The Westfield restoration - June 2015 update!

[mickylall]

Really enjoy these threads Ralphy.
Are you a qualified mechanic or just enthusiastic amateur?
I really can't imagine taking on something of this,or the TVR, scale,I've done a couple of scooters and that's about my limit
Looking forward to the updates

Cheers, Mick

[ralphy]

Today it actually stopped raining, so getting the chassis ready for the off to the blasters.

Joints: I wanted to give every one of welds a thorough inspection prior to be coated, so out with the wire brushes on them all



All looking pretty good and no evidence of structural degradation



Did I say there was a lot of them?



So onto the internals. The Westfield chassis is attached to the internal panels by rivets - loads of them. Now, I'm borderline phobic regarding hidden rust on vehicles so I was on full OCD agitation about water getting inside the tubular chassis via the rivet holes. A good look around inside with a boroscope was reassuring, but there was some slight surface coating so I wanted to stop any further deterioration and protect against any further ingress.

So it was time for the S-50 (I LOVE this stuff!)









The spray nozzle gives 360 degree coverage, so you simply push the tube in, start the pressure and steadily withdraw.


Finished the whole internals just in time to knock off for the day and within half an hour it started raining again!

R

[ralphy]

Really enjoy these threads Ralphy.
Are you a qualified mechanic or just enthusiastic amateur?

Very much the latter, Mick!

Back in my late teens all my mates were cutting their teeth on learning car mechanics by buying 'bangers' and keeping them running. I was fortunate enough to be in a company car then, so I got to miss all that learning curve. Whilst they envied me that luxury I actually felt a bit inadequate that I'd missed out on their understanding of basic car mechanics - so I guess I'm belatedly making up for that now (they have the company cars nowadays!)

R

[Chris W]

Looking good Ralphy!

Where did you get the radio room app from??

Rust treatment - needs to be timed to 2 minutes

[ralphy]

Looking good Ralphy!

Where did you get the radio room app from??

Ship's Radio Room Clock - Stuart Wolley iTunes App.

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/ship...386521358?mt=8

R

[Neil.C]

Glad the chassis looks fine Ralph, enjoying this and the pics.

[thieuster]

Great progress! And nice to show us these detailed pics. I love to see more of these (in fact, can't get enough of this step by step thing!)

Menno

[magirus]

Good work so far Ralph. Given the state it was in it's all cleaning up rather nicely. You must be pleased with the chassis. Look forward to the next installment!

[jk103]

Good thread Ralphy. Looks like a tough job with needed patience though far from anything i could do.

[swanbourne]

When I had my carburetter and tuning business many eons ago we used to use Applied Chemicals 8/77.

A couple of hours in there and the stripped metal parts would come out like new.

8-77 is nasty stuff Neil, I used to work for Applied Chemicals (Arrow Chemicals before that).

Eddie

[Neil.C]

8-77 is nasty stuff Neil, I used to work for Applied Chemicals (Arrow Chemicals before that).

Eddie

Blimey, small world Eddie.

It certainly did the trick. Used to put all the larger casings on a wire and the smaller parts into a can with holes punched into it leave for a bit, remove and then thoroughly hose off the components with water.

Came up like new!

I'd wear some goggles and heavy rubber gloves but Gawd knows what H&S would make of it nowadays.

Was there any other application for 8-77 or did everyone use it as a cleaner?

[ralphy]

More painting of the diff and gearbox:


In the interim I’ve been cleaning up the drivetrain: drive shafts, half-shafts and wheel mounts.

The rear drive-shafts are connected through the uprights to the wheel hubs by splined shafts and secured with a large nut.


The largest diameter socket I possess is 26mm, which wasn’t anywhere near big enough and the nut is imperial (as is a lot of the fasteners on this age of car). A local garage helped me out with the correct socket, but I couldn’t shift either nut as they were seized tight and highly torqued up too. Two days of Plus-Gas didn’t help so I took the assemblies to the garage and used their air impact wrench. Successfully removed, back home and the hubs have been cleaned and painted up: they’re now in the ‘Done’ area for when reassembly starts. The half-shafts were now free for the same treatment:

wire-brush off the remaining powder-coat:


rubbed down and rust-treated:



and now painted up and hanging to dry (no pic as it was late this evening).

Just enough time to get started on the uprights:


And that was it for today. Tomorrow I’ll finally be taking the chassis and suspension parts off to the blasting company to get them treated. Hoping to have them back next week, meanwhile it’s more of the same really: prepare, rub down, rust proof, paint – and repeat.

R

[JonW]

Fantastic to see you emabrk on another project Ralphy! If only cars were cheaper in Aus I would be doing the same thing, instead I had to revert to bikes as they are at least sensible value when in boxes here. Stories on them if people are interested is on my 2smoked.com website rather than me supply forum links etc.

I'm very impressed with how the chassis came up, im sure there are a few worse areas there but what cleaned up so far has been a winner for sure!

[kungfugerbil]

I love stripdown and rebuild threads. It could be anything - toaster, canal boat, combine harvester... Being of a mechanical mind but currently residing in a flat with no drive, I live vicariously through others :)

Good to see that the rustproofing stuff they advertise through practical classics and the like is actually used and effective!

[Groundrush]

Damn it, I've got the bug for one of these now. I've driven and worked on Caterhams and Westfields back in the day; always fancied a Caterham but realistically the Westy is 9/10ths the car at 5/10ths the price. I don't suppose you know how long and wide these things are? It would need to share garage space with a couple of motorbikes.

[magirus]

Good to see you are soldiering through the mundane stuff Ralph. Was all of the wiring present and usable?

[thieuster]

Good to see you are soldiering through the mundane stuff Ralph. Was all of the wiring present and usable?

I suppose that getting a new loom is always the best option for these GPR cars. UK based companies like Autosparks http://www.autosparks.co.uk are surprisingly cheap when it comes to buying a off the shelf or even bespoke loom! Imho, a well routed wiring loom is the icing on a car restoration-cake! It's the visual difference between a bodged job and thoroughly sorted out car.


And for novice restorers, rule of thumb here is: you never have too much fuses and relays in your loom!

Menno

My TR when we started rewiring:


The result, a few weeks later.

[ralphy]

Damn it, I've got the bug for one of these now. I've driven and worked on Caterhams and Westfields back in the day; always fancied a Caterham but realistically the Westy is 9/10ths the car at 5/10ths the price. I don't suppose you know how long and wide these things are? It would need to share garage space with a couple of motorbikes.

Overall Length - 3450mm. Width varies, mine's a Standard wide body with a maximum of 1560mm, the Wide body version is maximum 1640mm.

HTH.

R

[ralphy]

Good to see you are soldiering through the mundane stuff Ralph. Was all of the wiring present and usable?

You tell me, Bob, you tell me. ;-)


Essentially, there are two wiring looms: chassis and engine. The engine loom will be irrelevant as I'm going to fit a different engine, I'll have a look at the chassis loom (lights, indicators, instrumentation, etc) but I'll probably replace the lot - I'm a bit obsessive about wiring/connector standards.

@Menno: we are of similar accord regarding relays and fuses.

R

[magirus]

Ah, I see! New loom then.

[Foxy100]

The result, a few weeks later.

It took you a few weeks to rewire your car?!

This is what worries me about my MGB restoration (Ralphy - would you like to do it for me?), ideally I would have the shell chemical dipped but I'd have to remove all the wiring, something I'm not that keen to do.

[thieuster]

Not hyjacking the thread, just an addition 'how to install a wiring loom' (Ralph knows his business, I'm sure, but just for who's interested)
When (re)installing a loom:

• Get yourself a b/w photocopy of the loom. Have printed in the large possible format at a copy shop.
• Use kid's crayons to colour code the b/w lines on the photocopy. Check it with the wiring's colour and tracer (the thin contrasting colour). That way, you're sure the wire is complete and is in fact accounted for.
• Never trust used (spade) connectors. Always renew them.
• Make sure all connectors on w/wiper motors etc are clean and shiny.
• Try to centralise the earth points of your car. Saab did this with their 96 and Sonetts. Despite the aweful weather in Sweden and bad road conditions in the 50s and 60s, Saabs never had electrical problems. And remember, about half of electric components in their cars had 'Lucas' stamped on it! It can work!
• Go to the copy shop and get a decent size full colour copy of the loom and have it covered with plastic. Store one in your car, for roadside use and stick one on the wall in your shop. ('Decent size = one you can read without reading glasses. Don't ask how I know...)

Menno

[ralphy]

The chassis and other components that were ready were loaded up on the trailer and off we went for the next stage which was to get them all blasted back to the bare metal and then to be treated prior to painting.

Once blasted, I went back to have another inspection of the revealed welds and to have a further look inside the chassis with a boroscope:









Before & after's of some of the suspension:




And of the brakes:



Everything was to be left now as I wanted to get on with some other work before returning to see the zinc spraying process in action.

R

[thieuster]

Things look great! And it's always nice when you're working on a clean car.

Menno

[ralphy]

Back home and it was more work on the running gear. Although it is a 'winter' project I am keen to get the car back to a rolling state as soon as possible, i.e. wheels back onto the chassis, for ease of moving about prior to me going off abroad for some underwater stuff.

Rear wheel uprights being prepped:


Primed:


And painted:



Diff and gearbox given their final coat:




Half-shafts and steering rack undergoing treatment:




R

[kungfugerbil]

That gearbox looks very smart indeed.

The chassis has come up well after the blasting - you can see the nice looking factory welds now :)

You don't hang about do you!

[ArcofZen]

This is great stuff, I loved the Chim project and this thread will also be watched with interest.

One thing I did notice was the Makita battery screwdriver. It is worth treating yourself at some point to one of the newer models that are Lithium-Ion. It's night and day better! In fact after buying a DeWalt with Li-Ion I liked it so much I bought another and haven't used my Nicad version since.

Good luck with the rest of the project.

[ralphy]

Yesterday afternoon I went back to see the zinc treatment, a really interesting exercise to see how it is done.

Take one roll of zinc wire:


Feed it into this:


Connect up oxy-acetylene and high-pressure air:


Ignited, the optimum temperature is 1800c and the molten zinc is blown out as a fine vapour:



And apply:







It stinks to high heaven, the noise is deafening but the end result is very impressive.




Back onto the trailer complete with the other parts I’ve had treated (wishbone arms, springs, drum brakes, etc,) and back home now for priming and painting.







R

[magirus]

Excellent work Ralph!

[Neil.C]

If you carry on at this rate Ralphy it will be finished by next weekend!

Interesting to see that zinc coating treatment.

[doubledee]

Really impressive stuff. I love threads like these simply because I would love to do something like this myself but sadly I don't the space (or mechanical knowledge) to do it!

[thieuster]

Impressive! I have never seen pics of the zinc treatment before. The 'for and aft' result IRL, yes. But not the process. Thanks.

When writing this: looking at the pics, I can see that there's a lot of heat generated. How's the S-50 holding up inside the frame? Did the flame affect the S-50 coating?

Menno

[ralphy]

Impressive! I have never seen pics of the zinc treatment before. The 'for and aft' result IRL, yes. But not the process. Thanks.

When writing this: looking at the pics, I can see that there's a lot of heat generated. How's the S-50 holding up inside the frame? Did the flame affect the S-50 coating?

Menno

The heat is almost completely contained within the flame: so much so that I was able to touch the metal either side of the application straight away with my bare fingers. As the zinc is vaporised once it leaves the flame it cools immediately on contact with the workpiece, a further advantage of which is it allows the operator to be able to do repeated passes straight away (to build up layers). Accordingly, the S-50 will be unaffected.

In addition to zinc other metals such as copper, brass and even bronze can be applied with the thermal spraying technique and, due to the rapid cooling, they can be applied onto delicate surfaces too.

R

[hogthrob]

The heat is almost completely contained within the flame: so much so that I was able to touch the metal either side of the application straight away with my bare fingers. As the zinc is vaporised once it leaves the flame it cools immediately on contact with the workpiece, a further advantage of which is it allows the operator to be able to do repeated passes straight away (to build up layers). Accordingly, the S-50 will be unaffected.

In addition to zinc other metals such as copper, brass and even bronze can be applied with the thermal spraying technique and, due to the rapid cooling, they can be applied onto delicate surfaces too.

R

It pretty much sounds like industrial scale PVD.

[thieuster]

The heat is almost completely contained within the flame: so much so that I was able to touch the metal either side of the application straight away with my bare fingers. As the zinc is vaporised once it leaves the flame it cools immediately on contact with the workpiece, a further advantage of which is it allows the operator to be able to do repeated passes straight away (to build up layers). Accordingly, the S-50 will be unaffected.

In addition to zinc other metals such as copper, brass and even bronze can be applied with the thermal spraying technique and, due to the rapid cooling, they can be applied onto delicate surfaces too.

R

Nice. What about other parts being treated the same way? Brake back plates, outside of the brake drums? Or does the zinc add a lot of weight?

Menno

[JonW]

Loving the Zinc process, very cool indeed.

Wish I could get sensibly priced S-50 here, I've been on the search and a can that's 15quid in the uk is an eye watering $72 here, that's over 40quid! Grrr...

I will second the 'new drill/drivers are better than the old' comment. Ive just retired my Makita 18v lion in favour of a set of new AEG (hammer)drill and impact drivers. To be honest the Makita wasnt dead at all and I've used it most days for 4 years now it's just that I needed the impact driver in the new set to help build a new deck, and Ive always found that new kit like this is well worth the upgrade for the new ones. Will say that the biggest upgrade I ever made was going from ni-cad/nimh to lithium ion tho.

Keep up the pace Ralphy, you will have it done in no time!

[ralphy]

Nice. What about other parts being treated the same way? Brake back plates, outside of the brake drums? Or does the zinc add a lot of weight?

Menno

It adds very little weight: each pass of the gun deposits between 70 - 100 microns onto the workpiece (that is the equivalent amount that zinc dipping will give) and he gives between 4 - 5 passes.

Regarding my drill: it's old and well-used, but I still use it for 'rough' jobs (just bought another spare battery for it in fact) but for drilling I use an electric drill.

R

[Dangermouse64]

I am enjoying this, and the zinc treatment has surprised me, I thought the part being plated would be dipped like a chrome treatment

[ralphy]

I am enjoying this, and the zinc treatment has surprised me, I thought the part being plated would be dipped like a chrome treatment

The problem with zinc-dipping is that the heat required can distort the metal workpieces. As this has been seen to occur on TVR chassis's* I had my Chimaera zinc-sprayed and given the Westfield chassis is all-together lighter in it's structure it would be very unwise to dip it.

* Quite how one would notice/measure distortion on a TVR chassis is a moot point. ;-)

R

[Dangermouse64]

You learn something every day Ralphy, thanks for the explanation

[Mrcrowley]

Great Ralph

You can help when i do the chair.

[Kingstepper]

Interesting stuff, thanks for posting.

I'd love to do something like this but don't have too much space, am happily(?) married and it would take me months to get as far as you have in a week or so.

[ralphy]

Interesting stuff, thanks for posting.

I'd love to do something like this but don't have too much space, am happily(?) married and it would take me months to get as far as you have in a week or so.

I don't have much space either, hence the working out of a trailer:


Wives can be a bit of issue too, I had to spend most of today shopping. :-(

But I did manage to get the chassis off the trailer and (just) into the man-shed:


Although I'd prefer to spray on the primer and paint, it's an outside job & that's weather dependent of course, so it'll have to be a brush job if the forecast is to be believed.

R

[paulpsz008]

It adds very little weight: each pass of the gun deposits between 70 - 100 microns onto the workpiece (that is the equivalent amount that zinc dipping will give) and he gives between 4 - 5 passes.

R

Roughly how much does this Zinc coating cost Ralphy?

Looking very good by the way.

[Jim W]

Great thread, loving it. There's a lot of work in restoring a car.

[markrlondon]

This is a fascinating thread but I just wanted to say...

Back onto the trailer complete with the other parts I’ve had treated (wishbone arms, springs, drum brakes, etc,) and back home now for priming and painting.

What lovely sunset colours and view in the background. It reminds me of my time in Wales.

[ralphy]

Roughly how much does this Zinc coating cost Ralphy?

Looking very good by the way.

The cost was £250 for blasting and coating of the chassis and the other components.

(They won't do the coating without their own blasting, i.e. had I done the latter and then took the workpieces over).

R

[ralphy]

This is a fascinating thread but I just wanted to say...
What lovely sunset colours and view in the background. It reminds me of my time in Wales.

I hadn't even noticed the background until your comment, typical photographer's fixation on the subject matter!

That's Dartmoor National Park in the distance and with the typical autumnal evening mist forming in the valleys. We do get spectacular sunsets here, but I'm so used to it I take it for granted. :-(

R

[markrlondon]

I hadn't even noticed the background until your comment, typical photographer's fixation on the subject matter!

That's Dartmoor National Park in the distance and with the typical autumnal evening mist forming in the valleys. We do get spectacular sunsets here, but I'm so used to it I take it for granted. :-(

How wonderful. :-)

Many years ago I'd sometimes walk to the top of some of the hills around Maesteg where I lived to watch the sun set. One hill allowed a view down a valley directly west, over Port Talbot and over the Gower peninsular, with the sun setting behind it all. I wish I'd taken more photos and I wish I knew where my existing photos are!

[soapy]

you must have a organised mind to do this so methodical and with no mechanical background.

if I had a shed you would have inspired me to have a go on a old bike.