closing tag is in template navbar
timefactors watches



TZ-UK Fundraiser
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 50 of 99

Thread: The (bathroom) scales of shame!

  1. #1
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Newtownards, NI
    Posts
    564

    The (bathroom) scales of shame!

    Thought I'd post this on here partly to try and encourage others and to keep me focused!

    Here's the deal, every year in work the guys in our office do a weight loss competition. It runs for 2 months, so deadline this year is 28th February. We all weigh in on a set of bathroom scales we bought for the office at the beginning on January and weigh out on the same by the end of February. Each person sticks a tenner in and the person who looses the most weight (or to keep it fair we use % of body weight lost) gets to pick a charity for the donation. We have helped quite a few charities over the years with this. 5 of us also have a side bet of a lunch with the person who loses the least picking up the bill, that can focus the mind! It's a bit of craic and of course the usual office banter kicks in with makes it all the more fun. People trying to temp others with chocolate, biscuits etc.

    Anyway, Last year through health issues and a wee touch of depression caused by the same (but this is no pity party so let's not dwell on that) I put on a bit of weight. On my weigh in on 3rd January I was 95.8kg or 15st 1lb (we keep it in KG as it's easier to work out % of body weight). Latest check on the scales and I am down to 93.3Kg or 14st 10lb., that was monday morning, 9th January. My aim (and it's ambitious) is to lose 10kg inb total before the end of February, so hoping to be under 90kg before end of January.


    I will post up updates along the was so you lot can shame me into action if I'm not on target! There's 22 of us in it including 3 women (they took some convincing as we publish the weight on a shared network location for all to see!) so there's £220 for charity at stake here plus a £50 lunch for some unlucky punter to pay for. Next weight update will be on Friday 13th January.

    Wish me luck!

  2. #2
    When we did that once some people drunk few litres of water beforehand.

  3. #3
    Master
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    3,051
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    When we did that once some people drunk few litres of water beforehand.
    I call them people losers

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    When we did that once some people drunk few litres of water beforehand.
    I call them people losers

  4. #4
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Newtownards, NI
    Posts
    564
    Oh yes, there's a lot of underhanded actions going on here too. People sitting in a steam room the morning of the weigh out etc. But that's why we now do it over 2 months, it means there's more of a difference between people who "cut weight" and people who actually try. I'm eating well and swimming 64 lengths before work each morning and will continue to do so to the end of Feb. I may cut a little weight towards the end as well

  5. #5
    Grand Master Andyg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Wiltshire
    Posts
    24,924
    Keep doing what you are, however I can recommend down loading MyfitnessPal on to your phone and simply logging what you eat.

    If you stay under 2200 calories day then you will lose weight. You will be amazed how many calories are in some food. Tortilla Chips for example should carry a health warning.

    I lost 20Kg (now 80Kg) and have kept it off (even after stopping smoking).

    Good luck.

    Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
    Friedrich Nietzsche


  6. #6
    Master kungfugerbil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Whitby (not the one in Ontario)
    Posts
    6,838
    We used to do that. We called it 'Fat Club'. The first rule of fat club...and so on. Remarkably successful for all, and a real team motivational boost. Ran it for a few years, the whole office used to be interested and get involved in the weigh in days.

    Now I work from home so it's not the same :)

  7. #7
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Newtownards, NI
    Posts
    564
    I did lose over 30kg and was doing well at keeping it off for a few years but put 10kg on in the last year. I'm well aware of the calories in some foods and have a smile as I watch my competitors much on them blissfully unaware! We've taken to making our own low fat sausages and all meals are prepared from scratch using fresh ingredients.

    2200 calories, I know it's not good for me but I'm way, way under that!

  8. #8
    I'd highly recommend using MyFitnessPal, and logging everything. The only thing that I'll help you lose any weight is to eat less than you burn.

    If you want to be a little sneaky prior to weigh in, cut All carbs 4-7 days before the weigh in which will reduce the amount of water in your system, and don't drink too much fluids the day before or morning of - then you can binge all you like after the weigh in ;) Personally, I wouldn't bother but it could be worth around 2kg or more in water weight.
    It's just a matter of time...

  9. #9
    Master MakeColdplayHistory's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    5,870
    ...boring comment about chasing quick weight loss without other lifestyle changes...

  10. #10
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Newtownards, NI
    Posts
    564
    Quote Originally Posted by MakeColdplayHistory View Post
    ...boring comment about chasing quick weight loss without other lifestyle changes...
    I did change my lifestyle which is why I lost 30kg and kept it off for years, last year was a bad one for me medically and emotionally, so this feels more like me getting back on track than a quick weight loss for bragging rights.

  11. #11
    Winter is a difficult time to lose weight. The cold weather just makes you crave the stuff that's bad for you.

    I don't even bother trying in winter, but wait until March/April when I get back out on my bike and salads are more appealing.

  12. #12
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Newtownards, NI
    Posts
    564
    Quote Originally Posted by noTAGlove View Post
    Winter is a difficult time to lose weight. The cold weather just makes you crave the stuff that's bad for you.

    I don't even bother trying in winter, but wait until March/April when I get back out on my bike and salads are more appealing.
    Couldn't face a salad at this time of year myself either. Soup, that's where it's at this time of year!

  13. #13
    Craftsman jonasy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    London
    Posts
    756
    Perhaps controversial for some https://www.dietdoctor.com/ (low carb, high fat)

  14. #14
    Master
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by Andyg View Post
    Keep doing what you are, however I can recommend down loading MyfitnessPal on to your phone and simply logging what you eat.

    If you stay under 2200 calories day then you will lose weight. You will be amazed how many calories are in some food. Tortilla Chips for example should carry a health warning.

    I lost 20Kg (now 80Kg) and have kept it off (even after stopping smoking).

    Good luck.
    Totally agree with this was having a small pack of crisps ( 1 of those which come as part of a multipack) 512 calories Mind, it is an very occasional treat for me (with a young boy at home setting a good example and all that) To put it in perspective, that is one third of my daily calorie requirement!
    Good luck OP. My aim is to lose 1 stone by summer through reducing calories, eating the right type, reducing booze especially beer and exercise. One advice I'll offer is go to town on fruits.
    Last edited by 72bpm; 11th January 2017 at 13:10.

  15. #15
    Grand Master Saint-Just's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Ashford, Kent
    Posts
    28,934
    Careful going too low on cals OP.
    Not only will it impact mentally but whilst it is one thing to lose weight it is a totally different thing to starve your body and it will fight back: we do not put fat on for fun, but it is a legacy from evolution. The direct consequence is that as soon as your body (your primitive brain) identifies starvation, you will burn your fat faster. But you will put it back on at the first opportunity, without you being able to do anything about it.
    Swimming as you do is good, and balancing your diet is perfect. It may not win you the competition but it will make you healthy. But don't go down below 2200 cals.
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

  16. #16
    Master
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Here and there mostly
    Posts
    1,432
    Quote Originally Posted by 72bpm View Post
    Totally agree with this was having a small pack of crisps ( 1 of those which come as part of a multipack) 512 calories Mind, it is an very occasional treat for me (with a young boy at home setting a good example and all that) To put it in perspective, that is one third of my daily calorie requirement!
    Good luck OP. My aim is to lose 1 stone by summer through reducing calories, eating the right type, reducing booze especially beer and exercise. One advice I'll offer is go to town on fruits.
    People underestimate some Cal's, a tube of pringles ( easily finished over day) has approx 1000 Cal's!

    Where as you could have about 14 eggs for the equivalent.

    Unlikely I know but just making a comparison

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by gunman View Post
    Soup, that's where it's at this time of year!
    Couldn't agree more. Proven to keep your appetite at bay for longer when compared with and equivalent solid meal.

  18. #18
    Another good tip is to turn the thermostat down a coupe of degrees.

    You may p1ss of the wife and kids, but will be working your body harder to maintain core temperature, while saving a few quid of your bills.

  19. #19
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Newtownards, NI
    Posts
    564
    Quote Originally Posted by Estoril-5 View Post
    People underestimate some Cal's, a tube of pringles ( easily finished over day) has approx 1000 Cal's!

    Where as you could have about 14 eggs for the equivalent.

    Unlikely I know but just making a comparison

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
    Tell you what I noticed as we're talking about pringles, see those "low Calorie" alternatives to crisps, rice cakes and the likes. If you took 100g of them and 100g of pringles, the pringles would be the lower calorie option! Just so happens there's only about 18g per bag of them (as they're mostly puffed up air)! Low calorie bread is about half the size of a normal loaf. Sometimes better just eating normal food but less of it.

  20. #20
    Grand Master Saint-Just's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Ashford, Kent
    Posts
    28,934
    Completely agree ^^
    'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.

  21. #21
    Master
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Here and there mostly
    Posts
    1,432
    Oh and fat doesn't make you fat, excess carbs do 👍

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

  22. #22
    Master
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by gunman View Post
    Couldn't face a salad at this time of year myself either. Soup, that's where it's at this time of year!
    Totally forgot about them. Good option I usually make a large batch of soup to last me a couple of days. Experimenting with a few recipes. Need to broaden my repertoire. Agree, salads are for summer

    Quote Originally Posted by Saint-Just View Post
    Careful going too low on cals OP.
    Not only will it impact mentally but whilst it is one thing to lose weight it is a totally different thing to starve your body and it will fight back: we do not put fat on for fun, but it is a legacy from evolution. The direct consequence is that as soon as your body (your primitive brain) identifies starvation, you will burn your fat faster. But you will put it back on at the first opportunity, without you being able to do anything about it.
    Swimming as you do is good, and balancing your diet is perfect. It may not win you the competition but it will make you healthy. But don't go down below 2200 cals.
    For my height & weight 1800 Cal/day trying to reduce it to 1300 to 1400/day.

    Quote Originally Posted by Estoril-5 View Post
    People underestimate some Cal's, a tube of pringles ( easily finished over day) has approx 1000 Cal's!

    Where as you could have about 14 eggs for the equivalent.

    Unlikely I know but just making a comparison

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
    Absolutely My usual breakfast is one or 2 egg Indian omelette, mushrooms, some fruit for the sugar kick! 3/4 cup of coffee of course, black no sugar.
    Remember if losing weight was so easy there won't be a single fat person in the world!

  23. #23
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Southern Spain
    Posts
    23,658
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by noTAGlove View Post
    Winter is a difficult time to lose weight.
    As you burn more calories to stay warm winter is actually the most effective time to lose weight.

    My approach is simply eating half and drink water/tea instead of soft drinks/wine.

    To make it easier on myself I drink extra water. Helps flushing the kidneys and all too.

    Human body fat delivers about 7500 KCalories per kilo.
    Shedding 10 kilos of the jelly thus means burning 75 thousand KCal. more than you take in.
    Losing that quickly on less intake alone cannot be very healthy.
    Burning a bit more because it is winter to me seems to make it the best time to shed fat.
    Last edited by Huertecilla; 11th January 2017 at 15:22.

  24. #24
    Grand Master Daddelvirks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Leiden- Netherlands
    Posts
    39,816
    Blog Entries
    1
    Totally unfounded, the water flushing the kidneys story.

    And soft drinks are for children, and even they should learn from their parents there are other options.

    Daddel.
    Got a new watch, divers watch it is, had to drown the bastard to get it!

  25. #25
    Grand Master
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Wakefield, West Yorkshire
    Posts
    22,498
    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    When we did that once some people drunk few litres of water beforehand.
    I call them winners

    More exercise combined with reasonably healthy eating is the key. People spend too much time sat down thesedays.

    Paul

  26. #26
    Master
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Mendips
    Posts
    3,159
    Quote Originally Posted by 72bpm View Post
    Totally agree with this was having a small pack of crisps ( 1 of those which come as part of a multipack) 512 calories
    What crisps are you eating??? Walkers are my favorite and their multi-pack bags are only 130.

  27. #27
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Southern Spain
    Posts
    23,658
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by 72bpm View Post
    Remember if losing weight was so easy there won't be a single fat person in the world!
    It is the other way around. It is ever so easy to put on weight.
    Junk food, processed food and sugar saturated drinks are just about forced upon us.
    It already takes conscious discipline to not put it on. THAT is why there are so many fat persons in the 'civilized' world.

  28. #28
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Scottish Borders
    Posts
    467
    Blog Entries
    1

    good luck

    i've put on around 8kg since i stopped smoking,all the best with the weigh in

  29. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by hafle View Post
    What crisps are you eating??? Walkers are my favorite and their multi-pack bags are only 130.
    Think it's 512 calories in 100g!

  30. #30
    Grand Master Neil.C's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    SE England
    Posts
    27,035
    I managed to lose 2 stone (12.7kg) over about ten months by simply just eating three square meals a day and cutting out all snacks, crisps, choc bars etc.

    Once your habits/taste changes it is easy to stick to.

    I used to love a Kit Kat but when my Grandson had one the other day and gave me a bit it tasted unbelievably sweet!
    Cheers,
    Neil.

    My Speedmaster website:

    http://www.freewebs.com/neil271052

  31. #31
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Southern Spain
    Posts
    23,658
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by Daddelvirks View Post
    Totally unfounded, the water flushing the kidneys story.
    Then so be it.

    Since burning fat releases all the crap also stored in it and the kidneys are instrumental in expelling most of that with the urine, I still like the idea of a bit of extra water streaming through.

    Soft drinks, energy drinks, alcoholic beverages are all massively marketed whereas plain tap water is not; a conscious upstream battle to avoid putting on weight.

  32. #32
    Grand Master Dave+63's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    East Sussex
    Posts
    15,914
    Quote Originally Posted by Huertecilla View Post
    Soft drinks, energy drinks, alcoholic beverages are all massively marketed whereas plain tap water is not; a conscious upstream battle to avoid putting on weight.
    Look what happened to Coca Cola when they tried to market tap water!

    Anybody remember Dasani?

  33. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Neil.C View Post
    I managed to lose 2 stone (12.7kg) over about ten months by simply just eating three square meals a day and cutting out all snacks, crisps, choc bars etc.

    Once your habits/taste changes it is easy to stick to.

    I used to love a Kit Kat but when my Grandson had one the other day and gave me a bit it tasted unbelievably sweet!
    Yep, it's not rocket science. Anyone should be able to lose weight.

  34. #34
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Southern Spain
    Posts
    23,658
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Yep, it's not rocket science. Anyone should be able to lose weight.
    Ofcourse! Burn more that you take in and you lose weight.

    There is no denying though that the focus of our culture on consumerism is one big fat trap with all the marketing of junk food and soft/energy drinks.
    No, it is not the 'fault' of those industries if one gets fat by taking in to much of the crap; you still do that yourself.

    Imo it has reached the point of smoking. People ARE gullible and not everyone has the discipline needed to resist the temptations or to go even further and lose weight,

  35. #35
    Master
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Think it's 512 calories in 100g!
    Ah! My mistake didn't read fully

  36. #36
    Master
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Mendips
    Posts
    3,159
    Quote Originally Posted by Kingstepper View Post
    Think it's 512 calories in 100g!
    Shame. They sounded like my kind of crisps. More is better!

  37. #37
    Grand Master thieuster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    GMT+1
    Posts
    11,749
    Blog Entries
    8
    The LifeSum app on your phone is an interesting way of supporting your weightloss aim. Check it out and give it a try

  38. #38
    Grand Master Daddelvirks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Leiden- Netherlands
    Posts
    39,816
    Blog Entries
    1
    No, no rocket science.

    But after being called a "hard guy" concerning these issues (Levis 501 31-34 from 16 untill 49) I've done some research myself the last years.

    We all (or should) know that's it's all about food and lifestyle, decent food and enough exercise etc.

    But we have to accept that some people are just not capable of leaving the bad stuff alone, even if it kills them.
    Addiction, for some an aliën word for others a nightmare. And genes can play a role as well.

    And a few just really don't care and stuff themselves, whatever the consequences, and can be legally called Fat Bastards :)

    Daddel.
    Got a new watch, divers watch it is, had to drown the bastard to get it!

  39. #39
    Master
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Mendips
    Posts
    3,159
    Quote Originally Posted by Daddelvirks View Post
    No, no rocket science.

    But after being called a "hard guy" concerning these issues (Levis 501 31-34 from 16 untill 49) I've done some research myself the last years.

    We all (or should) know that's it's all about food and lifestyle, decent food and enough exercise etc.

    But we have to accept that some people are just not capable of leaving the bad stuff alone, even if it kills them.
    Addiction, for some an aliën word for others a nightmare. And genes can play a role as well.

    And a few just really don't care and stuff themselves, whatever the consequences, and can be legally called Fat Bastards :)

    Daddel.
    And a few don't care because they just can't put on weight :)

  40. #40
    Master
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by hafle View Post
    Shame. They sounded like my kind of crisps. More is better!
    I was absolutely livid when M&S changed their ridged ready salted crisps to baked! Seriously! What is the point of baked crisps.
    To be fair Oxford dictionary does define crisp as fried or baked! Remind me of the time I saw a 8 year old tubby girl with tummy pain in A&E. On asking about what she ate that day the answer was "cheese and chips" X 3!

  41. #41
    Master
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by hafle View Post
    And a few don't care because they just can't put on weight :)
    I HATE YOU!

  42. #42
    Master
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Mendips
    Posts
    3,159
    Quote Originally Posted by 72bpm View Post
    I HATE YOU!
    I might not be fat, but doesn't mean I'm necessarily healthy. Dinner last friday was 20 chipolatas and half a rack of ribs, washed down by 5 pints of lager I might be 6'2" and only 11 stone, but I'll probably be 6 feet under within a decade :D

  43. #43
    Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Berkshire, UK
    Posts
    4,331
    Quote Originally Posted by jonasy View Post
    Perhaps controversial for some https://www.dietdoctor.com/ (low carb, high fat)
    Not for me, I've lost 12kg and have maintained it this way.

    I think the traditional approach is largely discredited in many quarters now. You just have to look around to see how "traditional" diets don't work: eating bland unpalatable food in portion sizes a small child would object to simply isn't sustainable. So people lose a bit of weight then yo-yo back once they can't stand it any longer. And I genuinely believe the whole "low-fat" thing is going to become a huge scandal one day.

    I eat food I like in satisfying portions I just avoid sugar totally and keep carbs low. Bit of exercise on top and I've achieved great results. For me this isn't a diet; it's how I eat permanently now (being doing it for well over a year now). Obviously you need to use a bit of common sense - if you eat 10000 calories a day of anything and don't bur it off you'll put on weight.

    On top of the weight loss I feel so much healthier and energetic it's amazing.

  44. #44
    Craftsman
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Newtownards, NI
    Posts
    564
    Never been a fan of these fad diets, the way I look at it is this. We are all adults and don't need a diet plan or a celeb to tell us pizza and chips are bad for us. For those of us that are overweight we generally know what the problem is, it's just taking the plunge to do something about it.

    I don't avoid any food groups, just eat sensible portions of decent food, watch my calorie intake and do my swimming each morning. Some of the guys here are trying all sorts of things, like the 5-2 diet. They sit in the office for 3 days a week eating chocolate biscuits, then for 2 days eat 500 calories. How long can that be kept up??

    Anyway, we've had another entrant so we're now at £230 at stake for charity. What we see often is people do well for the first few weeks, come February people have given up because of their stupid diet is too hard to stay on.

  45. #45
    I'd echo what may have said in this thread - Myfitnesspal app and count everything. It sounds horribly tedious but after a while you'll have learnt the calorie content of most of your usual foods.

    The other tip I would mention is protein as an appetite suppressant. A protein (and fat actually) -rich meal will keep you sated far longer and better than one with lots of carbs. I find that a protein smoothie in the morning is quick and easy and reduces all sorts of shameful mid-morning sugar/carb cravings.

    I'd also echo what Huertecilla says about plenty of water. As long as your intake is adequate a bit more isn't necessary to 'flush your kidneys' but it may help you eat less, and most of us could usefully drink a bit more water.

    Best wishes,
    Martyn.

  46. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave+63 View Post
    Anybody remember Dasani?
    Go to the States and it's everywhere.

  47. #47
    +1 to the fitnesspal, really helped me realise how much I was eating and my calorie intake.

    I don't use it as much anymore, but do try and keep track of my food intake.

  48. #48
    Grand Master Onelasttime's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Everywhere, yet nowhere...
    Posts
    13,712
    The quickest way I ever lost weight, and I wasn't even trying to, was giving up all booze and meat during a 'funny turn' in my 20s. I did it for 3 months and looked like a long distance runner after. I soon went back to my old self but then I'm lucky, with a high metabolism inherited from my 'Slim Jim' granddad.

    Now I just eat properly and still enjoy all the fruits of the vine, hops and grains and remain at a pretty static 11st.

    I don't do the gym or any 'proper' exercise, but I walk everywhere as much as I can, with big family yomps at weekends, and try to take the stairs to my 5th floor at work once or twice a day instead of the lift. And I drink about 3l of water through the day. Seems to work

  49. #49
    For the most part, those who think they have either a fast, or slow metabolism for that matter, don't!
    It's just a matter of time...

  50. #50
    Master
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Northern Ireland
    Posts
    6,697
    I decided a few years ago I didn't like being chubby (I wasn't fat, I was 12'7)

    Once I decided I didn't like my body shape, I set about fixing it and never looked back.

    It's about your mindset. I eat freshly cooked food, and keep beer and takeaway for the weekends.

    The only things I avoid are processed foods, especially meat, and sugar. Although the odd bacon sandwich never hurt anyone right?

    I also exercise 3 hours a week as a minimum - football, running and Pilates.

    I'm 39 now and 10'3 soaking wet, my aim is to remain under 10'7. Sleep much better, and have much more energy.

    Wish you well OP!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Do Not Sell My Personal Information