Reply With Quote6D + 24-105mm. No brainier, other opinions are available ;)
I have booked a photography course in April but don't currently have a DSLR, this is a requirement of the course. I've had various canon cameras over the years so want to stick with what I know. I have narrowed it down to the 7d mkii, 6d, and 80d after talking with sales people in John Lewis and jessops. Also reading things online. The 6d is probably the best as it's full frame, but this is being replaced this year and I want something now. The 80d for its features etc and the fact it's the newest is what I'm looking to put my money out in the next few days. I was wondering if any of you guys on here had any pointers for me?
Also what should be my first all round lens? I will mostly be taking pics of family, my dog and wildlife whilst on walks/holiday.
Many thanks.
Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app
6D + 24-105mm. No brainier, other opinions are available ;)
Fas est ab hoste doceri
I have a 30d with the 24-105 which works for me in the same sort of situations you suggest
What are you going to be photographing mostly?
If it's landscapes, then a full frame model like the 6D might be better. With a 24-105 or 24-70 lens and you're good to go.
For most other subjects, a cropped sensor model like the 7D2 or 80D is fine. Both are extremely capable cameras. A 24-105 lens might still be fine with these, but if you want some wide angle options then maybe a 18-135 lens might give you more options.
This is a good website to show most of the best deals around: http://www.camerapricebuster.co.uk/C...n-Digital-SLRs
I bought a 70d in December, it was discounted (300 pounds) because the shop had 80d's in and when I weighed it up given my abilities it seems better value to purchase a Canon 70d with a 'stock' 18-135mm IS STM instead of the 80d with 'stock' 18-55mm IS.
What about 2nd hand from a camera shop?
I have a 70D and love it.
It's just a matter of time...
I love my 7D (mark 1) its about 4 years old and still clicking away.
I'm a Nikon user, so no advice on which model from me. What I will say is that you should consider size and weight if you're going to be carrying your purchase on walks.
You can get decent shots using any modern camera body, so think more about the lens(es) you want. A telephoto lens is where most of us start and I see that Canon offer packages with a 18-135 mm lens. Research that one and see if it gets decent reviews. Once you have done your course (good idea) and done a bit of photography you'll know more about what you really need to achieve what you want.
For prices you can look here and elsewhere on the net.
Oh...an afterthought. Is there a camera club near where you live? They will be a good source of advice.
Last edited by PickleB; 10th February 2017 at 06:51.
I know of a 5d MK11 and a 300mm,50mm and grip for sale.
I have the 6d withe the 24-105 kit lens. Absolute amateur am I, but I get beautiful photos. My only gripe is that the 6d doesn't have many focus points so anything other than portraits with still subjects gets a bit tricky for me. I will be upgrading along the line probably to the model above mine mk5 in some guise, as I think I'd get a lot better shots with more focus points. I wouldn't consider a 7d as it is not full frame.
Just found this: Considerations for buying a canon dSLR.
£1.6k for a camera to take pics of the dog and family seems a bit steep if you ask me... (yes, it's a great combo)
but for learning on...even 450d with a decent lens would produce very respectable pictures in the right hands and you can get that for well under 500 quid...no big loss when you come to sell it after you decide what type of photography you'll be really into.
Does it have to be an SLR? Surely something like the Fuji X-T10 with the XF18-55 or XF18-135 would be ideal if you're buying it purely because of the course - lightweight, all the same controls as an SLR (and all on dials as opposed to in menu's) - the Fuji refurb store has some cracking deals on them at the moment as the X-T20 is due any time soon. You'd be looking at half the price for body+lens of just the canon body alone and Fuji glass is as good as it gets!
Appreciate you wanted to stick with Canon, but I think looking further afield could be beneficial.
I echo the sentiments of paying less. A 450d is plenty decent to learn photography with.
I personally would recommend a used 5d mk2 or mk3 for the benefit of being able to buy full size lenses.
And before you start messing about with cheap nasty zooms get yourself some primes . A good 50mm is an essential inexpensive lens and indeed you may find you use it way more often than any zoom and even a cheap one will be sharper and faster than all but the super expensive zooms.
This could be a winning combo with some good deals out there at the mo.Originally Posted by VDG
- - - Updated - - -
Thanks, will probably go for this lens with a 80d/6d
A 50mm is a must by the sounds of things, you are the 4th person to say that i should get one and they are cheap!
I want to future proof myself so will probably go for a new camera.
thanks.
I think so through the flexibility of what a SLR can do, I have a canon G12 and that is fully adjustable but i want more creativity.
thanks.
I can get a decent lens camera combo for around £1000 after shopping around. and as you say I will probably get around half that back in a couple of years if upgrading.
thanks.
for this reason I think I'll go for the 80d as it has plenty of focus points, I think from what everyone says the 24-105 is the lens to get. and the 6d mkii will be around soon. but I will wait a year for this to drop in price.
Thanks
I think you have decided to go for a full frame camera. A 50 mm prime lens is common enough, but it wouldn't be my first choice. Have a read of:
Last edited by PickleB; 10th February 2017 at 18:34.
Although it sounds like you've settled on the combo you want to get, just wanted to add in my experience as a DSLR newbie - I bought the other half a 1200d with a 18-55 kit lens for £200 2 Black Fridays ago and then this year we've added the Canon 55-250 lens for £115 and a 50mm Yongnuo that for £40, does a remarkably good job. As a step up from her Lumix point and shoot, it's been absolutely fantastic. We're well aware that we're never going to be using it for anything other than dabbling but it's been producing absolute treats of pictures even in auto mode. So, all in for ~£375 including filters it's done everything we want it to cover from a first time use DSLR.
Just on a different angle.
If you have £1100 to spend you should spend £1000 on the lens and £100 on the camera body and not £1000 on the body and £100 on the lens.
TBH, your camera is going to make very little difference to the quality of the shots you get, quality being defined in its widest sense.
I'm always minded at this point to remember a black and white photograph of Martin Luther King delivering his "I have a dream" speech. Without a doubt one of the most powerful photographs I've ever seen whilst technically being rubbish, One of my favourite photos.
Ten years ago I bought the works, Nikon body, lenses, the lot. Today the body is junk status but I just pick up a nearly-new s/h example of last year's 'must have' for a third of the price and carry on snapping through the glass! There was a decent Nikon body on SC a couple of days back for about £65 for example.
You'll never regret buying good glass.
Thanks for your advice, maybe I should spend less as that seems a theme of everyone.
Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app
Great advice! I'm getting the point now that I the lens is what makes a pic not the fancy marketing led camera. As a novice I think I should get something second hand that will get me hooked and then I can upgrade later keeping the lenses previously bought. Apparently a 24-105 is the one of choice??
Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app
I'm a Nikon man so can't help you with that one. Try and read up on what is epic in the camera range, certainly quite a few earlier posters specc'd the 24-105.
It is a bit of a generalisation, but the kit lenses, i.e. the ones that come with the cameras from the shops, are rarely stellar performers. They are often two-a-penny on the used websites like Wex or LCE. Take a look through their secondhand listings to sort something in your budget. I've bought from both and they are easy and pleasant to deal with.
Get a decent range, 20 to 80 sort of thing. Much more and you'll get compromises rearing their ugly head. Also getting a prime (50mm is ok) with a very wide aperture (1.4 or 1.8) will help your scope and develop your creativity. Also, with a fairly standard prime you get a lot of bang for your buck. Pin sharp performance at a cheap price. There's a lot to be said for primes, but keep dust off your sensor when you're changing lenses.
Thanks for your reply. You are reinforcing the lens choices I plan to make with most of my budget going on the two you describe. Ta v much
Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app
Personally I think the 24-105 is not wide enough on a crop sensor, I have the 80D with a sigma 17-55 f2,8 and the canon 70-200 f4 an amazing combo.
Last edited by neillp; 10th February 2017 at 20:58.
You also mentioned one key phrase in your original post "whilst out on walks"
Quality full frame glass can be very heavy whereas glass designed for crop sensors will normally be lighter. I had a Sony full frame set up but it was just too heavy to walk around with so went back to a crop set up.
Having recently swapped from Canon SLR setup to a lighter Sony mirrorless setup I have come to realise that unless i want to be a professional or make bill board size pictures the Camera will always outperform my abilities no matter what camera I'm using
So my advice is pick a camera that feels right for you and go for it, any that you mention will be more than enough for all but the most demanding, just remember walking and carrying a Full frame camera and lens can soon get on your nerves in my experience
Make sure you do these mods if you buy a 70d
https://youtu.be/FvhOwpip0K8
The Fuji system is as flexible as any other brands. £1600 would get you an Xt-10 and some lovely prime lenses. My current favourite is the Fuji prime 35mm lens, paired with an xt-10, and a whole lot smaller and lighter than the canon SLR it replaced.
Some recent pics @ www.instagram.com/c_p
Thanks, although I want to make this a hobby so will future proof myself with a higher spec model.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Great advice. I will be out and about with this plus travels around the world on holiday.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I'll give it a look tomorrow then. Ta.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
In that instance I'd definitely say size of the camera is more important than size of the sensor.
As a couple have said - invest in lenses.
Camera bodies go out of date rediculously fast these days (I mean in terms of latest features/tech - realistically actual image quality doesn't really change as much or quickly) a 450d with a good lens in the hands of a good photographer is better than the latest 1D in the hands of a novice.....
Ultimately decent glass, a little skill and an eye for a good photo is what matters!
he he, I knew this would turn into a looong thread :)
Couple of points and my personal observations FWIW, obviously:
- you do not need DSLR to take great pictures or learn the craft.
- DSLR gives you flexibility of the whole system ie lenses, accessories etc, and opportunity to take pictures in a challenging conditions ie low light and/or fast moving subjects.
- not all DSLRs are equal - try before you buy, or at least just look through the 'peep hole' of a couple on your shortlist (with the same lens attached) before you commit your money.
- lenses are forever and your best friends. (c) VDG ;)
- old bodies do not stop taking photos just because MKII/s/x/f is released.
- as with any hobby, there is no limit to how crazy far you can take it. Buy what you need, not what you may need.
- I recently realised that 90% of my (crappy) photos, including holiday/travel snaps nowadays are taken with iPhone
Last edited by VDG; 11th February 2017 at 08:44.
Fas est ab hoste doceri
Ah, new information. I would get a s/h Sony RX100 for your travels. Side-by-side with my Nikon on a tripod the shots are, in a technical sense at least, as good as identical. Mine's the mk 1, enough said.
If I were you I would not get an expensive DSLR right now.
[QUOTE=VDG;4244078]he he, I knew this would turn into a looong thread :)/QUOTE]
As a member of Talk Photography I can confirm these threads normally turn into war zones with Canonites v Nikonettes followed by the Sony/Fuji mob throwing barbs for good measure
The advice I always give is to go with an included kit lens as long as it isn't going to cost you too much as you will very quickly discover it's shortcomings and want better glass. I'd echo the 50mm prim suggestion as it's the best lens to teach you about composition and the use of depth of field through aperture choice. Enjoy!
Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app
As a side note I picked up the 70d as an upgrade of my 8 yr old 1000d (which is the lowest spec DSLR I think Canon ever did). One thing I have noticed is that now that I have switched my 17-85 lens as my walkabout lens to the 70d and put the kit 18-55 back on the 1000d for the first time in about 4 years the 1000d 18-55mm combo is so light that I now have started carrying it almost everywhere with me whereas when it was with the 17-85 it just felt so heavy I would only take it out when I was going somewhere specific.
I've even been taking the 1000d 18-55 places and testing out how to take photographs there (low light no flash) because it's so much easier to carry around.
After all your kind feedback and advice I had sold myself on something second hand from one of the many sites available. This morning I have had a massive spanner thrown in the works in that I have a client who happens to be the head of legal for Canon U.K. And has offered me a 30% discount on anything on their website. Now I don't know what to do again? I'm thinking new body either 760d or 80d and second hand lens from web?
Sent from my iPhone using TZ-UK mobile app
By way of example, this very lens on SC at £110 today:
http://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.ph...on-35mm-f-1-8G
and reviewed by Ken Rockwell here:
http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/35mm-f18.htm
produced this shot with amazing edge to edge clarity:
http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/d53...s/DSC_0252.JPG
Coupled with a camera that was advertised a few days ago at £65 here:
http://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.ph...0-with-a-story
would have been a good start...
I'm not a Nikon fanboy, I just have a Nikon system and am reasonably familiar with the possibilities.
I think an afternoon with some nikon's may be in order just to definitely rule them out.
You haven't got an offer of 30% off of new Nikon equipment...or have you?
Early in the thread a couple of us posted a link to the same price comparison site. As an alternative you might consider these chaps: link...grey market discount sellers (I believe) but with a reasonable reputation, as I recall.
PS Tell us a little more about the course you have booked, can you please? Is it general, DSLR specific, make specific etc etc?
I did my A-level photography in one year with a praktica 35mm slr a 50mm and a x2 diopter. ( I was laughed at by the tutors but they all looked a bit sheepish when I gained entry into a very prestigious animation degree course)
I also shot my cousins wedding with it at age 16 and she was extremely grateful as my pictures were better than the professional photographer and a rather snooty distant cousin who was doing a BA in photography. And I was using a really crappy flash which I'd figured out to bounce off the ceiling
So you don't need to spend a lot to learn photography. In fact a more basic rig might force you to study the fundamentals ...like the fact the metering is based primarily around mid gray ( i used to use cement pavements as an improvised gray card then lock the exposure and shoot)
I usually run around with a 5d mk2 or mk3 on film sets these days ( mainly for technical reference). However you could say my clunky praktika my mum got me out of the littlewoods catalogue played a role in getting me a pretty successful 25 year career in the film industry.
Nikon vs Canon...I'm more familiar with the Canon 5d mk2 and later as its often used on film sets ( mainly as it was the first DSLR to give good quality 1080p at 25/24fps). However Nikon is probably just as good if not better for stills work.
Oh yeah : stick it on manual , learn how to expose correctly (tip bracket if you are not sure not like you have film costs to worry about these days) , learn how to prioritse aperture , sensitivty and shutter speed depending on what you want. Always shoot RAW. Learn about magnification vs field of view. Thats you technically sorted ...rest is composition and creativity.
Get your technicals down before you start breaking rules ( its actually quite simple) . You don't want to spend ages waiting for that perfect moment and then mess up because you don't know the technicals .
Don't rely too much on the digital darkroom. Too many people do really terrible misguided work in there that professionals laugh at the instant they see it.
Go and look at some famous photographers : Eve Arnold , Bill Brandt and Q. Winston Link are some of my faves. That will be more useful than worrying overly about the kit. Also get out there and shoot , you'll soon realise a decent bag , waterproofs , thermals and boots are more important than Nikon vs Canon.
Last edited by Mr.D; 11th February 2017 at 16:07.
There's pretty much nothing that an SLR can do that a mirrorless system like the Fuji X-T1/X-T10 cannot - sure the AF system on high end bodies will likely be faster or better with tracking, but the X-T2 is right up there to the extent that one organisation who specialise on motorsports photography and swapped out all their Nikon DSLR's for X-T2's.
You won't lack for creativity with a mirrorless system camera and for what you are looking to shoot that's where I would be looking to get maximum bang for buck.
The G12 is a compact camera with a 1/1.7 size sensor (effectively a 4.6x crop) - this isn't really comparable to a mirrorless APS-C system.
Funnily enough my ex wife bought a limited direct from negative Eve Arnold print of Marilyn Monroe , signed and numbered. I've always told her to be careful of direct sunshine but she ignores me.
I looked into buying a Link print from original negative of Hotshot Eastbound which is one of my favourite photos . It was going to cost something like $25000 and was about 8x10 ! Needless to say I didn't go ahead . It could probably be a good investment but I can get a good giclee print about 5 times the size for £60.
[QUOTE=J3w3ll3r;4244162]Same here - who are you on there!?!?
For more reference... https://500px.com/ashsmith1
The majority of the architecture pics were taken with the Fuji X-T10 and XF18-55 (an amazing lens). The travel ones were taken with a D5100 and 18-55 kit lens
Posting Permissions
