Reply With Quotebetter late than never eh ;)
I've always loved the Sea-Dweller. In fact, I've had a couple of magnificent Great Whites as well as both drilled and non-drilled versions of the 16600; I've even had a gorgeous stardust Triple 6. For a desk diver like me they're a bit daft really, but the very things that polarise opinion when it comes to the Sub v SD debate epitomise why I've enjoyed owning them. For that reason, I don't intend waffling on about the merits or otherwise of the SD 4000 over the Subc, because everyone has a view already and that view won't change on the back of my comments. I do think the changes are worth a mention in the context of new v old SD, though.
Firstly, the case. I don't know why Rolex decided that they needed a mid-size in the line-up but personally I think they've got it just right. The lugs on the 4000 are probably halfway between the old style of the 16600 and the newer maxi cases. This has the effect of giving the watch greater bulk and wrist presence without "squaring off" the shape like some of the other models in the current line-up. I think they've got it spot on, actually, but these things are clearly pretty subjective.
Much has been made of the matt maxi dial but to be honest the difference in finish is fairly subtle. Sometimes you can see clearly that it has a matt finish, but mostly the black is deep and rich, and not much different to the gloss dial of the 16600. The maxi sized plots are a huge improvement, though, as to my mind those on the previous model (and on the 16610, for that matter) are now looking far too small in the face of recent changes.
The ceramic bezel is a big change for sure, but whilst the look is completely different to the old aluminium inserts it's really not blingy at all, as has been suggested more than once. In fact, in certain light it takes on a grey hue and almost looks matt itself, much like the bezel on the MM300 if anyone can picture that. I think this is a clear upgrade, as is the newer style glidelock clasp on the bracelet.
The only thing I can't quite get my head around is the design of the end-links. I've taken a couple of shots to show the issue clearly, but the end-links are proud of the lugs where they curve downwards and are also on a different plane on the outside to the section in the centre. All in all it's a bit confused, but needless to say it's unnoticeable when the watch is on the wrist, and I'm being really picky.
I suspect that those who like the SD as a concept with still like the latest incarnation, and those that don't will unlikely be swayed by the changes. I'm certainly very happy with it, though, and reckon it's a perfect diver/sports watch and a close to perfect all-rounder. A few shots below, of course, which hopefully highlight the changes and demonstrate what I was trying to describe with regard to the end-links. In short, a bloody good watch.
And an iPhone shot from earlier today...
better late than never eh ;)
Great photos and review of a special watch. Currently not in a financial position to choose between this or a SubC but if I was-it would be this one!
probably some best pix I saw after the sub green.
Can anyone explain the design logic of the end-links?learningtofly The only thing I can't quite get my head around is the design of the end-links. I've taken a couple of shots to show the issue clearly, but the end-links are proud of the lugs where they curve downwards and are also on a different plane on the outside to the section in the centre. All in all it's a bit confused,
Last edited by Tinker; 1st November 2014 at 03:10.
The first picture alone would persuade you to buy the watch!!!
Beautiful watch!
Don't think my finances or wife, will ever allow me to get one of those bad boys.
A quality time piece you will enjoy though.
Congratulations Tony. The watch looks stunning!
I'm off to try one in a few hours. Still not sure how I'll feel about it.
Lovely photos.
Hi Tony
Excellent write up complemented by some stunning pictures.!
As much as I love the watch I cannot get my head around lug-gate, petty I know. But it pains me to think that there was not much thought given to the fit and therefore finish to this great piece.
Thanks
deano
Thanks Tony. Great pictures of a stunning watch and a nice review. I appreciate you mentioning your thoughts on the end links openly. Kind of hard in the middle of the "having bought a new watch Rush".
I am also unsure on this point and haven't made up mind yet. To keep a factual approach can you see if the sides that stick out have a finish applied? And can we rule out these are end links shared by another model to hopefully rule out that suggestion and conclude these links were at least made for this watch, making it a design choice?
Jasper
Once Watch and nice pics. Congrats!!
Lovely pictures as always and an interesting read too. I saw one of these a few months ago in the flesh and was converted on the spot. They are a beautiful and elegant interpretation of a classic watch (end links aside which, to be honest, I hadn't noticed).
Great shots Tony, do like the look of it and have tried one on briefly.. Not sure about the shiny Ceramic Bezel with the very prominent pip! As you say all very subjective and as someone commented in the vintage thread "The old uns tend to fly under the radar more" Glad you are happy with it though.
Originally Posted by Tinker
Can anyone explain the design logic of the end-links?
It's a design own goal and looks dreadful considering the attention detail for the rest of the watch, which looks awesome.
Enjoy the watch.
The old Sea Dweller wasn't the greatest retail success, which allows us lot on here and others, an excuse to wear one and be cooler than Mr Average.
Why? Because the Sub is a better all round watch. Imho it goes to show, sometimes, a true tool watch does not always transfer into daily life.
Personally, I think this incarnation will go the same way as the DSSD and won't sell in huge numbers, in comparison to other models.
That's not me being negative Tony, just my slant on the model. I've been very close to owning one, but the 116610 always wins, as it always has. However, despite feminine wrists, you do actually carry that off rather well
Not sure about those end links, but the watch itself looks stunning.
A great watch made all the easier to appreciate from your photos. Which seem to have a slightly different style to the norm? I too noticed the end links, my attention being drawn to them by Internet macro photos. And I cannot think why they did it. But it is deliberate, as witnessed on the DSSD and Daytona which have the same "feature". However after wearing for a few days I no longer notice so it's not bugging me.
That said I have tried quite a few Rolex Subs and SDs and feel this is what suits me best. I found the ceramic Sub square on the wrist and it never completely gelled with me. I need the glidelock due to a body that seems to react significantly to changes in temperature. So much so that my 5513 has moved onto leather, the horror! And I like the fact it's deemed too expensive by many, so one day it'll be relatively rare. As my first brand-new, collected from an AD, peel off the stickers Rolex I'm very pleased and yes, it's a keeper.
Ant
I sold mine after the honeymoon period. A lovely watch but just too much money at RRP. Plus it felt very heavy to me... The first watch in a long time to make my wrist ache after a day of wear. The DSSD balances better on the wrist IMO whereas this just didn't balance too well for me. Removing the dive extension is also imperative as otherwise, it was the most uncomfortable watch I've ever worn!
The lume is excellent though and the end link issue really didn't bother me. I just don't get what all the fuss is about with that. Maybe it's people that wear glasses? Really glad you like the watch anyway Tony. I'm looking forward to trying a SubC again at some point and see how it compares.
Wayne
Agree with you on the divers extension, truly uncomfortable with it but easily removed as I did within 5 minutes.
Not sure on the weight though as I weighed mine and my Sub and think there was only 15g in it. But the weight is condensed into a smaller case shape, which increases the perception of "heft".
Ant
That has to be one of the flips of the Century considering the gushing review you gave it.
i think it is a good looking watch. i really think the end link fitment is shoddy but it is the same with my dssd and i dont notice it when worn. It just seems odd when people talk about the top quality finish of the watch and bracelet that people are so willing to overlook this pretty simple to solve mistake.
Great pictures of a nice watch.
Might I suggest an ISA and a different wife? ;)
Great photos and a great watch.
Interesting read, great watch and fantastic photography.
scooter
I'm sure its a lovely watch, i actually ordered one when announced mistakenly believing it was 42mm.
But as mentioned previously WTF is it with those end links? Is there a reason they don't follow the same contour as the case? Probably an easy thing to overlook for many, but how much better could it look in that area. Are Rolex simply too lazy to harmonise that detail or am i oblivious to some other deciding factor? If i wanted one, that bracelet would have to go
Thanks, all, regarding the photos and other comments.
Yes, the sides are finished. In fairness it's not the first time that Rolex have done this, so one must assume that it's intentional.
The pearl is as per all the ceramics, Vince. I agree it's a different kettle of fish to vintage, of course, but there's room for both.
As I said in the OP, Steve, those that prefer the Sub will still prefer the Sub. I've always loved the SD, and I actually much prefer the less square case shape of this one.The old Sea Dweller wasn't the greatest retail success, which allows us lot on here and others, an excuse to wear one and be cooler than Mr Average.
Why? Because the Sub is a better all round watch. Imho it goes to show, sometimes, a true tool watch does not always transfer into daily life.
Personally, I think this incarnation will go the same way as the DSSD and won't sell in huge numbers, in comparison to other models.
That's not me being negative Tony, just my slant on the model. I've been very close to owning one, but the 116610 always wins, as it always has. However, despite feminine wrists, you do actually carry that off rather well
I'm with you, Ant.
I wouldn't have paid RRP for it, Wayne, but at a competitive dealer price it was to compelling. Agree regarding the lume, by the way - it was lighting up the bedroom all night.
Just took the extension off mine too - much better!
Congratulations Tony, it's the insert that does it for me. I will try one of these at some point, I just need to sell a couple of mine first!
Tony that is really the current killer Divers watch of choice.Really fabulous photos as well.
Lovely photos and i know you don't agree along with most people but i still think this should have been 42mm.I only have 6.75 wrists but having tried this on many times it was too small for me and therefore i bought the Explorer 11.
Only last week i tried it on again along with the Tudor Pelagos and IMHO the Pelagos was better for my next watch.
Not being negative just giving a different POV.
Yes, I really like the insert too, Duncan.
We have the same wrist size, actually, so I'm surprised you found it too small; the ExpII wears flatter as well as larger, so maybe that's something that - perhaps subconsciously - sways your decision-making?
I've tried the Pelagos a few times, and although the quality is undeniable I found it a bit sterile for my tastes. I can see why you'd go for it, though
I love it. Suits you.
Gray
Amazing photo's, I love my sea dweller. The proportions just seem to work and I couldn't care less about the end link thing and have never once noticed it when wearing it.
Thanks Tony. When viewed from normal "time telling" angle the links do provide a stepped pattern, but it still looks weird to me from other angles.
Is there a number on the end link that identifies this as a new designed end-link?
Really like the overall look but if I were ever to buy a watch in this price range it would have to be perfect to me. So still going for a really really good explanation here.
Last edited by Glen Goyne; 1st November 2014 at 17:11.
That's great - I'm convinced. Next time a TZ'er says they want to trade one of these for a 16600 I think I'll be first in line.
The deepsea is the same.Can anyone explain the design logic of the end-links?
No one ever picked up on that
Last edited by alexaff; 1st November 2014 at 18:31.
If I was new to watches, that and. 42mm Exp2 with white dial would probably do me for the rest of my life.
It's just a matter of time...
Lovely, lovely photos. Also a great watch. Gratz!
Tried it on a few times now in AD's, still not sure if it's for me.
It is, to my mind at least, the best out of the modern day Rolex divers due to the less square design but I still prefer the old shape lugs.
Everything else is without doubt an improvement on the new one though, maxi dial, bracelet, bezel etc. etc.
Mind you I have girly wrists so that probably explains my preference for the thinner lugs and having said that, the SD4000 does look good on your wrist it that shot.
Thanks Alex. Clearly a design decision (albeit a confusing one) and I'll think no more about it.The deepsea is the same.
No one ever picked up on that
You could certainly do a lot worse, Scott.
@Billy - man up and buy one already.
I'll buy yours when you flip it!
Enjoy wearing it Tony.
It does look good Tony. I will be interested to hear how it wears after you have 'worn it in'. I love the feel and presence of an old 1665 on the wrist but I have never been able to get comfortable with the 16660/16600 case shape on my wrist, despite owning a few over the years. The new SDc is the best modern Rolex for a long while, in my opinion. The insert and the case shape look superb.
Great pick up and a great write up.
Agree, almost the perfect all rounder.
The end link issue is not at all a biggie and makes me laugh when people try to make it a big deal. I don't even notice it when wearing.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. You obviously think it is a small issue you can live with and that is all that matters, it is after all your watch.
I fail to see how that would make you laugh though. I've seen far smaller issues discussed on here, sometimes fiercely, on watches that cost one tenth of the service cost of this watch ;-) one way or the other brand and value come in to the picture and the expectations at a certain price level.
Similarly I have watches with very nice fine details, I also don't notice them when wearing (loupe needed) but I know they are there.
Beautiful photos! Has the same pros and cons of the old SD in my opinion. If I didn't have the old one, I'd be very tempted by the new one.
Still the ultimate tool watch if you ask me.
Great photos Tony and a lovely SD. It's by far the nicest modern and new Rolex you can buy today. A true dive instrument, with a normal case and lug design (imo). Really really like it, i hope to get one in the near future and get that thing wet ASAP. This one has to be worn on a dive suit!
Congrats again for your purcase!
Amazing photos - great watch!
Posting Permissions
