Reply With QuoteYou're in Scotland, go for the 4WD option (Audi) unless you want to fork out for a spare set of winter wheels/tyres.
BMW, the Ultimate Driving Machine (expect for viewers in a Scottish winter)
I'm about to pull the trigger (personal purchase, not business) on either an A6 SE Exec TDI Quattro saloon (190bhp) or BMW 520d M Sport saloon. Two questions:
1. Local dealers can do both of these for around £330pm over 4 years (with 9 month deposit), both standard specification (no options other than paint). For the same cost, which would you choose? The BMW is supposedly more exciting to drive (but comes on run-flats and the M Sport is stiffer and less forgiving), but the Audi is arguably more reliable in winter conditions (however I am ignoring winter tyres, so arguably any additional comfort limited - plus how much snow do we get anyway).
2. You can seemingly get these for around £40pm cheaper (over 3 years not 4) using an online lease website (Freedom and Select Leasing) - if the quoted deals can be believed. From speaking to dealers today and mentioning the online companies, their argument for the extra monthly PCP cost is:
- Dealer offering PCP which can provide some equity following the 4-year term, but this is not guaranteed and if you choose to change early (after say 36 months) then you have no equity contribution (as I understand it).
- Dealer hinted that service from dealer would be less favourable for those buying online with no dealer relationship (but this may be an empty threat).
Note that both these are outgoing models, the new BMW model coming in next month and the Audi later this year.
I also test drove the Merc E220d and the Jag XF, but found the former a bit too fancy / large / expensive, and just didn't bond with the XF at all (found it quite sluggish).
I have always bought outright before, and only had VW and Skoda - so this is a step up for me, and also my first financing deal.
Many thanks!
Andrew.
Last edited by jukeboxs; 8th January 2017 at 01:18.
You're in Scotland, go for the 4WD option (Audi) unless you want to fork out for a spare set of winter wheels/tyres.
BMW, the Ultimate Driving Machine (expect for viewers in a Scottish winter)
Make sure you're comparing like for like as you mention PCP from a dealer however the likes of Freedom offer PCH deals the big difference being no option to purchase at the end of term.
My understanding is that it's. easier to get out of a pcp than a lease should things go tits up and you need out of it.
It's bollocks that you'll get a better relationship with a pcp though. The day car dealers pay that much attention so that they could even do that is still some way off!
Echo the sentiments on rwd and winter if you're in an area that gets snow. Although I'm running cross climates at the moment which are almost as good as winters but without the penalty in the summer.
Go for the lowest payment for the car you choose, relationship will not be compromised, come service time you will be lucky if they remember you.Pick the car you like not what we think is best, i prefer Bmw to Audi currently as the seats are a better shape around the shoulders, M Sport Vs S line and have had 4 in the last 5 years
If you plan on giving the car back after 3/4 years then lease is a no brainer. We leased SWMBO a Quashqui, the sums purchase vs lease were:
£4800 vs £715 (deposit)
£340 vs £245 (monthly over 3 years)
£9000 vs £0 (final payment)
it's total BS that they will have a better relationship with you if you take the PCP. The sales team get commission for selling finance (so much so that cash sales are less preferable) and have a vested interest in you doing that. They won't care about you later as after sales will be dealt with by a different team and they won't know you and your car from Adam. Sales team spin - don't fall for it. There is very little (if any) equity from a PCP deal and if there is that may well be offset by a higher deposit.
I know my way around car dealerships and my advice is get the car you want for the lowest price you can get. Maintenance plans, tax, warranty can sometimes be the determining factor (and a "free" service pack as part of the deal may then swing the balance back to the dealer) - though dull you have to account for all the costs over the period that you will have the car.
RWD on proper winter tyres will perform better than AWD on summers - a set of winter wheels will set you back around £750-1000
Is the 3.0l jaguar out of the question? Definitely not sluggish
I had this 5 series in M Sport guise with 18" wheels and the ride was fine. The handling was excellent aswell and I believe better than the Audi although I didn't do a direct comparison (I did with the Mercedes and again BMW better). Handling and ride in Jag both excellent.
Agree about comments on service post sale or pcp or lease. Will be the same - don't fall for sales lies.
After 3 years there may be break charges (unlikely to be high), but you equity will be based on residual value. Remember that this will be lower once the new models out. If going PCP, negotiate hard on the price of the vehicle. I had nearly 10k off my 5 series and went for PCP over 2 years
That BS alone would be enough to stop me buying from them. What planet are these salespeople on?Originally Posted by jukeboxs
With regard to any future equity have a look on Autotrader and see what a similar spec/mileage 3 or 4 year old car is retailing for. If you can find a reg number pop it into WBAC to give an approximate trade in value, if that value is close to the balloon payment you aren't going to have much equity in the car.
Obviously a lot can change in 3 or 4 years but it will give you a rough idea.
Feed your details into Carwow and await the results can be appreciably cheaper my wife's new PCP Mercedes still came from my "local dealer" in Devon rather than my real local dealer in Colchester but a lot cheaper and as to the BS re backup and servicing it is just that BS have done this for years and just get local AD servicing.
Oh and i would recommend the all drive option especially in your part of the UK.
Last edited by mart broad; 8th January 2017 at 11:38.
As I have mentioned in the past PCH has always worked out a lot lot more competive than PCP for me.
Dealers will alway push PCP for their own reasons of locking you into them and their brand. Look at PCH there are several brokers to consider although my Q7 is direct through Edinburgh Audi, no one else could touch them and I have secured another Golf R direct with MK VW.
Regarding servicing my local dealer (both Audi and VW) treat me no less than when they were servicing new cars I had purchased from them. It would be interesting to hear the service managers thoughts to your salesmans comments.
There are with the new quarter many good PCH deals out there.
Pitch
Thanks all! Yes sorry, I forgot about the extra flexibility with the PCP compared to straight leasing (with ability to withdraw once 50% has been paid, and the option to buy at end which is possibly appealing). If I can get the dealer down to say £10-15pm differential, this doesn't seem unreasonable to me to keep dealers alive (but then maybe I'm being too romantic!).
My travel is mainly between Glasgow and Edinburgh so snow/ice should be limited (ignoring Dec 2010!) - but I appreciate the advice that winter tyres are more important than AWD (although hoping to avoid the additional cost of winter tyres, especially if I am changing car and brand every 3-4 years, but maybe a bit naive). I do have 16'' winter wheels/tyres for my current Skoda Superb which might fit the Audi...
The 520d seat did seem more comfortable, but then rear legroom seemed more limited. Test drive too brief for me to notice drive/wheel differences (plus coming from Skoda non-VRS I am sure both will be an improvement!). BMW ongoing costs may be more (but limited I suppose during warranty period).
If I could ignore winter conditions, I would probably sway for the BMW - if I'm ignoring winter tyres on both, maybe both models are on a par.
Man o' man - shouldn't buying a car be fun ?!
P.S. Thanks for CarWow suggestion. I submitted an Audi request last night - got a few A6 deposit quotes this morning, need to ask them for PCP equivalent now.
I do the same commute (well as far as Livi) and you have my sympathy.
Just be careful on mileage limits and cost per mile if you exceed. The best deals are often 6k a year which is unlikely to work for that commute.
For what it's worth I drive a 9 year old astra most days and spend the money I would have spent on a nice daily on a rather lovely lotus. That's good man maths right there :D
The advice i've seen is that if you do the maths before hand, it's often cheaper to pay the excess than for the higher miles upfront...
I've heard that too but haven't done the maths myself.
Thought I'd give a quick update. I found a very good online deal for the BMW 520d M Sport (£285pm, 6+35) with metallic paint and steering whee paddles. So, £11.5k over 3 years, for a £38k RRP car - really a no brainer! So, I've gone with this (order confirmed yesterday), delivery in 2 weeks. Very excited to say the least! I'll consider buying some winter tyres and alloys seperately on Gumtree or eBay.
Do you recommend Gap insurance, or is this a swizz? It logically sounded like it served a purpose for the initial months to cover any shortfall.
We now have two 7-6 yr old Skoda's to shift, one with a mechanical which the local dealer has never been able to fix. So, we will likely trade these in for another Skoda. But, after this, I can see us both leasing hereafter.
I'm interested on the question of gap insurance also. I'm due to take delivery of a brand new VW Tiguan this weekend on lease and have been reading about gap insurance. Do the forum members recommend getting gap insurance for lease/pcp new car purchases?
Gap insurance has come up a few times on the forum and I think the general advice was that yes, it's a good idea but organise it yourself from a specialist broker and don't buy it through the supplying car dealer who will whack in a large margin for the cover.
Cheers..
Jase
Would you mind providing a link to this one ?
If you want an even better deal then use carwow to find the best offer then go direct to the listed dealer. I did that and the dealer knocked another grand off because they said they didn't have to pay the carwow commission. Actually it might have been more than a grand but those brain cells have been killed off now.Feed your details into Carwow and await the results can be appreciably cheaper my wife's new PCP Mercedes still came from my "local dealer
Oh and i would recommend the all drive option especially in your part of the UK.
Tend to agree, I used the internet and halved the dealer price for GAP Insurance.
Make sure the gap vendor/ insurer is part of an industry body, the policy we bought for my wife's lease company went pop but was covered by trade body so all ok, but could have been so wasted cash.
I just can't get me head round the leasing malarkey, how is losing £11.5k in 3 years good?
We got a quote from here
https://www.ala.co.uk
took it to the Mercedes garage and they matched it (down from £450 to £175)
Any company you buy it from will be Authorised by the FCA and you will be covered if anything happens to them under the Financial Service Compensation Scheme
I wouldn't consider this particular deal "good" but so long as the cost of the lease is less than what the depreciation would be, it's considered beneficial. Assuming of course you *need* a brand new car in the first place. It will almost always be cheaper to buy a 3+ year old car.
Buying a new car would normally be alien to me, but I have a 335d xdrive on lease at £240 a month.
Total cost over two years £7700 for a car just shy of 50k. The depreciation on the same car would be at least double the cost of the lease, but I've still thrown away £7.7k for the privilege of driving it of course.
As others have said, our Golf R 2 year PCH ceases in 8 weeks and on looking at private used values and allowing for discount the lease has cost me 65% of what the depreciation is.
Likewise with my Q7. Being conservative I am thinking my lease cost over two years will be 50% of the depreciation.
Caveats to this are 1) being happy with a standard car, 2) mileage not exceeding 10k per year, 3) you actually have new cars, not 3-4 year olds, 4) in reality would I buy a new car every two years.
For me and my circumstances PCH makes perfect sense and the big lump of car buying fund is nicely invested.
Ta
Pitch
A point I over-looked, but agree completely with.
The above figures make a little more sense to me and if you add (as someone has already mentioned) the fact that I'd have £20k odd spare cash as well?
Indeed, 24th June we used funds to purchase shares in four of the national housing developers that plummeted 35-40%.
They have recovered very well and have paid for the next two years PCH's.
Just a thought to factor in.
Pitch
1: If you think dealers make a fortune on car finance you are sadly mistaken! Last year alone WE the dealership paid a subsidy to the finance company on every used car finance deal which averaged out £250.
2: Yes Gap insurance you can get it cheeper from a internet provider, but be very careful, the amount of GAP Insurance companies that are being run above a chip shop and fold within a year is staggering.
3: A PCP agreement is a good way of changing your car after the time you agreed, do not put a large deposit as you would need that same deposit again to keep a similar payment to last time. You will not have much if any equity in the car at the end of the contract.
So what about new car finance?
0% finance and £1500 FDA..
Thats a great lease deal but lets be honest a 3 series (335d ) was never a 50 grand car!
If that includes the deposit and VAT, that's an unbelievable deal.
Go configure one with a few of the toys....And as stated you'll be just "shy of £50k"
Invoiced or list
Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
What deposit did you put in? Is it a business lease? I am interested as that sounds amazing and I am in the market.
That will be before a whopping discount , "it will never be shy of 50k"
You will get easily 20% off (and if you add 10k of options Im sure even bigger)
Heres 20% off with first google search
https://broadspeed.com/CarView/BMW/3...omatic_4_doors
+1.....definitely not sluggish! Mines the older model but it's still quick enough for most sane people. 6 cylinder diesels are so much nicer than 4s
Paul
Yes, it does include deposit and VAT. Crazy deal, though you can pick them up brand new heavily discounted too. I'd rather invest the cash than sink it into a depreciating asset.
Mine was the GT model, list was £48k. Discounted by Alphabet - I think the invoiced price was £38k from memory.
Certainly: https://www.contracthireandleasing.c...ies/148281036/
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