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Thread: "Trip Advisor Review: Trying to Sell Fake Rolex, Greater M'cer & Merseyside 1/2/2018"

  1. #151
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    Sorry to revive this thread, but the nationwide circulation of Safergems' monthly newsletter has prompted a number of other businesses to confirm that a certain individual has been trying to peddle his poo further and wider still, visiting Edinburgh and Glasgow in the same week as we were lucky enough to see him. That now suggests at least eight attempts to sell in two days and it is reasonable to imagine there are more of which we are not yet aware. His previous travels around the country are being linked.

    I am puzzled to report that he has not yet made contact to see if we found his passport.

    It is not unreasonable to wonder if there is a white Mercedes 220 AMG WG66 HPX or a garage in Nottingham full of fake Rolex.

    Investigation continues.

    HM
    Last edited by Haywood_Milton; 12th March 2018 at 11:22.

  2. #152
    Grand Master Dave+63's Avatar
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    It makes you wonder if he’s actually sold a few on his travels.

    I’m sure there are plenty of less vigilant jewellers/pawnbrokers/cash converters who may not have looked so closely before buying.

  3. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave+63 View Post
    It makes you wonder if he’s actually sold a few on his travels.

    I’m sure there are plenty of less vigilant jewellers/pawnbrokers/cash converters who may not have looked so closely before buying.
    Indeed, only today I have been emailed to confirm that another jeweller was fooled and paid this clown £4,600 for a different fake Submariner, with "warranty card from Goldsmiths" : 1L06Y253. Payment by BACS? That'll make for a nice paper trail, at least.

    After the unwitting jeweller in turn sold it, condensation quickly formed under the glass and it was sent to Rolex for repair, where of course it was identified as fake.

    I do wonder how many more of these watches are entering the system. If not spotted when bought in, there is no reason to think such buyers will suddenly be able to spot them at any later stage. The fakes will then be sold to unsuspecting retail buyers, who perhaps take comfort in visiting a familiar or smart store on their high street.

    The case against Sir Bent Kingsley grows...meanwhile, how many similar pieces must be shifting through E-prey, Schmuck and all these other trading platforms?
    Last edited by Haywood_Milton; 20th March 2018 at 12:45.

  4. #154
    Craftsman P.Sheridan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave+63 View Post
    It makes you wonder if he’s actually sold a few on his travels.

    I’m sure there are plenty of less vigilant jewellers/pawnbrokers/cash converters who may not have looked so closely before buying.
    I would think there is no doubt about it. He is selling any number of them. Crime pays otherwise why would one bother.
    What baffles me is why he continues unhindered by police. Surely a low cost investigation could relieve him of his current stocks and charge him with something.

  5. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by P.Sheridan View Post
    I would think there is no doubt about it. He is selling any number of them. Crime pays otherwise why would one bother.
    What baffles me is why he continues unhindered by police. Surely a low cost investigation could relieve him of his current stocks and charge him with something.
    Patience...

  6. #156
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    You have to think he’s shifting a few a week.

  7. #157
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    I've turned up a bit late to this party Haywood, but I just wanted to add my expression of appreciation and awe. Brilliant story, well told and serious kudos to you and your team for taking this idiot on.

    Can't wait for the next instalment (I have a feeling that there will be one...).

    All the best,

    Simon

  8. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by Haywood_Milton View Post
    Indeed, only today I have been emailed to confirm that another jeweller was not so sharp and paid this clown £4,600 for a different fake Submariner, with "warranty card from Goldsmiths" : 1L06Y253. Payment by BACS? That'll make for a nice paper trail, at least.

    After the unwitting jeweller in turn sold it, condensation quickly formed under the glass and it was sent to Rolex for repair, where of course it was identified as fake.

    I do wonder how many more of these watches are entering the system. If not spotted when bought in, there is no reason to think such buyers will suddenly be able to spot them at any later stage. The fakes will then be sold to unsuspecting retail buyers, who perhaps take comfort in visiting a familiar or smart store on their high street.

    The case against Sir Bent Kingsley grows...meanwhile, how many similar pieces must be shifting through E-prey, Schmuck and all these other trading platforms?
    What a horrible tale. I hope the buyer got their money back, and I hope the jeweller had some kind of insurance so they weren’t out of pocket either (oh, and I hope they get their watchmaker or watch buyer retrained!)

    Surely with all of the evidence you gathered, and this development, the guy can be apprehended and charged? I doubt that he would get anything other than a slap on the wrist, but we live in hope.

  9. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by haberdashery View Post
    What a horrible tale. I hope the buyer got their money back, and I hope the jeweller had some kind of insurance so they weren’t out of pocket either (oh, and I hope they get their watchmaker or watch buyer retrained!)

    Surely with all of the evidence you gathered, and this development, the guy can be apprehended and charged? I doubt that he would get anything other than a slap on the wrist, but we live in hope.
    I would be sure that the retail buyer was refunded, but the jeweller cannot insure against such a loss.

    As for retraining their watchmaker or buyer......how and where do we expect anyone to learn other than the hard way, like everyone else? Years of research, record-building and some hard knocks along the way....I don’t see another route. It has been sad to see so many setting themselves up as “pre-owned watch specialists” overnight in recent years. It’s going to become a very expensive mistake now.

    As for “catch the rat” ...patience...
    Last edited by Haywood_Milton; 19th March 2018 at 19:22.

  10. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Haywood_Milton View Post
    I would be sure that the retail buyer was refunded, but the jeweller cannot insure against such a loss.

    As for retraining their watchmaker or buyer......how and where do we expect anyone to learn other than the hard way, like everyone else? Years of research, record-building and some hard knocks along the way....I don’t see another route. It has been sad to see so many setting themselves up as “pre-owned watch specialists” overnight in recent years. It’s going to become a very expensive mistake now.

    As for “catch the rat” ...patience...
    That’s bad news for the jeweller.

    I think the difference between now and times gone by, is the new breed of super fakes that are seemingly more and more like the real thing. The watch itself might be very hard to identify as fake (I have no idea, I’m not a watchmaker!), but the Goldsmiths thing on the warranty card is a dead giveaway. Isn’t there a UV strip on genuine cards too? Has that been successfully copied?

    Can’t disagree with anything else you have written, and the cream will certainly rise to the top. There’s a plethora of “pre-owned watch specialists” out there, but probably less than four or five I would actually trust and give my money too.

  11. #161
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    This would make a great TV series.

  12. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by bwest76 View Post
    This would make a great TV series.
    Haywood 'The Equalizer'

  13. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse View Post
    Haywood 'The Equalizer'

    Inspector Milton of the yard

  14. #164
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    Great write up OP. But terrible to think as the used prices of these creep ever upward, so does the payback for investing in higher quality counterfeits.

  15. #165
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    It's been the most useful thread for a very long time. Trouble is, counterfeiters have plenty of time to up their game. Buying an expensive Rolex outside the AD network means either finding a true expert dealer or, If buying privately, you now need to check the history of the watch back to the original dealer. Easier said than done sometimes.
    It's not a pleasant experience.

  16. #166
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    Thoroughly enjoyed reading this thread - nothing better than seeing the crooks getting called out and never a better reason to stick to credible channels as I research my first Rolex purchase. Love the reference to E-prey.

  17. #167
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    What a great post!! Thanks to the OP for the effort. Keep up the great work!


    Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app

  18. #168
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    It's a frightening thought that even seasoned dealers have fallen foul of these fakes & the cretins that peddle them.

    I've always felt I could tell a fake from a real Rolex, not so sure now.

  19. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by paskinner View Post
    It's been the most useful thread for a very long time. Trouble is, counterfeiters have plenty of time to up their game. Buying an expensive Rolex outside the AD network means either finding a true expert dealer or, If buying privately, you now need to check the history of the watch back to the original dealer. Easier said than done sometimes.
    It's not a pleasant experience.
    Tracking to the dealer who originally sold the watch? Won’t that be stamped on the warranty card? What then? Call the dealer and ask if they sold it?

  20. #170
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    Nothing is foolproof. But when I bought a late-model Rolex sports model through SC, I was able to speak to the original owner and was given copies of the sales receipt and copies of the credit card payment to the AD. Thus I knew the owners had paid the dealer for this watch.
    So I had the watch, box, properly filled-in guarantee card (with the buyers name and address on it) , matching serial number, sales receipt and credit card payment proof.
    All could be false, but that's vanishingly unlikely.
    In truth, the really crucial bit was being in touch with the chap who first owned the watch . A stalwart of SC.
    Paranoid? Maybe. But goodness, you stand to lose a lot of money.

    And I don't know if the AD would confirm anything directly because of laws on confidentiality, client privacy.
    Last edited by paskinner; 7th April 2018 at 16:19.

  21. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by paskinner View Post

    And I don't know if the AD would confirm anything directly because of laws on confidentiality, client privacy.
    I guess they could at least confirm whether they sold a certain serial or not.
    Last edited by Van Diemen; 7th April 2018 at 16:33.

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