Reply With QuotePioneer 505, nad 304, TDL rtl3
Should come in under £500
A bit of advice sought from the hi-fi buffs amongst us.
I quite fancy acquiring some new/old kit, which will give reliable, solid, high quality performance, but without spending a fortune. I’m happy browsing classifieds ads in various places, but a few pointers as to what to look for would be much appreciated. I would like a CD player and amplifier, plus some speakers (maybe floor standers). Initial thoughts on budget are £500 for this. So would those with an opinion on such matters think I can get something that will impress for this amount? I am fully expecting and happy to be looking at equipment which is a few generations old now to achieve the sound I want for my budget. I used to have a nice little set-up of Roksan Caspian M1 CD and integrated amp playing though a pair of PMC GB1i and I loved the sound it produced. Unfortunately that was sold a few years ago now and I cannot afford to splash out the same kind of cash this time around.
Pioneer 505, nad 304, TDL rtl3
Should come in under £500
ktmog6uk
marchingontogether!
In terms of amps, older amps are likely to suffer from capacitors drying out that will need addressing at some point even if they are still working. A great option might be to pick up a NAD 3020 from ebay then treat it to a service/recap from someone like these guys: http://www.amprepairservices.co.uk/nad/4568276007 which would give you a cracking amp as new for not much more than £200.
An older CD player would make me more nervous, things like the laser will give up at some point and can often not be cost-effective to repair.
As for speakers, in spite of what the industry might like to have us believe I don't think the technology has changes much for many years so definitely worth considering an older pair.
I'd go to richer sounds with £500 in pocket and see what they've got!
Just get the best speakers you can find and don't worry about the electronics; any competently-designed amp and CD player from the past few decades will do, and the affordable mainstream ones are almost without exception free of "audiophile" cult BS. (The inferior-sounding oddball designs tend to be expensive.)
Personally, I'd look for early-'90s to mid-'00s speakers from a reputable maker while they were still produced in the UK, US, Canada, Denmark, Italy, etc. — i.e. before the bigger companies such as B&W started really cheaping and getting everything other than their top ranges made in China.
don't know where you are based but if you are near this is a bit of a bargain.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Cambridge-...MAAOSws6ZZ6Dyo
ktmog6uk
marchingontogether!
^
Indeed, that's perfect. Good amplifiers are insanely inexpensive on the secondary market these days. The best part is that there's no compromise in sound quality.
In my experience, simple solid-state electronics such as those found in any decent amplifier are about as problem-free as things get. Likewise, quality speakers essentially last forever if they aren't abused.
If you crave the old style look Yamaha still do it with ultra modern internals. Best of both worlds IMHO and within your budget. I'd forget a CD player and put the money into streaming services or a NAS drive.
I have two hifi systems, one in the lounge and one in the dining room. Both are Naim based systems and neither would come cheap. Some old stuff such as a set of Tannoy speakers will set you back thousands.
As a rule of thumb, most British stuff was built to a high standard and could not compete on price with Japanese imports in the 1980s and hence went bust. The name was subsequently sold to the highest bidder for rebranding purposes.
Anything made in the UK has a loyal following and is priced accordingly. Anything just a couple of years old (made somewhere in the Far East) will sell for peanuts and this is what you should be looking at. If you have a budget of £500.00, you should easily buy something that was sold a few years ago at around £1500.00. The sound will be good as will the quality and reliability. With your budget, you will probably do better buying stand mounted speakers but don't make it a deal breaker.
Your best bet is to hear a complete system so you know how it sounds and then buy it complete.
Buying a mish mash of separates is an acquired art if sound quality is the prime aim.
If you want to save some budget for watches and settle for a midi system I have one of the little Denon D-M38DAB
Systems with Gale monitors that was hardly used and I haven't installed since moving house 3 years back. I keep meaning to list it on SC but feel free to PM me if interested.
There's some good and poor advice above. I would seek out a decent HiFi dealer. Go armed with some room specs/dimensions as your room will dictate the sound quality. Tell them your budget and be guided a little by them. They may have some decent S/H kit in stock to listen to as well which they will cover with a guarantee.
As a rule of thumb the front end (source) is important and 33% wants to go on the CD player (rubbish in, rubbish out). Speakers are subjective and depending on the room, floor standers are not always the best choice.. try a bookshelf speaker on a decent weighted stand and it can outperform a floorstander in the bass dept, depending on the room. Avoid corner positions too which will emphasise the bass. It's also better to have the sound coming across the width rather than the length.
Listen to a couple of suggested systems (particularly speakers) and take your own CD's that you know well (not an MP3 player)! If you buy a system from a dealer and it's not quite to your liking they should be prepared to solve why. There's bright speakers, natural sounding speakers, bassy speakers out there!
Don't assume the more drive units in the speaker the better they are... a good 2 way will generally be better.
I could go on but as I said a good dealer is the best place to start... good luck.
Not any more.
Reference-grade DACs are plentiful and cheap these days, and any CD player with a digital out will do as a transport, or just use an old computer and a USB DAC.
Sorry but you are way off beam.Originally Posted by Rod
No decent dealer would even dream of talking to anyone with just £500.00 for a complete system. The OP is better sourcing via ebay or similar.
Also your proposed percentages of spend are well out of date. The old source first theory was based on when CD players and Tuners were expensive. Today they are cheap and speakers are a bit dearer.
With £500 he can buy a decent system but it will be second hand from a private seller and he needs to hear it before he buys. No dealer is going to mess around for £500 and that is assuming he has got something in stock.
Ok I don't know what I'm talking about I'll shut up.
Like someone else said have a look at Richer Sounds, for example they are listing this package below
https://www.richersounds.com/catalog.../category/453/
Cheers
Kevin
If you are a dealer and I suspect you are, then you are in a trade that is all but dead. Twenty years ago every high street had a Hifi dealer in it but now after years of being talked down to, customers now deal direct and save themselves a lot of money.
Your price analysis is poppy cock, the percentages you quoted were the sort of thing Julian Vereker and Ivor Tiefenbrun were quoting in the days of the Naim-Linn axis on high end and expensive equipment back in the eighties.
For a purchase of second hand equipment, those figures are now irrelevant.
Also, are you as a dealer, going to have the range of a full second hand system costing £500.00 that could match what ebay will have, even within a 5 mile radius. I very much doubt it.
If you are not a dealer, your percentages were still wrong and misleading.
Sorry but that is the reality.
Last edited by Mick P; 19th October 2017 at 17:40.
Go Micky go Micky go !
Given the generally pompous, overbearing and self important tone of most of your forum contributions I'm not sure that you're in much of a position to comment. I've benefited from Rod's advice in the past and I certainly know where I would prefer to look for hi-fi advice.
In the Sotadic Zone, apparently.
That's strange Rod, you knew what was what all those years ago in the shop in Darlo when I blasted my CDs through your Arcam kit and bought the Dynaudios . . . ;-)
F.T.F.A.
We are talking about going to a dealer on the purchase of a bit of second hand equipment for £500.00
First thing to remember is he has to cover his overheads and pay tax etc, so what he sells for £500, a private seller will probably let it go for considerably less.
Also if you walk into a Hifi dealer, assuming you can now find one as most operate from home, they hardly ever sell second hand stuff.
My advice is hardly controversial, buy something like a complete system that is a couple of years old from ebay and have a listen before you take it away.
mick. i think it would be great if you started your own 'agony aunt' column in the bear pit or somewhere like that. you could call the thread 'dear mick' or suchlike. i think it would provide many hours of enjoyment for the forum membership.
Good luck everybody. Have a good one.
I'd maybe take a look at a Linn classik?
Had one for years and still sounds/performs well
In fact may look for another for my workshop
Fantastic effort Mick.
Why are Hifi dealers as dead as the Dodo - watch this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvswW6M7bMo
Mick, don't you think that is a bit rude to a respected forum member, even by your standards?
Agreed, great bit of kit. Only sold mine as I moved away from CDs
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LINN-CLASS...-/202049630932
Please make this happen, Mick. It would be akin to Viz Comic's 'The man in the pub' column
As an ex consultant, I would insist on an obscenely high fee.
A CD player of say 10 years+ age may need repair or maybe just cleaning of the laser and loading tray.It depends how accessible they are to work on but it wasn't demanding to me with my old Marantz 7001. However,a CDP of a certain age will be the weak spot in your kit.
Integrated amps can last for decades and might just need blowing some pure air on the innards and polishing up connections.
Speakers are even better for years of service.
Having said all that,the prices of decent second hand kit do seem high and technology tends to improve so I spent about £1000 at Richer Sounds for a cd transport and amp (with built in DAC).
When I get around to it,I will connect up some old JBL freestanders and see what they sound like.
Try and contact some local hifi dealers because some do trade ins now and I presume they have to sell on the items they've taken in.
If you want quality at a modest price I think you will have to be a little patient.
Look at the Richer Sounds website or call them as they have clearance items and I would guess a January sale.
Good luck.
You can't go wrong with Arcam and there's plenty of older, British made stuff on eBay. You should also be able to find a decent set of kef, Monitor Audio or Mission speakers there too. You'll need to be patient but you should easily put something together for your budget.
Went through something similar very recently as was putting together a system for our daughter's birthday.
Would definitely recommend the listen first approach if possible on eBay - the Denon system I purchased didn't work when I went to pick it up, came as a surprise to the seller. Needed some new resistors as the output stages had blown. But found a local repairer and it works fine now.
Also bought a Technics turntable to go with the system.
All this came to around £150 so £500 for a used system should see you with something really good.
I also picked up a Technics 500 receiver which I haven't set up properly yet, but sounded wonderful when I tried it upon receiving it.
A system that might be worth looking at is the Rotel RA series - amps; CD player; tuners in the same series. Sounds wonderful and good value used.
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
Plenty of replies to read through, so thank you for your thoughts on this. I am definitely minded to go secondhand over new. I know it is a minefield, but I hope that with care and time I can put together a decent enough system.
I have the streaming base covered at home, so this is definitely going to be a CD based set-up, as I have a reasonable collection and although it may be considered outdated now, I still like the process of choosing a disc, removing it from the case and placing it in the player drawer. Weird eh!
How can this not be the answer?
In budget
Good quality bits
Brand new
^
The better part of £500 can get you speakers a hell of a lot better than those ones on the used market.
I have a Cambridge Audio CD player, A1 mk 3 Amp and some bookshelf Gales as our dining room system. Second hand value 150 - 250 tops, is it the best hifi in the world, no, does it sound fantastic, yes.
Potentially you could get the deal of the century on used bits, or you can buy £500 of crap/faulty/mismatched gear
Or a brand new setup
I know wher my money would be going, but what do I know?
Was that a management consultant?
But you clearly know nothing of value?
When you look long into an abyss, the abyss looks long into you.........
I can see that your adopting a 'pay to post' policy might have benefits for other members
Good luck everybody. Have a good one.
Given a £500 budget, the speaker portion of your money would go toward wimpy little Wharfedale things that can easily be had for £120 new, and look it?
I think the answer will be for others to ghost-write on Mick’s behalf. After all, a good many members have sat at the feet of the Master and absorbed his wisdom. Like apostles they can go forth and spread the gospel according to Mick.
Who’s up for starting the thread? BP obviously, as the valuable IP imparted should not be in the public domain.
I have not had any dealings with Rod, but as an ex sound engineer who worked with many big names and as someone who knows a bit about this subject, everything I have seen from Rod comes from someone who is beyond the usual hi-fi buff,
although funny, I would step away Mick and put your hands up, the guy knows his stuff...period.
I also agree with him on this thread lol
Hi,
I would look out for a pair of second hand Q-Acoustic 3020. Not a floor stander, but more than enough for decent room sizes. They are now on the market for almost 4 years, so there should be plenty of them on the second-hand market.
For amplifier and CD-Player, I would look around for a MARANTZ combination. A CD63 and all the SE or KI versions are nice sounding players, the amplifiers from the same age or newer are also not bad at all. Sent a little bit of money on speaker cables (entry level Chord or QED) and that makes a nice sounding system. Most of the smaller MARANTZ CD-Amp combinations of the last 10 years are pretty good.
No worry abou the capacitors....they will stay for many more years
Just my 2c :-)
Best regards
Karl-Heinz
Richer Sounds like these guys are saying - have a look at they're 'open box' sale - there's always a deal to be done as well on display stuff
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