Reply With QuoteJust make sure it meets EURO6 emission standards.
Ok, hands up, I know next to nothing about cars, and even less about the state of the market/industry. However what I do know is that since getting our new 8 month old lab, our loyal Ford Fiesta 'Fleur', that's right 'she' has a name, is feeling a little cramped and it's only going to get worse.
The car itsel has been brilliant, cheap to run, cheap to service/MOT and never missed a beat. As such and given I know naff all about cars we were thinking of sticking with Ford and going bigger and getting a Kuga. However we have noticed that bigger often means diesel, esp if you get into the SUV market. We could go estate which offers some petrol options but again a lot of diesel.
I understand diesel engines are under the microscope at the moment as a realisation has set in they might not be as kind to polar bears as once thought or some such.
It is a good idea to buy a diesel car now or should I steer clear. We would be going second hand hopefully 2013/14 plate if we can stretch to it to give an idea of engine era if that means anything.
Thanks, and apologies for my ignorance.
Ed
Just make sure it meets EURO6 emission standards.
Strange but I was wondering this same thing earlier. I know nothing except what I read about diesel cars being not a good thing, but BMW, Mercedes and the like are all selling new ones. So I'm presuming they aren't affected and its older ones? I've no idea though.
I've got a 15 year old Volvo s60 diesel that returns around 50mpg...I think its time to change, but i just don't know what to buy!!!
I'd hate to buy an expensive diesel only to find that the government hits me with a massive hit on either taxation or city zone charging.
Looks like I'll be driving the s60 for some time yet, until the Government decide what they want to do with diesels.
How many miles do you do?
What sort of driving do you do?
This^Originally Posted by Coops365
I currently have a diesel as it's a company car and tax is less but I'm probably buying privately next year and as I think I will do around 10000 miles I'm going to get a petrol- even if I was doing more given the negative publicity for diesels and the chance of penalising legislation (albeit a few years away) I'd still go for petrol
Currently secondhand petrol cars seem comparatively good value and with the likely ban of diesel from big cities coming in at some stage, I'd not buy diesel for the long term.
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I'm in a similar situation. Looking to replace my car I bought in 2010 but just don't know what to replace it with. Ruled out diesel due to recent negative press. That and I probably don't cover enough miles to justify the extra cost.
The more miles the better the case for derv
Anything below 25-30000 miles a year stick to petrol anything above buy a diesel in my opinion I use a van and a 4x4 so both diesels however the Mrs next car will be petrol because she just doesn't do the miles to justify it anymore.
Thanks for the replies and glad to hear I am not the only one in this boat.
We do very minimal miles, I would say about 7K ish, expect it will go up now we have a dog but sounds like I am well off diesel territory.
As that seems rule out most SUV's will look at estates me thinks.
Thanks
I wouldn't buy another diesel, we run a 1 litre ecoboost fiesta and a diesel Volvo 4x4. The Volvo is a bugger to park and has a turning circle like the titanic. I live in a rural area but unless you're a farmer I don't think a 4x4 is necessary. Sure it's very swish inside, but the fiesta is way cheaper to run and I reckon the writing is on the wall for diesel. If you like the fiesta, and aren't that bothered by cars, why not get a petrol focus estate? Room for the dog and no pretending you're off on an adventure across Namibia when you're off to the shops and the park!!
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I think it would be mad to buy an expensive diesel now which wasn't Euro 6
Great minds, the petroleum Focus estate is what seems to be coming up as the option in my searches on auto trader. Did wonder if the normal Focus would have enough boot pace for a fully grown lab - at 7 months he fits in the boot of the Fiesta fine with bars, but obviously that won't last hence the need for a change of car.
I guess now would be a good time to haggle a price for one. Certainly not selling my cr-v, too useful.
Theres another similar threada believe.
Regardless of the future implications for diesel cars, and the mileage/running cost equation, I actually prefer the way my diesel drives. Masses of low-speed torque means excellent acceleration,albeit over a narrow rev range.......but that's all sorted by the auto gear-box. A decent diesel engine coupled with a modern auto-box is an ideal combination for real-world driving.
Having said that, the latest generation of turbo petrol engines have made big leaps forward in terms of power output and fuel efficiency. Diesel's usually the daddy whwn it comes to fuel efficiency, due partly to the fact that it's around 15% denser than petrol and we calculate fuel efficiency on a volume basis......not rocket science to see why diesel's got the advantage! There are other complicated factors too that I can't claim to understand.
There was a lengthy thread on this very topic a few weeks back, but I don't think any conclusions were drawn; we're all guessing at the moment.
Paul
Well you would struggle to buy one new that wasn't since Euro 6 has been mandatory since 1/9/2015 but I agree buying second hand from before this cut off would be a huge risk and I can see even relatively new diesels from before then diving in price in the next couple of years. There is nothing to say of course that they won't punish the Euro 6 stuff at some future point too.
Last edited by Padders; 16th May 2017 at 23:03.
Just taken delivery of a Caddy on lease with the 1.4TSI petrol. It's quick around town and cruises nicely on the motorway. I would have gone for the 150bpp diesel if it had been available on the deal rather than the 102bhp because I like the diesel burble and the sheer torque. The TSI has a supercharger and turbo which are highly complex items and doubtless will need attention at some point. The new Euro6 engines are very efficient emissions-wise and don't make badgers cough.
Current VW 1.4 is turbocharged only, the 150hp version has cylinder deactivation too. No supercharger any more, they had big issues with the twin charged ones.
Thanks again for the replies and heads up on previous threads. Will have to brush up on my forum 'search-fu' which let me down when I looked!
1.5 litre now, but same power.
I would buy diesel again, but then I drove over 5,000 miles last month.
It's just a matter of time...
We've used diesel cars for about 30 years.
I've put up with additional valves/gizmos to improve emissions control but the modern diesel seems to be a more complicated creature than my original Peugeot 305 estate and will be much more expensive to repair(my Peugeot had 115000 miles on the clock when I traded it in and I spent £11.50 on repairs to it).
My current diesel has 66000 miles on the clock.
My wife has a Fiesta eco 1.0 and loves it.
My next car will probably be petrol.
If you have a dog (or small children) go for an estate car IMHO.
We are talking about the petrol? Mine is brand new last Friday. In the dealers for a month before that I believe. Oh well, I don't do intergalactic distances so I'll have to wait and see.
The 1.5 is not listed in their online brochure.
Personally I wouldn't buy a diesel, if taxation changes and pollution levy's or charges are introduced it could make a modern diesel depreciate at an alarming rate if the bottom drops out of the market. All speculation and conjecture I know.
Since you seem to be a 'Ford man' I'd suggest you look at the Focus Estate 1.0 EcoBoost. A friend of mine who always had diesels replaced his last Focus TDCi with the modern 1.0 EcoBoost 125PS and he loves it, says it still give great economy, costs £30/year to Tax and has room for 5 and 2 dogs. I have been out in it several times and you'd never guess there is only a 1000cc 3 cylinder engine under the bonnet, it feels like a 1.8 engine. It's really nice. Do they do that engine in the Kuga?
Great solution except the 1.0 Ecoboost engines are increasingly suffering timing issues so they too can be problematic after a few years. All modern engines are increasingly complicated, not just the diesels so petrol isn't the no brainer solution some seem to think it is.
Yes the small VW petrol engines have no supercharger any more just a turbo but are powerful, reliable and economical so you shouldn't have any issues hopefully. The 1.5 is an upcoming minor update.
Yes. Just bought a new Up in petrol. If they'd been able to offer a Diesel, I would have gone for that instead though I would have expected a 33% increase in MPG as a result.
I think it depends a lot on where you will be driving. Once you get out into the countryside and need to drive uphill a lot, smallish petrol engines do not have enough torque. A fair number of people who bought a city car with a one litre petrol engine complain about the real life fuel consumption as they need to shift down and keep up the revs a lot of the time. Diesels are not just synonymous with big 4x4s or vans. We just got a second hand compact Dacia crossover for my wife who needs to drive to work every day through hill country, and in our area, diesels are kings. We got it with a 1.5 litre 90 hp turbodiesel, euro 6. The equivalent petrol, turbo 3 cilinder, also has 90 hp, but its torque maxes out at 120 Nm at a high rev number, while the diesel gives you 220 Nm over a comfortable range of revs, with a lot of uphill pulling power even if you do not downshift like mad. I don't think authorities will prohibit E6 diesels from urban areas for the foreseeable future, there would be no vans delevering goods.
We found that an engine with start/stop makes a difference once you get into town. Better for pedestrians' airways too. ;-)
Very sensible: I live in a very hilly rural area, and I really appreciate the low torque and not constantly stirring the gears. Also comfortable quiet cruise at economical revs.
Euro 6 clean diesel no problems on cars after 1 sept 2015, but check because Audi BMW & Mercedes got ahead of the game well before that cut off date. My A8 first reg June 15 is Euro 6.
This is true, unfortunately in their wisdom the government have chosen to apply the regs for diesels based on the arbitrary date of 1/9/15 as this was the date all new cars had to be Euro 6. Now this is manifestly unfair if you own a Euro 6 diesel or Euro 4 petrol from before the respective cut off dates but you will still get penalised as it looks at present. I looked into this as I have a Euro 4 petrol 2004 car as well as a new diesel and it seems the date is the cut off, not the emissions spec quoted on the V5. Hopefully this may be addressed but at present, a June 15 Audi is treated the same as a smokey 1995 Mondeo and will be liable for the clean air charges.
Last edited by Padders; 17th May 2017 at 19:10.
I had the petrol/diesel dilemma earlier this year when considering changing my Golf 2.0 diesel.
Given current situation I went for petrol and am currently getting c.48mpg compared to c.53-55mpg on the diesel.
Very happy wth the choice I made, quieter car and it seems a little more nimble as it's quite a bit lighter.
I'll stick it in the scrappage scheme then.
Jokes aside, hopefully sense will prevail and they will go on the actual emissions performance rather than date of registration but perhaps there is a question mark over Euro 6 VWs muddying the waters or was that Euro 5?
'The engine that powers the world' on BBC4 was a good program and made it obvious that diesels are unlikely to be 'phased out' in any foreseeable future.
They (whosomever they are) are said to be considering banning diesels from cities. so does that mean taxis, buses, delivery lorries, ambulances, generators, fork trucks etc etc are going to be banned from cities?
Not sure about VW scandal as my Audi's engine was not included, if i want to drive in the ULEZ then i would use our 2015 3 pot petrol Aygo but seeing as we live a a leafy suburb of Manchester it an't going to happen.
I change my car's when they hit 3 years old so I've a bit to go yet, then the car has to be able to tow an 1800 KG twin axle caravan so so my choice is limited, I can tow at 100% but I like a buffer zone, I don't like 4x4 as they just wallow around, so I guess it will be the new 2018 Audi A8, after all I spend more time driving than towing.
To be clear, I wasn't having a pop at your Audi, some smaller older Audis may well have been affected but a 2015 A8 certainly wouldn't be caught up in the emissions defeat scandal, I was merely postulating a reason why they could decide to ignore the actual Euro rating as printed on the V5 in favour of an arbitrary cut off if for instance they suspected not all Euro ratings were equal.
Last edited by Padders; 17th May 2017 at 19:58.
I know you wasn't having a pop, but when the scandal hit I had to check because it was all so unclear at the start.
That was an excellent and interesting prog. Highlighted the issue exactly - I dont see all those diesel powered utility vehicles- even all those trains that arrive in cities every moment of the day- suddenly being banned.. It's not like petrol engines emit nothing but fairy dust..
I've actually just put a deposit down on a diesel Mercedes. It was something I was concerned about, but it meets Euro6 standard and I cover varying miles so it will hopefully work out.
As an aside, I went looking at various cars and it seems petrol sales have recently gone through the roof according to several salesman. However I didn't trust any of them and I was of course looking at buying a petrol before going for the Mercedes. There's apparently a 6 month wait on the Seat 1.4T engines due to demand, but VW, with the same engine are only suggesting normal waiting times for new build cars. This wait and the fact that a used Mercedes came up in my search were the reason I didn't;t go for a small petrol engine in the end; something I'm glad about now.
If you're buying a car for cash, then depreciation is of course more concerning than a car on finance or lease if you're happy to hand back.
So I don't get a car with a supercharger nor, separately, do get the V8 I've always lusted after. Damn.
The new 7-speed DSG box is good.
I seriously doubt I'll get the advertised mpg mind. It's already averaging 31 whereas my last Ford Grand C-Max 2 litre diesel was doing nearly 40.
It's not broken in yet, I've only had it since Friday.
When I bought my car I calculated tat breakeven mileage for diesel over petrol was c.17000 miles pa, for a Golf taking into account higher purchase price of diesel car and mpg differences. As I do c. 10000 miles pa the petrol made sense.
I think diesel will be around for a long time yet, maybe mainly on bigger cars, say 3 series and above, but the cost of further gizmos on such cars to reduce diesel pollutants is likely to be fairly expensive.
Trying to second guess politics & taxation changes is risky (ask the landlords) so on that subject you just take your gamble.
That brings us back to running costs question.
Personally despite doing 25-30k miles PA & being an engineering who develops diesel engines, I choose petrol for the following reasons;
- I prefer the driving experience, I can't stand the short rev range of diesels.
- They are simpler & cheaper to maintain. I use a £500 rule, how many opportunities are there for something to break & cost over £500 to fix, diesels have many more of these than equivalent petrol.
Yes it costs me an extra few hundred per year in fuel, but I normally offset this by minimizing depreciation.
In order to hit emissions levels most modern diesels are now chock full of tech that needs mileage at speed in order to work properly. More info on DPF's here
https://www.theaa.com/driving-advice...culate-filters
Most dealers now won't sell you a diesel car new if you declare a low mileage.
However as you've seen most SUVs will only come in diesel so you may have to re-think car choice.
I can't see any diesel ban being applied retrospectively in a manner that would instantly kill values of cars so if your mileage allowed i'd still buy diesel if it's the right choice for you. I'd just bought a 2.4 5 cylinder diesel to prove i take my own medicine :D
To answer the OP.
NO!
Sorry, but this is not true.
Most?
Won't?
When i was buying two dealers asked me about my mileage straight off the bat "to make sure diesel was suitable"
I think there have been a few cases of customers hvae PPF issues and then blaming the dealer for not advising the car was unsuitable.
Your experience may be different but it happened to me.
If you are getting it rather cheap and you do a lot of mileage then diesel still has a strong appeal.
I feel we have yet to see the full extent of the financial penalties of owning a diesel but the fuel cost saving of say 55mpg v 35mpg, at high mileage, is very substantial and is likely to cancel out all extra pollution costs imposed.
I've not been buying since the emissions scandal struck but I suspect there are some real bargain diesels to be had now. Anyone confirm?
Hybrid is another option? Recently bought a used Lexus and vhappy. I get 50+ mpg on long distances, 45 with mixed driving ( not using eco mode) Toyota / Lexus have introduced "hybrid care" which as part of a service extends the warranty on the hybrid drive components by 15k km or 1 year, up to a max of 10 years.
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As has been mentioned above, the new Audi/VW/Seat 1.4 turbo 150bhp petrol engine is a cracker.
I have this in a Seat Leon, and it does 50mpg on decent journeys easily (my wife gets better than this), with a 0 - 60 time of about 8 secs.
I don't miss diesel cars any more after years of having them
Pete
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