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Thread: Tie with button-down collar?

  1. #1
    Grand Master markrlondon's Avatar
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    Tie with button-down collar?

    We have some clothing buffs here so I wondered: What is the view of button-down collars worn with ties? Acceptable or faux pas?
    Last edited by markrlondon; 22nd April 2014 at 07:22.

  2. #2
    Grand Master VDG's Avatar
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    Acceptable. Across the pond
    Fas est ab hoste doceri

  3. #3
    For Seppos only.

  4. #4
    Grand Master learningtofly's Avatar
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    Same as blue suits with brown shoes. Acceptable to anyone with a sense of style ;)

  5. #5
    Thomas Reid
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    Until recently, I've almost always worn (white) shirts with button down collars when I've worn a tie. I don't so often now because my wife bought me a bunch of shirts without button down collars. It isn't that she has anything against button down collars; it is just that they weren't available in the Tyrwhitt sale. :)

    I also always change the lacing on my shoes from the straight across to the over and under pattern. (I can feel the apple pie coursing through my veins.)

    Best wishes,
    Bob

    PS Button down collars don't work with broadcloth. Best to go with either Oxford weave (my favourite, although too textured for really formal wear), or Oxford pinpoint (a bit more formal). Broadcloth for formal.
    RLF
    Last edited by rfrazier; 18th April 2014 at 20:17.

  6. #6
    Grand Master zelig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rfrazier View Post
    I also always change the lacing on my shoes from the straight across to the over and under pattern.
    Interesting. I do the exact opposite.
    (As I feel the over & under looks untidy)

    z
    Last edited by zelig; 18th April 2014 at 20:16.

  7. #7
    Master
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    no-button down collars are casual

  8. #8
    Master
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    Only if it's a skinny black tie, you're wearing an ironic short sleeved white shirt, and sport a hipster beard.

  9. #9
    Thomas Reid
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    Quote Originally Posted by KurtKlaus View Post
    Only if it's a skinny black tie, you're wearing an ironic short sleeved white shirt, and sport a hipster beard.
    No skinny black tie, no beard, but I do have a number of white, short sleeved, button down collar shirts. :)

    Best wishes,
    Bob

  10. #10
    Master
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    Perfectly acceptable...


  11. #11
    Grand Master Seamaster73's Avatar
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    As others have said, only the septics can get away with button-down collars, an appalling sartorial faux pas for the rest of us.

  12. #12
    Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by teknicolourfox View Post
    Perfectly acceptable...

    but that's not a button down collar

  13. #13
    I used to wear Ben shermans with a tie, never saw it as an issue. Still have a couple, but I rarely wear ties these days. Never considered the cross cross shoelace as a US thing either, all depends on the footwear.

  14. #14
    Master
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    Another in agreement that this is only for the folks across the pond.

  15. #15
    Grand Master Carlton-Browne's Avatar
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    Somebody's going to suggest in a minute that it's OK to play polo whilst not wearing a tie. Bloody hell.
    Last edited by Carlton-Browne; 18th April 2014 at 22:42.
    In the Sotadic Zone, apparently.

  16. #16
    Yes, but only with a Brooks Bros or Mercers shirt and Rooster or J.Press knitted or Repp tie. It's part of the classic American Ivy look.

  17. #17
    Master Argon's Avatar
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    Absolutely fine - it can look great, although NOT with a suit which requires a shirt with a traditional semi-spread or English spread collar (this is where many North Americans get it wrong). A shirt with button-down collar and appropriate tie works well with odd jacket and trousers for smart business-casual. As has been mentioned, shirt should be made of one of the less formal and more textured fabrics such as an Oxford weave. And, if wearing with odd jacket and trousers, try and make sure jacket is darker than trousers (and shirt). Much easier to get right than lighter jacket and darker trousers.


    Last edited by Argon; 18th April 2014 at 23:24.

  18. #18
    Charles Tyrwhitt posted pics on facebook of their new button down shirts with ties.....I don't think it went down well with non-Americans. Personally I think a tie with a button down shirt is only marginally better than a tie with a short sleeved shirt!!

    Next we'll have people saying its ok to wear a crew neck jumper with a shirt!!!!
    Last edited by Rob; 18th April 2014 at 23:43.

  19. #19
    Craftsman
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    I think it looks terrible, cringe every time I see it (usually US based thankfully)

  20. #20
    Master scarto's Avatar
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    Very Brooks Brothers.

    I'm not so stuffy as some folk are on here about sartorial rules but this looks very obviously like poor taste.

    So the answer is no.

  21. #21
    No,unless you're a badly dressed American

  22. #22
    Thomas Reid
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    If it's good enough for Cary Grant, it's good enough for me.



    Notice the lovely "roll" in the collar. Not the sort of thing you'll get with those flapping things. :)

    Best wishes,
    Bob

  23. #23
    Master Argon's Avatar
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    Tie with button-down collar?

    ^ Yes! Good call. That elegant roll is what the button-down is all about.

  24. #24
    Master carlyrox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Argon View Post
    ^ Yes! Good call. That elegant roll is what the button-down is all about.

    Elegant roll or unsightly crease, depends on the occasion or look you are after.

  25. #25
    Grand Master markrlondon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rfrazier View Post
    If it's good enough for Cary Grant, it's good enough for me.



    Notice the lovely "roll" in the collar. Not the sort of thing you'll get with those flapping things. :)
    Hang on... Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick here, there do not appear to be any buttons on those collar wings. It doesn't seem to be a button-down collar.

  26. #26
    http://oxfordclothbuttondown.com/2013/07/collar-roll/
    This is how my collars roll and I cross the laces on my Gunboats too.
    Last edited by bonzo697; 19th April 2014 at 06:19.

  27. #27
    Master Wolfie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markrlondon View Post
    Hang on... Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick here, there do not appear to be any buttons on those collar wings. It doesn't seem to be a button-down collar.
    It's buttoned from the underside?

  28. #28
    Master Red Steve's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bonzo697 View Post
    http://oxfordclothbuttondown.com/2013/07/collar-roll/
    This is how my collars roll and I cross the laces on my Gunboats too.
    That works for me too.

  29. #29
    Grand Master learningtofly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markrlondon View Post
    Hang on... Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick here, there do not appear to be any buttons on those collar wings. It doesn't seem to be a button-down collar.
    It's not - it looks like a tab collar to me.

  30. #30
    Thomas Reid
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    Quote Originally Posted by markrlondon View Post
    Hang on... Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick here, there do not appear to be any buttons on those collar wings. It doesn't seem to be a button-down collar.
    Perhaps you are right. That was extremely silly of me. I can't see the buttons either. I was going by the roll, which I don't know how to get otherwise, except for a tie pin.

    How's this?



    Best wishes,
    Bob

  31. #31
    Master Wexford's Avatar
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    Unless you're going back to the mid nineties, it's a definite no.

  32. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by rfrazier View Post
    If it's good enough for Cary Grant, it's good enough for me.
    Quite right. Good old Archie Leach (Bristol's finest...)

  33. #33
    Master Scrubnut's Avatar
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    It's fine. What is not fine is short sleeved shirts with a tie. If you are hot, roll the sleeves up to below the elbow.

  34. #34
    Master Glen Goyne's Avatar
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    You can only do button down and tie if you wear a diamond encrusted PVD Rolex.

  35. #35
    Craftsman
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    During the last hot spell I got berated for a having similar rant on Facebook, one ally fairly commented that only two types of men can wear short sleeved shirts with a tie... bus drivers and dead Hawiians!!


    Quote Originally Posted by Scrubnut View Post
    It's fine. What is not fine is short sleeved shirts with a tie. If you are hot, roll the sleeves up to below the elbow.

  36. #36
    Master aldfort's Avatar
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    Defo says "American" or you spent a lot of time there. Much like tee shirts used as vests.

    Not "British" But like Bob I've worn button downs for years with and without ties and prefer them. Be your own man and wear what you like.

  37. #37
    Master grey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrubnut View Post
    It's fine. What is not fine is short sleeved shirts with a tie. If you are hot, roll the sleeves up to below the elbow.

    And get sweaty and yukky creased sleeves as well, and worse, look like a Tory minister trying to look cool.

    We can learn some things from the Yanks, and ventilation is one of them. Remember asking if a new car had air con, only a few years ago?

    'Oh no sir, you would only use it for a few days a year here in the UK, so why bother?'

    For the last few years of my working life I worked for a Nordic company, and no-one wore ties; I only ever wore one again for funerals, and then only to avoid arguments.

    Don't get me started on the trend for not wearing ties with suits and Jermyn St shirts. And as for blokes inadvertently looking like ironic versions of Alexei Sayle....

    (Apologies for the lack of sequence, but haven't found how to cut and paste with me cheap tablet).

  38. #38
    Wearing a short sleeved shirt in an office makes you look like the guy who's come to fix the photo copier.

  39. #39
    Master lysanderxiii's Avatar
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    Button-down collars are fine with a tie and suit, just not with a Dinner Jacket.....

  40. #40
    Grand Master Raffe's Avatar
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    Tie with button-down collar?

    Quote Originally Posted by rfrazier View Post
    If it's good enough for Cary Grant, it's good enough for me.



    Notice the lovely "roll" in the collar. Not the sort of thing you'll get with those flapping things. :)

    Best wishes,
    Bob
    Audrey was as hot as a jar of mustard. $#^^£$ (edited as this is not BP).
    Someone who lies about the little things will lie about the big things too.

  41. #41
    Master Scrubnut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grey View Post
    And get sweaty and yukky creased sleeves as well
    If you wash and iron your shirts this isn't an issue.

  42. #42
    Craftsman
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    I've done the botton-down collar and tie look before a I think it's fine as long as it's on a casual basis, i.e. no suit, top button open, tie loose. This may be a younger persons thing though. If you're in your 30's I think it's definitely cooler than wearing a t-shirt for a smart-casual occasion; not so cool if you're in your 50's giving a presentation to the the client.

  43. #43
    Master grey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrubnut View Post
    If you wash and iron your shirts this isn't an issue.
    How does that work then? You put on a clean ironed shirt and it stops you sweating? New technology? Gis a clue .

  44. #44
    Grand Master learningtofly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodriguez View Post
    I've done the botton-down collar and tie look before a I think it's fine as long as it's on a casual basis, i.e. no suit, top button open, tie loose. This may be a younger persons thing though. If you're in your 30's I think it's definitely cooler than wearing a t-shirt for a smart-casual occasion; not so cool if you're in your 50's giving a presentation to the the client.
    That's just too sweeping a statement. I've had clients that would far prefer that image to a pin-stripe suit (etc) and most organisations are seemingly more and more tolerant of smart/casual styles of clothing. It's really just the financial and legal sectors that are lagging behind in this regard.

  45. #45
    Master grey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodriguez View Post
    I've done the botton-down collar and tie look before a I think it's fine as long as it's on a casual basis, i.e. no suit, top button open, tie loose. This may be a younger persons thing though. .
    Reminds me of that fashion amongst younger women a year or two back of wearing braces, but leaving them hanging. Were I not such a toff, I might have been minded to ask a girl thus clad if she had enjoyed a good shit.

  46. #46
    Grand Master SimonK's Avatar
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    Why not go the Gianni Agnelli route and wear (always) button-down collar shirts with a suit and tie and leave them (equally always) unbuttoned. Team up this look with a wristwatch worn on the outside of the shirt cuff.

    I suspect to pull this look off you need to be Italian, fabulously wealthy, head of a huge corporation and have patrician good looks and charm in spades.




  47. #47
    Master Alansmithee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aldfort View Post
    Defo says "American" or you spent a lot of time there. Much like tee shirts used as vests.

    Not "British" But like Bob I've worn button downs for years with and without ties and prefer them. Be your own man and wear what you like.
    Yes - what's all that about?

  48. #48
    Master oldandgrumpy's Avatar
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    I'm surprised this topic has gone on for as long as it has. Really, you're not talking to the right person - someone who's got his finger on the pulse.

    Why didn't you ask Steve ? You know, Steve, TZ's resident style guru, (if we're honest, the style benchmark around here)......... you know, ........... Steve McQueen.













    Nuff said


  49. #49
    Grand Master
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    I`m a fan of button downs, with or without ties.

    Paul

  50. #50
    Grand Master markrlondon's Avatar
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    Thanks everyone! So the consensus is that it's an American thing rather than a British thing. Interesting.

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