Reply With QuoteOriginally Posted by Jeremy67
LOL, I won't say it will never happen, but I would imagine this would only happen if hell froze over.
If a team was formed it would most likely be the Lauda Wolff F1, but again very unlikely.
I see it more likely Nico coming back in a team management or ownership role. Maybe when Mercedes decided this period has served its purpose and they move on we might see Rosberg Wolff F1. Maybe LH will still be driving for them and Nico could become Lewis's boss :)
LOL, I won't say it will never happen, but I would imagine this would only happen if hell froze over.
If a team was formed it would most likely be the Lauda Wolff F1, but again very unlikely.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
Here we are, then. The season finale, at a circuit where the most notable feature is the hotel covered in light bulbs which change colour.
Abu Dhabi, and the Yas Marina circuit must surely be the ultimate expression of the Bernie Ecclestone era of Grand Prix racing. A sterile circuit, set in a country with riches beyond even Bernie's wildest dreams. Liberty have to decide whether to continue holding races in such locations, or spice up the show using proper circuits, although as it's a given that the likes of Abu Dhabi will continue to willingly stump up the extortionate (and escalating) hosting fees, it will be some time yet before the sport's owners can afford to look elsewhere, more's the pity.
I'm not a fan, as you may have guessed.
Anyway, what's been going on in the world of Formula 1? Well, not a lot, but most of it seems to revolve around speculation as to the identity of a replacement for the retiring Felipe Massa. Formula 1 won't be the same without the affable little Brazilian, and Williams aren't short of options for next year and beyond. Robert Kubica will be testing a current Williams at the official test session next week, which will be his second run in a current car, after acquitting himself well in a Renault earlier in the year, and the choice appears to be between him, Paul di Resta and Daniil Kvyat. Both Kubica and Kvyat are rumoured to bring money to sweeten the deal. Williams aren't as cash-strapped as they have been in recent years, but they're a Limited Company quoted on the Frankfurt Stock Exchange, and are bound to maximise the return for their shareholders, which may have a bearing.
Elsewhere, Fernando Alonso has had a test in the Toyota LMP1 car, and is believed to have impressed. He has stated that he would like to race every weekend next year, implying a full-time assault on the WEC alongside his McLaren commitments. I'm not sure if any of the races coincide, and if so, which he would favour.
Back to this weekend, and tyre choices:
Pirelli rarely wheel out the Mediums these days, and the Hard compound has rarely been seen at all this season. Much like Brazil, the track has sections which will favour Mercedes, and some which will suit Ferrari. Lewis Hamilton will have the benefit of the mostly 2018 spec engine he used for the race at Interlagos, whereas most of his peers will be using components at or very near the end of their life cycle, or taking grid penalties.
More later.
Update from Abu Dhabi, and Pirelli have unveiled their range of tyres for next season and beyond.
The available compounds have increased to seven from the current five, with the addition of a Hypersoft at one end of the range, and an Ultra Hard (which I had hoped would be christened the Well-'ard) at the other. I'm not sure if the others will be the same compounds as at present, or whether for example the Well-'ard is the same as this year's Hard, and the "new" Hard will be slightly softer than at present. Given that this year the Hard compound hasn't been seen during the second half of the season it raises the question of the requirement for something even harder.
Oh well.
FP1 is under way, but as the real action takes place in cooler temperatures later in the day, it's just really a test session, and teams are using it to assess aero tweaks for next season - Ferrari have a new floor on Kimi Raikkonen's car, for example, and run a couple of new drivers. There's a proper Test later next week as well. For now, several litres of flow-vis paint and some incredible pitot tube arrays are circulating Yas Marina.
So, two new colours in the "Rainbow"...pink and ice blue. Whatever next?
So, two new colours in the "Rainbow"...pink and ice blue. Whatever next?
Fair play to Bottas. The first corner should be interesting, however I doubt Lewis will be pushing to hard. No point risking a shunt.
So Bottas just needs a good start otherwise LH will just drive off.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
I expect you've already got one of these, Andy:
I expect you've already got one of these, Andy:
How cool is that.
Hopefully they also do Rosberg and Vettel toilet paper.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
... and a MV My First Shaver kit...
MV announced a ‘go big or go home’ strategy for today. His Renault engine has survived the last races by not going flat out. Not this race according to Max. Big chance his engine will go up in smoke...
Some of the drivers will be "out"! :)So, two new colours in the "Rainbow"...pink and ice blue. Whatever next?
Was that the most boring Grand Prix since hybrids started
Quite possibly. It's not a great circuit for overtaking, and tends to produce two-by-two grids with team mates next to each other. And this season both Championships were done and dusted a few races ago, so apart from the scrap between Toro Rosso, Renault and Haas for sixth in the Constructors' championship (which actually makes a difference of several million dollars) and the outside possibility of Bottas finishing second in the Drivers' championship there was little at stake.
The test next week will probably be more interesting.
It was telling that cameras focused on the battle for 11th for such a long time.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Well that was all a bit of a shame, wasn't it? A deflated end to the season, which had really already ended. Kudos to Bottas, he appeared to genuinely have the legs of his teammate and that should do him some good over the off-season, and congrats to Renault who despite fluffing CS Jnr's stop still snatched 6th from Torro Rosso.
I wonder if Williams will release Kubica's lap times unlike Renault in their test/evaluation session. I really didn't rate his chances to return though it's looking increasingly likely.
Last edited by CardShark; 26th November 2017 at 20:55.
I'm hoping for DiResta, trouble is the other two are bringing buckets of cash with them
I’d rather have a young driver. But of those, Kubica is probably the most bankable media wise.
'Against stupidity, the gods themselves struggle in vain' - Schiller.
Agreed, with the exception of the initial Alonso/Massa battle. I thought Alonso drove well given his Honda handicap.
Fair play to Bottas, but you could see the Aero problems LH was having each time he drove behind him.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
It was an awful race on an awful track but I think Russia this year was even worse (with only one on-track pass I think).
Certainly one of them. Almost wore out my fast forward button.
Andy
Wanted - Damasko DC57
Well, that race... snore.
The season though, one of the best in a long time. From the back-and-forth thing between Mercedes and Ferrari, we had a great battle for a long time but it ended way too soon with Ferrari's entirely predictable implosion. Good to see RB getting closer as the season wore on and the internal politics of Renault, Honda, McLaren, Toro Rosso and Ferrari kept things interesting off the track.
I can see Renault's engine closing the gap to the top two further over the winter, I hope it isn't unrealistic to hope that RB, McLaren and potentially even Renault will be regularly up there scrapping with Merc and Ferrari next season. Three seasons in, it's time Max stopped having race-winning potential and started having championship-winning potential but Daniel Ricciardo isn't a guy to lie down and hand him that. Vettel will have no-issues with Kimi again, Bottas won't trouble Hamilton over a full season and if McLaren do build a decent car there could be a shot for Fernando too.
Roll on March!
I agree with most of what you say, but all the time Carlos Ghosn is involved, I can't see Renault giving their engine department the blank cheque that they'll need to compete with Ferrari and Mercedes. His major focus, wherever he's been, is cost-cutting and massaging the margins. He's not one for splashing the cash, so involvement in Grand Prix racing goes against his every instinct.
What a non-event.
Untill the first tire stop, I think it was MV lap 13 or 14, the top 12 were like a row of ducks.
That was pretty much representative for the whole of the field.
After four years of Mercedes domination, the title decided early, this was a death stuggle. The bits I have seen of Formula E this year were more exciting than F1; what a perspective...
Liberty really needs to come up with sómething.
So that's it for the 2017 season. Thanks everyone for the chat, particularly Backward Point and Cardshark - I've found both of your posts to be knowledgeable and insightful. Others have been too but it's these two who spring to mind right now. We've had facts, analysis, opinion and humour with less bickering than there could have been.
See you on the 2018 thread.
He’s the road car side of Renault isn’t he? I would have thought the motorsport side is run independently.
No, he also has control over the F1 team, and was in the garage at Abu Dhabi being very involved.
You're very kind, thank you. I'd also like to thank Card Shark and others* for their insights and contributions, which makes this an enjoyable thread to be involved in.
*Does not include the blinkered Lewis Hamilton fluffers.
It's a pleasure to be able to contribute to a thread such as this, F1 is probably my keenest interest so to be able to share my thoughts and discuss all the various topics within the sport with you all is extremely enjoyable. Thank you to Backward Point and to you all for your input, please let us keep this up for 2018.
On the subject of next season, I think it's shaping up very well indeed. The gap has closed between the top 3 teams in a season that could well have seen the performance differentials increase given the blank canvas that everyone started with - next year's relative rule book stability should, in theory, condense the grid. The driver line-up at Mercedes, Ferrari and Red Bull remains the same as well, though each driver will have their own individual motives to prove themselves considering the contract status of Messrs Bottas, Raikkonen and Ricciardo.
How will McLaren get on with Renault? And Torro Rosso with Honda? How will Liberty Media continue to exert its influence? Verstappen vs Ricciardo? After a damp squib of an ending to 2017 there's all that and more to look forward to.
Last edited by CardShark; 27th November 2017 at 23:04.
Abu Dhabi race report from Hark Hughes, if anybody is interested:
http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/re...ent=AbuDhabiGP
There is indeed much to look forward to in 2018, as the cars will be broadly similar to this year's, albeit with the addition of the much-derided "halo", which is giving the designers headaches already - apparently the device and fittings add approximately 14kg to the weight of the car, above the centre of gravity.
Pitpass reports that Lando Norris will be in a McLaren at this week's test, having been due to run in Brazil two weeks ago in a session which was cancelled due to security concerns. Expect to see Giovinazzi and LeClerc get a run-out as well - rumour has it that Marcus Ericsson's seat at Sauber is anything but guaranteed for 2018, despite his connections with the team's new owners.
In other news, Ferrari sponsor Santander have not renewed their deal with the Scuderia. The original sponsorship deal began when Fernando Alonso joined the team, so whether they will move to McLaren remains to be seen. McLaren themselves face a shortfall of c.$100m following their divorce from Honda.
I do hope that Kubica get's the nod and surely Liberty will love the publicity potential of the great comeback story.
It could also give Williams the advantage they've been seeking to get nearer the front. I understand he is incredibly driven even by the standards of F1 drivers and maybe they need that.
I can't see it happen. Ignoring his physical issues, there's more of a trend these days to give fast kids a chance rather than necessarily stick to a known reliable driver. Kubica just isn't the future of F1 anymore, there isn't a team that will take a punt on an old guy and risk missing out on the next Michaelewis Verstapenna.
Aston Martin will "probably" enter sport in 2021:
...Aston Martin boss Andy Palmer said: "It moves from probably I wouldn't propose it to the board to probably I would."
He said existing rules were "annoying the public and driving them from F1".
Palmer wants to use F1 as a marketing platform as he seeks to expand Aston Martin's range of road cars.
But he added that he and the Red Bull team were acting in concert to try to influence a change in engine rules.
Aston Martin has this year had a sponsorship arrangement with the former world champions, who are vocal opponents of the turbo hybrid engines used in F1 since 2014, and the car company will next year become the team's title sponsor.
"The issue is making the sport entertaining again," Palmer said in an exclusive interview with BBC Sport...
BP has mentioned in the past that title sponsor Martini may influence the decision in that it would be favourable for them to have an "older" driver for marketing reasons, Stroll is the youngest on the grid IIRC. Renault reserve driver Sergey Sirotkin will be taking the FW40 out for a drive tomorrow, he's in his early 20's as is Daniil Kvyat who has also been touted as a potential candidate. Both Russians will most probably have notable financial backing though so does Kubica, their youth might not count in their favour. The Pole completed 100 laps today and will be targeting a fast lap time tomorrow, let's see how it pans out.
There's Paul di Resta as well though I'm counting him out seeing as he didn't get any seat time today and I don't think he's due any tomorrow.
Today's times:
https://www.pitpass.com/60828/Test-T...bu-Dhabi-28-11
I liked Robert, but I hope that he does not get the Williams drive.
I know what you mean. On the one hand it would be one of the greatest sporting comebacks of all time, and great publicity for the sport.
On the other hand, I wouldn't want to see him struggle (not that there's any indication that he would), or be involved in a serious incident.
Although as the alternatives appear to be a couple of second-rate Russians (yes they are) or Paul di Resta, I'd like to see Kubica get the drive.
Alfa Romeo are back in F1!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/42166023
(Well, Sauber's Ferrari engine will have an AR sticker on it, at least).
Today's times from Abu Dhabi:
https://www.pitpass.com/60828/Test-T...bu-Dhabi-28-11
Pirelli say that the 2018 tyres are a step softer than their 2017 equivalent, and that the new Hypersoft is two steps softer than the 2017 Ultrasoft.
Kubica again impressed in the Williams.
So that's it for 2017. The last time that these cars will be driven in anger, and the next time that we will see Formula 1 cars on circuit (apart from individual "filming" days) until pre-season testing in 2018. It's been the best season since the hybrid era began in 2014, for the sole reason that Ferrari were able to mix it with Mercedes at the front, at least until their challenge imploded for a variety of reasons as the season climax became - well, anti-climactic.
I for one will be eagerly awaiting the start of the 2018 season, hoping that Mercedes can be made to look ordinary. Formula 1 needs more winners in 2018.
Who in the current market is most likely to drag next year's Williams, assuming with Lowe's input it's a bit better than this years, on to the podium, for me that is RK.
Williams need a number one driver who has experience, and is a leader. Kubica is the only option, as he fulfils both criteria.
A sidestep:
I spoke with a father who's son and my son attend the same school. His son (12 y/o) is regarded to be a talented kart driver. In fact, last season he has raced for AMG. The boy became achieved 3rd place during the European Kart season. So, you can call him talented, I think. Sadly, parents have to pay 95% of the annual costs. AMG only forks in 5%. One training / testing weekend costs about 2500 euros. He told me that it costs about 2 million euros to become a world class driver - not even considering a seat in the F1.
Menno
I'm hoping to see more input from above now that Mr Brawn has had a year to get his feet under the table.
Fundamental shake up in the quest for a retjrn to wheel to wheel racing is almost 25 years over due now.
Just because the season is now finished I hope this does not mean an end to F1 talk on here as I really enjoyed reading all the comments from those more knowledgeable than myself
Don’t worry, the 2018 thread will start soon enough.
In 32 days, I would assume.
"A man of little significance"
Everything the teams do between the chequered flag at Yas Marinas and the red lights going off at Albert Park is for 2018 onwards, the 2017 season is no more.
Still, it does seem a touch early to start the 2018 thread...
Formula E has started, but Vernon Kay!! OK he did own a Noble until he crashed it.
It is getting more popular and all the car manufacturers with an interest in electric cars are throwing there hats in the ring, worth watching, I'll will be interesting to see if this season grabs some attention
The difference in media approach could not be more... different.
Where F1 demands überlarge amount of money, the FE is doling it out.
The result is that over here FE racing is getting a LÓT of air time and F1 basically nothing unless you have a pay channel.
Ok, we all know it is political bs that FE is cleaner et al, but fact is that they do not polute the air where they race. Racing in p.e. Paris city center tells it all.
It was 100% politically scoring for the mayor.
Tried watching it but got bored in about two minutes.
Thanks for the VK warning will pass, he's on par with that annoying twonk on F1 saying "DeeSea" like he's best buds, you can see Coulthard just resisting chining him into next season.
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