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Thread: iOS11... anybody else got the BETA?

  1. #1
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    iOS11... anybody else got the BETA?

    Downloaded the beta this morning to my 7 Plus and it's like someone has stuck a supercharger in my phone. Much faster, everything you do is animated etc. I'm not a phone geek per se, but I like things to be efficient, and it's much better.

    One great feature though is Do Not Disturb whilst driving. It magically knows (GPS I guess) when I'm driving and when set to on, you don't see any distracting messages or popups etc. I noticed when I have the tomtom app running that it bypasses the DND mode, but for the most part, it's great at stopping temptation to look at your phone.

  2. #2
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    Not tried beta but will probably wait till full release.
    allowing proper files will be the game changer for me
    Hopefully apple have finally listened

  3. #3
    I'm using the beta on my 10.5" iPad Pro but won't be installing it on my phone.

  4. #4
    Grand Master Seamaster73's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by W44NNE View Post
    One great feature though is Do Not Disturb whilst driving. It magically knows (GPS I guess) when I'm driving and when set to on, you don't see any distracting messages or popups etc.
    It's less magic that that ó it simply knows you're connected to a car's bluetooth.

    Or more magic than that ó if you're not connected to a car's bluetooth, it detects the doppler effect over wifi.

  5. #5
    Master ach5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seamaster73 View Post

    Or more magic than that ó if you're not connected to a car's bluetooth, it detects the doppler effect over wifi.
    That's interesting - I often wondered why in maps on my iphone, when out and about, it will say something like "activate wifi for a more accurate position" - I always wondered how this could be, since I wouldnt be connected to wifi, and I thought GPS via 4G was more accurate anyway?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ach5 View Post
    That's interesting - I often wondered why in maps on my iphone, when out and about, it will say something like "activate wifi for a more accurate position" - I always wondered how this could be, since I wouldnt be connected to wifi, and I thought GPS via 4G was more accurate anyway?
    WiFi is quite a local effect so detecting Doppler is only going to work when WiFi is in range - more likely it's detecting GSM / LTE Doppler.
    An internet connection is used in 2 ways to improve GPS,
    1) the ip address of your wifi network will be attached to a real world address / position, if this can be read then it can be used to locate you very quickly,
    2) Ephemeris data (satellite visibility) can be downloaded to speed up acquisition of the GPS satellite signals.

    In all likelihood it's probably using gps and / or radio mast Doppler to determine speed and internal acceleraometers to back that up when gps and radio mast Doppler is not available, couple that to bluetooth connection and robert's your mothers brother.

  7. #7
    Craftsman
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    I'll trial tonight and pass on my findings.


    Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app

  8. #8
    Grand Master Seamaster73's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by julian2002 View Post
    WiFi is quite a local effect so detecting Doppler is only going to work when WiFi is in range - more likely it's detecting GSM / LTE Doppler.
    Apple have said its wifi.

  9. #9
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    Can you select a third party default app for browser and email yet?

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Coot View Post
    Can you select a third party default app for browser and email yet?
    I don't think so.

    It's a shame apple still haven't introduced multitasking to the iPhones. It looks like this update is mainly for iPads.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  11. #11
    Grand Master magirus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coot View Post
    Can you select a third party default app for browser and email yet?
    For browser try iCab, far superior to anything else. Very customisable and very good support if needed.

  12. #12
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    This is the incremental version which drops support for 32 bit is it not? In which case there are going to be an awful lot of people extremely p**sed off when their favourite app stops working when this is eventually rolled out. I have an irreplaceable 32bit app which I need for work which means that I will have to indefinitely forgo any advantages this may have.

  13. #13
    Grand Master Seamaster73's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Padders View Post
    This is the incremental version which drops support for 32 bit is it not? In which case there are going to be an awful lot of people extremely p**sed off when their favourite app stops working when this is eventually rolled out. I have an irreplaceable 32bit app which I need for work which means that I will have to indefinitely forgo any advantages this may have.
    Contact the developer and ask why they've abandoned it.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by ach5 View Post
    That's interesting - I often wondered why in maps on my iphone, when out and about, it will say something like "activate wifi for a more accurate position" - I always wondered how this could be, since I wouldnt be connected to wifi, and I thought GPS via 4G was more accurate anyway?
    If you switch off wifi you disable gps at the same time. There is no separate switch for gps.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Normunds View Post
    If you switch off wifi you disable gps at the same time. There is no separate switch for gps.
    Not true in my experience. GPS works fine without Wifi being switched on, the message is because it uses Wifi data as an additional location detection method.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seamaster73 View Post
    Contact the developer and ask why they've abandoned it.
    Yes of course I can do that but I am flagging up the fact that I won't be alone in depending on an app which doesn't have a 64 bit update and will therefore get bricked, many won't even realise that the update will do this, though I realise that there have been vague warning messages about compatibility on several apps for months now.

  17. #17
    Master ach5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Normunds View Post
    If you switch off wifi you disable gps at the same time. There is no separate switch for gps.
    ??

    I use my sat nav (Waze) all the time and never have wifi on (hence the pop up I was querying) - just 4G

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Normunds View Post
    There is no separate switch for gps.
    There is.

    Under Privacy, turn off Location Services.

  19. #19
    Please do not mistake location service and GPS.

    Iphone gets its location from mobile tower triangulation, wifi networking and GPS. mobile tower triangulation is fastest, but least accurate. If you are inside your house and open apple maps, you'll see your position somewhere around or inside your house marked by blue dot, but then there will be also light blue circle 50-100m wide and your phone might be anywhere inside that circle. if you go outside the light blue circle will decrease to your exact location, because of your phone will start receiving GPS coordinates from GPS satellites marking your exact position.

    I can't find reliable source, but here is what I've remember from while ago - GPS reception on iphone is controlled by wifi switch, hence the message that switching on wifi improves location service accuracy.


    upd. just remembered. While ago I was flying on airplane and had ipad. It did not had a sim card, but out of curiosity I opened Navigon, switched on wifi and in a couple of minutes I got my position on map, speed and altitude. That was when I got confirmation that GPS antenna is controlled by wifi switch.

    Of course that was 5-6 years ago, things might be different now. But I will test my theory in a month when I will fly next time.
    Last edited by Normunds; 13th August 2017 at 09:43.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Normunds View Post
    Please do not mistake location service and GPS.

    I can't find reliable source, but here is what I've remember from while ago - GPS reception on iphone is controlled by wifi switch, hence the message that switching on wifi improves location service accuracy.
    I’m afraid you are wrong. The top Location Services toggle on iOS turns off GPS location services. If you turn off wifi with Location Services enabled, GPS apps such as TomTom Go and Google Maps can still find your location to a high degree of accuracy. What is slower is the time it takes to find your first location. iOS uses Wifi as a quick, rough and ready reckoner to find your location whilst the GPS chip locks on to the satellites.

    When I turn off wifi and Location Services, TomTom Go and Google Maps display errors asking me to turn on Location Services. If I turn on wifi with Location Services off, the apps still display an error and are unable to track location using GPS. I have tested this in iOS 10 on my iPhone 7 Plus whilst making this post.

    See also https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT207092
    Last edited by Phil Lee; 13th August 2017 at 09:38.

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Lee View Post
    Iím afraid you are wrong. The top Location Services toggle on iOS turns off GPS location services. If you turn off wifi with Location Services enabled, GPS apps such as TomTom Go and Google Maps can still find your location to a high degree of accuracy. What is slower is the time it takes to find your first location. iOS uses Wifi as a quick, rough and ready reckoner to find your location whilst the GPS chip locks on to the satellites.

    When I turn off wifi and Location Services, TomTom Go and Google Maps display errors asking me to turn on Location Services. If I turn on wifi with Location Services off, the apps still display an error and are unable to track location using GPS. I have tested this in iOS 10 on my iPhone 7 Plus whilst making this post.

    See also https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT207092
    Of course if you disable location services, you will not be able to use any app that uses them. to test my theory that GPS antenna is controlled by wifi switch you have to be in area with no cellular service (to be sure you don't use mobile tower triangulation) and then play with tomtom, navigon or any gps app with built in maps.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Normunds View Post
    Of course if you disable location services, you will not be able to use any app that uses them. to test my theory that GPS antenna is controlled by wifi switch you have to be in area with no cellular service (to be sure you don't use mobile tower triangulation) and then play with tomtom, navigon or any gps app with built in maps.
    Iím sorry but you are wrong. If I enable airplane mode (switches off wifi and cellular service) I can still get my GPS location in TomTom.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Normunds View Post
    Please do not mistake location service and GPS.


    .
    It it pretty plain who has the mistaken belief here. I have walked up Welsh mountains with zero phone signal, no wifi signal for miles and to conserve battery wifi and Bluetooth switched off and still got a location fix based logically on gps data. The wifi switch does exactly what it says, switches off wifi.

  24. #24

    iOS11... anybody else got the BETA?

    My apologies, I was wrong :) switched off everything and still was able to get GPS location. So, there is no way to switch off GPS on iPhone.

    Itís interesting because of I swear that some years ago you couldnít get location with WiFi switched off, only cellular tower triangulation.

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Normunds View Post
    My apologies, I was wrong :) switched off everything and still was able to get GPS location. So, there is no way to switch off GPS on iPhone.
    Yes there is. Switching off Location Services switches off GPS.

  26. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Lee View Post
    Yes there is. Switching off Location Services switches off GPS.
    yes and no, switching off Location Services switches off all processes that uses location services including information from motion activity and other sensors, not just GPS. So, you can't switch off GPS and keep for example wifi calling or motion calibration (step counter if I understand correctly) enabled, because of these do not actually use GPS info (at least I think they don't).

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Normunds View Post
    yes and no, switching off Location Services switches off all processes that uses location services including information from motion activity and other sensors, not just GPS. So, you can't switch off GPS and keep for example wifi calling or motion calibration (step counter if I understand correctly) enabled, because of these do not actually use GPS info (at least I think they don't).
    Again you are wrong. Step counting is enabled/disabled through Settings > Privacy > Motion and Fitness > Fitness Tracking. This means you can keep GPS (controlled via Location Services) enabled with Wifi and motion tracking disabled.

  28. #28
    Craftsman
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    Is anyone else's screen now going blank post update to ios 11??
    many thanks.

  29. #29
    Journeyman Robti's Avatar
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    Switched both my iPhone and iPad over a few weeks back and after a couple of days switched the iPhone back as the Bluetooth for the car radio wouldn’t enable voice dialing, but loving the iPad on it

  30. #30
    ..have my iPad Pro (9.7") running on it. Has issues with some wifi portals (The ones that pop a login page) so I'm going back. Quite slick otherwise though. Experience has taught me not to try this on my phone .. too many apps didn't like it (banking in particular)

  31. #31
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    It seems to have cured itself with the latest update today and a switch on and off


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