GWS G10 Pro Diver or CWC GS Sapphire black

[Snoozedoggydog]

Hi,
I'm in a bit of a conundrum. I'm ex army so have a bit of a soft spot for CWC. I'm in the market for a black military looking quartz for everyday wear (I own 3 autos already).
I owned a Traser P6500 a good few years ago but the second hand had slop which I just couldn't put up with so sold it.

I'm currently looking at the H3 GWS Pro diver (may as well say Traser) £224. And the CWC GS Sapphire black £299. From what I can make out, spec's wise they're the same watch. So my question is ... is the customer service and heritage worth the extra for the CWC. General opinions well received.

Thanks
Phil

[TimeThoughts]

Hi, just followed you herefrom Watch talk.

Like yourself I have some military background (from 20yr ago). I never saw a CWC till I finished my brush with the RN.

I bought a CWC G10 (w/date) a few years back and they are an amazing watch. Just took mine off after a hard day of replacing trellis fencing.

I see the GWS selling point as the tritium personally.

CWC has the heritage but GWS has the night time ! Its as simple as that for me.

I'll probably buy the GWS pro diver job on silicon next month. I'm too busy this month, if you want to hang on I'll post pics etc.

[Snoozedoggydog]

Figured I'd best post this particular thread on BMW, I hadn't learned the rules when I posted about the GWS G10 on watch talk :-(

I'm torn between the two ... One screams military and the other doesn't. But I know if I get the GWS G10 and it's got slop in the second hand I'll be giving myself a dry slap. I'm only guessing but I bet the CWC won't have slop.

Phil

[TimeThoughts]

Based on my CWC G10;

No danger mate. Tight as a drum. I've had this watch in bits and its very very well built.

Ronda 7oo series mvmnt seems very good to me. I set a Rolex off this watch (sad; £200 watch governs £5000 watch).

Good luck with the choices.

[markrlondon]

I'm only guessing but I bet the CWC won't have slop.

There is no reason to think that. In general the CWC's second hand is no more or less likely to hit the markers than the Traser/GWS.

You might be lucky or you might not be with either CWC or Traser/GWS. It really is luck.

Note that "slop" is perhaps a misleading way to think of it. There may be a number of reasons why quartz second hands do not hit the markers and "slop" (which I understand to mean looseness in mechanism) is not necessarily the most likely reason. Second hands and mechanism can be absolutely tight (in that they hit the same places every time regardless of orientation) without any lag or looseness and still not reliably hit the actual markers.

[markrlondon]

To add to my earlier message: If getting a quartz watch with a second hand that reliably hits the markers is important to you (it's important to me!) then there are five ways to go about it in my opinion:

(1) Buy a watch you can actually look at before you buy.

(2) Buy online from a vendor who will agree to confirm that the watch they are sending you hits the markers. (Many won't do this).

(3) Buy online and be willing to send the watch back under distance selling rules if it doesn't hit the markers. Of course, if you order another identical watch from the same vendor then then you might just get the same watch back again.

(4) Buy second hand and keep on buying until you find one that hits the markets reliably. By buying second hand you can sell on with little or no loss.

(5) Buy a watch that is well known for always hitting the markers: Examples are modern very high end Seiko quartz (Grand Seiko), very high end Citizen (Chronomaster or The Citizen), or vintage Seiko. (Modern mass market Citizens in the UK are poor in this respect, in my experience).

The simple truth is that mass market Ronda and ETA quartz movements simply cannot be guaranteed to hit the markers. You might be lucky or you might not. As I mentioned earlier on, Ronda movements are often better than others in this respect in my experience but, even so, it's still a matter of luck.

[Snoozedoggydog]

Thanks for all the advice. I clearly do not know enough about quartz movements to understand why it's a game of luck for a second hand to hit the markers. I'm my mind it's 2nd in quality control to 1st keeping good time. Especially when clearly it is possible to make Ronda 715 movement that does hit the mark .... if you get a lucky one.

My old P6500 Traser had slop ... meaning if I held the watch a particular way the second hand would progress but then visibly drop back. I spoke to Traser directly and they said it was within tolerance. Something I find unacceptable. But that's just me.

Anyway, I don't mean to come across all angry about it. Clearly I'm showing my ignorance that for £200 it's pot luck hitting markers.

Thanks
Phil

[markrlondon]

I clearly do not know enough about quartz movements to understand why it's a game of luck for a second hand to hit the markers.

I don't know either. For what it's worth, there is definitely more than one distinct reason for second hands not hitting the markers. I think it's a matter of manufacturing techniques: Most buyers don't really care so other factors have become more important.

Something I find unacceptable. But that's just me.

Me too. I can't tolerate a quartz watch whose second hand that not reliably hit the markers (or at least very, very close to them).

For what it's worth, analogue G-Shocks are often quite good in my experience.

I think a Ronda-powered Traser or GWS is probably also a reasonable bet.... it's just that it really can't be guaranteed.

[Snoozedoggydog]

On a positive note Mark from GWS emailed me in reply to my concerns. He's happy to fish through his stock and send me one that does hit the marks.

I'd like to say thanks to all concerned for the info provided and having patience with me.

Phil.

[Geronimo]

Ever thought about these?

[Snoozedoggydog]

I already own a Seiko SKX007 which doesn't look too dissimilar. But thank you for the heads up. I wouldn't say no to the Speedbird 3 though perhaps with a PVD coat on NATO ;-). You can't probably imagine the look I'm after.

Phil.

[Snoozedoggydog]

Oooo just spotted the Damasco DA38 in black. It's a tad over budget for a beater :-(. My Chronoris is getting nervous ........

[markrlondon]

On a positive note Mark from GWS emailed me in reply to my concerns. He's happy to fish through his stock and send me one that does hit the marks.

Wow, that's excellent! Good to know.

[Rollon]

http://www.cwcwatch.com/collections/...re-watch-black

http://www.cwcwatch.com/collections/...nt=14857551430


For myself, I thought Eddie did a much better job more congruent with the original’s military mission in tweaking the issue G10 design with his TF Precista PRS-10, which was so well and comprehensively reviewed here by EwanW [ http://watcharoo.co.uk/prs10.htm ] when this watch was first introduced.

The PRS-10 only had 100m WR (still a good boost) instead of the CWC’s 200m, but Eddie’s design kept the original G10's mil-spec “armoured” steel tension ring secured domed acrylic crystal which meets military aviation standards for negative pressure resistance (which press-fit/squishy gasketed sapphire designs can sometimes fail if not specially fixed in place like the IWC pilot watch series, the TF Speedbird IIIs, etc.) and resistance to shattering into eyesight threatening small-hard-sharp shards (very unlike the brittle sapphire which is relatively prone to it).

IIRC, the Precista PRS-10 was also only 90 GBP when it went out-of-stock, circa 2013, compared to the 285 to 299 GBP the CWC GS Sapphire goes for now, and that seems a lot of extra cash to pretty much just avoid crystal scratches. The CWC’s higher 200m WR is nice, but I was more than fine with the Precista’s 100m for this kind of watch and very much regret the PRS-10s went out of stock before I was able to get one. I wish Eddie would make more of them someday, even if it had to be at a higher price than the previous 90 GBP