Reply With QuoteEh???? nest egg? Seems to me watches have never been more expensive. What watches do you think are being sold at bargain prices?Originally Posted by Blueboy1
Having been away for a couple of years and now looking through Sales Corner it seems the bottom has fallen out of the watchmarket - or maybe it was just a gradual process? There goes my nest egg!
Eh???? nest egg? Seems to me watches have never been more expensive. What watches do you think are being sold at bargain prices?
Watch prices seem pretty high still to me. However, SC is a surprisingly small market I think. Some things seem to sell rapidly, others not at all, and price is not necessarily the deciding factor. It's all about what the relatively small pool of buyers want, have already got, or still want but cannot currently afford.
Have a look at WUS and eBay? Would you say that these are as depressed as TZ-UK's SC?
Last edited by markrlondon; 23rd March 2015 at 05:15.
Watches are taking longer to sell. AP End of Days used to fly out of the dealers but hang around for ages now and the prices have dropped. Daytona prices are falling, even the Zenith's. I think the money has moved into classic cars.
Mid range brands like Rolex are being devalued with 'bling' designs for buyers in the developing world
Last edited by J J Carter; 21st March 2015 at 09:01.
I dont see that prices seem to go up all the time.
I am not surprised there is a slowdown, watch prices are at absurd levels and have to peak somewhere, irrespective of the marketing hype and drivel!
When you have Omega watches in the £5-7,000 range for Stainless Steel, you know that they are seriously believing their own bullshit, not that I dislike Omega, far from it, but they, like many other Rolex aspiring 'band-wagon' brands are seriously overpriced in my opinion given the manufacturing cost per item.
Ok, watch manufacturers may indeed spend many millions on marketing, that impresses me not one jot, if I do not think a watch is 'reasonably' priced, I will not buy it, not that I am their target market being a guy who is entirely unimpressed with celebrities and what freebies they hang from their wrists.
I reckon my cat knows more about watch movements than most so-called celebrities!
You have got to be kidding.
Not surprised. Do those things cost more than a G shock?
Ooo, tell us about Seiko, oh Seiko enthusiast!! They make their own oil and other things!
SC has been slowing down for some time, and prices have dropped again as buyers doing some research on Chrono24 will notice European prices are looking much better now that the pound as increased in value. I noticed the BLNR Rolex on SC was withdrawn recently, people added to the thread by saying it's was on at a good price, but the reality was the watch was available new direct from Europe for less than what was deemed to be a "good" price on SC and a very nice watch at a good discount from rrp went unsold.
I was talking mostly of vintage / diver watches in the mid-price range, which is what I used to collect. I don't have many high-end watches, other than a handful of subs and seadwellers, because they were never particularly visually appealing to me.
But I'd say that vintage Seiko, Oris, Philip, Ollech & Wajs, Sinn, Lip et al have definately dipped.
Two highly specific examples there I think - the APs are fast becoming unfashionably large and the brand association for certain pieces is getting worse and the Daytona, even the Zenith... well, the bubble has burst for sure. It's also unfashionably small :)
Pieces like the SDc on SC not selling... gorgeous watch, great price, but those who want it and can afford it on tz-uk already have it by the look of it. There are maybe a few dozen people who buy and sell at that level on SC, it's a tiny pool really (as Mark said).
Perhaps that's the case, but if you go to the next price bracket, try buying a mint blue Tudor for anything like the price you could have paid just 2 years ago, it ain't going to happen.
SC has become less and less indicative of the market at large, particularly over the last year or so. I know of countless examples of watches hanging around on SC at fantastic prices and then being sold to dealers for more than the price listed; it's a small market here and it's not exactly booming!
It's a bit like the housing market which has been starved by the availability of new buyers to get mortgages as in the 250 post thing means most people join the forum and leave before they qualify or buy from ebay or another forum. SC is a very reasonable place and a lot of watches are advertised at the trade in value to the trade so he'll mend those who don't take advantage as they could own then for free and always be able to get the cash back.
RIAC
Its become a market place for quasi dealers and flippers, who need to get their money back. Lots of foot stamping if people they don't get prices they want through threats of selling to dealers and ebay. I think this has shaken trust along with a small but significant chunk of people discussing fakes. The prices are also ridulculous for well know brands which feeds into the need to recoup money attitude.
Last edited by Martin123; 21st March 2015 at 10:47.
TBH...... I now look at the prices of some watches on SC......and in my head say well if I wanted that model, I'd buy brand new from Italy or Germany......and still be £200 or so in pocket.....
Agree there is a lot of fake talk on here these days, and if you ask why or challenge it, it gets pretty nasty pretty quickly.
Not sure if that impacts SC though?
I am still glad the 250 post rule is there otherwise it's eBay with less protection!
Yeah Andy I agree, there are some silly prices and also silly-low ones from Europe.
Wanting back what you paid doesn't mean you'll get it. We'd all like that, on almost everything.
Taking aside the SC approach, a look at Chrono24 shows a few Subs and SDs at less than £3k in Europe. I'm not an owner of either, but when I was considering an SD, they were a fair bit more. As has been mentioned, this is likely to be currency fluctuation as much as anything.
The flip side is the lower priced vintage watches are not going down in price in my opinion.
The market for high end Smart watches has the real potential to distract the brand conscious non WIS from the traditional timepieces too.
Totally agree. Watch prices have gone crackers since 2009 - Even the good German brands, Nomos, Sinn, Stowa etc - a few years back you could pick up a cracking U1 for 700 quid, an Antea for 400, and a Club Datum for 900!
I bought my First Seiko Tuna for 375 new in 2011, now over 600 quid on average.
I bought a nearly new 2531 Seamaster for 750 in 2011.
I bought a Breitling Avenger Seawolf NEW from an AD in 2006 for 1200 quid.
Those Chinese Nouveau Riches have got a lot to answer for.......!
As has easy finance...
What type of cat have you got? My two are utterly useless. Couldn't even spot the 8500 movement in my PO!
Watch prices for mass produced steel watches seem very high eg Rolex Breitling Omega etc.They charge what they can get away with , how long people will pay these prices who knows .There is good value in lower priced internet only brands,Stowa steinhart squale .The big names are better but not £5000 /£6000 better
Change the cat. Mine spotted my Seiko Tuna's second hand not hitting the markers straight away.
How much should they charge then, less than they can?
They are running a business, not a charity.
All I hear is
IMO SC is artificially cheap and not particularly indicative of average private prices. (Rolex in particular, so i disagree with the people charge what they can get away with nonsensical comment earlier)
I think a few bits have set a below value precident by going way under if people have been wanting to sell quickly. These prices are then used as a benchmark for how others should price if they want to make a sale.
is your cat doing servicing yet? what is the waiting list like
Sold three watches on SC and never had one hang around more that two days. Price it to sell and it will - simple.
It depends on the marketplace you're looking in and the type of watch you're after too. Just going on my personal experience in areas I have focused on in the vintage market prices have certainly gone up. I used to be much more into military issued watches and similar and outside of issued IWC's and the like I could find plenty within in my low enough budget. Not so much these days, if you can find them at all and they're not in bits. Even the IWC's were "cheaper. We were having this very discussion over on the MWR forum recently.
Ditto for "trench" watches and other early wristwatches. There used to be a wider selection and again cheaper(maybe the centenary of the Great War buoyed the prices in that area).
Early quartz and electronic watches have steadily climbed over the last 5 years. Watches that were regularly going for under the 100 quid mark, can now go for three times that. Personal example: Three years or so back I got my LIP Nautic Ski compressor cased electronic divers for just north of the 200 quid mark, good luck in finding one today at that price on a Bay auction. More like 400 upwards. They often start at 200. Longines Ultronics prices have most certainly climbed, even in the last 18 months.
The vintage market is a volatile one anyway and I would reckon the availability wave has crested in some ways. It's a finite resource. Fewer are making it to market, certainly on ebay and collectors are flipping fewer and fewer of the nice examples, so prices are climbing. There seem to be more dealers and dealer prices on the bay too, which is influencing the market. You do see the same watches coming up time and time again going unsold.
However, there are "bargains" and very nice vintage watches still to be found, they just come up with a little less regularity. Example: This NOS 1960's Longines diver closed at 453 euro, which is what.. around 360 sterling? Even with a flurry of 67 bids. That's a "brand new" vintage Longines 60's diver with original Tropic strap(which can go for 100 quid on their own) for under a quarter of the retail for a new Longines legend diver. Even with the increased interest in vintage Longines that their new reissues brought. So Blueboy1 you can still most certainly find nice divers in the mid range. Put it another way if I had say a thousand quid and a month to dig the bowels of the Bay, I would be pretty spoiled for choice with vintage divers of note. Even with a budget of 500 quid, I'd not have to search too long to find nice examples.
As for SC? The vast majority of watches offered would be well out of my price range and knowledge comfort zone. However I have seen some real beauties at very keen prices compared to other marketplaces. Here's a current example. An Omega Chrono Quartz, with service and a very interesting history. You'd be looking long and hard to find close to similar elsewhere. Never mind that you'd be dealing with a fellow member of good standing when it comes to SC.
PS all prices above are in euros. Sorry about that, but if I tried to work out the sterling price, my head would likely have burst with the effort. :s
Simple in the immediate, but potentially destructive in the long run.
Eg -
14060m - priced to sell - 2.5k
Sold.
next 14060m - priced in line with value - no sale because buyers have the 2.5k one in mind and want the same deal.
Artificially drives down prices.
As long as these deals stay mainly "in-house" its fine, you sell cheap but you'll likely get a good deal as well unless you always buy bew; what sucks is when dealers start coming in to snap up deals just to flip along at a tidy profit, like what is happening on WUS a lot nowadays, quite sure it happens here as well but not so much in the open.
I find that a lot base the price they want for a watch on ebay prices, they omit to take away the fees they would get if the watch was sold on ebay though. By all means check what a watch goes for on ebay but then factor in the smaller audience and the fees that would need to be paid.
Steve
Yes - I've taken a hit each time but the watch sold quickly, and to someone on the forum. The alternative is ebay, and when you look at the *completed* prices, as opposed to the many chancers with inflated asking prices, then take 12% off for fees, then factor in potential problems with scammers etc I don't really think SC prices are out of kilter all.
Tony, I was thinking more of the new breed flipping to make a fast buck rather than those with a terminal afflipction:)
Last edited by Martin123; 22nd March 2015 at 10:57.
There's nothing artificial about market mechanisms and prices fluctuating.
Spot on. But... what can you do. I needed £5k fast, I sold my DSSD for £5k and it was gone in 3 minutes.
Now every one I see at a very fair £5600-5700 I think 'good luck' with that!
Some of the cheaper watches usually have to be very cheap to sell as most on here already have much more expensive watches already and are only buying out of curiosity/bit of fun etc so it is unlikely anyone will pay top prices
Exception seems to be Eddies which are very popular (rightly so) and it is a safe bet no money will be lost giving them a try
Everyone wants the maximum they can get for their watches and pay the least possible for any they want to buy, it is pretty normal and to be expected really
Some will be desperate to sell or simply cannot be bothered to wait and they can accept/can afford to take a big loss, i think others need to remember that this does not set hard and fast values of any similar watch on SC and i also think that until anything is sold it is up to the owner to ask whatever he likes (as long as there is no profiteering etc)
You can state your opinion effectively by not buying the watch (or even a considerate offer over PM)
Me too. Even though I haven't been here for that long, I intend to stay and the community and trust here is important to me. I'd rather sell for a few hundred less and keep it on here - there's always the chance to buy it back that way and see it on Fridays :)
Unfortunately nothing i have sold on here (and taken a loss on) has ever been seen again, hopefully soon
I'm fairly new to here, only having just got access to SC. Despite a couple of recently well publicised (and now banned) chancers I would feel far more comfortably buying from this community than Euro dealers via Chrono 24. I'm in the awkward position of having access to view SC, but not to post, which has the potential to significantly dent my cash flow. However as a buyer appreciate the extra reassurance that all of those selling are well 'kent on these boards.
Aye.
Ive seen a few low priced and decent bits sitting about waiting to get slashed to rock bottom just to get some movement on them.
Great for buyers, but may switch the sales flow in the long run towards private networks and competitive dealers.
Taking a hit on a sale, is the nature of the beast....for me it's a hobby, and hobbies cost money....
I pretty much always accept I'm going to out of pocket somewhat......but that doesn't mean I'm not going to expect a "fair" deal.......and a fair deal to me is when the buyer, and the seller walk away happy....
Quoted for truth.
I buy from ebay, but no way would I sell there. Too much of a hit in fees and the risks are high enough. OK if it's a 50 quid item but a watch sale that could have many thousands of pounds involved? Nope. When I have sold watches in the past it was always through various forum sales to people I "knew". Plus call me sentimental if you will, but I prefer to see a watch go to a fellow enthusiast.
Some good points on here - I've also sold icon SC, but nothing like Rolex etc, g-shock on bracelet I proced to sell and it did within a couple on mins, could have sold it 10 times over!
Or both buyer and seller, both walk away, deal done, equally unhappy :-)
Sorry, but that doesn't work for me.....if I'm unhappy in any way, I'd leave it....... And have done on more than one occasion...
Can't get a fair price??= pull the sale, try again some other time, sell elsewhere or just don't bother...
Can't buy at a fair price??...look elsewhere, buy something else, or just don't bother...
What have you been smoking ? Prices been going up. 4 or more years ago I bought a Tudor Snowflake for 2000.00 US at the MWR PX they now sell for 3500.00 US and up vintage military watches have went up drastically that it slowed me down in my collecting habit.
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