They are only air guns, used mostly for tin can shooting or vermin. They weren't bought with a Home Alone type situation in mind I assure you! But they are good quality ones with laser sights and magazine loading so could be handy in a worst case scenario type situation (they are perfectly legal and do not require a licence to own, and legal to discharge provided you have the land owners permission and it's not within 50 feet of a public highway).Originally Posted by td1596
The pepper spray a friend gave to me, he'd brought some back from Prague when he'd been living there, and I never got rid of it although I am of course aware it's illegal in the UK. Again, I didn't go out and think "right, I must buy some pepper spray to defend my castle". All said items are way beyond the access of children.
It's not a "look at me and how tough I am" type post, quite the opposite, and plenty of people keep something handy just in case. As I said before, I'd hand over valuables in a heart beat rather than create a confrontational situation and put my family at risk, all I'm saying is if I was absolutely forced to defend my family from some lunatic these are the things I have to hand. Don't see why that's such a big deal.
Last edited by davidj54; 24th December 2017 at 23:08.
Yes I've seen these, they let off a pungent scent that can briefly stun, and an identifying mark that stays on for 3 days. They don't contain the same noxious chemicals as pepper spray or CS gas so are legal in this country. I think you can get them on eBay and Amazon.
Well I have shotguns and plenty of ammo which are both stored in two seperate biometric gun safes. One is a standard 5 or 7 gun safe I think with a seperate locker at the top only accessed once in the safe. The second one is another biometric safe however this is the wide and deep version but only maybe 10” High I suppose and this is an actual ammo safe so this is my choice for all our jewels and watches etc.
Well it is for some of them as some are in the safes at work? I do also use my brother in laws safes on occasion!
Spare override keys are kept seperate to the safes and house in a locked and coded key cabinet!
All sounds a bit over the top really but I’m an Ops Director for a Manned Guarding Security Company so Security or at least Safety is paramount in our industry so it does make you over cautious!
I for one will be using the biometric safes from now on as myself and my brother in law both bought them when a local shop stopped dealing in weapons and sold off its stock at a discount which meant we got a bargain!
I use mine daily as all I have to do is push the button and put my thumb on the scanning pad and then it opens!!!
If you rotate your watches a lot and still want the safety without the hassle of keys or codes then I really would recommend a biometric safe.
As far as I can tell there’s no difference between the gun ones and the normal except the standard were higher priced when I looked, whereas the gun safes were slightly lower and let’s face it securing my weapons is a legal requirement, so the safes have to meet the standards for that legal requirement.
Standard safes, which I have two off don’t have to meet any specific legal requirement or at least you can buy ones that don’t!!
Chris
Last edited by subchris; 25th December 2017 at 01:37.
A number of years back I used a guy called Fred Whale to fit a safe. Very nice chap. He was recommended on this forum.
In my case it was the insurance company, Hiscox, that requested I have a safe fitted
A number of years ago I had a safe installed by Fred Whale. He was recommended by another forum member on this site. He was a really nice guy with good sensible advice.
Here’s his website:
http://www.a2wsecurity.com/about.htm
I hadn’t thought about installing a safe but my insurer, Hiscox, insisted I have one fitted.
Apologies for double post. My first post didn’t initially appear
Exactly! and being caught with such items could very likely lead to 5 years imprisonment.
Add to this that there is a Home Office consultation underway which if brought into law would allow the police additional powers to search your premisses..... and don't forget Policemen like nice watches too and are members of forums such as this.
Your airguns may well be perfectly legal to own.... BUT, if you happen to threaten a burglar with them, then it is you who is going to be arrested. I know that sounds wrong, but these scum have rights.
I am a licensed gun owner...... but if someone broke into my house and while I was upstairs in bed, I'd sure as hell NOT be reaching for my gun safe keys.......
If not pepper spray, many other household sprays to the eyes would be a deterrent. They wouldn't know it was deodorant (or something worse).
You can use reasonable force to defend your property and possessions. If the intruder has a gun and you are a registered gun owner, I think it's reasonable to reach for your gun to defend yourself so long as you don't shoot the scum in the back while he's running away.
OK. Then the spray is gone, disposed of. Far be it from me to break the law.
RE the guns, I've think I've been quite clear in saying that I would avoid confrontation at all costs and allow a burglar to take my valuables and car etc rather than put my family at risk. That's a no brainer. Once again, what I said was, if my family were in genuine physical danger, if I feared for the safety of my children, then I at least have X to hand as a means of trying to protect them, and obviously in that type of situation the law is secondary to your family's safety. I've also said I know it's a very very unlikely scenario and that any weapons I have were certainly not bought with that in mind.
It's proportionate force. If an intruder has a screwdriver and is running away from you, it's disproportionate to open fire on him with a crossbow and you will go to prison for it. If he comes at you with a hammer and you grab your own hammer from the windowsill and clobber him first, the force used is proportionate to the level of threat and your solicitor will be able to argue that in court.
You might get away with that as a defence if for example you have just come home from shooting, have a shotgun out of its case ready to clean and cartridges within arms reach....... at the same time when a burglar bursts through your door.....
The police are going to expect your guns to be locked away at all times other than for cleaning, carrying out work on them or perhaps just admiring them.
When it comes to magazine fed rifles, you are typically not going to have loaded magazines to hand as most people I know only load up at the range or on arrival at the land over which they have permission to shoot. Ammunition for FAC rated rifles, long barrelled pistols etc. needs to be stored in an ammo safe (along with solid slug shotgun cartridges).
The police would be asking "if you had time to open several gun / ammo safes and load a gun, why did you not run from the house?"......
There is a very real chance that Police forces would revoke the license/s of a gun owner who had such a confrontation with a burglar.
Deleted , I apologises others had already expressed my fears for the OP
Last edited by Norbert; 28th December 2017 at 17:04.
OK, thanks for the thoughts, suggestions and opinions. I have decided to get a new safe, a floor mounted one, with what I understand is a Grade 0 or 1 classification as a minimum. The 0 class gives up to £60k jewellery cover, which is what I will need currently, and the 1 class covers up to £100k, and this will allow for any future purchases should I make any.
The older heavier stuff which can be had reasonably cheap may be harder to actually move (both by any scum, and also myself), and may not have the required insurance grading. I will look into a more modern design. Now then, I can get a reasonable Chubb Zeta in a small size, enough for my actual watches, but not big enough for the boxes etc.
Whats peoples thoughts on this, do I get a cost effective safe for the actual watches, or should I spend a bit more on a larger safe. My initial thoughts are get the Zeta 15, and store the boxes somewhere else. I doubt any scum would be interested in empty boxes if they found them, or would they ??. I get if I ever wanted to sell any pieces boxes papers etc increase the attractiveness, but atm I'm not planning a cull or another purchase, but who knows what may happen down the line. Still undecided !!
Stuart
I was thinking watches and papers/cards in the safe. The boxes and accessories are replaceable if needs be.
You would be surprised what ends up in a safe apart from watches, therefore the larger the better. Do not base the size on a watch or jewellery box.
A decent safe should be a once in a lifetime purchase so specify it accordingly. A grade 2-3 should be sufficient. Key or electronic locks are your next choice.
Finally get it professionally installed and bolted down. No point in having a good safe and it not bolted down which can invalidate a policy. Anything less than 1,000kgs needs to be bolted down to a secure surface.
Last edited by Kiloman; 3rd January 2018 at 13:39.
Or a mechanical combination lock, no keys to lose, no batteries to go flat.
The one I have tells you the battery is going. If you are daft enough to ignore it then it has 9v battery terminals in the front to let you power it to open and change the battery. So electronic for me provided you have means to deal with a flat battery.
I’ve gone through a number safes and learnt from mistakes.
Ive purchased cheap before (£150-200) to hold docs and fireproof data. Electronic lock.
Flat batteries and lost key. Took me a whole 30seconds to sledgehammer the door in (concrete dust everywhere).
I had another safe (electronic) and a 50kg pull magnet would flip the internal solenoid.
Some safes can be bounced to release the drop hammer.
I now now have a key-only Eurograde2 safe which I sure a Pro could nail in a minute but at least it keeps insurance people happy.
And if anything to do with the circuitry fails it's going to be a right royal pain. We had a hotel electronic safe fail whilst on holiday in Jersey, it took the best part of a day for the manager to get a specialised locksmith/safe engineer in so we could retrieve our flight tickets and cash, the normal locksmith couldn't do anything.
I went for a traditional dial combination lock on my safe, I don't have to worry about anyone finding a key to it if I'm away on holiday, or taking the key with me to prevent the aforementioned then losing it, and I also have no concerns about any failure of an electronic lock. The dial lock lock can't be bumped as the safe is far too heavy to lift and is bolted to the concrete slab in any case. A mechanical dial combination lock is an extra cost but I think it's money well spent, it'll just do its job day in day out, decade after decade. An electronic keypad is admittedly quick and easy to use but they do have a failure rate even though it's a very small one.
Blackal ,possibly the worst hiding place ever ...especially if your talking about a bath panel .Many burglars kick in bath panels as a matter of routine.
Sent from my iPad using TZ-UK mobile app
They’d have had to dismantle half the bathroom.......
(it wasn’t for regular access)
i take your point though.
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