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Thread: Westworld

  1. #451
    Master RossC's Avatar
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    I absolutely adored Season 1, but Season 2 is proving really disappointing. I'm hoping it gets back on track soon.

  2. #452
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    I thought episode 5 was the best of the second series so far, watched it twice. Looks like we are going on quite a journey.

  3. #453
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    It's lost its way. Especially disappointing given how long it was off screen.

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  4. #454
    It’s definitely a bit patchy. On the whole I like what they’re doing, particularly with the Delos backstory, but the latest episode was poor. They need to be careful not to overdo the robots’ subplots, which they definitely did with the Samurai story. Also giving Maeve “superpowers” is a little bit like they’re just throwing a bit of a The Matrix into the mix.

  5. #455

    Exclamation

    Now there are too many plot holes - like why didn't Maeve use her telepathy powers BEFORE the Samurai lord killed the young Geisha. Lazy writing.

    I think the fundamental problem with Season 2 is that now we and the robots know that they have consciousness and free will. Therefore the robot rebellion/ killing spree, unless done REALLY well (hasn't been so far) - is bound to get a bit tedious.

    The first Season was so gripping because we were watching the robots' journey - scifi & horror. Now we're more interested in the backstory (of the human characters) and what the buggers at Delos are up to - probably trying to weaponise their IP - super soldiers. Arnold wanted to help his creations achieve consciousness and that's done.

    Season 1 should have been a LONG feature film - with no sequel.

  6. #456
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    I agree that Season 2 has been OK until this Episode 5. It seems to have lost its way and not sure where to go next.

  7. #457
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    Quote Originally Posted by luckywatch View Post
    I thought episode 5 was the best of the second series so far, watched it twice. Looks like we are going on quite a journey.
    I agree, but it would seem that we're in a minority. I was enthralled by episode 5 from the very beginning and particularly enjoyed the classical arrangement of Paint It, Black.

    That said, I do agree with the comments(s) citing Dolores as a bit of a bore, I've lost interest in her unless she gets naked again.

  8. #458
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    Quickly losing interest in this show, liked the first season but can’t seem to muster the same enthusiasm so far.....


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  9. #459
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    Delores definitely seems to have become unmoored of late. I think she's overdue for a tuneup.

  10. #460
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Hack View Post
    Now there are too many plot holes - like why didn't Maeve use her telepathy powers BEFORE the Samurai lord killed the young Geisha. Lazy writing.

    I think the fundamental problem with Season 2 is that now we and the robots know that they have consciousness and free will. Therefore the robot rebellion/ killing spree, unless done REALLY well (hasn't been so far) - is bound to get a bit tedious.

    The first Season was so gripping because we were watching the robots' journey - scifi & horror. Now we're more interested in the backstory (of the human characters) and what the buggers at Delos are up to - probably trying to weaponise their IP - super soldiers. Arnold wanted to help his creations achieve consciousness and that's done.

    Season 1 should have been a LONG feature film - with no sequel.
    Ahh but are they free or do they just think they are free. I think this could be the storyline Ford was working on. After all, he knew he was getting booted out, I think this is him getting his revenge.

  11. #461
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    For the first time, I was bored by an episode. It’s sort of Kung Fu meets a Spaghetti Western. What’s going on with Arnold? It needs to start to make sense or it will become like Walking Dead!

  12. #462
    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    Ahh but are they free or do they just think they are free. I think this could be the storyline Ford was working on. After all, he knew he was getting booted out, I think this is him getting his revenge.
    This is certainly the beauty of Westworld’s Phillip K Dick vibe - they could well pull the rug from under us again. I’d also be surprised if we don’t see Ford again (either in flashback or otherwise).

    However, if they get bogged down in spurious subplots like the Samauri one, the main story will lose its momentum.

  13. #463

    Red face

    Quote Originally Posted by wildheart View Post
    For the first time, I was bored by an episode. It’s sort of Kung Fu meets a Spaghetti Western. What’s going on with Arnold? It needs to start to make sense or it will become like Walking Dead!
    ...or 'Lost' which from Season 3 was pile of well-acted POO!

  14. #464
    Guess I'm in a minority here then but I loved Ep5 - the nods to S1 and how they'd written pretty much the same narrative for each Park.

    Hector hating his'dopplebot' Musashi and not really understanding why was both hilarious and totally understandable--it's not like he was a character written to be friendly in any way.

    The nod to US racism to Asians "I'm from Hong Kong ASSHOLE", the stylistic cues from Yojimbo, the slow mo focus on Maeve with the blood in background was sublime. And to top it all off Akane dancing to Wu-Tang's C.R.E.A.M before going full on mental.

    I want to know where its going and I think that's going to really kick on now. I think Maeve has somehow managed to connect to the mesh network, while Dolores, I think, is following Ford's narrative

    Also, poor Teddy.
    Last edited by Geoff W; 24th May 2018 at 10:25.

  15. #465
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    May I also complain about the lack of nudity. A kneejerk result of #metoo?

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  16. #466
    Teddy's sculpted butt cheeks not enough? :P

  17. #467
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff W View Post
    Teddy's sculpted butt cheeks not enough? :P
    Only so many times those can inspire you....... ;-)

  18. #468
    Quote Originally Posted by The Hack View Post
    ...or 'Lost' which from Season 3 was pile of well-acted POO!
    Lost was shocking. They were obviously just coming up with random storylines and red herrimgs, but even when they knew they were winding it up, they barely attempted to bring them together other than “it’s magic” and a poorly disguised purgatory-scenario (which they swore at the beginning they wouldn’t do).

    Absolutely appalling writing, and the low benchmark of how not to write a complex, multi-season story.

  19. #469
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    Only got round to watching it last night and was expecting the worst from the comments here. But I agree with you, I thought it was very good.

    I also love that they used the guy from The Last Samurai, he is clearly very good at playing that role :)

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff W View Post
    Guess I'm in a minority here then but I loved Ep5 - the nods to S1 and how they'd written pretty much the same narrative for each Park.

    Hector hating his'dopplebot' Musashi and not really understanding why was both hilarious and totally understandable--it's not like he was a character written to be friendly in any way.

    The nod to US racism to Asians "I'm from Hong Kong ASSHOLE", the stylistic cues from Yojimbo, the slow mo focus on Maeve with the blood in background was sublime. And to top it all off Akane dancing to Wu-Tang's C.R.E.A.M before going full on mental.

    I want to know where its going and I think that's going to really kick on now. I think Maeve has somehow managed to connect to the mesh network, while Dolores, I think, is following Ford's narrative

    Also, poor Teddy.

  20. #470

  21. #471
    Master luckywatch's Avatar
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    Lovely touch at the end of episode 6.

  22. #472
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    Not the worst episode but still disappointing. 6/10

  23. #473
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  24. #474
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    Nice to see Anthony back but another structural omni-shambles. My persistence will force me to watch to the bitter end.

  25. #475
    fell asleep again, I wont bother any more, but a good cure for insomnia

  26. #476
    Master luckywatch's Avatar
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    The second series was a long wait. Its getting a bit better but not holding up to series one. I got to stay with it as its the only show I watch and there is always a chance Tessa Thompson might just get naked...................


  27. #477
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    Struggling to believe that hundreds of highly trained/armed special forces types are so easily getting their asses kicked. They are getting destroyed by the hosts.......

    No idea where this season is going and frankly don’t care anymore. Not a single character I have empathy for or care about which imo is a real issue for a show of this type.


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  28. #478
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    Just how many times can Ed Harris get shot and survive. Although Thandies line was a cracker. "I don't care how you (f word) die, as long as I get to watch."
    Unless of course he is also a host.

  29. #479
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    I’m finding the second series hard going, for a lot of reasons above!

    It just doesn’t seem to be “believable”

    Fingers crossed it gets better.


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  30. #480

    Thumbs up

    Yep - think the writers really didn't have a clue where they were going to take the story - so it's all a bit of a mess with only a few interesting elements or concepts. Maybe they should have made the first Season as a 3-part mini-series and just left it at that?

  31. #481
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    Real shame this idea has descended into chaos, first series was so good, this series is just awful.

  32. #482
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    Well this episode was a bit different.

  33. #483
    Craftsman halfpasttwothirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    Well this episode was a bit different.
    Liked the Indian fella in Fargo.

  34. #484
    I really enjoyed it, not sure why!

    Just hope all these different arcs are going to come together?!?!

  35. #485
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    I'm enjoying it as much as the first series.

    I still think its thousands of years in the future and the hosts have wiped out mankind but are running the park as a roleplay experiment to try and rediscover how to reproduce sentient hosts.

    Thandie is a babe.

  36. #486
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    Just watched it, hard going with subtitles throughout.
    Less and less interested with each episode.
    Last edited by Nigel306; 12th June 2018 at 20:34.

  37. #487

    Thumbs up

    I have a feeling the writers are indeed making things up as they go along a bit. You enjoyed the 'Indian' episode as it's a copy of Season 1 - in terms of the 'awakening' of the robots and their search for the truth.

    I'll keep watching - but I'm very disappointed in Season 2. :(


    Quote Originally Posted by Ashtennisguru View Post
    I really enjoyed it, not sure why!

    Just hope all these different arcs are going to come together?!?!

  38. #488
    It’s a shame to criticise a programme for being too broad in its ambitions, but I think that’s probably the problem with Westworld - it’s just trying to be a bit too clever imo. It’s turning into a bit of a mishmash of sci-fi tropes and overindulgent (but well shot/acted) side stories - and losing a lot of its watchability.

  39. #489
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    Found some time to catch up with this.

    First 3 episodes almost forced me to quit. Ep 4 however pulled me back in.

  40. #490
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    I thought tonight’s episode was brilliant. Billy has lost the plot !

  41. #491
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    Quote Originally Posted by Van Diemen View Post
    Found some time to catch up with this.

    First 3 episodes almost forced me to quit. Ep 4 however pulled me back in.
    Good to hear as I watched episode 3 a couple of weeks ago, and haven’t been bothered watching another since. I will try episode 4 now!

  42. #492
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaytip View Post
    I thought tonight’s episode was brilliant. Billy has lost the plot !
    Last couple of episodes have been great - singular stories focusing on one character. Maybe also less of the Deathbringer whose narrative is the weakest I feel

  43. #493
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildheart View Post
    Real shame this idea has descended into chaos, first series was so good, this series is just awful.
    Feels like this second series is much closer to the Futureworld movie - copying guests and replacing with hosts rather than the simple narrative of host awakening like the original movie which was the basis of season 1

  44. #494
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    Well that's the end of season 2, and it was a bit all over the place, not sure it's a good recipe to have so many competing timelines/stories, then to have complex conclusions and the probably 12-18 month wait for season 3!

  45. #495
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    I don’t think I am entirely stupid but I like the concept of the show. Do they really have to make it so complex and cerebral?? I spend more time trying to figure it out than watching/enjoying it and still feel stupid at the end of each episode. Not sure I will bother if they do a season 3.....


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  46. #496
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    Smile

    I’ve haven’t read this thread yet to avoid spoilers so excuse me if this isn’t on topic... but I’ve found this season quite irritating due to all the ‘multiple timelines’ malarkey. The first book I ever read on screen writing said ‘don’t use flashbacks because they are confusing and interrupt the flow of the narrative’. This has certainly proved it. If the story isn’t interesting enough to tell in order, then shuffling it does nothing much to improve it.

    That said, the excellent Patrick Melrose managed to jump around in time very effectively, you always knew where you were and there was a reason for it. The fact that in Westworld they’ve made it confusing on purpose does nothing to excuse it, and it isn’t the same thing as being genuinely smart. No doubt Westworld is building up to some even more confusing reveal but I’ve lost patience with it. This clever-clever structure sort of worked in the first season but even then, call me stupid but I prefer a straight story told in order, where you follow protagonists you’re interested in, and you know what they’re trying to achieve (eg ‘Godless’). It’s more absorbing and has more of a payoff, while the clever-clever structure usually turns out not to be clever enough to be worth the effort. Science fiction can be conceptual without being confusing and disappearing up its own artificially intelligent robotic backside. I hope they learn from this if they get to a season 3.
    Last edited by Itsguy; 25th June 2018 at 19:54.

  47. #497
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    I think they can only really recreate the show for season 3 now, the flashbacks were explained a little, but even then, a lot of the earlier bits in the season now seem pointless without the reveal being more than just thrown into the last episode. The man in black bit is still a bit all over the place though, not sure what/who/when/where with most of that one!

  48. #498
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    Having watched the season finale last night and fallen asleep mid-way through the episode it has [to my mind] started to jump the shark. The differing timelines are all over the place and it appears to be an exercise in nosebleed inducing viewer confusion.

    Reminds me a bit of Lost, I don't plan to get caught out like that again!

  49. #499
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    Quote Originally Posted by MST View Post
    Having watched the season finale last night and fallen asleep mid-way through the episode it has [to my mind] started to jump the shark. The differing timelines are all over the place and it appears to be an exercise in nosebleed inducing viewer confusion.

    Reminds me a bit of Lost, I don't plan to get caught out like that again!
    Having also seen the finale since my previous post, I agree. The music swelled at the end suggesting an emotion that I certainly wasn't feeling. I looks as if various ideas where thrown at the wall during development but as predicted they never quite coalesced into a satisfying payoff that made all the confused timelines worth the struggle. In contrast to this, the much simpler Ex Machina deals with similar themes in a much more satisfying manner, and leaves you actually feeling something at the end.

    I did however enjoy the excursion into samurai world during the season as a change of scenery, and Evan Rachel Wood / Delores did some top notch psycho robot acting, looking spookily artificial at times without ever overdoing it.

    Ah well, at least it wasn't The Handmaid's Tale! That's taking hard work to a whole new level.

  50. #500
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    Quote Originally Posted by Itsguy View Post
    This clever-clever structure sort of worked in the first season but even then, call me stupid but I prefer a straight story told in order, where you follow protagonists you’re interested in, and you know what they’re trying to achieve (eg ‘Godless’). It’s more absorbing and has more of a payoff, while the clever-clever structure usually turns out not to be clever enough to be worth the effort. Science fiction can be conceptual without being confusing and disappearing up its own artificially intelligent robotic backside. I hope they learn from this if they get to a season 3.
    Agreed.

    S2 jumped around so much that I started to feel motion sickness, let alone loosing the narrative.

    The season finale felt like elements of the Matrix mixed with a myriad of other sci-fi themes. The problem was, by end I had simply given up caring about any of the characters and I couldn't help but spend more time wondering whether the actors even understood the plot, let alone the mumbojumbo the script asked them to spout.

    S1 was excellent and was very watchable. S2 was very hit and miss, in fact, more miss than hit; unlike others, I actually enjoyed the samurai storyline but overall I found the season lacking and parts almost unwatchable.

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