Reply With QuoteGiven the recent expose regarding how good fakes are - I would get it serviced, and sell immediately after, with the provenance that the service provides. Ensure that serial number is included in service documentation
I’m looking for some advice as to the best route to sell my Rolex Daytona 16520, Zenith movement, white dial (I already know the best advice is don’t sell as prices are going up rapidly, but needs must as I need to help fund a house purchase).
My watch is a late model (P series) with solid end links. It keeps excellent time and is in pretty good condition. The bracelet is nice and tight, but it could do with a polish as it has quite a few desk-diving marks where I’ve worn it at work. I purchased it with no box and papers in April 2015. It came from a well-respected German dealer (100% positive feedback on Chrono 24).
My choices are:
1) To sell as is. I can provide the sales documents from the dealer as provenance.
2) Get it serviced at Rolex. This would sort out the bracelet polishing and would mean I could probably get more on sale.
What do you guys think? Is it worth going down route 2, or – with the cost of servicing built in – would I not be better off? If I was keeping it I wouldn’t consider a service as it’s running very nicely and I’d only scuff up the bracelet again.
For pricing context, the cheapest I can find on Chrono 24 is £12.6k and I’m guessing I’d get around £9.5-£10.0k from Watchfinder.
Thanks.
Given the recent expose regarding how good fakes are - I would get it serviced, and sell immediately after, with the provenance that the service provides. Ensure that serial number is included in service documentation
Values have jumped significantly over the last 12 months, as the 16520 is probably now seen as a 'vintage' model, long out of production, with finite numbers made, so becoming increasingly collectible. Not everyone likes the latest model.
However, values vary from £12k to £30k++, and there are plenty for sale and it's not easy to sell privately, especially without papers and provenance.
Firstly I would try here at, say, £12k. Or, Watchfinders and expect a bit less. They would get it Rolex Serviced, and sell it with a Rolex box for c.£15k.
You could get it Rolex Serviced (cost is always a risk, but c.£1k) and try and locate the correct box and booklets/accessories. It will then look virtually 'as new', with a 2 year Rolex Warranty and you could ask c.£14k on here.
I would start off by taking some good close up photos (plenty of them) and email them off to watchfinder to get a price from them. You should hear back from them by mid-week and if nothing else you will have a ballpark figure rather than your guestimate.
I don't see how a Rolex service card offers any provenance ... what is to stop a rouge seller getting a genuine watch serviced then switching it for the fake and selling it with the service card?
Would the serial number not be on the service documents?Originally Posted by Montello
If you trust the seller then it proves the provenance
The forum has to be based on trust and I would be assuming that the OPis not going to switch a watch after a service.
The P serials are slightly different to the earlier models with the luminova and Swiss marking on the dial. Some people like them, but I think a greater majority prefer the earlier tritium dials.
I would agree with Geneve's assessment, £12k 'as is' is perfectly reasonable and £13k to £14k if sold straight after a Rolex service with the stickers intact and a full two year warranty. WF would presently ask around £15k for your watch, but full sets seem to start closer to £20k which is crazy money.
Hood
Unfortunately Haywoods recent expose' has made it obvious that none of us can be trusted to confirm that our watches are genuine. The seller may believe it is genuine but was he himself conned.
If the market is being flooded with super quality fakes, then we need to operate under new rules of trust.
I would expect more people to buy from an established bricks and mortar shop and less from private sales.
Mick
Mick, Hood’s “trust the seller” comment was in response to a comment about whether one could rely on a very recent RSC service card.
If RSC confirms a watch is genuine, the risk is limited to if the owner does something dodgy. That’s where trust comes into the equation.
The super-cautious would still have one option: to meet the vendor at RSC and take possession the moment that the service bill is paid and the watch released.
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Yes I know but my point being that if these HQ fakes do indeed flood the market, who cares about trusted private sellers anymore. I am not questioning their integrity, just their ability to know that a watch is really genuine.
This is not new - for as long as there have been fakes around, someone could have fallen victim to such a piece and resold it on still believing it to be the genuine article. Nothing is new about that, and unless you've previously thought 'Well this seller says it's real, so it must be', you've already been aware that the item could be iffy, no matter the seller's faith in it.
caveat emptor
Yes very true but the problem being that for all of us, if Haywood is right, verifying watches will be much more difficult , so we need more Caveat Emptor.
This is why I suspect more punters will soon buy more from dealers and less from private sellers.
I would have Rolex service centre fit a new link or something trivial. They will inspect the watch and provide you with a receipt.
Then sell and let the new owner decide what they would like to do service wise.
It's just a matter of time...
Mick if the watch comes straight from service(which obviously confirms it’s legit) then the only other person in the chain is the seller. So if you trust the seller there isn’t a problem.
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Hood
If the watch is say 18 months old and not now stickered - then what, do I believe the watch is genuine ?
Why not just stick it on SC, with all the facts and back story and allow potential buyers to make their minds up.
I purchased a box no books Zenith last year from an independent jewellers and on a credit card so have some degree of protection. If I were to sell I’d get an RSC service done and try and add the booklets.
GLWTS.
^ This is good advice. Then get a quote from WF and sell it on SC ^ Or keep it and enjoy owning a Zenith Daytona that will only increase in price.
Possibley so Mick, but buy the seller equally applies to dealers. The issue is at present that punters cannot walk into Goldsmiths and the like and buy SS sports models because they don't have them in stock. The next port of call is a second hand or grey B&M establishment, some like Haywood offer a great level of protection, others like your local Cash Converters, less so.
Yes and this will be at the expense of private deals. It is bound to happen.
I think some of the reactions are possibly going overboard.
Based on one fake watch we are writing off the entire second hand Rolex market now?
I would perhaps wait for some more evidence of it being a problem before making such drastic assumptions.
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stick it on the SC !
FYI - last time I got a Zenith serviced it cost me > 700 € and that was 3 years ago.
If you want a hassle free sale I would go with watchfinder if you are happy with their quote.
James
I like that idea; thanks.
Thanks to all for the advice.
I will also go to Watchfinder initially to get a 'base' price and work from there.
More overboard than Goldie Hawn imo.
I'd stick it on SC AND see what happens. Then ring around a few dealers who specialise in used Rolex with watchfinder as a last port of call.
Nope they are the last run of the Zeniths (A&P’s with SEL’s) and are being snapped up by collectors today. Only early ones trumph them IMO.
If you can’t tell a fake from the real thing buy new or do more homework lads. Put it on SC and if nessasary have it opened and take lots of snaps for your sales post. Someone will thank you in a few years :-)
M
If the watch has been serviced and has then only been in the hands of Tz members with a bit of history then yes after 18 mts I am happy to assume that the watch is as it should be.
Its a bit like sending off thousands of pounds for a watch you haven't seen.Its done on trust so the time span changes nothing in that respect.
Ok and say the TZ member had bought it off a non TZ member, unstickered with a bit of paper ( dead easy to fake) claiming to be a Rolex receipt. Do you trust the TZ member to be able to determine if the watch was genuine or not. How many people actually check that the receipt is genuine ?
The simple fact is that a HQ fake raises the odds of being conned and the easiest people to con are members of the public, so it is more risky buying off private individuals.
That wasn't the original scenario though.
The original statement was to say that if a watch has beeb serviced by a reputable watchmaker or Rolex and then only a TZer has had it then I think it is safe to assume it is genuine.
You are now introducing other people into the chain which of course changes things in that regard.
That's my point, with thousands of sale you are going to get thousands of scenarios.
I have a 16520. I bought it off a guy I did not know but I went to his house and he was affluent and looked stable and honest etc. The watch had a 2 yr guaranteed (now expired) from an independent watch maker and I still have the receipt. I have owned the watch for 20 months.
Simple question - if you wanted a 16520, would you buy mine ?
Yes
Are you selling?
You said yes - Then frankly you are taking a chance after what Haywood said yesterday. I could be sitting on a really good fake for all you know. I took it in to the local AD who has a damn good workshop and he pronounced it genuine, however I have no evidence to support that and who is to say that I am not lying in order to promote the sale. I don't think I would now buy a Daytona off a private seller as it ain't worth the risk. I would pay the ADs profit as a comfort factor.
Am I selling it, Possibly but not here, the Bear Pit crowd would slice the advert and me to ribbons, so it would go somewhere else.
Didn't have you down as yellow Mick!
Having taken the advice on here, I have today received an estimate from Watchfinder (see below). I will sell the watch, but I’d prefer to let someone on the forum have it if I could match the top-end of the Watchfinder estimate. I’ve had three messages from members already expressing a potential interest on the back of this post. I’ll give those guys first refusal, but if there’re no takers will take some pictures on Sunday and put up a for sale post. Thanks again for the input.
Thank you for your recent enquiry regarding selling the watch listed below (purchasing reference XXXXXX).
Rolex Daytona 16520
Subject to inspection, our initial offer is between £10,000 and £11,000. This estimate is valid for 7 days.
In order for us to make you a final offer, we will need you to send your watch to us to be checked by one of our experts. Once this is done, we will email you with a quote.
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