watches were shite anywhere near the stuff and 50 years won’t have made them any better.
I really don't see how the seller is in any way at fault in this instance. It was working perfectly when it arrived, it's a vintage piece and it was damaged by getting wet in your use (rather than on the journey to you in the post for example). I wouldn't think of asking the seller to contribute if this had happened to me.
Now if it had stopped working just on its own and had just arrived then that's a slightly different matter, but in this case, I do understand why the seller hasn't offered to pay. Also why should he/she apologise? I'd be sorry for your situation but the seller has nothing to apologise for as it was all ok when not wet. Unlesss sold with certain promises etc.?
It's a crappy situation to be in with a busted watch now needing work done to it though Doug, so I do feel for you!
Last edited by hughtrimble; 18th March 2018 at 01:23.
**** Commenting on an identical copy of a locked thread seems to me something we shouldn't do ****
ooops, lost in translation.. but still, I wouldn't give you a single penny if I were the seller. Vintage = no water resistance.
Last edited by Evangelos; 18th March 2018 at 09:40.
I wasn’t going to comment again but this is hilarious.
Perhaps re-read post #1.
Absolute total utter rubbish.
Watches rated to 30 metres back in the 60s were fine, they did what they clamed. Sadly, the seal materials were poor and after a few years they deteriorated, leading to a WR of zero.
I regularly wear 50s/ 60s wachs with a nominal WR of 30 metres, I get them wet and they do NOT leak. The reason for this is simple, they’ve been restored by someone who knows what he’s doing......me!
Some folks walk the walk, some talk bollocks.....I rest my case.......I don’t make this stuff up. I was out last week with the dog, rain was running off my coat onto my wrist, 60s Omega was getting soaked .....no worries!
Paul
As I said, the watches in question were at the cheaper end of the market. Wind your neck in and don’t be rude.
You made a sweeping statement condemning everything out of hand, totally misleading. I find it v. frustrating, I spend my time working with old watches and getting good results, I try to give an informed input based on facts and I’ve little patience with anything that’s inaccurate.
Paul
+1
No I didn’t, it was a story about what used to happen to cheap watches when they got wet if you take the trouble to read it. It mentions that if you spent the money on quality then of course it was achievable. If that wasn’t clear to you I hope it is now. It would have been perfectly possible to add your experience and knowledge to this without jumping to conclusions and down my throat and being downright rude. It’s just a story about what I saw when I was a kid ffs.
Having read the OP's edited (now closed) post, I would like to take this opportunity to wish him well.
Last edited by TomGW; 18th March 2018 at 02:23.
First of all, My best regards to Doug, I do think that a lesson can be learned from this thread, unless the seller verifies the watch is waterproof then we need to assume that any watch sold on the forum may not be be waterproof as it was when manufactured, in this instance it was an old watch and perhaps we should definitely assume that any contact with moisture and it would fail. I think it is also safe to assume that unless a watch has been pressure tested or under warranty then it will not be safe to assume it will not allow moisture in should it be subject to any water contact. I will not assume in future but ask the seller to verify. Lets be honest, how many of us would assume that a 200 meter watch would be suitable for swimming if it was 3 years old?
Last edited by stevecross; 18th March 2018 at 09:13.
Yes me too, all the best mate.
Seriously?
"Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action."
'Populism, the last refuge of a Tory scoundrel'.
A big +1 to that! I have had a few dealings with Doug, he has always been a rock solid gentleman to deal with and I could not fault him in the slightest!
Likewise. All good wishes Doug.
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