Reply With QuoteAMEN
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Hello All ,
I am quite new to the interest of watches in general and am only interested in purchasing "ONE" watch which I hope after viewing the various watch forums , youtube etc will be the best Divers watch that I can afford and will also be of a reasonable quality and practical watch for my everyday use . There are many people on the forums who obviously have a much deeper interest , knowledge and experience in Horology and the collection of watches than I have and I openly admit to using their expertise and advice in helping me choose what I believe to be a half decent watch within the price range that I can afford . So before I continue I would like to thank all those members who have contributed to answering my threads with their well founded advice . Watches , like other objects that people collect are something that comes down to personal choice and everyone is different in their own particular choices . What I do find rather snobbish and yes even arrogant is certain peoples views regarding "Homage " watches . I am aware that there is a massive controvossy within the ranks of serious Horologists regarding Homage , Copy , Fake ( whatever people choose to call them ) watches that lend their design to past well known high end makes and models of other famous watches . I would just like to put my ten penneth worth into the debate ! WHO CARES , if you like a particular watch for whatever reason then buy it , what does it matter if it resembles a Rolex Submarriner or an Omega Seamaster , if you like it for whatever reason then go for it . Why should it matter to the owner of a Rolex or whatever high end make of watch that there are other less expensive watches out there that resemble theirs ? There cannot be a watch in existence that has not borrowed or copied some or part of their design to a previous model or make ! I do not intend to offend anyone who owns one of the better known models out there ( If I had the money , I also would probably own one , or maybe not ! ) , all I am saying is be happy with what you can afford or are happy with . For the record I have recently ordered a Steinhart OVM , and in my opinion , I like the newer style of Vintage Black / Grey face dial , and as I say it all comes down to personal choice . Once again thanks to the members who write their opinions on the many different aspects of choosing a watch .
Mike
AMEN
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Paragraphs are personal choice.
To use the kids text analogy "pmsl" that did make me laugh!!Originally Posted by JP Chestnut
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I tried to read it in one breath ...... nearly died lol
The sentiment (buy what you like, not what people think you should) is good, but it was hard to pick out of a solid block of text.
Stillperhapsthechallengecouldbegreaterstillbyremov ingspacestoo?
Welcome anyway and enjoy your watch.
M
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Breitling Cosmonaute 809 - What's not to like?
You have hit a nail of sorts on the head so to speak, we are all different, like different watches, have different budgets, like different numbers of watches in our collection etc.
Well done to you (see what I did there with the change of paragraph). You have found what's right for you and that is great. I admire people on here who go their own way, be it a Steinhart or a more varied collection.
Too many people just have a bog standard collection of relatively similar Rolex, because they think that's what they should have and will win them the admiration of others.
Last edited by Wallasey Runner; 7th April 2017 at 23:17.
Paragraphs aside!
You are right it shouldn't matter to anyone what you wear and in true reflection of that you shouldn't care what someone thinks of your homage, ripoff, copy, fake etc?!?
Each to their own for me and I can see the attraction of a certain look without having the price point of some of the top end watches.
I personally am lucky enough to be able to afford a few of the slightly more expensive watches but nothing compared to some of the guys on here?!? From my point of view I suppose the history behind a watch stops me getting a homage of any sort really or at least that's what stops me being so into a specific watch that I have to have it even if it's just a copy?
I have a fascination with regards to the mechanism and marvel at how something so small is so intricate and accurate, which means for me it's more than skin deep it's what lies behind the outer casing it's all about the workings.
This means that a homage for me will always fall short but it doesn't make me have an opinion of anyone that wears one, except when we are talking an outright fake that tarnishes a brand and is made to con people out of the same money that the original cost!?!?
Anyway good luck with your watch!
Chris
Last edited by subchris; 7th April 2017 at 23:32.
Is that a rant because you've bought a homage or a genuine "who cares?" question?
If it's the latter then some people obviously do or it wouldn't be such a bone of contention. They have as much personal choice about that as you do, no?
I'm not disagreeing with you in general—nor, I think, is anyone else—but these three things are not at all the same. Unless you're saying Timefactors watches are fakes, which under the circumstances would be a little tactless.
Good choice but you strike a very defensive tone.
Don't worry about homage/copy thing. Enjoy your watch.
Hello All ,
I am sorry that some of you seem to have misread my thread regarding Homage watches in general and as such I would like to be able to answer any misunderstandings .
First of all I am not being defensive as I have nothing to defend , I am only stating my personal ideas just like anyone else on the forum .
As I said in the thread if you like any watch for any reason , it is a personal choice so go for it .
where did the statement come from that I might be suggesting that Timefactors watches are FAKES !!! , I NEVER HINTED AT OR SUGGESTED ANY SUCH THING , and that definitely goes for any other Homage watch . I am actually looking at a timefactors watch that I might be interested in .
If you noticed I openly admit to seeking advice from members of this forum who know a great deal more than I do about watches in general , and that helped me to make my choice of watch also based upon what I can afford .
So please Guys don't put a Newbie off just for aking questions and stating their views . Just for the record I have nothing against anyones ideas of buying a top of the range watch and if I had the money I possibly might or might not buy one , that is all I said . We all have our priorities in life based on many things and I respect that , so all I ask is that you respect me and let me say my piece which was after all only my thoughts and opinions , I wasn't starting a war .
With thanks
MIKE
Hi Mike. No-one is having a go at you. Take your time and get to know the place. Congratulations on your new watch - pictures when it arrives please.
If there is a 'debate' it does not revoke around the notion of 'personal choice', with the suggestion that the only issue is individual liberty. Some of these watches get close to being deliberate clones. They drip with cynicism in feeding off the hard work of other manufacturers. They hope to be taken as the 'real thing', and any sensible person knows it.
If someone made an obvious copy of a Range Rover, there would be no talk of 'personal choice'....some clones are innocent enough , others are more problematic (Parnis for instance?).
As for deliberate fakes...they are just disgusting.
Last edited by paskinner; 8th April 2017 at 18:17.
Hello alfat33 ,
Thanks for your comforting words and I do appreciate them , but on the contrary I am old enough and wise enough to know when people are being objectionable . I have actually read and re-read through my thread to see if it was offensive and the only point that anyone could pick up on and possibly get annoyed about was the fact that I said there was some snobbishness and arrogance from some (not all ) owners of higher end watches regarding some of the Homage style watches , and this was regarding the watch forums in general , not just Timefactors . Please believe me when I say , that was not my intention and was simply stating a fact that I had picked up on whilst doing my research on the various forums and youtube slides . When I mentioned Fakes , Copies etc , these were not my words or thoughts but actually many and numerous comments made by people who find Homage watches offensive for whatever reason ( I personally cannot see why ? ) . That then was the point I was trying to make and I did see a snobbishness and arrogance in that way of thinking , after all its nothing that hasn't been mentioned on the various forums many times .
so once again I will say No offence meant to anyone and I will just read through the forum for any further research and enjoy it that way . But thanks again all those that gave me good advice .
Mike
Hello Paskinner ,
Please read my reply to alfat33 . I totally understand what you are telling me and that deliberate fakes are not only Illegal but morally wrong in my opinion . I think you are taking my original point of view too far which is obviously making you angry , but apart from the Illegal practice of making deliberate fakes or counterfeits , to me a watch is not that important in the big scheme of things . All I am after is a watch that is aesthetically nice in my eyes and is made and constructed with half decent components and is obviously reliable , my personal choice nothing more .
With thanks
Mike
Not for everyone. I'll suggest a different view.
I've owned a few homages; Timefactors, Steinhart etc and I buy them for what they are. An example of when this went too far was a Squale I bought in 2016. The build and finish were superb but it looked far too much like a sub for me so I sold it. I knew that anyone looking at it who knew watches would think it was a sub as it was so close and I didn't want that. So rather than buying for being taken as the real thing, I sold for being taken as the real thing.
Can someone summarise since that looks torturous to read ? Just another fake lover ?
I certainly haven't found any snobbishness about homages. I, like many others here, have owned both homages and non homage watches.
The one thing most people on here won't accept is fakes.
Show your homages proudly and no one here will care; try to pass off or even discuss fakes and you'll find yourself unwelcome.
Someone who has bought a Steinhart and is very happy with it. Not everyone has the budget for multi Rolex so perhaps a little unfair to lable him as a fake lover.
^ Thanks for summary. Are you saying Steinharts are only for people who can't afford a Rolex, or multiple Rolex ? I don't think that's true at all, I used to own one myself and it was decent IIRC.
Not at all, but a lot of homage bashing does take place on this forum and let's keep homage and fake in completely different boxes as they are not the same thing. In the case of the vintage Steinhart range they are clearly a homage to extremely rare Rolex that very few people get the opportunity to own, even if they can afford it. But a £300 Steinhart does the job.
Congratulations your Lordship on becoming a Grand Master.
Remember, you are not the Messiah, you are just a very naughty boy.
Thank you
Hadn't you better report to the BP? Remember, line on the left, one cross each.
Not for me, I am due to be released.
Thanks for that sensible comment Wallesy Runner , and I will certainly second your comment . I have the right to defend myself this time and I quote , I am not a fake lover !!! . Just proves my point about people taking things too far .
I will leave it there .
Kind regards
Mike
Enjoy your OVM Mike, it's a cracking watch
Thankyou for that , gives me a bit more faithEnjoy your OVM Mike, it's a cracking watch
He's the William Wallace of homages.
As an aside, how come watch design is so difficult to copyright? Could anyone just mock up a Sub lookalike and put an original brand name without any fear of being legally challenged?
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And how many still have the stickers on? Seems to me a rather absurd amount. Watches are for wearing...
It has been done!
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/g...t-which-better
Looks like LR have objected though.
I see these on the roads of Shanghai all the time so they are doing well out of it. A snip at only £14K versus £40K for a proper one. Is it a fake, a clone or an homage?
Homages are ok, defensive attitude about them as reflected in accusations of snobbishness and projections about the aspirations of the owners of the real deal - absolutely not.
Nothing wrong with a homage, they helped me on the way to the real thing. The best similarity is they are all a comfortable 40mm diameter.
in your opinon of course and congratulations on your mind reading ability regarding the decision making & thought process of Rolex owners. Some people jump about from brand to brand, others stick with one brand be it Rolex, Omega, Sinn or whoever - horses for courses I would suggest.
Don't spend too long on this forum. You will soon realise that one watch is never enough. The ideal number of watches is n+1 where n is the number you already own
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Lol, love the formula!
How can any Timefactor watch be a fake? To Be a fake it'd have to made by someone other than Timefactors. I'm not keen on the term homage either as that implies some sort of copy.
I've one of Eddie's Smiths Everests that bears the same name as the watch Smiths released the year after Hilary summited Everest wearing/carrying a Smiths.
The Smith's Everest of 1953/54 looked identical to the watch Hilary wore.
As to the Explorer, the Everest watch was a white dialled Oyster (the forerunner of the perpetual) and nothing like the Explorer we know today.
The Explorer was released late in 1953 to celebrate the achievements of Hilary. Indeed Rolex has never said it was the watch worn by both Hilary and Tenzing, that's the myth that's been created over time and seems to be considered factual now.
Indeed, as far as I am aware Rolex has never said the Explorer was the watch that conquered Everest.
Interestingly Rolex sponsored many Everest (and other) expeditions on sea and land with Smiths and Tudor mainly sponsoring/being involved in Arctic & Antarctic exploration (hence the Tudor North Flag) with both developing watches that were both waterproof and functioned perfectly at minus 40 degrees (something of a feat still today)
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Exactly. Eddie's watches are something different again: a new interpretation of classic watches using modern movements and materials, and uprated specifications. They are, in many cases, better than the originals, and some bear the same brand name as the original, because Eddie owns the rights to it. I don't really care for the term 'reboot', but I can't think of a better one at the moment.
That is quite different from something like a Steinhart Milsub homage, or an Invicta Sub-a-like.
And a each one numbered along with the year produced so none of all that looking up letter date codes to verify age.
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I love my 55 Fathoms
but always feel that I'm on thin ice with the hommage argument.
Designs that have been in the public domain for so many years are difficult to protect.
Then, many current designs are based on a military specification, the MOD wrote a detailed spec for various watch houses during the war which produced the 'Dirty Dozen' watches, each watch has a very similar look, the the only protectable thing was the brand name.
Specific innovations are protectable like the HEV via patents, but they expire too.
So yes you can make a Sub-a-like if you wish.
Thanks for the info. I'm away out to my shed, see if I can knock up a copy, I mean homage to something good.....
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I think there are very, very few watches which are newly released and haven't taken an influence from an existing design, whether that be on purpose or not. I mean unless you go avant garde/haute horology then you can see design influences in nearly any new watch. There's only so many possible designs if you're looking at something that has a dial and hands.
I've got nothing against the more obvious looking homage watches and own and take pride in everything from my Seiko5 and upwards in price.
Wear what feels right for you and no-one else. And enjoy your hobby.
Hear , Hear
A very defensive first post, that continues at every reply.
Wear what you want as you are exercising your personal choice.
Please do not ask for peer validation and all will be well. And if you do, then accept that not everyone will share your enthusiasm.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Please don't be so serious about it all and chill out .
Only agreeing with the Guy
Did I quote your 'hear, hear'? No? Then I was referring to your OP and the following posts.
You are the one who needs to chill, starting with the number of exclamation marks on the title of your thread.
You are wearing a wannabe sub. It is your right, it is your choice. Enjoy it!
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
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