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Thread: 2018 6 Nations

  1. #101
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
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    Thinking it was a try and it actually being a try is too completely different things.

    As an aside the penality count yesterday was England 10 - Wales 2. I cannot explain this giving the 50/50 nature of the game.

    But talking about the refereeing, today my son played a game and from the opening kick we all knew it was going to be hard work because the ref missed an obvious knock-on. His mistakes continued over the course of the game causing a huge amount of frustration with the players, coaches and the mums and dads.

    Alas it all ended with a punch up caused by a phase after phase of players being offside, handling in the ruck and holding on in the ruck, then one of our players getting send off for trying to explain to the ref what a useless **** he was (he did not swear at him) and we then lost another player to a red, for providing a further explanation . These are u15 who had a perfect discipline record this season.

    its a difficult job being a ref, but anyone wanting to be a ref should a) learn the rules and understand them, b) make sure they are consistent, c) communicate with the players d) be fit enough to keep up with play. Alas this halfwitt have none of these skills.

    Very disapointing for the lads. It was a long way to travel for that.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  2. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by PickleB View Post
    Is that "pressing down on it"? That is the wording, no mention of 'control' except, perhaps by implication. Even if it is enough to satisfy the laws, that would be difficult to determine from the side view that (I think) the TMO had to work from. A close call, in either case.
    or even, "By pressing down on it with a hand" - touching it on the side with fingertips is perhaps not grounding the ball.

  3. #103

  4. #104
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    Well played Scotland, in the end!

    They needed that win, as did France, but they deserved it by the whistle I think.

    Lots to work on for both teams though.

  5. #105

    2018 6 Nations

    Quote Originally Posted by andy tims View Post
    This.

    I'm also surprise the Brown got MoTM.

    Bloody cold in the stands too.
    I was down in the lower level and was actually surprised how warm it was, particularly compared to the walk back to TWI station. I was expecting to get a soaking!

    Personally I thought Brown had a good game - solid under the high ball and often looking dangerous when running at Wales. MOTM though? That’s tough when measured against Launchbury and Farrell. Great as that tackle was, it would have been a brave judge to give it to Underhill based on his limited time on the pitch.

    It was a shame Wales were under-strength, and it was quite telling comparing the level of experience of both teams. Halfpenny was sorely missed, and a bit more experience on the pitch could have steadied the side and made the difference.

    I am surprised no one has mentioned the kicking game, as I felt Wales’ kicking out of hand was a level or two below England’s, and in a game of that intensity that can be significant.

    When North came on you felt anything could happen, and it seemed like the tempo rose appreciably - in the stands if not on the pitch. But England by and large contained North well. Otherwise Wales never really looked terribly threatening, at least from where I was sitting.

    Today’s game hopefully put some of Scotland’s demons to rest. I could only follow it online, but it seemed France faded in the last 15-20 minutes.

  6. #106
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    Well done Scotland. Though can you all get up a little bit earlier next time to make sure you're fully awake before the game starts.
    I was glad to see Finn Russel substituted, he had a very poor game - which happens to everyone so give him the benefit of the doubt for the next game.
    France have obviously given all their budget to their forward coach because they murdered Scotland in the rucks but only the try scorer could actually hold a ball.

    Two weeks off now. God knows what I'm going to do with myself next weekend.
    Gardening I expect :-(

  7. #107
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    What a good game. Most enjoyable and very close until the final minutes. However I doubt Ireland or England will be very concerned based upon the performance of either teams.

    The result will however give Scotland "some go" Prior to facing England, but even with today's improvement it would be a massive failure by England if they did not win.

    Still no yellow cards - amazing.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  8. #108
    According to the BBC Robbie Henshaw has undergone surgery for a dislocated shoulder and will (not surprisingly) miss the rest of the tournament.

    England will be practicing scrummaging against Georgia next week, apparently.

    And on the subject of yellow cards, don't forget that Joe Marler will be available for the Scotland game.
    Although no trees were harmed during the creation of this post, a large number of electrons were greatly inconvenienced.

  9. #109

    England v Wales

    Regardless of whether the TMO failed to identify a perfectly good grounding or missed a possible knock on,
    the bottom line is that this clown was flown in all the way from NZ and when called upon to pass judgement, got neither call correct.
    NZRFU have some good refs but this guy isn't one of them.
    And really the match day ref JG could've made his own call given the images.
    Anyone who has ever played rugby union knows that the grounding was good, whether the try was good or not is another thing.
    As for yellow cards, Brown should have been shown the way to the bin for illegally interfering with play towards the end of the match. He's quite an excitable character eh!
    The better team won on the day, but only just.
    Looking forward to seeing how the rest of the tournament plays out.

  10. #110
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    I have only just realised that the England vs Ireland game is played on St Patricks Day. Should make for a cracking atmosphere!

  11. #111
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    I was also at the stadium on Saturday. I thought Wales kicking was awful and part of the reason why Brown looked so good - they kept picking him out. Farrell / Ford on the other hand repeatedly found grass which meant the Welsh back 3 were always under pressure.

    In the last 15 minutes England looked out on their feet, Mako in particular before being sub'd looked knackered. Wales definitely looked to be the fitter team.

    I found the refereeing very frustrating - there was one particular incident in the 2nd half, I think it was just outside the England 22, when JG seemed to signal that the ball was out by holding both his arms out. Robshaw (I think) went round to compete for it and was immediately pinged for being offside. Seemed totally bizarre and I think Wales kicked the 3 points. I've got no idea how they got away with giving away 2 penalties. Their were quite a few times their backs were offside defending from rucks.

    Will be interesting to see who makes it back into both teams for the next round...

    For England, Daly (who I bumped into at the game - he's much bigger in real life than he looks on TV!) and Hughes both expected to be back and fit. Will be interesting to see the extent of the injury to Simmonds and Watson. It would be harsh to put Daly in ahead of Nowell I think.

    For Wales, Biggar, Faletau and Liam Williams all expected to be back too, so will see what they end up doing.

    Also to say that the TMO decision didn't really make that much of a difference - if it had been awarded as a try and if Anscombe had made the tough touchline conversion they'd have only had 4 more points than the penalty they ended up kicking from the advantage being played.

  12. #112
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    If wales' kicking out of hand is as poor against Ireland as it was against the english they'll ship a lot of points .
    I thought Farrell was the best of England's players as he so often is nowadays .I believe Brown had an easy run for the above reason .Launchbury' pass was crucial in the second try .Man of the match had to be Farrell IMO.Confident ,full of vision, good kicker and defender ,competitive in extremis .Good luck to them against Scotland in Edinburgh .Need to do better I think.

    Incidentally grounding for the Wales "try" seemed OK to me although there has been some bitching about a knock on in the movement .I'm not so sure .
    Anyway the better performing team won but since I stopped playing and became a coach with rain jackets galore and clipboards many years ago I have become a miserable bastard while watching test matches as I seem to pick up on every single error by players and referees .
    There's a good competition in the making here this year .May not be packed with scintillating skills but so interesting.

  13. #113
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    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/43046791


    World Rugby have admitted that a mistake was made by the television match official (TMO) in Wales' 12-6 defeat by England.
    TMO Glenn Newman ruled Anthony Watson had beaten Gareth Anscombe to the ball, with Wales coach Warren Gatland describing it as "a terrible mistake."
    Rob Howley says World Rugby's Alain Rolland has confirmed the error.
    "It was good to have dialogue with World Rugby... they confirmed the TMO made a mistake," Howley confirmed.
    "That dialogue happens continually throughout international periods," he continued.




    "That phone call took place yesterday and Alain Rolland confirmed on behalf of World Rugby that it was a mistake.
    "I haven't spoken to any of the match officials. It's happened, it's disappointing that happens in professional sport. But we focus on the next two weeks and getting ready for Ireland."
    In a statement issued to BBC Sport Wales, World Rugby confirmed Howley's comments.
    "World Rugby has clarified to the Wales team management as part of the usual review process with teams that the TMO made an error in the application of law during the England versus Wales match at Twickenham," they said.
    "In accordance with law 21.1 b Wales should have been awarded a try as the Wales player grounded the ball."


    England coach Eddie Jones compared the incident to a batsman being wrongly given out in a cricket match.
    "The decision is made, that's the game and I'm sure Wales are upset about it and I can understand why, but the game is gone," he said.


    ______

    ​Jim.

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    Thinking it was a try and it actually being a try is too completely different things.
    Except we now know that the TMO WAS wrong.

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    Except we now know that the TMO WAS wrong.
    No. He made the wrong decision but on the day his decision, right or wrong, stands. In this respect what he says is right, regardless of how accurate he is.
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saint-Just View Post
    No. He made the wrong decision but on the day his decision, right or wrong, stands. In this respect what he says is right, regardless of how accurate he is.
    Furthermore, as evidenced a few posts above, what neither ref had spotted was that the ball had been knocked forward so had the try been awarded by the TMO, he would still had been right but the ref would have asked the wrong question leading to England complaining that Wales were awarded a try that wasn’t.
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    Except we now know that the TMO WAS wrong.


    Its interesting that World Rugby have gotten involved and are now judging the TMO using imagines not actually available to him. Also no criticism of the ref who missed the initial knock on, and what about every other decision made? Don't forget the penality count was 10-2. What about the incident when the ref ruled the ball was out and Farrell then penalised - strangely silent on that. Perhaps they are trying to stir up some media attention in a contest which has become a two horse race.

    All very interesting but it still wasnt a try - if it was then it would show up on the score board.

    Gatland has had his fair share of decisions go for him (the World Cup game against England in 2014 to name one) so him moaning now is making him sound like a bit of pussy bitch.
    Last edited by Andyg; 13th February 2018 at 23:35.

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  18. #118
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    At the end of the day Evans knocked it on as per the video posted in the Rugby Onslaught link. After that the grounding is irrelevant and the right decision was made albeit for incorrect reasons.

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olly View Post
    At the end of the day Evans knocked it on as per the video posted in the Rugby Onslaught link. After that the grounding is irrelevant and the right decision was made albeit for incorrect reasons.
    Ah but it wasnt a knock on was it. Otherwise it would have been given!!! :)

  20. #120
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    In other news Simmonds will miss the Scotland and France games. Bummer, but Hughes is fit, so not a bad replacement.

    I am curious to see whether Teo is going to play. Plus I think Wriggles will start ahead of Care in Scotland with Care coming on as a "finisher".

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by kultschar View Post
    Ah but it wasnt a knock on was it. Otherwise it would have been given!!! :)

    And it wasnt a try either

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  21. #121
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    Predictions for the weekend?

    England surely on for a win in Edinburgh (I reckon by 9ish).
    Ireland to beat Wales but to be close - wouldn't be surprised if Wales are leading for a decent chunk of the match.
    France to beat Italy, could be a narrow one though as Italy have been their bogey team for a while.

  22. #122
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    OK then, my predictions are:

    England by >30 at Murrayfield (writes a pragmatic, realist Scot!).

    Wales by <10 at the Aviva.

    France to blow Italy away at the Orange Velodrome.
    ______

    ​Jim.

  23. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwg663 View Post
    OK then, my predictions are:

    England by >30 at Murrayfield (writes a pragmatic, realist Scot!).

    Wales by <10 at the Aviva.

    France to blow Italy away at the Orange Velodrome.
    Yeah, I've got this niggly feeling about Wales in Dublin. I've changed my fantasy team 2-3 times already!

    Have gone for:
    Halfpenny, Watson, Earls, Aki, Grosso, Farrell, Machenaud, Porter, Guirado, Healy, Shingler, Launchbury, Camarra, Stander, Hughes

    Bench: Fall, Laidlaw, Williams

    The game rewards kickers, hence having Laidlaw, Machenaud, Halfpenny and Farrell, as well as massively rewarding the winning team if they are away from home. Ireland v. Wales makes it particularly difficult

  24. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwg663 View Post
    OK then, my predictions are:

    England by >30 at Murrayfield (writes a pragmatic, realist Scot!).

    Wales by <10 at the Aviva.

    France to blow Italy away at the Orange Velodrome.

    You are a braver man than me, however I agree England will win simply because it will all get a bit to much for the Scottish lad at home, especially as it looks as if the weather will be nice. The first 20 minutes by England will be key. Proving they keep it tight then they should win, but I doubt it will be by more than 20 points unless Scotland really meltdown.

    Ireland vs Wales will be a very interesting contest. Both teams are still well in the championship, but Wales have done better against tougher opposition so I also have them a slight favourites - but only slightly. The weather should however suit Ireland running game, but its marginal now that North and Halfpenny are back in.

    France Vs Italy. I would love Italy to get a result, but Frances strength in the pack should make this a no brainer.

    If Ireland lose, then it's all over from their Grand Slam ambitions.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  25. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelicans View Post
    Yeah, I've got this niggly feeling about Wales in Dublin. I've changed my fantasy team 2-3 times already!

    Have gone for:
    Halfpenny, Watson, Earls, Aki, Grosso, Farrell, Machenaud, Porter, Guirado, Healy, Shingler, Launchbury, Camarra, Stander, Hughes

    Bench: Fall, Laidlaw, Williams

    The game rewards kickers, hence having Laidlaw, Machenaud, Halfpenny and Farrell, as well as massively rewarding the winning team if they are away from home. Ireland v. Wales makes it particularly difficult
    Shingles at lock? Itoje / Henderson/ Gray/ Jones?

  26. #126
    France looked as though the selectors had picked fifteen random people from the crowd before kick-off. I know that they "dropped" eight of their squad for "internal disciplinary" reasons, but I'd expect to see those ironed out and the players restored to the team that faces England next weekend.

    If we play against the shower that turned out for France last night we might as well declare when we're 50 points ahead and see if they can match it.
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  27. #127
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    2018 6 Nations

    Quote Originally Posted by Backward point View Post
    If we play against the shower that turned out for France last night we might as well declare when we're 50 points ahead and see if they can match it.

    Very, very good
    I am so sorry this cannot be translated in French (we don’t have cricket or any other spirt where one side ‘declares’) as I would have posted it all over the French internet rugby community.
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

  28. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by Backward point View Post
    France looked as though the selectors had picked fifteen random people from the crowd before kick-off. I know that they "dropped" eight of their squad for "internal disciplinary" reasons, but I'd expect to see those ironed out and the players restored to the team that faces England next weekend.

    If we play against the shower that turned out for France last night we might as well declare when we're 50 points ahead and see if they can match it.

    The "internal discipline" issue was a night out after the Scotland and an accusation of sexual abuse (which the police have deemed not to be criminal).

    Actually I thought France were better but Italy were very poor.

    Wales and Ireland is a cracking game, but I would love to know how Wales only had 2 penalties aganist them against England and this week I have lost count - certainly double figures.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  29. #129
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    Although we were in with a sniff at the end, it would have been criminal if we had pinched it off Ireland, who were clearly the better team throughout. I'm still hopeful that we'll win our last two matches against France and Italy, both at home.

    Looking forward to the Calcutta Cup match now, as a neutral.

  30. #130
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    Owens is the ref today. That's 9 points to Scotland then

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  31. #131
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    Oh dear, Scotland are playing out of their skins, and England have forgotten to get off the bus.

    The next 40 minutes will be a real test for Eddie and the gang. I remain hopeful

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  32. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    Oh dear, Scotland are playing out of their skins, and England have forgotten to get off the bus.

    The next 40 minutes will be a real test for Eddie and the gang. I remain hopeful
    Yup!! England are being destroyed!! Eddie has got his work cut out at half time to rally the boys. Seems to be no cohesion between the team today...

  33. #133
    So far this is almost making up for Wales earlier.

    Mike brown not looking so good this week

  34. #134
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    England were frankly poor in 1st half, no support, no follow through, lazy lazy defending with most players seeming to think that someone else will cover..............Scotland didn't seem to be on fire, they were just doing things right and taking advantage of an England team that needs a rocket up them.

  35. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    Owens is the ref today. That's 9 points to Scotland then
    And there it was, even the French commentators said giving the penalty to the Scots was 'très sevère'.

  36. #136
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    Truly awful by England. The lack of a properly balanced back rom has really told against them.

  37. #137

  38. #138
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    Well done Scotland. To be fair, whilst I was rather distraught by the way France played in the first 3 matches, today’s games put their 2 defeats in perspective.
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

  39. #139
    Well played Scotland, they out thought and out fought England and the added touches of creative brilliance from Finn Russell sealed a well deserved victory. In the words of the Murrayfield crowd, they sent Eddie Jones homewards to think again. Saying that, Scotland will probably get beat off Italy.
    Last edited by zippy; 24th February 2018 at 19:46.

  40. #140
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    Well done Scotland.
    Ireland for the Grand Slam now.

  41. #141
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    Congrats to the sweaties. I always thought Murryfield might be a banana skin and alas was right.

    Very pissed off with some ref'ing inconsistencies but Scotland were worthy winners on the day.

    Onwards and upwards.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  42. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    Well done Scotland.
    Ireland for the Grand Slam now.

    Only if they can beat England at Twickers, so I still think England will win the championship.

    But if they can then kudos to them.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
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  43. #143
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    Ho ho ho. Ya beauty. Right up em. Let’s get the popcorn out and watch the excuses and other nonsense flow like a sewer.

    England ego not just dented but holed.

    There will be many many petted lips and big huffies in Scotland’s capital city tonight.

    Can’t stop laughing at the size of result.

    Jim

  44. #144
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    I'm obviously rubbish at predicting results. One correct from three games is terrible. That's probably why I don't gamble.



    Wales were awful & only competed for a quarter of the match. Glen Jackson was frightful (again!).



    England? They appeared complacent & as if entitled to steamroller the Scots (which I thought they would). The World's Best Referee infuriated both sets of fans. John Inverdale proved to have correctly opted for the waterproof mascara. Jones dignified in defeat.
    Last edited by jwg663; 24th February 2018 at 20:28.
    ______

    ​Jim.

  45. #145
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    Well done,Scotland.
    Caught the second half but a fair result from what I saw.
    They worked hard to beat France so England should have expected to work hard from the outset,especially at Murrayfield.
    Ireland to win the Six Nations (my great grannie from Cork might have been pleased)?

  46. #146
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    Fantastic display by Scotland, especially the first half. Interesting that Nigel Owens, probably the most consistently and fair referee at the moment, is suddenly the villain of the piece.

    Anything but criticise a very poor England performance!

  47. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by theoriginaldigger View Post
    Ireland top the table

  48. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmcb View Post
    Ho ho ho. Ya beauty. Right up em. Let’s get the popcorn out and watch the excuses and other nonsense flow like a sewer.

    England ego not just dented but holed.

    There will be many many petted lips and big huffies in Scotland’s capital city tonight.

    Can’t stop laughing at the size of result.

    Jim
    LOL

  49. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    I always thought Murryfield might be a banana skin
    "England will win"

    ?

  50. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmcb View Post
    Ho ho ho. Ya beauty. Right up em. Let’s get the popcorn out and watch the excuses and other nonsense flow like a sewer.

    England ego not just dented but holed.

    There will be many many petted lips and big huffies in Scotland’s capital city tonight.

    Can’t stop laughing at the size of result.

    Jim
    Jim? Is that really you, so far from Sales Corner? I can't do anything other than commend Scotland on the result, they outplayed England and looked as though they wanted it more, so no complaints. Besides, we had a good laugh at "the size of the result" at Twickenham last year. 40 points, as I recall. Same again next year, I expect - Scotland don't travel too well.

    Enjoy it while you can.
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