closing tag is in template navbar
timefactors watches



TZ-UK Fundraiser
Results 1 to 26 of 26

Thread: Land boundary issue question

  1. #1
    Master village's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Any further south and i would have wet feet
    Posts
    9,959

    Land boundary issue question

    Without going into huge amounts of detail,I have a small disagreement at the moment with a neighbour regarding the boundary between out properties. It involves (if they are correct) us losing a 1m wide strip of out front lawn. It is all based on them producing the land registry document which suggests they are correct. However.....according to the Gov.UK site "the exact positions of legal boundaries are almost never shown on registered title plans and are not shown on OS maps. The red edging on a land registry title is not definitive to the precise position of the boundaries.Land registry is unable to tell you precisely where a property boundary is located"

    So...I am led to believe that the decision on boundaries falls to the owner of a large piece of land who divides it and sells it I.e the developer and that whilst the land registry is only an interpretation one needs to establish it without doubt from the original conveyancing.

    Does this fall within anyone's purlieu? Do you think I am correct and how might one go about getting this proof of property line?

    As a rough indication see my highly technical drawing. The thick black line between my lawn and their drive is how it has been since the house was built in the 1990s. The land registry red line indicates the same as the dashed line.



    ta in advance for any info etc

  2. #2
    Master TKH's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    North West
    Posts
    3,858
    always the most challenging and common disputes and need handling with care and mutual respect (not always easy)

    I am not a solicitor but have been involved in similar

    1st thing to do is contact a good solicitor who will have direct access to LR with often more accurate details, and also you need to dig out your conveyancing docs from purchase

    also I think I am correct in saying that if its been like that un contested for more than 6 years (could be 12) then it will be hard(er) for them to challenge for a change.

    http://www.boundary-problems.co.uk/b...tatutelaw.html

    sure one of the legal (qualified) guys will be along soon
    Last edited by TKH; 24th May 2017 at 17:03.

  3. #3
    I am no expert but I presume the drive and garage are your neighbour's ? And as mentioned below for how long
    has the existing boundary been in use. And why do they now want to change it?

    We have a similar situation where we have a neighbours fence right next to our drive parallel with
    the edge of the garage for about 10' and then another 6 feet with hedging before it widdens out, it
    can be annoying if you have to get in and out of the car next to the fence as there isnt room to
    open the door fully although the neighbours allow us to trim back the hedge part as much as we like.

  4. #4
    Your diagram suggests someone got the boundaries mixed up. I would expect the boundary to follow the fence line and put the metre wide strip of lawn in your neighbours ownership. The conveyancing bumpf your solicitor put together at the point of purchase should express boundaries and rights but it is just as likely there is not enough detail. Sounds like you need to get yourself legal help or engage in friendly chat with your neighbour.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by TKH View Post

    also I think I am correct in saying that if its been like that un contested for more than 6 years (could be 12) then it will be hard(er) for them to challenge for a change.

    http://www.boundary-problems.co.uk/b...tatutelaw.html

    sure one of the legal (qualified) guys will be along soon
    I seem to remember from a discussion with a developer who bought a property that bordered the end of our garden at our previous home that there is a timeframe after which it is hard to reverse existing boundary aspects. They claimed we had 3 meteres of their land at the end of our garden, but it had been that way for decades with fencing in place and was even represented on land docs so they decided not to peruse it in the end.

    Best to get some professional advice and try to deal as amicably as possible. Sometimes easier said than done though!

  6. #6
    Master village's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Any further south and i would have wet feet
    Posts
    9,959
    To be fair,I suspect that the boundary line is as the neighbours claim it to be but I just wanted to be sure. I don't really want to get involved in a legal wrangle...cost/grief etc.

  7. #7
    Bill them for cutting their lawn for years,

  8. #8
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    London
    Posts
    5,831
    Blog Entries
    2
    by the looks of it they are correct, it makes sense that the boundary would be in line with the fence, at a 50/50 distance from both your properties, on the other hand the boundary has been in place for years and could be contested easily, and until settled (years) any work on your neighbors part could be seen as criminal damage.

    its up to you, but if your neighbor is willing to alter it with no cost to you, I would probably let them do it, save all the faffing around for 1 metre of nothing, at least you can still access the rear from the side of your property.

  9. #9
    Master
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    lancashire
    Posts
    1,102
    What's the boundary like on the other side of the house with your other neighbor or on other properties on your road?

    If they are the same as yours then that's how it's ment to be.

    Why do the want it now after years? Are they extending their garage or home?

    If they are have a think if what they are doing will impact on your property.

    I had something similar few years back my neighbor had about 200 Square meters of land that was on my deeds. I just let them keep it as long as it didn't cost me any money.
    Made a good friend too, he is a builder helped me with advice and doing diy, learnt loads from him.
    Last edited by golf; 24th May 2017 at 19:45.

  10. #10
    Master markl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Wigan
    Posts
    1,641
    Check your title deeds. They may just have a right of way over the land for access to the side of the garage for maintenance.

    Sent from my BBB100-2 using Tapatalk

  11. #11
    Master village's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Any further south and i would have wet feet
    Posts
    9,959
    All they are going to do is widen their drive to the 'new' boundary line. Actually,all it means is we lose* a 1 metre strip of lawn that is principally employed as a place for the neighbourhood cats to poo.
    They have agreed to pay for the cost of installing a low fence (about 1 metre high) as a demarcation. What we didn't want is them parking nearer to our bay window and what they haven't twigged is that by agreeing to the fence they will need to park pretty much where they do now in order to be able to open car doors.
    I had another chat with him earlier and I suggested that just for peace of mind we both get a copy of our deeds and go with whatever they indicate. As I said,I'm pretty sure that they are correct but it's a cheap way of us both being sure.
    Yes,I could go down the lines of claiming adverse possession but it's not worth the hassle for the bit in question.


    * lose being relative if it was not ours to begin with!
    Last edited by village; 24th May 2017 at 20:43.

  12. #12
    Master aldfort's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Cardiff
    Posts
    9,254
    Life is too short for this stuff. I have the same problem. My neighbour has a four foot strip of my land that forms part of their garden. For me it's behind my garage. If I fenced it off then I'd have a useless strip of land that I'd need to mow. For my neighbour it makes a nice herbaceous border. Came about because the builder took a shortcut when building the fence and saved themselves a few posts and a few board feet of fencing.
    In the OP' s case you need the definitive site plan. I very much doubt "deeds" will tell you anything. For all you know they may have a metre of your back garden.

  13. #13
    Journeyman
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    London
    Posts
    223
    If the fence has been in that position uncontested since 1992 then in theory I think you can claim the 1m strip as your own, but it would never be worth the grief of a nasty boundary dispute with your neighbour.

  14. #14
    Master bomberman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    The only town in Britain with Caesar's name
    Posts
    1,279
    Sorry disagree with most of the comments above about just folding and letting them have it uncontested. I believe some may be referring to "prescriptive rights" assuming you have had the benefit of the said parcel of land for sometime?

    Had many disputes for work over land that neighbouring properties had stolen or tried to steal. I would spend a few hundred quid on legal advice just to gauge your position although it does appear an error has been made.

    Land is land and who knows what will happen in the future with your and neighbours plot.

    Good luck as it's a mine field.

    B

  15. #15
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Cheshire
    Posts
    820
    I had a similar issue and had the boundary redrawn on the land registry as the boundary had been undisputed for more than 10 years as others have said. Here's a link to some information.

    https://www.wrighthassall.co.uk/know...ndary-dispute/

    Don't forget (as we did) that boundary disputes may be covered on legal insurance under your household insurance. But, get advice! We did and it made everything much smoother once we let our neighbours know that we knew our rights and had legal representation.

  16. #16
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    salisbury
    Posts
    358
    Your diagram is exactly the same as mine. Our lawn goes past the fence to the drive of the neighbours house, there is no gate through the fence. We have been cutting the lawn as our own. But legally it is their land and if they wanted they could use that metre of land. Its the same on the other side of our house, our boundary is a metre into the next doors lawn, although we do have a gate on that side, its still laid to lawn.

  17. #17
    Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Birmingham
    Posts
    3,126
    Before you let it slide for the sake of good relations, as noted above, ask yourself why they have started looking into it at all. It probably means that they want to develop the garage or extend the house which may be much more of a PITA than just the loss of a strip of grass. I would seek legal advice so you at least know where you stand on both the ownership of the trivial grass area but also the likelihood of develpment affecting your situation.

  18. #18
    Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    London
    Posts
    1,178
    Maybe it's the rest of the fence that is in the wrong place, and the boundary is aligned to the side of the garage

  19. #19
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    salisbury
    Posts
    358
    Quote Originally Posted by stuie-t View Post
    Maybe it's the rest of the fence that is in the wrong place, and the boundary is aligned to the side of the garage
    Like I said above, mine is the same, its quite common estates to have boundaries like that.

  20. #20
    Master village's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Any further south and i would have wet feet
    Posts
    9,959
    Quote Originally Posted by Padders View Post
    Before you let it slide for the sake of good relations, as noted above, ask yourself why they have started looking into it at all. It probably means that they want to develop the garage or extend the house which may be much more of a PITA than just the loss of a strip of grass. I would seek legal advice so you at least know where you stand on both the ownership of the trivial grass area but also the likelihood of develpment affecting your situation.
    All cool there....nowhere near the house (plus they've already extended it) and the garage is detached and separate from their house. They want it to widen the driveway which will be (eventually) block paved.

  21. #21
    Master
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Glasgow, Scotland
    Posts
    1,093
    Quote Originally Posted by stuie-t View Post
    Maybe it's the rest of the fence that is in the wrong place, and the boundary is aligned to the side of the garage
    I thought this, it might turn out you are entitled to 1 m of your neighbours back garden. I bet that would make you popular!

  22. #22
    Craftsman mikiejack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Barnsley, Yorkshire
    Posts
    762

    Land boundary issue question

    Quote Originally Posted by Padders View Post
    Before you let it slide for the sake of good relations, as noted above, ask yourself why they have started looking into it at all. It probably means that they want to develop the garage or extend the house which may be much more of a PITA than just the loss of a strip of grass. I would seek legal advice so you at least know where you stand on both the ownership of the trivial grass area but also the likelihood of develpment affecting your situation.
    This. I'd be considering their end goals.
    Unless the drive is quite small, or in need of replacing, very few would want to extend over a single meter wide strip, and pay for a fence, as it's hardly cheap, if they have a perfectly functional driveway already.
    Last edited by mikiejack; 26th May 2017 at 19:09.

  23. #23
    Master village's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Any further south and i would have wet feet
    Posts
    9,959
    Update to this situation:

    I agreed ,after discussions ,that the small strip of land was the neighbours. They have now installed a pretty solid fence (concrete posts and lintels) which isn't going anywhere. It does actually improve the outlook and it cuts of the view of the crap on their drive. Also,as I had already noticed,having installed the fence and redone their drive so that they could <quote> create a bigger parking area <unquote> they can't actually park any nearer to us than they already did. In fact,they way they have installed the fence and redone the drive I think they have to park an extra foot away from us!
    The result of this is that they have now had to pay someone to excavate a chunk of garden on the other side of the drive and chuck some shingle on it so they can stick a car there ;so it's a win for us and an expensive cock-up for them.
    I haven't laughed too much.....honest.

  24. #24
    Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Petersfield, Hampshire
    Posts
    6,310
    Quote Originally Posted by village View Post
    Update to this situation:

    I agreed ,after discussions ,that the small strip of land was the neighbours. They have now installed a pretty solid fence (concrete posts and lintels) which isn't going anywhere. It does actually improve the outlook and it cuts of the view of the crap on their drive. Also,as I had already noticed,having installed the fence and redone their drive so that they could <quote> create a bigger parking area <unquote> they can't actually park any nearer to us than they already did. In fact,they way they have installed the fence and redone the drive I think they have to park an extra foot away from us!
    The result of this is that they have now had to pay someone to excavate a chunk of garden on the other side of the drive and chuck some shingle on it so they can stick a car there ;so it's a win for us and an expensive cock-up for them.
    I haven't laughed too much.....honest.
    Are you tempted to ask innocently whether the extra space has helped?

  25. #25
    Master village's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Any further south and i would have wet feet
    Posts
    9,959
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy67 View Post
    Are you tempted to ask innocently whether the extra space has helped?
    I'm poised....... timing is everything!

  26. #26
    Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Petersfield, Hampshire
    Posts
    6,310
    Quote Originally Posted by village View Post
    I'm poised....... timing is everything!
    :) Keep us posted.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Do Not Sell My Personal Information